Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com

[joeventura]

* They maintained for the duration of the NPS window, that no competitors were shipping hashrate.

Just before the infamous newsletter I asked them about upgrade modules because obviously competitors were shipping, this was the reply:

From KNC:
"We are aware that some our competitors have started shipping. We will be releasing new products for our previous customers very shortly.
A newsletter will be released in the coming week."

Kind of goes against the maintaining that no competitors were shipping.....

I got $20 that says that news doesn't come in the coming week or month.

[jelin1984]

I bet that knc will have good news these week for us 

[pedrosoft]

I bet that knc will have good news these week for us 

Hope tm

[bkminer]

I got $20 that says that news doesn't come in the coming week or month.

That was the week before the Plan B announcement...

[dplusf]

i was once a knc fanboy. i got a jupiter and made a decent amount.

but,the last two months knc let us alone in the dark. the last newsletter was a eye opening fact.

knc is the new evil people. the hashrate will skyrocket to another galaxy...

http://www.thewhir.com/web-hosting-news/bitcoin-miners-building-10-megawatt-data-center-sweden

[joeventura]

I got $20 that says that news doesn't come in the coming week or month.

That was the week before the Plan B announcement...

Hahaha then that would make the "good news" the Plan B crap

[davewr2013]

knc will do all the best for us i think

the problem is the 20nm is very unique  so maybe the knc factory can not make it in time

It is a good thought.

http://www.google.ca/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&docid=CldvKNXxiO85YM&tbnid=spcbyZibIa0RaM:&ved=0CAUQjRw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.keepcalm-o-matic.co.uk%2Fp%2Fkeep-calm-and-believe-in-flying-pigs-3%2F&ei=l1b2UuTEGsPTqgGNmoDAAQ&bvm=bv.60983673,d.aWc&psig=AFQjCNH3wfHuWt9TqB6Hh8QYNggqpV90Lw&ust=1391962134623800

Hold onto it...

[Biodom]

* They maintained for the duration of the NPS window, that no competitors were shipping hashrate.

Just before the infamous newsletter I asked them about upgrade modules because obviously competitors were shipping, this was the reply:

From KNC:
"We are aware that some our competitors have started shipping. We will be releasing new products for our previous customers very shortly.
A newsletter will be released in the coming week."

Kind of goes against the maintaining that no competitors were shipping.....

I got $20 that says that news doesn't come in the coming week or month.

With all tension that we see here, I don't think that they have another month to wait.
First-they already floated a trial balloon re "about 6 mo free hosting"
Second-next week there is a large bitcoin conference in Germany that KnC is a gold/major sponsor of.
Could be good publicity for them to release the news during the conference.

[raskul]

Second-next week there is a large bitcoin conference in Germany that KnC is a gold/major sponsor of.
Could be good publicity for them to release the news during the conference.

and disappointing news so could it be. 

[Phoenix1969]

Extra "Plan B" hashrate for customers won't mean much if they wait until after Q2 to give it to us.

Now if they give it to us the moment the mega center is complete, then KnC is officially the best company out there hands down.

Hopefully it is turned on in the order the various batches were sold.

Unless they have fabbed out the new 28nm chips already.  Then there's no chance of giving us the hashrate by mid-April.  Which is when it needs to come online to ROI in bitcoin at current average difficulty growth.  Also, I wonder if they'll be using a new IC design for these new 28nm chips.  If so and it's more efficient than the old design.  Then why don't they offer us to take delivery of the equivalent hashrate with the new 28nm chips.  Instead of waiting for the 20nm chips.  Just ship us the racks that they'll be hosting I say.  If they design new more efficient 28nm chips and boards.

They were making over 800 boards a day (shipping 200 Jupiters a day @ 650+Gh/s each)during November... 3.6 peta(3 batches of 1200) by April or June (end of q2) isn't a problem.  
With those numbers... 650 Gh/s x 200/ day is 130Th/s a day....  they could have the entire 3.6 peta-hash whipped out in 28 days, based on OLD numbers.
No problem there... The challenge is.... can the data center be erected in time?... probably not... But with the current facility, and a couple smaller temps.... It could be done.... BUT   They need to have already started, and not wait until they "know for sure" Neptune is going to be late to dinner.... (Which we all know, they DO know, or the news and announcement would have never been given.)
So..... why not?....  they could be leasing any number of buildings, and have not shared any details... 15 mil profit made from Jupiter means they don't even need to touch Neptune money to do it. So all this conjecture and FUD is simply from fear....  and calculation!.... but wait!!! Calculation based on what?  Nobody knows what the offer is, or when.  It could be 5 th/s hosted beginning in April hosted for a year or until Neptune ships... The simple fact is we don't know! We made boo-coo from the Jupiter...and they are still pumpin'  (Some miners better than others)so give them a chance....  they are honoring refunds, and you will kick yourself in the ass if the offer is a good one, and you bailed already.... especially if you've been cashing out your coin as you made it, or on high-points.. and coin goes to 2 grand or above.... and calculating profit based on BTC return is ludicrous, because no calculator can show us ROI in BTC on ANY miner ANYWHERE, anytime soon.  Just sayin'    Either way... whatever you decide... Good luck.

[ElGabo]

I'm just listening a song.

"Welcome to the jungle".....

 

[soy]

Extra "Plan B" hashrate for customers won't mean much if they wait until after Q2 to give it to us.

Now if they give it to us the moment the mega center is complete, then KnC is officially the best company out there hands down.

Hopefully it is turned on in the order the various batches were sold.

Unless they have fabbed out the new 28nm chips already.  Then there's no chance of giving us the hashrate by mid-April.  Which is when it needs to come online to ROI in bitcoin at current average difficulty growth.  Also, I wonder if they'll be using a new IC design for these new 28nm chips.  If so and it's more efficient than the old design.  Then why don't they offer us to take delivery of the equivalent hashrate with the new 28nm chips.  Instead of waiting for the 20nm chips.  Just ship us the racks that they'll be hosting I say.  If they design new more efficient 28nm chips and boards.

They were making over 800 boards a day (shipping 200 Jupiters a day @ 650+Gh/s each)during November... 3.6 peta by April or June (end of q2) isn't a problem.  
With those numbers... 650 Gh/s x 200/ day is 130Th/s a day....  they could have the entire 3.6 peta-hash whipped out in 28 days, based on OLD numbers.
No problem there... The challenge is.... can the data center be erected in time?... probably not... But with the current facility, and a couple smaller temps.... It could be done.... BUT   They need to have already started, and not wait until they "know for sure" Neptune is going to be late to dinner.... (Which we all know, they DO know, or the news and announcement would have never been given.)
So..... why not?....  they could be leasing any number of buildings, and have not shared any details... 15 mil profit made from Jupiter means they don't even need to touch Neptune money to do it. So all this conjecture and FUD is simply from fear....  and calculation!.... but wait!!! Calculation based on what?  Nobody knows what the offer is, or when.  It could be 5 th/s hosted beginning in April hosted for a year or until Neptune ships... The simple fact is we don't know! We made boo-coo from the Jupiter...and they are still pumpin'  (Some miners better than others)so give them a chance....  they are honoring refunds, and you will kick yourself in the ass if the offer is a good one, and you bailed already.... especially if you've been cashing out your coin as you made it, or on high-points.. and coin goes to 2 grand or above.... and calculating profit based on BTC return is ludicrous, because no calculator can show us ROI in BTC on ANY miner ANYWHERE, anytime soon.  Just sayin'    Either way... whatever you decide... Good luck.

I agree we don't know.  One might suspect the non-exact nature of the Plan B is to trigger refunds leaving those earlier order numbers free to take for its own farm.  A linear increase from returns in the first week Dec to the first week in Feb continued to the _first week in June_ shows an impossibly low mining return for the cost but luck in the last week hasn't been good and that could have fudged the plot.  Also, the plot might not continue in that linear progression as it's been exponential so far not linear.  But the falling return has to take a toll on the sale of new miners.  But new KnC miners did pay off.  But the comparison of the return of a new Merc when it arrived to its harvest now even having an additional board is stark.  And the linear plot continued to the first week in June shows a 3.6THs Neptune harvesting less than the pseudo-Saturn at present, not less than the Merc when it first arrived but less than the pseudo-Saturn at present.  So that hashrate climb cannot continue unabated. or can it?  I'm not confident it won't, after all these are magic money printing machines that anyone can buy.

[soy]

I like comparisons but I'm not sure this is valid.  Can the question why don't bitcoin mining gear manufacturers mine for themselves, be compared to pharmaceutical companies asking why cure herpes when they can profit from treating the many diseases that result from herpes family viri?  Nah, I don't like it.  The comparison brings in unrelated elements from fields afar that are too complex.

[RoadStress]

What's the electricity rate in Boden?

[sikke]

Extra "Plan B" hashrate for customers won't mean much if they wait until after Q2 to give it to us.

Now if they give it to us the moment the mega center is complete, then KnC is officially the best company out there hands down.

Hopefully it is turned on in the order the various batches were sold.

Unless they have fabbed out the new 28nm chips already.  Then there's no chance of giving us the hashrate by mid-April.  Which is when it needs to come online to ROI in bitcoin at current average difficulty growth.  Also, I wonder if they'll be using a new IC design for these new 28nm chips.  If so and it's more efficient than the old design.  Then why don't they offer us to take delivery of the equivalent hashrate with the new 28nm chips.  Instead of waiting for the 20nm chips.  Just ship us the racks that they'll be hosting I say.  If they design new more efficient 28nm chips and boards.

They were making over 800 boards a day (shipping 200 Jupiters a day @ 650+Gh/s each)during November... 3.6 peta(3 batches of 1200) by April or June (end of q2) isn't a problem.  
With those numbers... 650 Gh/s x 200/ day is 130Th/s a day....  they could have the entire 3.6 peta-hash whipped out in 28 days, based on OLD numbers.
No problem there... The challenge is.... can the data center be erected in time?... probably not... But with the current facility, and a couple smaller temps.... It could be done.... BUT   They need to have already started, and not wait until they "know for sure" Neptune is going to be late to dinner.... (Which we all know, they DO know, or the news and announcement would have never been given.)
So..... why not?....  they could be leasing any number of buildings, and have not shared any details... 15 mil profit made from Jupiter means they don't even need to touch Neptune money to do it. So all this conjecture and FUD is simply from fear....  and calculation!.... but wait!!! Calculation based on what?  Nobody knows what the offer is, or when.  It could be 5 th/s hosted beginning in April hosted for a year or until Neptune ships... The simple fact is we don't know! We made boo-coo from the Jupiter...and they are still pumpin'  (Some miners better than others)so give them a chance....  they are honoring refunds, and you will kick yourself in the ass if the offer is a good one, and you bailed already.... especially if you've been cashing out your coin as you made it, or on high-points.. and coin goes to 2 grand or above.... and calculating profit based on BTC return is ludicrous, because no calculator can show us ROI in BTC on ANY miner ANYWHERE, anytime soon.  Just sayin'    Either way... whatever you decide... Good luck.

My wellbeing or economy is not tied to btc anyway. Its hobby.

Its evident now KNC is months away from delivering and eaven myself i got some TH/s rolling with Avalon chips now. Bitmain antminers coming... 3-4TH/s is my target and i make it before KNC ships out anything....seems like KNC is in trouble but what good can this mega hashing centre bring to the bitcoinworld cmon 50% network hash rolled out at once. Its still 3600 coins per day.

Fair to say none knows whats gonna happen to bitcoin in next 2-3 months but to sustain this all cumulative expectations or ROI bitcoin need few Billions of $$$ flowing in to payoff all the new hardwares.. ppl seem to froget ROI and price gainis only paid off with new fiat money flowing in to bitcoin network... what happens if fiat money income wont meet the hardware flow... we might have 200$ bitcoin by the time KNC ships out... i am gonna be at right path..

Expectations of 30% difficulty hops every change and to keep BTC price steady needs Fiat money flowing in.

So many ppl in here are in gold fever expecting only profits and $$$  some will suffer.

[soy]

Be nice if they developed and offered only to pre-existing customers 20nm single-module devices, all for the good of diversified bitcoin mining of course.

[Phoenix1969]

I hope nobody here expects them to stop making equipment?  Because it's "Not good for the community"?
Uuuhh... We're not talking about a non-profit organization here,so that's not going to happen.
It's a "Dog eat Dog" world out there.... and Bitcoin ASICs are TOP DOG right now, and KNC is arguably TOP DOG of the yard.
Don't expect them to stop making records, because they aim to stay on top like any other would, and I'm at least 100% certain that they will do whatever it takes to ensure that position, within limits.
With that said... looking at the existing pre-order business model in comparison to what they could do and offer with the hosting facility... It's a no brain-er. I think it's entirely possible we may even have seen the last actual machine offered for sale for a long time, if ever.

[Searing]

I hope nobody here expects them to stop making equipment?  Because it's "Not good for the community"?
Uuuhh... We're not talking about a non-profit organization here,so that's not going to happen.
It's a "Dog eat Dog" world out there.... and Bitcoin ASICs are TOP DOG right now, and KNC is arguably TOP DOG of the yard.
Don't expect them to stop making records, because they aim to stay on top like any other would, and I'm at least 100% certain that they will do whatever it takes to ensure that position, within limits.
With that said... looking at the existing pre-order business model in comparison to what they could do and offer with the hosting facility... It's a no brain-er. I think it's entirely possible we may even have seen the last actual machine offered for sale for a long time, if ever.

that's the issue even if what they say is legit...and that they are trying to stop the flow of Neptune orders being cancelled in case they are late..they are seeing the same difficulty rise we see coming...dump of equip...maybe even large unknown farms springing up they have rumors of.....but again I expected this kinda thing in fall with 20mm neptunes in any cloud hosting farm (more efficient....more time to do it less drama ) why the big rush to make such a farm now? I suspect knc has better numbers on private farms etc then we have hitting the market and probably a better idea on competitors dumping equip as well...and decided they needed to pull the trigger now even if it was using the less then optimal 28mm units in their farm.....and it was jump on the cloud hosting farm idea (ie be the biggest) or watch the boat sail away...

that brings me to the point of even if all they say is legit and on the up and up...they get me a virtual miner....for a bit or longer or they get me a refund or they get me the physical miner..if they are gonna mine to be come the largest cloud hosting firm (even say their prices are fair) and any refund of neptunes  will be no big deal will just go in to the farm....if they stick with the 5% limit on mining (knc that is) ie letter of the intent....of what they make ......they still are gonna sell the other 95% part of the worlds largest cloud hosting farm...ie my 3TH is looking like virtual or physical is gonna be road kill...heck at this rate even if in a reasonable time frame.....again this is from best light viewpoint knc is on the up and up.

my concern in all this is virtual miner physical miner..er is the same in that ...the difficulty is gonna go up sooooo much faster because of knc (known attempt as worlds largest cloud miner) and others I don't know about who maybe lit a fire under knc's butt to do this NOW with 28mm machines ie asap...rather then wait after Neptune is shipped say in summer or fall

if I get either type of miner even with virtual miner free hosting for 6months and or physical miner on time

I am so much ROAD KILL for the price I paid vs the difficulty I can expect from all these elephant's doing the hokey pokey in the ice fields of cloud hosting farms in Sweden/Iceland etc

I be squished

that does not look good even from the direction of knc is on the up and up in all this.....quite the rush imho...why now ..why the urge to screw up your equip timeline
why the muddying of the waters with cloud hosting...why this sudden need for 'speed' ..ie they see a difficulty sh*t storm coming imho and are in full gale warning mode..

anyway again looks bad even if they honestly are trying to cover their butt our butt and hedge with cloud hosting all at the same time

seems to be a lot of ducking going on......but who/what and how much incoming artillery of difficulty are they (or we) hunkering down for?

too much drama

anyway my 2c worth from the 'best light' point of view...add plots and sub plots and it looks even more dire

still think  I'm gonna punt..how long can I hold out?...hmmmmm another question? I just know as soon as I get a refund they will reward virtual miners for waiting with 6Th or some other kind of unexpected kudos......(unlikely in fact ...likely with my luck)

as usual I know zip just angles on this hodge podge that is the future of my neputune(s)

Searing

[dropt]

[rambling]

So after your Neptune(s) and Jupiters are worthless, can KnC count on you being a cloudhashing customer?

[Searing]

[rambling]

So after your Neptune(s) and Jupiters are worthless, can KnC count on you being a cloudhashing customer?

yeah even if they really are looking out for the customer as they claim.....if what they are planning to do they think they need to
do to survive (ie being an equip mnfg alone an't viable no more) ...again even if their motives are 'pure' ....is see many others doing
the same kinda cloud hosting farms under the radar..so..it is gonna be an arms race of epic proportions imho

that is their bet.....they gotta go that way.....if they are legit they are trying to bring the customer(s) along too if they wish
to come..ie physical equipment either won't fly or be here on time or will be toast in some manner..bring the minons along
as a nice gesture.....

the flip side is they are just gonna do it and screw us we can come along and be a cloud hosting customer or not....

the only thing that KNC does have going for it is they do give us a choice of the (3) refund (2) virtual miner 3TH or (1) physical miner *supposedly*

I am still waiting on my pre-order upgrade to monarch equip from BFL no refund still have nothing from last April
and those at BFL are putting the finishing touches on their cloud hosting farm filled with monarch 600gh cards I 'loaned' them $$$
to make from last spring..ie they funded their gh farm for free and I got zip.....

could be worse I guess at least KNC is nice enough to light up the "EXIT" sign....and have lifeboats if mining is sinking...

again even best case scenario it don't look too rosy and not I'm not big on being a cloud hashing customer if everyone is making
giant cloud hosting farms and kNC feels the need to be the biggest and baddest and they also can make the equip at cost and fast
to be the biggest and baddest.....that is  a cloud hosting race/scenario minons like myself will not be able to keep up with imho.

again I be squished...too many dancing elephants.....

how I see it now trying to see it in the best light again add darker motives it looks even worse....

Searing