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2881  Economy / Economics / Re: What’s consensus? on: August 13, 2021, 01:13:40 PM
It is unreasonable but it is effective and for how long it has been in our civilization, I think that we will have a hard time uprooting this system because it's coupled already with the global economy and global supply chain and what happens when we take away a keystone to those things, it will eventually collapse, it's a parasite that we can't remove.
Not exactly effective. Most of our world chases money, and neglects more important factors. I like the saying that we work to live, and not live to work. However, the reality is most people live to get money, and then they don't even enjoy it when they get it, because by the time they've amounted any sort of substantial earnings, they are on their death bed.

The system is designed to keep the poor, well poor, and contributing to the wealthy companies that pretty much rule the world. So, no the current money system makes no sense, yet people contribute to its survival every day.

Unless by effective you mean keeping those that control things rich, then yeah its pretty effective at that. However, what is clear is there are far more people unhappy with the current implementation of our concept of money, than there is supporters of it.
2882  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin Development Team on: August 13, 2021, 01:06:50 PM
I understand “official” as an agreed statement. No?
The definition would likely be along the lines of an authoritative body, which being open source doesn't exactly fit that description. For example, presidents or world leaders are only seen as official because the government recognises they are, not specifically because they've been voted in, but because the government has accepted those votes.

I wouldn't exactly describe it as an agreed statement, no. For example, I'm the end user of fast food, and you might too. However, because we think KFC has the best food, doesn't make it the official fast food of chicken. Horrible example, but we are end users to Bitcoin, and what we consider consensus can't be considered official. There is no authoritative body over Bitcoin, so technically nothing can be considered official.
2883  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin Development Team on: August 13, 2021, 12:46:03 PM
Essentially, “official release” is a statement agreed from people and since they all manage with their way how Bitcoin will work, there isn't such thing as “unofficial release”.
I don't think so, I think official is something that a lot of people just use incorrectly. What you are describing is what people have consensus agreed is the more appropriate path to take, but I don't think that makes it any more official than other suggestions.

Personally, I think official can only be used when there's a clear entity that controls it. For example, this forum theymos controls, therefore the rules that are posted by theymos can be described as unofficially. The Bitcoin code base isn't controlled by anyone, so nothing can truly be official. Though, there's obvious routes that might be better for the users, it doesn't necessarily mean its official.

have you actually tried.
have you seen all the hurdles involved and WHO set up the hurdles.
they are not very open at all.(imagine a little boys club)


yes you can make your own wallet.
but ever try to contribute to actually add a feature into the protocol. . if/when you do. you will spot the hurdles
This is common in open source development. The code proposals are peer reviewed, to make sure they actually contribute to the code. While you could argue that is centralisation, surely there has to be a point where we draw the line to prevent just any code being injected in the main development line. I think people, and in particular users on this forum, and Bitcoin supports treat centralisation as a bad thing, when its not necessarily bad for everything. There's definitely scenarios where centralisation makes sense, then other times like a currency it doesn't.
2884  Other / Meta / Re: Is Bitcointalk.org losing user base? on: August 13, 2021, 12:35:36 PM
Recently we can witness more and more newbies are entering the forum and trying to bring some contribution in the race if merit earning which is good to some extent because they are trying to bring something new but surely there is a drop in the real discussion lately especially after the people who can't run with the merit system, probably most of them were account farmers.
Loss of quantity that is replaced by quality isn't a bad thing in my opinion. Users come, and go, but we all stick around for the discussions. I would prefer to have less quality discussions, than having the place drowned out because of the abundance of poor quality discussions. At the moment, I think the forum is somewhat in between that metric, since there's definitely discussions here which aren't particularly of good quality.

I'm not really sure if the user base is growing any further because of this increase, but what matters most is that more users are involved in the merit distribution cycle. The user base may be able to grow given the rise in bitcoin's price so far could have an impact on it.
While you might not see immediate effects, I do believe it's quite clear that the easier it is for users to rank up, and progress the more likely they'll stick around. Ignoring the account farmers which have an incentive to rank up, ranking up is progression, and as we know progression is a motivating factor, so if merit distribution increases, so will the likelihood of users sticking around.
2885  Other / Meta / Re: Bitcointalk Youtube channel - what would you like to see? on: August 13, 2021, 12:31:24 PM
I think the viewer attention regarding masks can work both ways; there's clearly Youtubers that have built their brand, and audience around being anonymous, and that in itself creates a element of intrigue. However, I do get what you guys are saying; interviews are usually a little more personable, but at the end of the day, I listen to podcasts, and I don't usually see the guests at all, yet I still listen, and am intrigued about it. Podcasts are extremely popular now too.

For example, while Joe Rogan does have a visual element to his podcasts, I don't actually watch them, I've normally got them on when driving or traveling about, and I imagine its the same for most people. I don't think a visual aspect is absolutely necessary. It probably does help, but I'd probably watch or listen to someone that's got a history in Bitcoin, and his knowledgeable despite them having a mask on.

Also if you have a badass mask, I'm going to be intrigued.
2886  Other / Meta / Re: We need a new global moderator. on: August 13, 2021, 12:17:34 PM
The mininum merit usually just a rules to apply, it's not guarantee if you receive 5 or even 100 merit you'll not spam. Because I still see some user like that, he get a minimum merit to apply in a campaign but after got accepted he spamming to earn signature quota or burst posting.
This is actually really common from my observations. They bust their gut to actually get into the signature campaign, however once they are actually in it they get complacent, and just focus on getting to the required amount of posts. It's a pity, since they've demonstrated they can actually put a good amount of effort in. I think campaign managers should probably be a little more strict on this after all they hired them on the premise of their past posting quality.

I think part of the problem is the lack of readability of some sections, such as bitcoin discussion. Some sections are so bad that users who report posts won't even read certain sections. If modest improvements can be made to certain sections that result in increased readership, the number of reports may go way up as more people read these sections.
Talking about complacency above; I've probably become a little complacent in moderating, relying too much on reports coming in, rather than actually reporting outside of my sections. Like I mentioned I've started to kick into gear again in the Altcoin Discussion section, but I might have to make a little more time for a concentrated effort on Bitcoin Discussion, and other sections.

This should be a fairly easy fix. It should not be difficult to create a userscript that show the number of deleted posts within x timeframe. However, I think it would probably be better for this to be something displayed to moderators via the forum.

Its a good shout, I didn't really put much thought into it before this thread was brought up. I was always aware of that little niggle of deleted posts not showing, however never saw it as a big enough issue. Obviously, the drawbacks I see from including it on forum is it might influence moderators to take more drastic measures that need to be taken, because they may feel pressured by the fact that this user has x amount of deleted posts. Its probably worth moderators escalating these cases to global moderators though, since a temporary ban might be better depending on the context.

Anyway, back to your point; user scripts could definitely be a individual fix, but it would probably be beneficial if this was available on the forum directly, as not everyone wants to sort it out with setting up a user script    

This was made two years ago for 10th anniversary art contest, I never posted it in public and I found the picture few days ago when I was cleaning my hard drive (because I though it's going to die).
Ah, I was only kidding anyway I thought it was pretty cool.

Is there a way to see some public statistic for total number of reported posts and it's historic values?

Nah, hence why I didn't say a specific number of reports since it's not public, and there might be a reason for that. However, for sure reports have gone down dramatically over the last few months at least.

Could be them trying to maintain their accuracy scores, who knows? :p
Loads of reasons, some of which have been given in this thread by various users. I didn't want to specify exactly what, because it varies from each user.

What is clear to me is; there was a real community drive a few months ago to concentrate on removing the spam as a community, and that was fantastic. However, recently as outlined above in this thread there's been a shift in mentality. I think reporting badges are more important now, than when they were proposed so I would like to see these implemented sooner rather than later, however I don't think they are a permanent fix, and rather patching an issue up for a little while until the regular reports have achieved the highest level offered.
2887  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: Sportsbet.io's English Premier League Football Pool Discussion Thread on: August 13, 2021, 12:05:22 PM
By the way, who will be top three in the league? Any wild guess?
@LFC_Bitcoin will back me up here I'm sure of it.

Liverpool are going to win the league again, this year is our year. Nah, but seriously I think Liverpool are being underestimated because they haven't made any signings yet apart from Konate, who's an excellent addition by the way. Although, the existing team is brilliant, and while Robertson might be out for a few weeks, his replacement is actually pretty decent.

Having the fans back is a benefit for most clubs, but we've got a few players which absolutely thrive on the atmosphere, Firminho being the most obvious one to me. I think we'll be back with a bang, after a terrible season last season, despite rescuing it a little towards the end.
2888  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: Betting on the Paralympic Games? Ethical or not? on: August 12, 2021, 11:29:26 PM
I'd have to agree with your colleagues. It would likely be more unethical to treat them different based on the fact that they compete in the Paralympic Games. It would likely be unethical to bet against them if they were competing in the Olympics main (for a lack of a better word) events, and I do by no means want to make that sound like I'm being degrading on the Paralympic Games, like its not a main event, I just can't think of another word to use.

How it ends up with the idea that it's disrespectful for the disabled person? Can you elaborate on that?

Didn't you know that some of them really want to feel the experience of involving in sports which in reality, they can't even do. They have skills that they want to show to the community. The event is their best chance to do it and the only time they can make it.

These individuals are trained and the event is running for a long now without a massive critics globally.
As far as I'm concerned, they are some of the most mentally strong, and committed athletes in the world. I'm not one for the Olympics in general, but you've got to respect anyone that's in a disadvantaged (again for a lack of a better word) situation, being able to break through that, and perform to a excellent level, is definitely respectable.
2889  Other / Meta / Re: We need a new global moderator. on: August 12, 2021, 10:37:24 PM
The issue with re offending users is likely because a limitation to SMF. Moderators can't see if a user has been reported or had x amount of posts deleted recently, unless they manually check via the modlog. On a very busy day of handling reports, a moderator might see several hundred, and at its peak of reporting probably thousands of reports a day, and therefore potentially thousands of users. Now, because of the way reporting, and the report queue works, multiple moderators might be dealing with those reports at the same time, and therefore that's where the consistency might be lost.

For example, mprep might delete a post from user1, and I might delete another two from user1, but because there's no clear indication, at least without manually searching the recent modlog data, then there's no easy way of seeing if a user has had a number of posts  deleted recently. You could potentially look at the modlog or previously handled reports, but this is a rather messy way to do it.

It would probably be beneficial to include recent number of deleted posts by a user using the existing modlog already in place, and put that information on the profile page or potentially within the report queue itself.
 
I have few of those cherry Delete keycap buttons, along with bitcointalk, satoshi and theymos, just waiting for a challenge  Grin
You have too much time on your hands Cheesy.

If you really think that would help, then we are really in big trouble. If the members of this forum have to be motivated in this way to do something good, then at this moment it is crystal clear how much they care about this forum. "I'll clean up the spam if I have a badge, and if not then I don't care", how low someone can go to get one more dot in their profile?
Gamification works, as demonstrated by various industries. For example, universities now offer badges as motivation for completing certain tasks, and courses. Other learning resources like Coursera, and Edx also do the same.

I wouldn't be particularly motivated by things like this, however I know others will. Some people enjoy social status more than others.

If every active member reported at least 5 posts every day, so let's say at least 100 members do so - 500x30 = 15 000 fewer spam posts per month.
The reality is a few months ago reports were either around this value, or exceeding it. However, recently its been much lower than that figure.

Besides... you write as if current threads aren't unbearable.
And for the sake of the forum, can somebody handle the altcoin boards?
I'm going to be dedicating a little more time to the areas that I can moderate within the altcoin sections, but I've also recently delved back into reporting inside the Altcoin Discussion section, since that place is rather over run, and by accounts that I can't handle due to their rank. Although, I know that there's a lot of work that goes on within the Altcoin section, and while it might not seem like it there's multiple staff contributing to moderating there.

Also, I do get the frustration from reporting, it is at the best of times a thankless job. However, it is absolutely vital to the community, and I know that I'm always grateful for people throwing reports my way. I've got to echo hilariousandco here, but I think the reporter badges will at least help revitalise reports again, however it would probably only be a temporary solution until everyone has reached the highest obtainable badge. Judging by theymos' update though, it hasn't been cancelled, but rather its more work than anticipated.  


As I see it the current issues we have are:
 
- Slightly cumbersome UI when it comes to the reporting queue, and additional information between moderators e.g displaying recently deleted posts in a intuitive way.

- The community seems to have become tired with reporting, whatever the reasons that may be.

- There probably isn't enough moderators, however because of the lack of reporting, how is theymos suppose to determine a good candidate. Obviously, there's other factors, but I think it's safe to assume that reporting will be one of the primary factors considered.

Personally, I'd love to see the community operating towards a common goal again, like a few months ago, and making a real concentrated effort to get spam dealt with quickly, and efficiently. However, it would be unfair to ask that from everyone, and the best option we have is offering an incentive, without it being problematic. The reporter badges was a fantastic idea, and its probably the best solution to our problem, albeit likely a temporary one, unless some very high, and frequent reporter badges were added.

With the amount of reports increasing, it would likely mean the possibility of moderators being added would be higher. I can't speak on the behalf of theymos, and whether or not its in his vision for new moderators, but at least with the data being there i.e number of reports, there's at least a little more to work with when it comes the time he wants to add more.
2890  Other / Meta / Re: Question from mods @mprep, @Welsh on: August 12, 2021, 10:26:38 PM
For offering a AMA question, and answer style format; I guess it depends on how problematic that would be, i.e if they are low quality questions, and encourage low quality responses. However, if they aren't particularly problematic I can't see too many issues with that from my point of view.

However, offering incentives, particularly not in the games or rounds, and not in Bitcoin is usually a no go, so I'll leave the quote below of mprep;
Incentivizing posting in exchange for bitcoins is allowed but restricted to Games and Rounds. The incentive doesn't have to be guaranteed for each and every user (e.g. running a free BTC raffle with only 1 winner is completely fine). As such, I don't see anything wrong rules-wise with giving away free spins at a casino, provided that if you win during a free-spin, you get BTC.

The best solution to this if rewards are absolutely necessary would be doing the AMA in games, and rounds, and offering the rewards in Bitcoin.

In short; AMA sounds fine, probably. Rewarding users for posting depends if the rewards are Bitcoin based or not, and if so its probably more appropriate to do the AMA in games, and rounds rather in the project thread.
 
2891  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: Sportsbet.io's English Premier League Football Pool Discussion Thread on: August 12, 2021, 10:19:21 PM
I like to make my predictions as late as possible a preferrebly an hour before a match so I can look at the lineup and see if there is important players not playing.
Yeah, its a good idea. It's probably the best way of doing it, but I'm absolutely awful for remembering every game that goes on. I only really follow a couple of teams in the leagues, mainly Liverpool, and the welsh teams in the lower leagues. Its not ideal that I'm predicting in advance, but we will see how it goes.

Realistically, you could probably consider my entry as a donation Cheesy, because its extremely unlikely that I remember to update them frequently, obviously I'm going into this with the aim to win that pot, and not an actual donation, but as with any betting man, I'm probably kidding myself.

Hello Everyone,
 I have finished choosing my predictions and I hope to get good points.
 Tomorrow will be the first match in the EPL between Arsenal and brentford, It would be good to get the goal early in the game by Arsenal Cheesy Cheesy
Back to work Grin
I'm thinking Brentford will surprise a lot of people in this match. I can't even remember my prediction right now, but I think I did lean for a Arsenal win, but I can see Brentford stealing some points here.
2892  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: The UFC Info and Prediction Thread on: August 12, 2021, 10:15:06 PM
^  That’s cos Lewis was on a 4 fight win streak and Miocic got KO’d last spring by Ngannou.  The UFC can’t just match him vs another killer like Gane.  And that chin should be given enough time to recover imho as Miocic got starched.  His next match should be vs somebody who also just came off a loss.  Prolly somebody like Blaydes.  A trilogy wouldn’t make sense atm.
Blaydes would be a interesting fight, but if it was to be made I feel like it would have been made before the Derrick Lewis fight if this was on the schedule. I do believe Gane will get the opportunity against Ngannou. I don't he's ready, and I'm not sure if he will ever be ready, but as you put it a lot of the fighters in the division are currently recovering from some nasty knockouts. Particularly Blaydes, and Stipe. Before of those knockouts were significant ones.
2893  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: [Boxing] Anderson Silva vs Tito Ortiz on September 11 on: August 11, 2021, 10:27:50 PM
Yeah, Anderson has looked decent to be honest whenever I've seen him take a step into boxing. Not surprising since he was one of the best strikers in the UFC. I just can't bet against a legend of that magnitude, even if he hasn't looked as good in recent MMA bouts. Boxing, as you say he's looked somewhat good with a unexpected win recently.

With the strength of that win, I agree that Silva will be the favourite here. Tito might just be fighting for the money here.
Not like I would blame them to be honest. It's quite well documented that boxing generally pays more to its fighters than the UFC. Although, I'm not entirely sure what the shares or total number of this fight is, I'm sure its probably still better than most of their UFC careers.

avikz - Ortiz last fight was in 2019 with a low class fighter, but in 2018 he fought Chuck Liddell and won by KO.
Chuck Liddell might have not been at his absolute best that night, but having a win over Chuck looks good on anyone's record. 2019 is a fair amount of time to have a lay off from fighting, especially considering their age.
2894  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: Sportsbet.io's English Premier League Football Pool Discussion Thread on: August 11, 2021, 10:25:01 PM
Grin. Just put as many results in as you can or want in advance and when you have time or remember just update them.
That's the plan after this initial week. I've made my predictions for the weekend, and I'll then go on a spree one night, based on the performances of each team, and make some long term predictions, and check in on them, and update if necessary every so often when I remember.
2895  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: [Boxing] Anderson Silva vs Tito Ortiz on September 11 on: August 11, 2021, 08:54:17 PM
For me, Anderson Silva is far ahead of Tito. The matter if fact that both are ex UFC fighter, but Tito last fought his UFC match back in 2012 while Anderson fought his last UFC match in 2020. Also Tito has set foot in politics after his UFC career ended. I don't think Anderson would have any issue in winning here. But there are many think that goes in the background that we commoners don't know.
Can't really judge Tito due to the lack of recent fights, but Anderson certainly hasn't looked his best in his last few outings in the UFC.

In a day or two, the gambling odds will start to come out so we will be able to see what the bookies are thinking. But in sports, we must expect the unexpected!
I'm expecting the odds to heavily favour Anderson. The fact is; most betters will also bet on Anderson Silva due to the fact that he's more famous outside of UFC than Tito.
2896  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: [Boxing] Anderson Silva vs Tito Ortiz on September 11 on: August 11, 2021, 08:47:03 PM
Anderson Silva all day long. He's had a semi decent career in boxing too. The only thing I'm concerned with is Triller is hosting this. I don't tend to watch too much boxing these days, at least since UFC entered my life, however I'm a little concerned about Triller because the last event I tuned in for them was the Jake Paul vs Ben Askren fight, and is was absolutely awful from a fighting fan perspective. It was like a music concert rather than a fight night. I can't recall watching many of their other events though, so that might have just been an exception due to the fighters they had on that night.

Triller seem to be the king of white collar boxing, and cross sport fights in a boxing ring at the moment.
2897  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: The UFC Info and Prediction Thread on: August 11, 2021, 08:43:36 PM
Honestly, I'm hoping the odds of Gane VS Ngannou stay somewhat close or the odds reflect people buying into the hype of Gane. I'll be going for Ngannou despite Gane proving me wrong multiple times now, however I just can't overlook the fact that Ngannou is an absolute monster in the division, and he made massive improvements with his recent win over Stipe, which proves he can actually adjust to his competition too.

Alright, I'm actually a little hyped for the fight now. Make it happen, Dana.
2898  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: Sportsbet.io's English Premier League Football Pool Discussion Thread on: August 11, 2021, 08:39:10 PM
I'll be honest Hilariousandco usually sends me a message when this is about to start each year, and I've refrained the last few due to being absolutely awful at remembering to put in the predictions. However, Hilariousandco has twisted my arm Wink, and convinced me to join again this year. I'm actually quite excited about getting one result bang on this year, and then dipping into irrelevancy the rest of the weeks. It's a pleasure lads.

I'm also terrible at remembering to do the Super6 competition Sky runs, and that's free to enter each week!
2899  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Do you still have thoughts of picking Gold over Bitcoin, read this. on: August 11, 2021, 08:34:10 PM
I can understand why people would invest in gold. Lets be honest here; Bitcoin is a young currency, and has a extremely volatile market, which is certainly not for the faint of heart. Gold has been used for decades upon decades as a store of value, and that reinforces the belief that its a safe investment, while Bitcoin starts the alarm bells ringing because its relatively young compared to any currency out there. Obviously, Bitcoin has some obvious benefits to investing into it, and that's not solely based on the fact that it has the potential to exponentially increase in price.  

actually comparing crypto to physical assets is very useless. no matter how profitable a crypto coin is, there will always be a risk of dumping, missing, not being recognized, wallet hacking, etc. if you don't have the readiness to face that risk, it will be very risky, whatever crypto coins you hold.
while gold, has been legally recognized, exists in physical form, and is official. not wise to compare the two, each has advantages and disadvantages, I always remind that the risk in crypto is greater.
You largely have the same problems with any asset, including physical assets. Physical assets can be stolen, misplaced, and are subject to the potential of becoming less valuable. Gold is probably one of the best assets out there, but it isn't invulnerable from dropping in value. I think we'll see Gold drop more, and more once cryptocurrencies, in particular Bitcoin becomes more adopted by the general public. The world is moving to a digital world after all, in almost all aspects.
2900  Other / Meta / Re: [TOP-200] The most generous users giving merits on: August 11, 2021, 08:24:14 PM
(not to mention the fact that there are more significant factors that repel newbies).
No doubt, I don't think too many newbies receiving merit in the first place would complain about the amount that they received. However, I thought it was an interesting enough observation to comment on. My mind kind of wanders towards the fact users are wary of rewarding too much merit to new users, that might have a small sample size of posts, rather than any other reason.

What is clear about the new allocation of merit is there's a lot more merit circulating about, which is probably better from everyone's perspective. It remains to be seen though, that if the merit sources will be able to regularly spend 4 figure merits each period. I suspect there will be a drop off, due to the excitement for a lack of a better word this time around.
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