Russian Invasion of Ukraine[In Progress]

[johhnyUA]

https://ria.ru/20220729/obstrel-1805815751.html

There should be parts of the missiles there to make it clear whether or not it is HIMARS.

Ofc, russian scum "found" some "clues" that this ukrainians who shoot prison camp. This is so logical: we are shooting warehouses and command bunkers, but now for some reasons we shoot prison camp where our captive soldiers. Yep, sounds legit *sarcasm*

As I said above, this is clear message: "Our you stop using HIMARS, or we execute all captive ukrainian soldiers"

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[BADecker]

https://ria.ru/20220729/obstrel-1805815751.html

There should be parts of the missiles there to make it clear whether or not it is HIMARS.

Ofc, russian scum "found" some "clues" that this ukrainians who shoot prison camp. This is so logical: we are shooting warehouses and command bunkers, but now for some reasons we shoot prison camp where our captive soldiers. Yep, sounds legit *sarcasm*

As I said above, this is clear message: "Our you stop using HIMARS, or we execute all captive ukrainian soldiers"

Clear message: "Don't you see? We don't want to kill you. That's why we have prison camps.

"Stop fighting. Lay down your arms and surrender. This way we can all go home, and you will have some soldiers left to start over Ukrainian life with.

"But if you won't stop fighting, we just might kill all your guys in our prison camps, and wipe the rest of you off the face of the earth."

 

[TwitchySeal]

https://ria.ru/20220729/obstrel-1805815751.html

There should be parts of the missiles there to make it clear whether or not it is HIMARS.

Ofc, russian scum "found" some "clues" that this ukrainians who shoot prison camp. This is so logical: we are shooting warehouses and command bunkers, but now for some reasons we shoot prison camp where our captive soldiers. Yep, sounds legit *sarcasm*

As I said above, this is clear message: "Our you stop using HIMARS, or we execute all captive ukrainian soldiers"

Clear message: "Don't you see? We don't want to kill you. That's why we have prison camps.

"Stop fighting. Lay down your arms and surrender. This way we can all go home, and you will have some soldiers left to start over Ukrainian life with.

"But if you won't stop fighting, we just might kill all your guys in our prison camps, and wipe the rest of you off the face of the earth."

 

It's ironic they're accusing Ukraine of doing literally what Stalin did.

Stalin More Popular Than Putin in Russia These Days

[VKcams.com]

It's ironic they're accusing Ukraine of doing literally what Stalin did.

Stalin More Popular Than Putin in Russia These Days

Fake. Levada center from 16.04.2019

What is this Internet archaeology for?

[suchmoon]

One interesting moment: From the sart of the war, russian nazionalists propaganda and so-called "voencori" (war journalists) speculated that ukrainians cutting testicles to russian captives. Ofc, with 0 proofs, later one "voencor" Evgeny Poddubny told that this was  his psyop idea, but as you can understand russian didn't believe that all this shit was just a imagination of one "voencor". So they think that ukrainians doing this, but putin and russian govenrment trying to cover this facts. And as we see, they started to do it by themselves.

So what in return? We have proof that russian doing such things (at least once), but zero proofs about ukrainians.

Of course, they're projecting their own crimes on Ukrainians. Just like with attacks on civilian objects, looting, etc. It's easier to "report" it when you don't have to make it up, just blame it on the other side.

@paxmao, @suchmoon, @1miau, @LTU_btc

I've read that many of you discuss how russian will counter HIMARS strikes. Obviously, they can't destroy with arms, but because russian are shit nation, they've found another assymetric answer . Look at this:

https://i.imgur.com/NmBxj1wl.png

In short assymetric answer is: "If you continue to shot our warehouses and command stations, we will kill your captives who are in our disposal"

This one was actually quite successful as a propaganda move. I see Western media (AP etc) peddle this now, some reports like "Russia claims Ukrainians attacked prison" and some without the "Russia claims" part. Kremlin will do everything they can to create the impression that HIMARS is used "improperly", they're really afraid of it and perhaps hoping that US will slow delivery because of this propaganda.

[Branko]

This one was actually quite successful as a propaganda move. I see Western media (AP etc) peddle this now, some reports like "Russia claims Ukrainians attacked prison" and some without the "Russia claims" part. Kremlin will do everything they can to create the impression that HIMARS is used "improperly", they're really afraid of it and perhaps hoping that US will slow delivery because of this propaganda.

Anyone who 100% believes either side has an agenda...its war, and lies and propaganda are used on both sides.
Once its over, winner will decide who was liar and who was telling the truth

[VKcams.com]

Kremlin will do everything they can to create the impression that HIMARS is used "improperly", they're really afraid of it and perhaps hoping that US will slow delivery because of this propaganda.

Parts of HIMARS missiles from there you would of course call propaganda too.

How boring and monotonous it is.

[Veleor]

Ofc, russian scum "found" some "clues" that this ukrainians who shoot prison camp. This is so logical: we are shooting warehouses and command bunkers, but now for some reasons we shoot prison camp where our captive soldiers. Yep, sounds legit *sarcasm*

As I said above, this is clear message: "Our you stop using HIMARS, or we execute all captive ukrainian soldiers"

The statements of the Russian side are more reasoned and supported by material evidence at least.

Here some arguments against the Russian attack on the Elenovka detention center:

1. The Russian side has the wreckage of the HIMARS rocket and its number. By the number of the rocket, investigators can determine the exact place from which this rocket was launched and who gave the order to launch it. The Ukrainian side has Arestovich's statement that the Russians set fire to their own detention center.



2. According to a representative of the Russian Foreign Ministry, the Ukrainian side has fired before at the same detention center in Yelenovka on the morning of May 17 from multiple launch rocket systems. Also, a Russian correspondent at the end of June reported that the village of Yelenovka was being regularly shelled by Ukrainian troops. Let me remind you that in May of this year, three deputies of the Verkhovna Rada from the political party Servant of the People (Vladimir Zelensky's party) proposed to shoot Ukrainian soldiers for desertion without trial - this is about the attitude of the Ukrainian government towards its soldiers.



3. If this is a staging, then it is too unpredictable. With such a large-scale staging with so many victims and participants, it is almost impossible to be able to hide it in secret, because there are so many extra eyes. There will always be hunters to chat. Moreover, there were eight victims among the guards, and it would not be difficult for them or their relatives to find out where the blow was actually fired from - which would risk greatly worsening relations between the Russian Federation and the residents of the DPR in case of staging. And this is the last thing the Russian authorities need now on the eve of the forthcoming referendums. The Security Service of Ukraine published an alleged telephone conversation between two Russian soldiers who are freely talking about a provocation in Yelenovka. This is despite the fact that Russian soldiers are forbidden to have mobile phones with them. But it seems that Ukrainians are still falling for these fakes.

4. A very dubious provocation. Prisoners from Azovstal are too valuable for an exchange fund and they giving valuable testimony to be spent on staged provocation. The doubtfulness of the provocation also lies in the fact that even before the official statements of the Ukrainian side, Russia had already foreshadowed that the blame for this attack would be laid by the Ukrainians on the Russian army. That is, it would take a lot of effort for an incomprehensible reaction. The statement of the Ukrainian side does not stand up to criticism, because the captured Azov people are checking by the International Committee of the Red Cross and the wives of the Ukrainian prisoners of war which come to Russian prisons to visit their husbands.



5. The strike on the isolation ward was dealt literally a day after the confession of the acting commander of the press service of the Azov regiment, famous Dmitry Kazatsky, appeared on the Internet that Aleksey Arestovich personally from the office of the President of Ukraine ordered to shoot a video of Russian prisoners of war being tortured.

July 28 - confession of Azov fighter from Yelenovka about Arestovich
July 29 - explosion in the detention center in Yelenovka

For those who are interested, there is the text of Dmitry Kazatsky's speech. Translated from Russian into English.



Reporter: Please introduce yourself and tell us what functions you performed in the Azov battalion?
Dmitry Kazatsky: Dmitry Kazatsky, acting commander of the press service of the Azov Regiment.
Reporter: What is your call sign?
Dmitry Kazatsky: Orest.
Reporter: Dmitry, tell us, were there any peculiarities in your information work before the outbreak of hostilities, and then later?
Dmitry Kazatsky: Until the 24th, we had our own recruiting information campaign. There were suggestions that the war would start and we were engaged in recruiting personnel, that is, we gathered people, just in case. But the most interesting thing is that even before the 24th, before the start of the war, from the office of the president, as I understand it, I heard the name Arestovich, what exactly Arestovich is doing this - creating an information campaign to collect shock content, video materials, on the brutal murders of Russian prisoners of war. For us then it was still strange, we didn't think that it would begin. We just took the instructions and that's it. But then, when the war began, we started monitoring the information space in Ukraine and noticing that these videos really started to appear. As I understand it, these instructions were issued not only to us, but also to other military units or organizations. That is, we saw videos from Kharkov and Kyiv. As I understand it, these instructions were sent to both Botsman and Chile in Kharkov, because we saw these videos in different telegram channels and different sources. I understood from these instructions that this information campaign was created in order to provoke some kind of anti-war movements in Russia, so that there would be some kind of actions. But in fact, when we later monitored the information space, this information campaign caused more negative in the world community, because it was a war crime, and it did not cause the proper result in Russia, because there were no actions there. When there was a war - I don't remember what date it was - new orders were issued to stop this campaign. I understood this was from Arestovich. I heard that it descended from him - to stop so as not to cause a negative image in the world community. I don't know who specifically did this from us, these videos were collected, but I know for sure that after leaving Azovstal, all video materials, all flash drives, all hard drives, computers were destroyed so that these videos would not remain.

One interesting moment: From the sart of the war, russian nazionalists propaganda and so-called "voencori" (war journalists) speculated that ukrainians cutting testicles to russian captives. Ofc, with 0 proofs, later one "voencor" Evgeny Poddubny told that this was  his psyop idea, but as you can understand russian didn't believe that all this shit was just a imagination of one "voencor". So they think that ukrainians doing this, but putin and russian govenrment trying to cover this facts. And as we see, they started to do it by themselves.

So what in return? We have proof that russian doing such things (at least once), but zero proofs about ukrainians.

Is the confession of a Ukrainian doctor proof?

[johhnyUA]

Of course, they're projecting their own crimes on Ukrainians. Just like with attacks on civilian objects, looting, etc. It's easier to "report" it when you don't have to make it up, just blame it on the other side.

I've answered to this in my thread - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5403025.msg60651509#msg60651509

This one was actually quite successful as a propaganda move. I see Western media (AP etc) peddle this now, some reports like "Russia claims Ukrainians attacked prison" and some without the "Russia claims" part. Kremlin will do everything they can to create the impression that HIMARS is used "improperly", they're really afraid of it and perhaps hoping that US will slow delivery because of this propaganda.

Of course this is BS. We all seen accuracy of HIMARS rockets, so in that case, if we will try to believe russian propaganda, the only way is that ukrainian army done it with intent. But why it should destroy prison with a lot of captives, while a lot of russian munition warehouses are closer and more important targets?

But our main kremlin bot, Veleor, think that russian side is ofc "more reasoned"

The statements of the Russian side are more reasoned and supported by material evidence at least.

1. The Russian side has the wreckage of the HIMARS rocket and its number.

I see here a lot of metal scrap, without any proofs that this is parts from HIMARS rockets. It can be Grad, or Hurricane, or any other.

three deputies of the Verkhovna Rada from the political party Servant of the People (Vladimir Zelensky's party) proposed to shoot Ukrainian soldiers for desertion without trial - this is about the attitude of the Ukrainian government towards its soldiers.

Veleor tries to tell us, that "three deputies" is equal to "ukrainian government"
But 3 deputies is just about 1 % of Verkhovna Rada

In russian population there about 1.5 % of mentaly ill people. So, following to Veleor, all russian are mentally ill.

to have mobile phones with them. But it seems that Ukrainians are still falling for these fakes

if russian soldiers forbidden to have a mobile phone, when how they filmed cutting off testicles to ukrainian soldier? This is rhetorical question, tho

Prisoners from Azovstal are too valuable for an exchange fund and they giving valuable testimony to be spent on staged provocation.

There a lot of cases Azov warriors were killed by russian soldiers. Because of AZOV is the main scarecrow to russian propaganda, I doubt that russians would not kill some of them for the need.

5. The strike on the isolation ward was dealt literally a day after the confession of the acting commander of the press service of the Azov regiment, famous Dmitry Kazatsky, appeared on the Internet that Aleksey Arestovich personally from the office of the President of Ukraine ordered to shoot a video of Russian prisoners of war being tortured.

Ukrainians are following to NATO Doctrine, which states, that soldier can say anything in captivity, just to save his life. So any words of ukrainian captives can't be considered as anything. He could with the same probability told that Zelensky fought in Mariupol by himself. Or that putin is the great man. We can't know is this his thougths or just he telling what russians want to hear.

[VKcams.com]

if russian soldiers forbidden to have a mobile phone, when how they filmed cutting off testicles to ukrainian soldier? This is rhetorical question, tho

I don't know exactly, but the DNR and LNR have no such requirements.

[Waradlain]

>But if you won't stop fighting, we just might kill all your guys in our prison camps

Can't believe finally something sane from this guy.

The full quote looks like this "There is nothing we can do to you in a conventional war, so we'll continue to kill civilians and captives, wipe out infrastructure and entire cities, in the end, we may blow up a few residential buildings in russia and start a new round of threats with nuclear weapons. We are russians, this is how we fight wars."


btw one of the so-called russians from yesterday's video

[johhnyUA]

I don't know exactly, but the DNR and LNR have no such requirements.

Those who want, can take their mobile phones with ease. See here:

"Ha cмapтфoнe y мeня ycтaнoвлeн "cбepбaнк oнлaйн" - eдинcтвeнный cпocoб пoлyчeния дeнeг c poccийcкoй кapты в ЛHP. Пoceмy, пpoeбaть eгo я ceбe пoзвoлить нe мoг. Иcxoдя из этoгo, я нe xpaнил нa cмapтфoнe ничeгo, чтo мoглo бы пpивлeчь внимaниe "кyпoлoв". Дaжe тoпoгpaфичecкиe кapты paйoнa, пpeдвapитeльнo зaкaчaнныe, cтep. Бeз "кoмпpoмaтa" был шaнc oтбpexaтьcя и нe oтдaть тeлeфoн "кyпoлaм", cлyчиcь чeгo. Hy a caм cмapтфoн cпpятaл, вынyв бaтapeю и никoмy нe пoкaзывaл. Ha пepeдoк жe дaжe мыcлeй нe вoзникaлo eгo бpaть. Taм мoжeт cлyчитьcя чтo yгoднo и пpoeбaть eгo - лeгчe лeгкoгo."
https://leon-spb67.livejournal.com/1458764.html

As you can see, this man was with a smartphone all the time, the only difference that this guy had no desire to film. But such opportunity exists. And yep, soldiers inside LDPR have their phones, because this is not deploying on the frontline.

[Waradlain]

In russian population there about 1.5 % of mentaly ill people. So, following to Veleor, all russian are mentally ill.

Wait a second, how is it even negotiable? It must be taken by default.

[johhnyUA]

Wait a second, how is it even negotiable? It must be taken by default.

I'm just full of his (Veleor) bs and manipulations. It looks like he is really get paid for his nonsense here.  Btw, in russian section everything is the same, here is a good quote about Veleor's manner to write (not so obvious, we can't know for sure, we can't know all truth, truth is between and so on):

Пo этoй фoтoгpaфии нaпишy нecкoлькo кoммeнтapиeв.

1. Дocтoвepнo нe извecтнo,
........
2. Poccийcкиe coлдaты вoюющиe в Укpaинe...
....
3.  Maлoвepoятнo, чтo зa 18 днeй oбcтaнoвкa пpaктичecки нe пoмeнялacь. Этo пoднимaeт вoпpoc пo пoвoдy дaты cнимкa....
....
4. У тaнкиcтa тaкoe выpaжeниe лицa, бyдтo oн нaмepeннo кopчил гpимacы нa кaмepy, a фoтoгpaф cлoвнo cтaвил пepeд coбoй зaдaчy зaпeчaтлeть нeoтecaннoгo "paшиcтa" нa фoнe caмыx paзpyшeнныx здaний в гopoдe....
.....
5. Дaжe пpиняв зa фaкт, чтo тaнкиcт и пpeдмeты нa тaнкe нe являeтcя peзyльтaтoм paбoты в фoтopeдaктope ....

Eдeт тaнк c бapaxлoм. Bcё. Heт, нaвыcacывaл из пaльцa "дocтoвepнo нe извecтнo, пpeдпoлoжим, вoзмoжнo, cтaл бы? глyпo былo бы, мaлoвepoятнo, пoднимaeт вoпpoc, дaжe пpиняв зa фaкт, дa paзвe oни мoгли? Eщё бы дoбaвил, чтo дocтoвepнo нe извecтнo, кaк paзpyшeны здaния, вoзмoжнo этo aвapийнoe жильё пoд cнoc, c бoльшoй cтeпeнью вepoятнocти, пoтoмy чтo пo дoмaм нe cтaли бы cтpeлять, пoтoмy чтo этo пpecтyплeниe, кapaeмoe пo зaкoнaм вoeннoгo вpeмeни, ктo в здpaвoм yмe нa тaкoe пoйдёт??

We will never know the truth 

[Waradlain]

Wait a second, how is it even negotiable? It must be taken by default.

I'm just full of his (Veleor) bs and manipulations. It looks like he is really get paid for his nonsense here.  Btw, in russian section everything is the same, here is a good quote about Veleor's manner to write (not so obvious, we can't know for sure, we can't know all truth, truth is between and so on):

Пo этoй фoтoгpaфии нaпишy нecкoлькo кoммeнтapиeв.

1. Дocтoвepнo нe извecтнo,
........
2. Poccийcкиe coлдaты вoюющиe в Укpaинe...
....
3.  Maлoвepoятнo, чтo зa 18 днeй oбcтaнoвкa пpaктичecки нe пoмeнялacь. Этo пoднимaeт вoпpoc пo пoвoдy дaты cнимкa....
....
4. У тaнкиcтa тaкoe выpaжeниe лицa, бyдтo oн нaмepeннo кopчил гpимacы нa кaмepy, a фoтoгpaф cлoвнo cтaвил пepeд coбoй зaдaчy зaпeчaтлeть нeoтecaннoгo "paшиcтa" нa фoнe caмыx paзpyшeнныx здaний в гopoдe....
.....
5. Дaжe пpиняв зa фaкт, чтo тaнкиcт и пpeдмeты нa тaнкe нe являeтcя peзyльтaтoм paбoты в фoтopeдaктope ....

Eдeт тaнк c бapaxлoм. Bcё. Heт, нaвыcacывaл из пaльцa "дocтoвepнo нe извecтнo, пpeдпoлoжим, вoзмoжнo, cтaл бы? глyпo былo бы, мaлoвepoятнo, пoднимaeт вoпpoc, дaжe пpиняв зa фaкт, дa paзвe oни мoгли? Eщё бы дoбaвил, чтo дocтoвepнo нe извecтнo, кaк paзpyшeны здaния, вoзмoжнo этo aвapийнoe жильё пoд cнoc, c бoльшoй cтeпeнью вepoятнocти, пoтoмy чтo пo дoмaм нe cтaли бы cтpeлять, пoтoмy чтo этo пpecтyплeниe, кapaeмoe пo зaкoнaм вoeннoгo вpeмeни, ктo в здpaвoм yмe нa тaкoe пoйдёт??

We will never know the truth  

So sweet.
We will never know the truth but we always know what time it is. Just like our grandfathers!

Accordingly, Khaldei flew to Moscow the night after he had photographed the Reichstag. When the picture was first printed in the trade union magazine "Ogonjok" on May 13, 1945, one detail had been manipulated. In reality, the Red Army soldier supporting the comrade who was raising the flag wore a watch on both forearms. With the demand "Uri, Uri", Soviet soldiers plundered through Berlin at the time. Khaldei, he later admitted, used a needle to scratch the watch on his model's right arm from one of the negatives.

[Veleor]

But our main kremlin bot, Veleor, think that russian side is ofc "more reasoned"

By what criteria did you attribute me to the Kremlin bots? Bots get paid for multiple posts, right?
But it’s okay that you are now writing the Freebitcoin refcode in your signature here, not me. Thus, I have evidence that you can be called a Freebitcoin casino site bot.
If my statements with references to sources violate your subtle mental organization, then these are not problems of the Kremlin propaganda, but your personal ones.
And now, be so kind as to present your evidence that the Kremlin pays me for my posts in this thread, otherwise you are an empty talker.

Veleor tries to tell us, that "three deputies" is equal to "ukrainian government"
But 3 deputies is just about 1 % of Verkhovna Rada
In russian population there about 1.5 % of mentaly ill people. So, following to Veleor, all russian are mentally ill.

The project card indicates that the initiators of this bill № 7351 were 9 Ukrainian deputies: Bezuglaya, Aliksychuk, Bakumov, Grivko, Tretyakova, Voitsekhovsky, Mysyagin, Mazurashu, Fedienko. The bill was withdrawn without a voting, because, according to deputy Bakumov, it caused "an inadequate public outcry".
Can't you see how the Ukrainian government does not spare its inhabitants and sends them on suicidal attacks on the eastern front against Russian artillery, tanks and aviation? In Russia, there was not a single mobilization, while in Ukraine women from 18 to 60 years old are already being called up. Your government does not put you in anything, it uses you like cannon fodder to get new financial injections and weapons from Western countries, some of which will then be sold on the black market in exchange for your lives.

if russian soldiers forbidden to have a mobile phone, when how they filmed cutting off testicles to ukrainian soldier? This is rhetorical question, tho

Please post a link proving that the Russian military did it. I'll check what sources you trust completely.

Also, if possible, please comment on this post.

There a lot of cases Azov warriors were killed by russian soldiers. Because of AZOV is the main scarecrow to russian propaganda, I doubt that russians would not kill some of them for the need.

Russian troops were destroying them before the Azov fighters surrendered in May, two more Azov fighters were sentenced to death, and 144 AFU soldiers (including Azov) were exchanged in June for 144 Russian prisoners of war. First of all, the Ukrainian side wanted the Azov people back, so they are valued much more for exchange than for intimidation.

Ukrainians are following to NATO Doctrine, which states, that soldier can say anything in captivity, just to save his life.

By this logic, it turns out that Russian soldiers in captivity can also incriminate themselves in order to save their lives.

I'm just full of his (Veleor) bs and manipulations. It looks like he is really get paid for his nonsense here.  Btw, in russian section everything is the same, here is a good quote about Veleor's manner to write (not so obvious, we can't know for sure, we can't know all truth, truth is between and so on) [...]
We will never know the truth  

Well, based on your smile, only those who consume Ukrainian Zelensky noodles from morning to evening know the truth.
If you know the truth, please tell me, how many looters of Ukrainian origin were tied to poles with tape and beaten in the Ukrainian cities, and how many looters from Russia have already been prosecuted by the Ukrainian Ministry of Internal Affairs?

In russian population there about 1.5 % of mentaly ill people. So, following to Veleor, all russian are mentally ill.

Wait a second, how is it even negotiable? It must be taken by default.

Judging by how the Ukrainians have been thoroughly brainwashed for 30 years, that now they point-blank do not see how they are used in a fratricidal massacre to the applause of the Anglo-Saxons, they see nothing wrong with the glorification of Bandera, they approve of the complete de-Russification of Ukraine and membership in the aggressive NATO military bloc that destroyed Yugoslavia; and after the anti-constitutional coup, the Ukrainians elected the clown Zelensky as president, who had not an ounce of political weight and experience, - then it is time to treat the head of the Ukrainian nation.

[Waradlain]

In russian population there about 1.5 % of mentaly ill people. So, following to Veleor, all russian are mentally ill.

Wait a second, how is it even negotiable? It must be taken by default.

Judging by how the Ukrainians have been thoroughly brainwashed for 30 years, that now they point-blank do not see how they are used in a fratricidal massacre to the applause of the Anglo-Saxons, they see nothing wrong with the glorification of Bandera, they approve of the complete de-Russification of Ukraine and membership in the aggressive NATO military bloc that destroyed Yugoslavia; and after the anti-constitutional coup, the Ukrainians elected the clown Zelensky as president, who had not an ounce of political weight and experience, - then it is time to treat the head of the Ukrainian nation.

brainwashed for 30 years, Anglo-Saxons, Bandera, de-Russification of Ukraine, aggressive NATO, Yugoslavia, anti-constitutional coup, clown Zelensky

My god are we playing bingo? I think I won and we don't even have to wait for a Croatian to show up.

[Veleor]

My god are we playing bingo? I think I won and we don't even have to wait for a Croatian to show up.

Challenge at least one point, and it may turn out that you know nothing but bingo. Although about bingo, maybe you also greatly overestimate yourself.

[DaRude]

This one was actually quite successful as a propaganda move. I see Western media (AP etc) peddle this now, some reports like "Russia claims Ukrainians attacked prison" and some without the "Russia claims" part. Kremlin will do everything they can to create the impression that HIMARS is used "improperly", they're really afraid of it and perhaps hoping that US will slow delivery because of this propaganda.

Anyone who 100% believes either side has an agenda...its war, and lies and propaganda are used on both sides.
Once its over, winner will decide who was liar and who was telling the truth

Pretty much this. Nevertheless we can make educational guesses.

What we know, in support of RU side:
-Russian side went to great length to capture those PoW
-Azov "evacuation" had the most global attention and was overseen by Red Cross
-They have great PR value. Parading PoWs on cameras is a great moral booster
-PoWs have direct values when doing PoW exchanges. And we know that some were already used in a PoW exchange  
-Azov PoWs are especially prized, they're so valuable internally that Russia wanted to pass resolution banning their exchange
-Dead PoWs have no value to RU. It would be counter productive for RU. It can be used as moral booster and incentivize UA fighters to fight to the end instead of surrendering
-8 RU prison guards were also wounded in the shelling

In support of UA side:
-It's their most (?) prized military unit
-Azov PoWs had priority over other regular military PoWs

Summary of RU side claims as i see it:
-Azov PoWs started to talk with investigators and UA attacked to shut them up.

Summary of UA side claims as i see it:
-RU kills PoWs to pressures UA to stop using HIMARS
-RU kills PoWs so UA stops fighting  
-Because that's just what orcs do

Considering the value of Azov being alive to UA and RU sides, both claims sound ridiculous to the point of being laughable. So most likely this was an accidental attack. As these things go, like with MH17, one side will try to do everything to investigate and drum up as much attention as possible, and the other side has no option but to just blatantly deny everything and try to make it go away ASAP.

[Veleor]

Considering the value of Azov being alive to UA and RU sides, both claims sound ridiculous to the point of being laughable. So most likely this was an accidental attack. As these things go, like with MH17, one side will try to do everything to investigate and drum up as much attention as possible, and the other side has no option but to just blatantly deny everything and try to make it go away ASAP.

It's even more ridiculous to say it was accidental attack.
The captured Azovites are still highly valued for exchange, because at large in Ukraine they are apparently still considered the elite and there are many more of their fighters and supporters at large who are pressing the Zelensky government to exchange them in the very first place.
For the Zelensky government, for which victories on the information front are much more important than real ones, it would be better if the Azov people did not surrender, but died the death of the brave as martyrs. Therefore, on the one hand, Kyiv exchanges part of the soldiers, and on the other hand, instead of Russia, it may well seek to complete its plan to glorify the prisoners from Azovstal by completely destroying it. Moreover, as mentioned above, such attacks may be designed not only to intimidate witnesses, but to reduce the desire of Ukrainian soldiers to surrender into Russian captivity.

... Happy you can keep you sense of humour despite "one of the best armies" being proven to be a fossil from the last century, unable to mount anything but localised, slow pace offensives.
I would certainly would not consider Kherson "liberated" if I were you.

This means that either Ukrainian soldiers, with the help of Western weapons and foreign mercenaries, do not know how to fight at all against the antediluvian Russian army, or you are not able to impartially process information. To understand this topic, it is still better to read what correspondents from the fronts transmit.

Code:

"An American fighting for Ukraine who served in the U.S. Army with combat tours in the Middle East
described the constant Russian bombardment of the city of Severodonetsk in Ukraine’s Donbas region as
“the closest thing I’ve ever seen to hell.” Ukraine Armed Forces estimate that Russia is using eight times
as many artillery munitions each day, firing thousands more shells than the Ukrainians and stymying their efforts."

According to the Minister of Defense of Ukraine in June 2022, the Ukrainian army would have enough strength to confront such armies as France or the UK (which are among the five strongest armies in the world), but at the same time Ukraine *for some reason* is not able to cope with the "backward", "unorganized", "demoralized" army of the Russian Federation in the amount of 150 thousand soldiers, which is only 15% of the entire army of the Russian Federation.

The Russian army for five months taken about 126.610 thousand square kilometers of territories that previously belonged to Ukraine. The Russian government is already ready to accept these lands into the Russian Federation after referendums.

In general, if the Russian army is so backward, as you say, then it turns out that NATO troops are not capable of anything at all. It turns out that they can only fight against civilians in Yugoslavia and Afghan nomads armed with machine guns, but they lack the courage to fight against the Russian army, otherwise the "brave" NATO military would not hide behind the backs of Ukrainian soldiers and would have started a third world war long ago, which in the blink of an eye, it would turn into a nuclear one and destroy all life. After all, this is precisely what all those who escalate this conflict between NATO and the largest nuclear power are striving for.



PS. At first, I thought that it was beneficial for Russia when the West significantly underestimated its military potential. But this is wrong, because Ukrainians, deceived by local and European propaganda, are sent to the front, and then tens of thousands die there.