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Question: What type of pool payouts do you prefer?
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Author Topic: [40+ PH] SlushPool (slushpool.com); World's First Mining Pool  (Read 3857264 times)
mstrongbow
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June 27, 2014, 05:22:41 AM
 #17101

I set my payout to 1 BTC, I use to get 4 per month now I get two. when it goes down to 1 per month I may set the threshold to .5 BTC if I don't upgrade my hardware. when I go to spend those BTC, I do so with no fees. I don't know what kind of example you are looking for.

I just wanna know, how you manage to transfer BTC, without paying fees. Lets assume I have 1 BTC, which I received from my pool with one single transaction. What do I do (beside changing transaction fee to 0 in the wallet settings), to transfer 0.5 BTC without paying a fee? Will this be confirmed? When?

These questions bother me a lot, cause the way I understood the TX fee process, is that miners choose which TX to include in their blocks. And if someone is not paying the fee, the TX might not be confirmed at all...

Thank you.

When you try to send coins, you do so by picking inputs (payments you've received) which are equal to or greater than the amount you want to send.  The extra amount is sent back as change to yourself, and sometimes a piece of your inputs are used to pay a transaction fee.

The need to pay a transaction fee is based on the priority of your transaction.  This is determined by the "coin age" of your inputs.  Generally, "1 coin day" worth of age is high enough to avoid fees, as long as the transaction isn't huge.  A "coin day" would be 1 BTC with 144 confirmations, which is the target number of blocks in an average day.  If your input is 0.5 BTC, it would need 288 confirmations.  If it's 0.1 BTC, 1440 confirmations.

There's a few other caveats to a "no fee" default transaction.  These are:  All the outputs are at least 0.01 BTC and the transaction is under 1 KB in size.  Both of these are fairly easy to meet as long as your wallet isn't full of small inputs.

More detail is included here: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Transaction_fees


Keep in mind that these are the default rules.  There's a few other things that can create delays, such as other similar "qualified free transactions" with a higher priority than yours.  By default bitcoind only allocates a specific amount (17 KB IIRC) to processing no-fee + high priority transactions.

Good info to know! Thanks for posting this  Grin

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June 27, 2014, 05:24:05 AM
 #17102

When you try to send coins, you do so by picking inputs (payments you've received) which are equal to or greater than the amount you want to send.  The extra amount is sent back as change to yourself, and sometimes a piece of your inputs are used to pay a transaction fee.

The need to pay a transaction fee is based on the priority of your transaction.  This is determined by the "coin age" of your inputs.  Generally, "1 coin day" worth of age is high enough to avoid fees, as long as the transaction isn't huge.  A "coin day" would be 1 BTC with 144 confirmations, which is the target number of blocks in an average day.  If your input is 0.5 BTC, it would need 288 confirmations.  If it's 0.1 BTC, 1440 confirmations.

There's a few other caveats to a "no fee" default transaction.  These are:  All the outputs are at least 0.01 BTC and the transaction is under 1 KB in size.  Both of these are fairly easy to meet as long as your wallet isn't full of small inputs.

More detail is included here: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Transaction_fees


Keep in mind that these are the default rules.  There's a few other things that can create delays, such as other similar "qualified free transactions" with a higher priority than yours.  By default bitcoind only allocates a specific amount (17 KB IIRC) to processing no-fee + high priority transactions.

Thank you so much!!!

It makes lot of sense now to me. Is there a wallet software, that will "show" which coins are qualifying for a fee free transaction?
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June 27, 2014, 05:58:28 AM
 #17103

Thank you so much!!!

It makes lot of sense now to me. Is there a wallet software, that will "show" which coins are qualifying for a fee free transaction?

I'm having trouble remembering if bitcoind/bitcoin-qt prioritized older coins (high coin age) or fewest inputs (least tx size).  I don't THINK it will automatically figure out the way to make one qualify for no fee.

Unfortunately, I'm not familiar enough with 3rd party wallets to identify which ones (if any) will let you pick which inputs to use for making your transaction, or if any of them have been designed to attempt to prioritize making a transaction qualify for no-fee.

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June 27, 2014, 06:16:59 AM
 #17104

Thank you!
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June 27, 2014, 03:04:25 PM
 #17105

If the difficulty goes up and u have 900 gh and receive .01 as reward per block found does the reward for your work drop as the difficulty goes up?
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June 27, 2014, 05:07:55 PM
 #17106

If the difficulty goes up and u have 900 gh and receive .01 as reward per block found does the reward for your work drop as the difficulty goes up?

Correct. That is why a cryptocurrency miner must continually increase their hashrate

Please explain where my stupidity is misguided. My impression was that if the pool hashrate did not change, but the difficulty went up (due to the target number of blocks "found" occured earlier than the target time) that your "reward" per block would not change, but the number of blocks the pool would resolve would be lower due to the increased difficulty, thereby reducing your "daily reward". That being said, the reason that the Cryptocurrency miner would have to continually increase their hashrate (buy more equipment or OC their current stock) would be to increase the pool hashrate such that the number of blocks "found" by the pool would increase to the point where the "Number of blocks found" x "the reduced reward$" would equal the previously established "Daily reward", thereby maintaining the status quo. Further detailed explaination is anticipated with great eagerness!
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June 27, 2014, 05:19:42 PM
 #17107

If the difficulty goes up and u have 900 gh and receive .01 as reward per block found does the reward for your work drop as the difficulty goes up?

Correct. That is why a cryptocurrency miner must continually increase their hashrate

Please explain where my stupidity is misguided. My impression was that if the pool hashrate did not change, but the difficulty went up (due to the target number of blocks "found" occured earlier than the target time) that your "reward" per block would not change, but the number of blocks the pool would resolve would be lower due to the increased difficulty, thereby reducing your "daily reward". That being said, the reason that the Cryptocurrency miner would have to continually increase their hashrate (buy more equipment or OC their current stock) would be to increase the pool hashrate such that the number of blocks "found" by the pool would increase to the point where the "Number of blocks found" x "the reduced reward$" would equal the previously established "Daily reward", thereby maintaining the status quo. Further detailed explaination is anticipated with great eagerness!

If your hash rate stays the same but the pool hash rate goes up then - your reward per round goes down

If slush's pool hash rate remains the same but the overall network hash rate goes up - your reward remains the same but slush finds less blocks

If your hash rate, the pool hash rate and the network hash rate ALL remain the same, but difficulty goes up - your reward remains the same but slush finds less block...

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June 27, 2014, 05:22:40 PM
 #17108

If the difficulty goes up and u have 900 gh and receive .01 as reward per block found does the reward for your work drop as the difficulty goes up?

Correct. That is why a cryptocurrency miner must continually increase their hashrate

Not correct, increasing difficulty will not alter your slush reward per round - just makes blocks harder to find and hence you find them less often...

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RogMiner
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June 27, 2014, 05:29:14 PM
 #17109

So as I understand it if you have say 1TH/s at the moment you should expect to receive say about .005 per block (excuse the crude figures but they are really for explanation purposes only), and if we currently gat an average of about 5 blocks a day, you earn about about .025BTC per day.

If the difficulty increases then as long as everything else stays the same you should expect about a 20% drop in revenue, this means that you will only see an average of 4 blocks a day, so now you are looking at about 0.20 btc a day.

Now what really happens is that as difficulty increases people invest in new hardware and push up their hash rates to continue to earn more than the electric costs. If you leave your has rate the same your share of the block will decrease in real terms. So what happens is that difficulty goes up and hash rate goes up leaving us still finding about 5 blocks a day but if you haven't increased your hash rate then your earnings will actually go down by 20% per block. In other words your reward per block will drop to .04 and we will still find about 5 blocks a day.

Your cloice is ever decreasing revenues until the revenue is less than the electric cost, at which point you need to retire your equipment (unless you expect BTC prices to increase dramatically), or an ever increasing spend on equipment in the hope that you can play the margins and make more than you spend.

If like me your doing it because its fun, and you hope to make your money back when BTC are worth $1,000,000 each then just keep your old kit and wait, if however this is a real money making exercise then you must increase your hash rate and keep an eye on energy prices if you want to turn a profit.
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June 27, 2014, 05:31:18 PM
 #17110

If the difficulty goes up and u have 900 gh and receive .01 as reward per block found does the reward for your work drop as the difficulty goes up?

Correct. That is why a cryptocurrency miner must continually increase their hashrate

Not correct, increasing difficulty will not alter your slush reward per round - just makes blocks harder to find and hence you find them less often...

I stand corrected.  Grin

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June 27, 2014, 05:44:22 PM
 #17111

So as I understand it if you have say 1TH/s at the moment you should expect to receive say about .005 per block (excuse the crude figures but they are really for explanation purposes only), and if we currently gat an average of about 5 blocks a day, you earn about about .025BTC per day.

If the difficulty increases then as long as everything else stays the same you should expect about a 20% drop in revenue, this means that you will only see an average of 4 blocks a day, so now you are looking at about 0.20 btc a day.

Now what really happens is that as difficulty increases people invest in new hardware and push up their hash rates to continue to earn more than the electric costs. If you leave your has rate the same your share of the block will decrease in real terms. So what happens is that difficulty goes up and hash rate goes up leaving us still finding about 5 blocks a day but if you haven't increased your hash rate then your earnings will actually go down by 20% per block. In other words your reward per block will drop to .04 and we will still find about 5 blocks a day.

Your cloice is ever decreasing revenues until the revenue is less than the electric cost, at which point you need to retire your equipment (unless you expect BTC prices to increase dramatically), or an ever increasing spend on equipment in the hope that you can play the margins and make more than you spend.

If like me your doing it because its fun, and you hope to make your money back when BTC are worth $1,000,000 each then just keep your old kit and wait, if however this is a real money making exercise then you must increase your hash rate and keep an eye on energy prices if you want to turn a profit.


Correct Smiley

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June 27, 2014, 07:10:24 PM
 #17112

WTF? Diff Increase 30%?
some more such increases and i have to sell my S1 Antminers Sad
damn electricity prices.



dude! haven't you seen what is still to be delivered? network hash rate will probably double by the end of summer.

I retired 18 Erupter Blades a few weeks ago and my S1's will no longer be profitable soon as well. The blades were running since September of last year and did well, the S1's covered their cost and just a little over. It makes me wonder how the guys who spent >$2,000 on terrahash units will be doing in a couple of months, do you think they'll manage to recover 50% of cost before they are fully depreciated?

Are you looking to sell any of them? Electricity doesn't cost me a thing so I might be interested.

I dumped them all on eBay. I paired them standing them up in an old ATX motherboard with a 350 watt power supply for each pair, advertising them as Bitcoin Starter Kits. All nine pairs went with Buy It Now purchases in 24 hours. Suckers...  Wink Even if electricity is free your time is not, and I don't know about anyone else but a pair of these takes too much attention to run for a month and earn a measly 0.01 at the next jump.
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June 27, 2014, 07:24:46 PM
 #17113

If the difficulty goes up and u have 900 gh and receive .01 as reward per block found does the reward for your work drop as the difficulty goes up?

Correct. That is why a cryptocurrency miner must continually increase their hashrate

Not correct, increasing difficulty will not alter your slush reward per round - just makes blocks harder to find and hence you find them less often...

Slightly correct Not exactly.  You would assume if the difficulty is increasing, the pool hash rate is at least increasing slightly.


Assuming your hash rate does not grow:
1) Pool hash rate is growing at the same rate as the network => Same rate of block finds, but you get a smaller reward per block.
2) Pool hash rate is shrinking proportionally to the network (IE: Network grows 30%, pool only grows 20%) => Lower rate of block finds, you get a smaller reward per block.
3) Pool hash rate doesn't change => Lower rate of block finds, you get the same reward per block.
4) Pool hash rate is growing faster than network growth rate => Faster rate of block finds, but you get smaller rewards per block

In all 4 scenarios though, your expected earnings are decreasing since your hash rate is stagnant while the network difficulty continues to grow.


I've bolded the one that is most likely given the current mining climate.  Manufacturers are continuing to build up private mining farms which effectively shrink the share traditional pools have of the network, since Bitcoin is a zero-sum game.  For every large private farm that comes online, the amount which pools are able to obtain shrinks.



EDIT:  Edited to clarify what I was responding to.

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nottm28
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June 27, 2014, 07:55:20 PM
 #17114

Slightly correct actually...

Nah. If the only thing to increase was difficulty then your reward per round on slush pool would not change. You'd just find fewer blocks...

Original statement was either 'correct' or 'incorrect' - mathematics knows of no 'slightly correct' - unless you bring in quantum theory...

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June 27, 2014, 08:03:40 PM
 #17115

Massive drop in network hash rate with 292 block to be solved before the next difficulty jump - coincidence?

Slush lost 1 PH/s (~25%)
Ghash lost 10 PH/s (~25%)

That's some power to be able to turn off 25% on the network...

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June 27, 2014, 08:33:08 PM
 #17116

And the rich get richer while we just mine away.............

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June 27, 2014, 08:33:25 PM
 #17117

Slightly correct actually...

Nah. If the only thing to increase was difficulty then your reward per round on slush pool would not change. You'd just find fewer blocks...

Original statement was either 'correct' or 'incorrect' - mathematics knows of no 'slightly correct' - unless you bring in quantum theory...


Edited post to clarify that I was responding to your statement about difficulty not affecting slush reward per round.

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June 27, 2014, 09:29:43 PM
 #17118

Slightly correct actually...

Nah. If the only thing to increase was difficulty then your reward per round on slush pool would not change. You'd just find fewer blocks...

Original statement was either 'correct' or 'incorrect' - mathematics knows of no 'slightly correct' - unless you bring in quantum theory...


Edited post to clarify that I was responding to your statement about difficulty not affecting slush reward per round.

Sorry to be pedantic:

...
2) Pool hash rate is shrinking proportionally to the network (IE: Network grows 30%, pool only grows 20%) => Lower rate of block finds, you get a smaller reward per block.

I've bolded the one that is most likely given the current mining climate.
...

Your bold'un is still not quite right.

As long as your hash rate increases proprtionally with the pool hash rate, then the no matter what happens with difficulty or network hash rate, your block reward will remain the same. You might find fewer blocks however but your block reward only goes down if you don't match the increases in your pool rate.

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June 27, 2014, 10:40:36 PM
 #17119

I am a noob, but I really need help.  Not personal, just technical. I am using mining.bitcoin.cz and guiminer on my windows system.

My nvidia cards appear to be working properly, and data shows up on my account page just fine. I have a dual cpu 6-core xeon workstation and my cpus are on vacation most of the time, so I added rpcminer, and although guiminer show good results in Mhash/s nothing appears on my account page.  There's no way I can see what's going on except that the cores are all maxed, so something is happening but nothing appears on my account page.

I decided to use mining_proxy.exe and this allows me to at least see some activity from rpcminer but most of the msgs are requests asking for new work.
(2014-06-27 16:36:07,663 INFO proxy getwork_listener._on_authorized # Worker 'my_worker's name' asks for new work)

Is all this normal?

Thank-you for your help.
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June 27, 2014, 11:23:23 PM
 #17120

I am a noob, but I really need help.  Not personal, just technical. I am using mining.bitcoin.cz and guiminer on my windows system.

My nvidia cards appear to be working properly, and data shows up on my account page just fine. I have a dual cpu 6-core xeon workstation and my cpus are on vacation most of the time, so I added rpcminer, and although guiminer show good results in Mhash/s nothing appears on my account page.  There's no way I can see what's going on except that the cores are all maxed, so something is happening but nothing appears on my account page.

I decided to use mining_proxy.exe and this allows me to at least see some activity from rpcminer but most of the msgs are requests asking for new work.
(2014-06-27 16:36:07,663 INFO proxy getwork_listener._on_authorized # Worker 'my_worker's name' asks for new work)

Is all this normal?

Thank-you for your help.

You should add some screenshots, visual aids help ppls help you

And i dunno about cpu's, they might be too slow to register

also where we in the middle of a long round, no results will show except for estimate reward until a block is solved.

(Edit) If your hell bent on using cpu's, you can add them to guiminer from memory, just add the same way you did your cards.

You should try script mining with the HW you have

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