[ActiveMining] The Official Active Mining Discussion Thread

[Ytterbium]

The ripple protocol would be perfect for moving shares between exchanges.  In fact, you wouldn't even need exchanges, it could all be done over P2P, like with bitcoin.  Ripple works with a "central issuer", unlike bitcoin (I think), but with a stock, you obviously have to have a central issuer (the company).

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[Vigil]

Allow inter-exchange share transfers -> BTCT and BF. What argument is there against this?

Will this ever be possible??

Im arbing all my shares and picking up a few extra thousand for free

How?

Exactly... There seems to be some confusion on here about what arbitrage is.

What is arbitrage? The Khan Academy explains.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AuCH7fHZsZ4

[moribana]

I just don't see the point of moving shares unless it happens instantaneously. One can always sell shares on btct, transfer the bitcoins to bitfunder and pick up some cheap shares. And I actually do not understand why this is not happening. For long-term investors this seems to be a good strategy.

Why sell out on a market that has more chance of allowing you to fill your large orders quickly?

Think about it, the higher price is there for a reason. Liquidity is one of the most important and overlooked things here. Some of us hold much more than 10 bitcoins worth of shares. I had stock in another company on Bitfunder and lost so much money because there is no liquidity. (This company is often higher ranked on bitfunder for transaction volume that active mining on bitfunder too)

My conclusion is if you have a large amount of shares and you want to be able to flip them on news or whatever, BTCT is the way to go for now.

So the lower price on bitfunder is only a plus if you can one day transfer them. For now the price reflects the situation. That being on bitfunder is a negative for trading your shares.

I was talking about long-term investors, not speculators.

[zumzero]

Slightly off topic, but does anyone know if you can tender/transfer shares from one person to another on btct.co in the same way you can on BF?

[PurpleTentacle]

Slightly off topic, but does anyone know if you can tender/transfer shares from one person to another on btct.co in the same way you can on BF?

Yes, you can do an internal transfer from one account to another under > portfolio > my assets.

[zumzero]

Thanks.

[Vbs]

Awwww... You just met you quota of bullshit posts. Unfortunate.

There is 0 BS in his post.
ActiveMining was suppossed to have 6TH online by now.
But since Avalon did not deliver it did not happen.
Also I find it interesting that network is 750TH and not 250TH as predicted in this chart.
But yeah that 6TH would just be temporary measure until Easic would deliver and company starts mining/selling.

That spreadsheet was posted in May I believe, so ofc the network estimate was wrong. Since then I've posted probably like 10 different updates on that spreadsheet, but carpetbagger just chose to use a very outdated version for the theatrical effect.

The "Reality..." is that the eAsic deal is done and posted on their official website. I'm sure if I wanted to create a theatrical effect also, there's no shortage of posts either.

[carpetbagger]

Sorry VBS I wasn't trying to attack you or your estimates and wasn't after theatrical effect (didn't know there were multiple versions & you're missing the point anyway). It's fair to make estimates, just as it's fair for me to bag out a company for shitty performance. The point you should be gleaning is that everyone's estimates were wrong. Nobody in our worst dreams pictured things being quite this lackluster.

Yes, the easic deal is wonderful if it really really happens, but even then, it's a fraction of "the dream".

[crumbs]

...
If you think the eASIC Deal is "Wonderful if it really really happens" then you are also either living under a rock or were dropped on your head as an infant because contrary to whatever is going on in that head of yours the deal is signed, the PR is released, and come hell or high water eASIC will produce a chip in November under contractual obligations.

Ohai Bargraphics!  You've seen this contract?  The one that talks about November chippery?  Sauce pl0x!

[carpetbagger]

Bargraph, it's a pretty simple point for you to miss entirely. Rewind back to the heady days of page one. How were you feeling about actm? Where did you expect actm to be on Sept 8th, 2013? Was it here? Redundantly informing us about how we absolutely certainly have chips months behind schedule?

I bought this stock to make a profit with, nothing more, nothing less. Well, less, as it turns out. Thank you for asking though.

[zumzero]

Bargraph, it's a pretty simple point for you to miss entirely. Rewind back to the heady days of page one. How were you feeling about actm? Where did you expect actm to be on Sept 8th, 2013? Was it here? Redundantly informing us about how we absolutely certainly have chips months behind schedule?

I bought this stock to make a profit with, nothing more, nothing less. Well, less, as it turns out. Thank you for asking though.

You won't make any profit on this stock mate because by the time you've dried your eyes you'll have sold the lot, that is if you ever owned any. 

[carpetbagger]

I own enough to express my disappointment at how things have progressed, zumzero.

[coinfresh]

I own enough to express my disappointment at how things have progressed, zumzero.

I wouldn't be disappointed yet unless you already sold.

[zumzero]

Fine.  But posting infantile images aka icebreaker style isn't how to go about it.  If you approach the subject with a childish emotional response, you won't be taken seriously. Try a different tact and you might be pleased with the outcome, who knows.

[Stuartuk]

I own enough to express my disappointment at how things have progressed, zumzero.

lol yes the partnership with eASIC is the latest in a long line of disappointments. How dare this company pay for and sign off a next generation chip deal with one of the biggest and fastest to market players in North America. I know Microsoft give them nothing but praise and Seagate just signed a deal with them but what a really disappointing company to have making the ACtM chips. hey ho.

EDIT- I hope the Fujitsu foundry know what they are doing when they knock out our chips - but has any one ever heard of these people? another disappointing aspect of this so called progress. Fujit-WHO more like.

[thefunkybits]

Allow inter-exchange share transfers -> BTCT and BF. What argument is there against this?

Will this ever be possible??

Im arbing all my shares and picking up a few extra thousand for free

How?

Sell 1000 Shares on BTCT.
Buy 1300 Shares on Bitfunder.


 

[Vigil]

Allow inter-exchange share transfers -> BTCT and BF. What argument is there against this?

Will this ever be possible??

Im arbing all my shares and picking up a few extra thousand for free

How?

Sell 1000 Shares on BTCT.
Buy 1300 Shares on Bitfunder.


 

That is not arbitrage.

Arbitrage would be buying 1300 shares on BitFunder at say .0025 and selling them on BTCT for .003. Then sending the bitcoins you earned from selling on BTCT back to Bitfunder to buy 1600 shares at .0025 and then selling those shares on BTCT again. You do this until the price difference no longer allows a profit.

Arbitrage is not simply the act of buying more shares on one exchange than you had on another. You are missing an entire step in the process, i.e., the transfer of the cheaper "good" over to the exchange which is paying more to make the sale.

[AngelSky]

Well, that official announcement was like a soufflé. Hope to see some real hardware asap. Then the real things are going to be interesting.

[kleeck]

Allow inter-exchange share transfers -> BTCT and BF. What argument is there against this?

Will this ever be possible??

Im arbing all my shares and picking up a few extra thousand for free

How?

Sell 1000 Shares on BTCT.
Buy 1300 Shares on Bitfunder.


 

That is not arbitrage.

Arbitrage would be buying 1300 shares on BitFunder at say .0025 and selling them on BTCT for .003. Then sending the bitcoins you earned from selling on BTCT back to Bitfunder to buy 1600 shares at .0025 and then selling those shares on BTCT again. You do this until the price difference no longer allows a profit.

Arbitrage is not simply the act of buying more shares on one exchange than you had on another. You are missing an entire step in the process, i.e., the transfer of the cheaper "good" over to the exchange which is paying more to make the sale.

"In economics and finance, arbitrage /ˈɑrbɨtrɑːʒ/ is the practice of taking advantage of a price difference between two or more markets: striking a combination of matching deals that capitalize upon the imbalance, the profit being the difference between the market prices. When used by academics, an arbitrage is a transaction that involves no negative cash flow at any probabilistic or temporal state and a positive cash flow in at least one state; in simple terms, it is the possibility of a risk-free profit at zero cost. For instance, an arbitrage is present when there is the opportunity to instantaneously buy low and sell high."


There is no official mechanism for arbitrage so what people are calling arbitrage in the Bitcoin ecosystem is as close as we currently can get to what fiat institutions have. Further, the only inaccuracy I can see in calling what is described here arbitrage is that it is not instant or guaranteed. It was highly unlikely that the 35% spread yesterday would close before my coin transferred, though.

All this to say that arbitrage does not need to be cyclical to be called "arbitrage". It can be one trade from one exchange to the other that nets you a return due to the price spread.

TL;DR This IS arbitrage.

[lenny_]

Did any one tried to do Google reverse image search on their miner pictures? Any conclusions?