Official Anoncoin chat thread (including history)

[Simcom]

Gnosis, when can we expect the next round of commits?  I'm looking forward to seeing your most recent work.

[varun555]

We've made some progress on the wiki article Anonymity of cryptocurrencies, but is still needs some work. Who is up for a challenge?

Is a noob of any use?

[Jungian]

1) Bitcoin can be used with full anonymity if a person follows basic common sense. A bitcoin address is not linked to any person except when its transactions can be connected to a person. For 99% of users bitcoin is adequate in so far as anonymity. Other anonymity add ons like tor are of questionable value.

I don't think this is true at all with just common sense. The block chain is easily data mined and it will not take very long for a serious investigator to find a link with a transaction.

Some people can be anonymous, but most will not be able too. It's just too easy to fuck up.

[Apraksin]

For people new to this discussion let me clarify something. There are a number of bothersome trolls in this thread at the moment doing their best to twist and turn every scrap of information about the upcoming implementation of zerocoin into something sinister and flawed.

These trolls allegations have been answered and refuted a number of times now, but still they persist in their effort to make new people uncertain about the worth of zerocoin. Specifically they are: btcseller2b, btcseller3c and rsa-ufo-attack.

Pay them no attention. Put them on ignore and take your information instead from the anoncoin wiki where all important things that is to know about anoncoin is listed.

https://wiki.anoncoin.net/Anoncoin_Wiki

[Jungian]

1) Bitcoin can be used with full anonymity if a person follows basic common sense. A bitcoin address is not linked to any person except when its transactions can be connected to a person. For 99% of users bitcoin is adequate in so far as anonymity. Other anonymity add ons like tor are of questionable value.

I don't think this is true at all with just common sense. The block chain is easily data mined and it will not take very long for a serious investigator to find a link with a transaction.

As long as the person does not identify himself to any other third party (exchange...), the bitcoin blockchain is completely anonymous.

Or other person that can identify him, or reveals his IP address at the same time or using an address, or uses the an address to buy something that is sent to his home e.t.c

[gunzeon]

Pay them no attention. Put them on ignore and take your information instead from the anoncoin wiki where all important things that is to know about anoncoin is listed.

People have the right to make their own opinion. We are not in a dictatorship. In addition, you have no valid arguments. It makes me wonder who are the real trolls here.

Since it's inception Anoncoin has coveted integration of Zerocoin and that is why many of us are here - bar none I imagine - which means including you.

Now, you are also boxing Bitcoin's corner as well I see, and that is commendable, but let me ask you some questions Mr rsa_ufo ?
( for the benefit of the audience ... )

 - Do you believe an rsa-3072 is adequate for unbreakable encryption ?
    - If so, how "long" until it is cracked ?
 - Is not true that an rsa_ufo of length of ~45kb == 13*3500 able to provide trustless encryption, albeit slower, but as good as rsa-3072 ?

[gunzeon]

1) Bitcoin can be used with full anonymity if a person follows basic common sense. A bitcoin address is not linked to any person except when its transactions can be connected to a person. For 99% of users bitcoin is adequate in so far as anonymity. Other anonymity add ons like tor are of questionable value.

I don't think this is true at all with just common sense. The block chain is easily data mined and it will not take very long for a serious investigator to find a link with a transaction.

As long as the person does not identify himself to any other third party (exchange...), the bitcoin blockchain is completely anonymous.

Or other person that can identify him, or reveals his IP address at the same time or using an address, or uses the an address to buy something that is sent to his home e.t.c

reveals his IP address at the same time
If I send you 1 BTC wallet to wallet, this is impossible for you to get my IP address. (using the blockchain)

uses the an address to buy something that is sent to his home
This is why I wrote: As long as the person does not identify himself to any other third party (exchange, online shop...), the bitcoin blockchain is completely anonymous. (Added: online shop for you then)

No, IP addresses are not stored in the blockchain.

oh, who's he ?

But Gavin Andreson indeed notes that

    Unless you are very careful in the way you use Bitcoin (and you have the technical know-how to use it with other anonymizing technologies like Tor or i2p), you should assume that a persistent, motivated attacker will be able to associate your IP address with your bitcoin transactions.

[ToxicDartFrog]

1) Bitcoin can be used with full anonymity if a person follows basic common sense. A bitcoin address is not linked to any person except when its transactions can be connected to a person. For 99% of users bitcoin is adequate in so far as anonymity. Other anonymity add ons like tor are of questionable value.

I don't think this is true at all with just common sense. The block chain is easily data mined and it will not take very long for a serious investigator to find a link with a transaction.

As long as the person does not identify himself to any other third party (exchange...), the bitcoin blockchain is completely anonymous.

This is totally false. There are many ways which the bitcoin blockchain is not anonymous, especially to a service provider, NSA, or potentially other 3rd parties through the leak of one's IP address / snooping of traffic. I'm surprised you weren't aware of this? Makes one wonder about your other assumptions!

In regards to the leaking of IPs, a VPN could help but you still have to worry about the anonymity of the VPN itself. Likewise TOR and I2P help as well which were one of the first major advantages ANC has had over vanilla coins. My personal preference is to use a trusted VPN to connect to tor/i2p allowing for an extra layer of anonymity.

IP address leaks aside, as mentioned there is also concern of being linked to a blockchain address when making a purchase or any other coin transfer where you may disclose an identity. This is the primary reason why zerocoin is so essential to ANC as it masks the transfer through the blockchain preventing identities from being matched to wallet addresses. This cannot be done with bitcoin and why alternatives like zcANC are clearly needed.

[ToxicDartFrog]

We were talking about the bitcoin blockchain. In itself, the blockchain does not contain any personal informations (ip address, personal address...).

Again you totally miss the point but I guess that's what you're paid for. Of course the public blockchain does not contain this information, but do you seriously not think that private copies of the blockchain with as much identifying information as possible for each address are not being produced by 3rd parties?

[gunzeon]

We were talking about the bitcoin blockchain. In itself, the blockchain does not contain any personal informations (ip address, personal address...).

Again you totally miss the point but I guess that's what you're paid for. Of course the public blockchain does not contain this information, but do you seriously not think that private copies of the blockchain with as much identifying information as possible for each address are not being produced by 3rd parties?

Read my posts correctly. You are spirited to discredit you.

This is why I wrote: As long as the person does not identify himself to any other third party (exchange, online shop...), the bitcoin blockchain is completely anonymous. (Added: online shop for you then)

depends where your transaction is relayed from, but over time, on clearnet, data gathering nodes will map the source of your transactions as being a particular IP, believe it, the randomness means that one of your transactions will divulge to one of these nodes your IP, sooner or later, go and look in your own debug.log and see how many IPs are in it, it's called Big Data these days.

[ToxicDartFrog]

We were talking about the bitcoin blockchain. In itself, the blockchain does not contain any personal informations (ip address, personal address...).

Again you totally miss the point but I guess that's what you're paid for. Of course the public blockchain does not contain this information, but do you seriously not think that private copies of the blockchain with as much identifying information as possible for each address are not being produced by 3rd parties?

Read my posts correctly. You are spirited to discredit you.

This is why I wrote: As long as the person does not identify himself to any other third party (exchange, online shop...), the bitcoin blockchain is completely anonymous. (Added: online shop for you then)

I'm spirited to discredit me? I'm not sure what you mean? Sounds like I caught you making false claims and now you're in full on damage control mode.

The bottom line is if your traffic is snooped using clearnet you WILL run the risk of leaking your identity.

Since you love quotes of yourself, here is the false statement you made again:

This is why I wrote: As long as the person does not identify himself to any other third party (exchange, online shop...), the bitcoin blockchain is completely anonymous. (Added: online shop for you then)

Simply incorrect.

[Apraksin]

To avoid the traffic snooping, you can use TOR or I2P as proxy with your Bitcoin-QT wallet. No need of Anoncoin to do that!

And here you claimed to be a concerned ANC-holder.

If you think the TOR and I2P properties of ANC are unnecessary, and you think zerocoin is so deeply flawed, what exactly is it you want ANC to be. A barebones coin without properties? Would that be satisfying?

Haul your sorry ass back to DRK, this is just embarrassing, but apparently bitcoin is more than adequately anonymous so perhaps you should just sell your scamcoins as well.

[gunzeon]

pissing context deleted ...

Before you go please answer my questions, for the benefit of our readers please:
( skip all the jive about primes also, simple answers )

 - Do you believe an rsa-3072 is adequate for unbreakable encryption ? [yes/no]
    - If so, how "long" until it is cracked ? [ no of years ]
 - Is not true that an rsa_ufo of length of ~45kb == 13*3500 able to provide trustless encryption, albeit slower, but as good as
rsa-3072 ?  [yes/no]

and then apologise for pissing everybody off blowing in here professing to be an expert but proving yourself a clown !

[Apraksin]

To avoid the traffic snooping, you can use TOR or I2P as proxy with your Bitcoin-QT wallet. No need of Anoncoin to do that!

And here you claimed to be a concerned ANC-holder.

If you think the TOR and I2P properties of ANC are unnecessary, and you think zerocoin is so deeply flawed, what exactly is it you want ANC to be. A barebones coin without properties? Would that be satisfying?

Haul your sorry ass back to DRK, this is just embarrassing, but apparently bitcoin is more than adequately anonymous so perhaps you should just sell your scamcoins as well.

I was interested in Anoncoin for many reasons (ethical, moral ...) and especially when Meeh was in charge.
Since I discovered the zerocoin trickery, I started to sell slowly and I will be probably out of anoncoin in two or three weeks.

Aaah, yes, and it never occured to you to check the "zerocoin trickery" when they announced it many months ago, it's just now when it's close to release. Again, I do not believe you hold a single ANC, you are a paid shill. pathetic.

Meeh is to everyones knowledge still in charge AFAIK. Mentions of ethics and morals from you are a sordid joke, please refrain from using words you don't understand.

[ToxicDartFrog]

I added "ITSELF" for your understanding. Now, you are going to my ignore list because you are a real troll

Before you go please answer my questions, for the benefit of our readers please:

As I said before, you have no technical skills, I will not lose my time with you but as you don't want to understand it, welcome to my ignore list
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=227287.msg8945402#msg8945402

^Please note our resident shill's new strategy. When you catch him factually incorrect, unable to answer something, or flat out lying he calls you troll and claims to put you on ignore list. How cute, his trolling is failing and now resorting to "nanananan wawawa I can't hear you!!"  

[ToxicDartFrog]

^Please note our resident shill's new strategy. When you catch him factually incorrect, unable to answer something, or flat out lying he calls you troll and claims to put you on ignore list. How cute, his trolling is failing and now resorting to "nanananan wawawa I can't hear you!!" 

This is really my last post to you, I promise

Oh didn't actually ignore me? Caught in another lie I guess. As for your previous lie (ok maybe just ignorance):

This is why I wrote: As long as the person does not identify himself to any other third party (exchange, online shop...), the bitcoin blockchain is completely anonymous. (Added: online shop for you then)

There are many ways in which the blockchain can be de-anonymized aside from just identifying yourself to an exchange or shop. Failure to stay off clearnet or transacting with just about anyone (even off of clearnet) could expose you. Anoincoin with Zerocoin implementation solves both of these issues.

Also since we keep going in circles, while it's mentioned that the blockchain itself does not contain private information, 3rd party blockchains can and are most certainly being constructed in order to tie wallets to identities. This is a major concern for those worried about true privacy and a reason to mask one's transactions through protocols such as Zerocoin.

[SmokingSkull]

Can everybody please ignore the troll?

It's easier that way, and I don't have to read the bullshit.
If somebody denies something simply because he denies it then there is no reason whatsoever to argue.
Let him go

Use the ignore button and be done with it - It's easy to get people out of your lives in the internet, believe me.

[entertheabyss]

there really is not much you can say at this point, i added a couple trolls to my ignore list i suggest after you get fed up trying to reason with then everybody else should do the same

[matthewh3]

As I promised two weeks ago, here is an estimate for completion of Zerocoin-in-Anoncoin that I feel has a very high chance of being met (a "hard deadline").

By October 15, I'll have Zerocoin integration in "alpha" state, and on a testnet for anybody to try.

By November 1, I'll have Zerocoin in mainnet, which means you can use the ANC you have now to mint and spend zerocoins. It will still be in "beta", meaning you should pay attention to our website, IRC, and our bitcointalk.org thread for security updates to the wallet and anoncoind; this is especially important if you are a miner or running a relay node.

I realized that I have made deadlines in the past that were not met. I put a lot of thought into the above deadlines and I know that they can be met. Just as a reminder, I'm working full-time on Zerocoin until at least October 1, and possibly after depending on funding.

Other upcoming dates:

September 15: the RSA UFO project ends, participants are rewarded, and the server source is released to our Github.

September 17: the first Zerocoin commits get pushed to our Github (Anoncoin/anoncoin, "zc" branch). As I said before, the public Github will lag 2 weeks behind active development in our private repository; this is to make things more difficult for copycat coins.

Previous updates:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=227287.msg8750399#msg8750399
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=227287.msg8599297#msg8599297

It's now September the 24th in over half of the world.  So it's now three weeks exactly until October the 15th. 

[TheKoziTwo]

As I promised two weeks ago, here is an estimate for completion of Zerocoin-in-Anoncoin that I feel has a very high chance of being met (a "hard deadline").

By October 15, I'll have Zerocoin integration in "alpha" state, and on a testnet for anybody to try.

By November 1, I'll have Zerocoin in mainnet, which means you can use the ANC you have now to mint and spend zerocoins. It will still be in "beta", meaning you should pay attention to our website, IRC, and our bitcointalk.org thread for security updates to the wallet and anoncoind; this is especially important if you are a miner or running a relay node.

I realized that I have made deadlines in the past that were not met. I put a lot of thought into the above deadlines and I know that they can be met. Just as a reminder, I'm working full-time on Zerocoin until at least October 1, and possibly after depending on funding.

Other upcoming dates:

September 15: the RSA UFO project ends, participants are rewarded, and the server source is released to our Github.

September 17: the first Zerocoin commits get pushed to our Github (Anoncoin/anoncoin, "zc" branch). As I said before, the public Github will lag 2 weeks behind active development in our private repository; this is to make things more difficult for copycat coins.

Previous updates:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=227287.msg8750399#msg8750399
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=227287.msg8599297#msg8599297

It's now September the 24th in over half of the world.  So it's now three weeks exactly until October the 15th.