[1500 TH] p2pool: Decentralized, DoS-resistant, Hop-Proof pool

[pyramining]

If you think that my entry in p2pool is breaking up things, I can move my miners to solo-mining. I'm talking of around 250GH/s.

I joined having in mind to help p2pool to perform better, not to upset people.

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[rav3n_pl]

This is odd. My payout was usually mostly around 0.02 to top 0.05 per block when rate was 200-250GH and share diff about 500.
Now pool rate is 400-450GH, share diff about 900 and my payout wend down to 0.007 per block and p2pool.info shows me as 53MH. It is over triple less (not double like it "should").
Something is going terribly wrong when pool rate increased, worst thing is we are not finding much more blocks! I hope it will resolve automagially in next 2-3 days.
Maybe adding optional 10x higher share diff for >1GH pool users? As far I understand payout is calculated from number AND diff of share in chain? Ie share on diff 2000 is worth 2x shares diff 1000? This will decrease "spamming" sharechain by biggest miners.
I`m pretty small miner 190MH tops.

[organofcorti]

Any chance p2pool could be changed to auto adjust the share difficulty to a given miner based on hash rate?  I know I haven't taken the time to figure out what my ideal share difficulty is, and I'm sure I'm not the only one.

Here's some 95% confidence intervals for daily shares submitted:
1000 shares/day: ~ +/- 6%
500 shares/day: ~ +/- 9%
250 shares/day: ~ +/- 14%
125 shares/day: ~ +/- 17%
60 shares/day: ~ +/- 25%

1. Select a target number of shares to be submitted based on a payout variance you can live with (say 500 shares/day = 9%).
2. Work out the number of difficulty 1 shares you'd submit in a day (at 2.4 Ghps, that would be about 48280 diff 1 shares).
3. Divide number of diff 1 shares by the daily shares selected in step 1. In this example, 48280/500 = 98, so in this case a difficulty of 100 would be a good selection.

I'll post a longer list with better granularity if anyone find this useful.

[mdude77]

This is odd. My payout was usually mostly around 0.02 to top 0.05 per block when rate was 200-250GH and share diff about 500.
Now pool rate is 400-450GH, share diff about 900 and my payout wend down to 0.007 per block and p2pool.info shows me as 53MH. It is over triple less (not double like it "should").
Something is going terribly wrong when pool rate increased, worst thing is we are not finding much more blocks! I hope it will resolve automagially in next 2-3 days.
Maybe adding optional 10x higher share diff for >1GH pool users? As far I understand payout is calculated from number AND diff of share in chain? Ie share on diff 2000 is worth 2x shares diff 1000? This will decrease "spamming" sharechain by biggest miners.
I`m pretty small miner 190MH tops.

This is my point exactly!!  We're getting less blocks and less payout!

M

[mdude77]

If you think that my entry in p2pool is breaking up things, I can move my miners to solo-mining. I'm talking of around 250GH/s.

I joined having in mind to help p2pool to perform better, not to upset people.

Have you adjusted the difficulty to compensate for your high horsepower? 

M

[420]

If you think that my entry in p2pool is breaking up things, I can move my miners to solo-mining. I'm talking of around 250GH/s.

I joined having in mind to help p2pool to perform better, not to upset people.

Have you adjusted the difficulty to compensate for your high horsepower? 

M

you can set manual difficulty with p2pool?

[mdude77]

If you think that my entry in p2pool is breaking up things, I can move my miners to solo-mining. I'm talking of around 250GH/s.

I joined having in mind to help p2pool to perform better, not to upset people.

Have you adjusted the difficulty to compensate for your high horsepower? 

M

you can set manual difficulty with p2pool?

From https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/P2Pool:

Code:

Appending "/1000" to a miner's username will increase the difficulty of producing a P2Pool share to at most 1000. This is useful to large miners because doing this can make it easier for small miners while minimally impacting the large miners themselves. See recommended values.

    Appending "+1" (for example) after that will make P2Pool always give your miners work with a difficulty of 1 

See https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=18313.msg816322#msg816322 for recommended values.

M

[JayCoin]

If you think that my entry in p2pool is breaking up things, I can move my miners to solo-mining. I'm talking of around 250GH/s.

I joined having in mind to help p2pool to perform better, not to upset people.

Have you adjusted the difficulty to compensate for your high horsepower?  

M

you can set manual difficulty with p2pool?

You can adjust difficulty by making the miner's user name <username>+<difficulty> for example: username+1

This would be useful to decrease the load on your p2pool node on big time hashrate miners.

You would not want to increase share difficulty above p2pool share chain difficulty or a miner may discard work that could have been added to the p2pool share chain.

This has been disabled in recent versions because forrestv thought the shares that where not difficulty 1 would screw up some mining programs. 

To allow this to work, you need to edit the p2pool/bitcoin/networks.py file. On line 26 change:

Code:

SANE_TARGET_RANGE=(2**256//2**32 - 1, 2**256//2**32 - 1),

To:

Code:

SANE_TARGET_RANGE=(2**256//2**64 - 1, 2**256//2**32 - 1),

The other option (/) doesn't seem to be currently implemented anywhere (I PMd forrestv to find out about this)

CGMiner doesn't seem to be affected by different share difficulties from the tests I have done. That is all I can vouch for.

[racerguy]

This is odd. My payout was usually mostly around 0.02 to top 0.05 per block when rate was 200-250GH and share diff about 500.
Now pool rate is 400-450GH, share diff about 900 and my payout wend down to 0.007 per block and p2pool.info shows me as 53MH. It is over triple less (not double like it "should").
Something is going terribly wrong when pool rate increased, worst thing is we are not finding much more blocks! I hope it will resolve automagially in next 2-3 days.
Maybe adding optional 10x higher share diff for >1GH pool users? As far I understand payout is calculated from number AND diff of share in chain? Ie share on diff 2000 is worth 2x shares diff 1000? This will decrease "spamming" sharechain by biggest miners.
I`m pretty small miner 190MH tops.

This is my point exactly!!  We're getting less blocks and less payout!

M

True we got less blocks this week but i don't think it's anything outside of normal expected variance.

[organofcorti]

See https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=18313.msg816322#msg816322 for recommended values.

How are the values you linked to "recommended"? What's the advantage of using them?

It look like D&T is trying to provide a guide based on what is probably best to worst in terms of variance, but no values are given. So how do you make a selection?

[forrestv]

The + option (pseudoshare difficulty) is indeed disabled for the Bitcoin P2Pool due to me being paranoid, though that shouldn't be a large issue.

The other option (/) doesn't seem to be currently implemented anywhere (I PMd forrestv to find out about this)

The / option (share difficulty) is still there, though:

In work.py:

Code:

        desired_share_target = 2**256 - 1
        if '/' in user:
            user, min_diff_str = user.rsplit('/', 1)
            try:
                desired_share_target = bitcoin_data.difficulty_to_target(float(min_diff_str))
            except:
                pass

...

Code:

                desired_timestamp=int(time.time() - self.current_work.value['clock_offset']),
                desired_target=desired_share_target,
                ref_merkle_link=dict(branch=[], index=0),

I urge larger miners to use /3000 or higher in order to keep the variance down for smaller P2Pool miners. This will increase the difficulty of your shares to 3000, but each share is worth proportionally more. Simply append /3000 to the end of your miners' usernames. This will keep share difficulty (and consequentially, variance) low for small miners.

Also, don't worry, because no value is too high for either pseudoshare (+) or share (/) difficulty. P2Pool will ignore values of + that would cause it to drop shares otherwise, and the / value is capped at 10x the current minimum(default) share difficulty.

[Red Emerald]

If you think that my entry in p2pool is breaking up things, I can move my miners to solo-mining. I'm talking of around 250GH/s.

I joined having in mind to help p2pool to perform better, not to upset people.

I'm not blaming you and sincerely hope that you being part of the pool is a good thing.  I'm just wanting to make sure its luck and not a bug or something.  With today, it's looking like it was just a run of bad luck.

[Krak]

I urge larger miners to use /3000 or higher in order to keep the variance down for smaller P2Pool miners. This will increase the difficulty of your shares to 3000, but each share is worth proportionally more. Simply append /3000 to the end of your miners' usernames. This will keep share difficulty (and consequentially, variance) low for small miners.

Also, don't worry, because no value is too high for either pseudoshare (+) or share (/) difficulty. P2Pool will ignore values of + that would cause it to drop shares otherwise, and the / value is capped at 10x the current minimum(default) share difficulty.

Ahh, so right now ~10,000 is the highest difficulty allowed? Damn. My share variance is starting to hurt pretty bad.

[rav3n_pl]

The + option (pseudoshare difficulty) is indeed disabled for the Bitcoin P2Pool due to me being paranoid, though that shouldn't be a large issue.

The other option (/) doesn't seem to be currently implemented anywhere (I PMd forrestv to find out about this)

The / option (share difficulty) is still there, though:

In work.py:

Code:

        desired_share_target = 2**256 - 1
        if '/' in user:
            user, min_diff_str = user.rsplit('/', 1)
            try:
                desired_share_target = bitcoin_data.difficulty_to_target(float(min_diff_str))
            except:
                pass

...

Code:

                desired_timestamp=int(time.time() - self.current_work.value['clock_offset']),
                desired_target=desired_share_target,
                ref_merkle_link=dict(branch=[], index=0),

I urge larger miners to use /3000 or higher in order to keep the variance down for smaller P2Pool miners. This will increase the difficulty of your shares to 3000, but each share is worth proportionally more. Simply append /3000 to the end of your miners' usernames. This will keep share difficulty (and consequentially, variance) low for small miners.

Also, don't worry, because no value is too high for either pseudoshare (+) or share (/) difficulty. P2Pool will ignore values of + that would cause it to drop shares otherwise, and the / value is capped at 10x the current minimum(default) share difficulty.

Vote to change in code that will inerase share diff send to miner for big (>1GH) miners. This will not hur them and allow to smaller miners like me get some shares anyway. ATM we have 30 nodes less than 3 days ago. Small miners are running away.
1GH x2, 5GH x3 20GH and up x10 or something...

[tucenaber]

Vote to change in code that will inerase share diff send to miner for big (>1GH) miners. This will not hur them and allow to smaller miners like me get some shares anyway. ATM we have 30 nodes less than 3 days ago. Small miners are running away.
1GH x2, 5GH x3 20GH and up x10 or something...

I agree with this. I'm not hurt that much myself but the small miners reallly are getting huge volatility. Most users (pyramining included) doesn't seem to bother/understand how to fix it manually so automatic is the way to go.

[mdude77]

Vote to change in code that will inerase share diff send to miner for big (>1GH) miners. This will not hur them and allow to smaller miners like me get some shares anyway. ATM we have 30 nodes less than 3 days ago. Small miners are running away.
1GH x2, 5GH x3 20GH and up x10 or something...

I agree with this. I'm not hurt that much myself but the small miners reallly are getting huge volatility. Most users (pyramining included) doesn't seem to bother/understand how to fix it manually so automatic is the way to go.

Agreed.

M

[Ente]

If you think that my entry in p2pool is breaking up things, I can move my miners to solo-mining. I'm talking of around 250GH/s.

I joined having in mind to help p2pool to perform better, not to upset people.

On the contrary!
There may or may not be scaling issues, it doesn't seem to be clear yet. However, I see it as a great chance to have you here, with a huge hashingrate concentrated in one node. If there are scalingissues. we already have them, and will have them even worse when, well, we scale up. We would need to fix it anyway. So lets better find out about it now, way before the BFL crazyness begins! :-)

A propos:
In theory, a much higher hashing power shouldn't change anything for p2pool. Lets say the difficulty rises a hundredfold, when the BFL come out. Then the block difficulty is a hundredfold, the p2pool hash rate is a hundredfold, and the share-diff will be a hundredfold too. The block time will adjust again to around 10 mins, the share time will adjust again to 10 secs. Even the network traffic won't change, as we will have a share every 10 secs just like now.

So, the big questions are: Do we have scaling issues? If so, why?
I only see scaling to influence anything in the short time when a huge node connects, dumps many shares, and the share difficulty didn't adjust yet. But this time window must be around a few minutes at most, not?

Tl:dr: pyramining, you are very welcome here! Even *more* if you are causing scaling issues! :-)

Ente

[Gyrsur]

can anybody explain the concept of this p2p pool in few words? is a from bitcoin seperated blockchain the fundation? thanks!

[twmz]

can anybody explain the concept of this p2p pool in few words? is a from bitcoin seperated blockchain the fundation? thanks!

Here you go.  Check out the first couple paragraphs:  https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/P2Pool

[rav3n_pl]

can anybody explain the concept of this p2p pool in few words? is a from bitcoin seperated blockchain the fundation? thanks!

Read 1st post and https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/P2Pool