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Author Topic: [ANN] DERO: DAG + Cryptonote + Bulletproofs + SSL + POW + Smart Contracts  (Read 121196 times)
valgandar
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July 10, 2018, 06:49:18 PM
 #3601


I, too, ended up coming around on the reasoning behind sticking with original Cryptonight, but after thinking on it some more I identified a few other potential problems:
...


You know that this tech is literally the best of its kind around, you know what the potential is for Dero, even if they disappointed you with they way they handled things, and it's not like I wasn't disappointed, but I can easily look past it because I use many things and support many things in life that I don't necessary get along with or agree on everything with the people who made it..  At the end of the day, the tech wins, even if you're currently upset about it and some of the earlier supporters are too, the tech and subsequent success will move on with or without you.  I think people are making way too big of a deal about this because in reality it doesn't change their lives in any way, and Dero is still the best tech around, and was never meant to be some community coin that the community makes all the decision on.

Actually, I don't know how good DERO's tech is because the source code hasn't been released, there haven't been any public comments from the "experienced" cryptographers that were asked to evaluate it, nor have there been any updates to the (closed source) binaries since June 29 (implying no one found even a minor bug in the code after weeks of feverish work and a testnet that saw updates being released on an hourly basis at times).



There are two options to check out how good is DERO's tech.
1] First Dont wait for others , start  DYOR, Go through the already released source code https://github.com/deroproject/derosuite , let me know if you are capable to figure out something good.
2] Else see below and start believing on others:
 DERO find place in blockchains build from scratch Smiley  https://twitter.com/cryptic_monk/status/999227961059528704


https://i.imgur.com/t71KA5K.png
https://i.imgur.com/6hZfLhH.png

Pls feel free if you still have any doubts.

Rd.
Captain.




The last commit was in April 12th. I think he's talking about all the big changes made in the last months in Atlantis.
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krypt0id
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July 10, 2018, 06:53:36 PM
Last edit: July 10, 2018, 10:01:18 PM by krypt0id
 #3602


The last commit was in April 12th. I think he's talking about all the big changes made in the last months in Atlantis.


Even if you remove the DAG, it is a port of cryptonote in Go, not a fork.

DERO - Secure. Private. Smart Contracts.
scott d
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July 11, 2018, 09:12:42 AM
 #3603

Congrat CaptDero, Dero is a long hodl  Smiley




https://i.imgur.com/dArQapw.jpg


Hello @Everyone,
Since the time the DERO Project started weʼve had the opportunity to grow in many wonderful ways that have helped us bring some of the best technology available to the blockchain. We feel itʼs time to grow in another extremely valuable way by helping with the formation of & “DERO Community Advisory Board” (DCAB). The purpose of this board would be to advise the DERO team on behalf of the collective community, oversee DERO Project development and the community in & manner seen fit for DERO by the community.  All long term DERO supporters and DERO technology believers, pls drop a mail on [support ATT dero.io].

Thanks.

Regards.
Captain
MagicSmoker
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July 11, 2018, 12:53:02 PM
 #3604

Welp, it appears that --Serena-- has abruptly left the DERO team with no public explanation given. File under: the beatings will continue until morale improves.

MagicSmoker
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July 11, 2018, 01:08:47 PM
 #3605

There are two options to check out how good is DERO's tech.
1] First Dont wait for others , start  DYOR, Go through the already released source code https://github.com/deroproject/derosuite , let me know if you are capable to figure out something good.
2] Else see below and start believing on others:
 DERO find place in blockchains build from scratch Smiley  https://twitter.com/cryptic_monk/status/999227961059528704

[images deleted]

Pls feel free if you still have any doubts.

Rd.
Captain.

All @cryptic_monk said in the tweet/google doc spreadsheet was a repeat of what you have said about DERO Atlantis - that it's a rewrite of CryptoNote in Go.

Furthermore, it isn't even clear if he was referring to the latest Atlantis code - i.e., he met your onerous requirements of either having a MSc/PhD or 6+ years experience in cryptography - or is commenting on the outdated and incomplete code that is available on github (as @valgandar points out).

krypt0id
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July 11, 2018, 04:52:06 PM
 #3606

There are two options to check out how good is DERO's tech.
1] First Dont wait for others , start  DYOR, Go through the already released source code https://github.com/deroproject/derosuite , let me know if you are capable to figure out something good.
2] Else see below and start believing on others:
 DERO find place in blockchains build from scratch Smiley  https://twitter.com/cryptic_monk/status/999227961059528704

[images deleted]

Pls feel free if you still have any doubts.

Rd.
Captain.

All @cryptic_monk said in the tweet/google doc spreadsheet was a repeat of what you have said about DERO Atlantis - that it's a rewrite of CryptoNote in Go.

Furthermore, it isn't even clear if he was referring to the latest Atlantis code - i.e., he met your onerous requirements of either having a MSc/PhD or 6+ years experience in cryptography - or is commenting on the outdated and incomplete code that is available on github (as @valgandar points out).



The code on Github is still a rewrite of cryptonote in a new language. Before you dismiss that, I think you should take into consideration how hard that is. It requires a deep understanding of cryptography and blockchain. If anybody that can even understand that piece would like to come forward with bugs/security flaws in the Github code, I will allow them to cast a shadow of doubt on the years of experience required to write it (or read it properly).

Until then, I'm on capt's side and I can wait a month.

DERO - Secure. Private. Smart Contracts.
MagicSmoker
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July 11, 2018, 05:34:09 PM
Last edit: July 11, 2018, 08:57:13 PM by MagicSmoker
 #3607

All @cryptic_monk said in the tweet/google doc spreadsheet was a repeat of what you have said about DERO Atlantis - that it's a rewrite of CryptoNote in Go.

Furthermore, it isn't even clear if he was referring to the latest Atlantis code - i.e., he met your onerous requirements of either having a MSc/PhD or 6+ years experience in cryptography - or is commenting on the outdated and incomplete code that is available on github (as @valgandar points out).


The code on Github is still a rewrite of cryptonote in a new language. Before you dismiss that, I think you should take into consideration how hard that is. It requires a deep understanding of cryptography and blockchain. If anybody that can even understand that piece would like to come forward with bugs/security flaws in the Github code, I will allow them to cast a shadow of doubt on the years of experience required to write it (or read it properly).

Until then, I'm on capt's side and I can wait a month.

I'm not dismissing anything, and I don't have the programming skill or knowledge of cryptography to make even a cursory evaluation of a blockchain*, but I did start actively trading in my personal brokerage account in the late 90's so I've seen a massively hyped technology cycle play out before...

And just so you know, I haven't sold any of my DERO since the disastrous announcement of June 23rd, so I still believe in the project overall, but that belief is much reduced in strength and I am basically just one negative issue away from dumping my bags for good.


* - which CaptDero alluded to with the snarky, "let me know if you are capable to figure out something good," comment.
fellestreum
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July 12, 2018, 09:43:37 AM
 #3608


* - which CaptDero alluded to with the snarky, "let me know if you are capable to figure out something good," comment.

I wouldn't interpret that as snarky.  I don't think Capt is a native speaker of English.  Substitute "able" for "capable" and there is no tone of snarikiness IMO.  No reason for him to be snarky, either.  It's unmotivated.
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July 12, 2018, 11:14:30 AM
 #3609


* - which CaptDero alluded to with the snarky, "let me know if you are capable to figure out something good," comment.

I wouldn't interpret that as snarky.  I don't think Capt is a native speaker of English.  Substitute "able" for "capable" and there is no tone of snarikiness IMO.  No reason for him to be snarky, either.  It's unmotivated.

Meh, it doesn't matter either way because I didn't take the comment personally.
Slimdev
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July 12, 2018, 11:42:53 AM
 #3610

dero.fairhash.org

Transparent Dero pool with 24/7 support

Features:

- Mining to exchange

- Workers

- Adjustable instant payout levels

- Email and telegram notifications

- SSL
Azzi
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July 13, 2018, 12:37:32 AM
 #3611

The code on Github is still a rewrite of cryptonote in a new language. Before you dismiss that, I think you should take into consideration how hard that is. It requires a deep understanding of cryptography and blockchain. If anybody that can even understand that piece would like to come forward with bugs/security flaws in the Github code, I will allow them to cast a shadow of doubt on the years of experience required to write it (or read it properly).
What Dero devs accomplished so far was a really hard task done very quickly and it seems with rather few bugs they needed to patch. It tells you they are very talented and hard working. There are very few developers in the whole crypto space who can be compared to them. They must have their reasons for the secrecy surrounding the project and we should respect this.
CaptDero
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July 13, 2018, 06:07:21 AM
 #3612

Full Premine intact as of 12 JULY 2018.

MagicSmoker
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July 13, 2018, 12:13:35 PM
Last edit: July 13, 2018, 12:42:46 PM by MagicSmoker
 #3613

What Dero devs accomplished so far was a really hard task done very quickly and it seems with rather few bugs they needed to patch. It tells you they are very talented and hard working. There are very few developers in the whole crypto space who can be compared to them. They must have their reasons for the secrecy surrounding the project and we should respect this.

Since the source code hasn't actually been released - and now there is some question as to whether "experienced cryptographers" were even allowed to look at it in private - we don't really know what the "devs" have accomplished (put in quotes because I'm not convinced there is more than one).

Frankly, all I can see is a drop in price from $1.70US to <$0.70US ever since the Atlantis announcement on June 23rd; everything else is hearsay.

Whether their reasons for secrecy are legit isn't the question, it's whether their reasons for lying are legit. So far the community, in the form of the market*, calls bullshit on their antics.


* - something devs ought to always keep in mind; once your coin is mineable and tradeable you need to behave more like a public company with shareholders, than a private fiefdom with serfs.


Abrustetha
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July 13, 2018, 12:52:23 PM
 #3614

funny after alienating community members (and banning them - like myself) they now want to establish a community advisory board?

i had such high hopes, and still have high hopes for dero. but it just seems like a neverending spiral down the rabbit hole.

i can only hope the price recovers a bit so i can at least salvage some of my investment and mining expenses.

The AMA tomorrow is bound to be interesting....
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July 13, 2018, 01:15:50 PM
 #3615

Community Advisory Board was already formed, privately I believe
MagicSmoker
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July 13, 2018, 01:21:53 PM
 #3616

Community Advisory Board was already formed, privately I believe

I'm not on it; are you? I didn't really see the point since the wily ol' Cap'n hasn't listened to a damn thing the community has said so far (not that the community is always right, but the point remains).

shanepottermi
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July 13, 2018, 07:49:46 PM
 #3617

Community Advisory Board was already formed, privately I believe

I'm not on it; are you? I didn't really see the point since the wily ol' Cap'n hasn't listened to a damn thing the community has said so far (not that the community is always right, but the point remains).



Did Serena really quit the Dero team? If thats true things internally have to be pretty bad. I wouldn't know though as I'm still banned from their Discord and don't care enough to make a dummy account to get back in.
scott d
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July 13, 2018, 09:45:27 PM
 #3618

Serena is on Discord  Smiley
krypt0id
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July 13, 2018, 11:03:21 PM
 #3619

Community Advisory Board was already formed, privately I believe

I'm not on it; are you? I didn't really see the point since the wily ol' Cap'n hasn't listened to a damn thing the community has said so far (not that the community is always right, but the point remains).



The advisory board has many long time supporters that may not be active on the ANN.

DERO - Secure. Private. Smart Contracts.
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July 14, 2018, 05:26:18 AM
 #3620

IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT

To whom Captain, Dero’s lead developer feels it does not concern,

This is an urgent message from Serena, and Mojo to the DERO community. When Mojo and I started with DERO (at different times) we did so with the understanding that DERO was a community based project (https://github.com/deroproject/documentation/blob/master/WhitePaper.md - https://imgur.com/a/7YuroN5 and more archived in various public places). We joined after communicating with Captain that we have a strong personal focus on the ideologies surrounding the field of cryptography (https://www.activism.net/cypherpunk/manifesto.html), outstanding morals, promising technology, and the goal of helping as many people as we were able to while growing and learning ourselves.

Mojo and I recently discovered that Captain has to date no intention of locking the DERO premine (https://imgur.com/a/I2eKS94) and instead intends to disregard both the originally stated intentions of DERO (https://github.com/deroproject/documentation/blob/master/WhitePaper.md) and the more recent public promises to lock the premine when Atlantis launched and we had confirmation of the actual block times. Worse, Captain intends to propose an ongoing agreement with John McAffee (https://twitter.com/officialmcafee/status/887024683379544065?lang=en) for an ongoing piece of the premine (https://imgur.com/a/hYuzSXS). This is Captain’s proposed version of aggressive marketing, while Serena was pushing for https://wachsman.com/. In order for a leading blockchain marketing company to pick up DERO, they require that the team meet its commitments in all areas, including transparency, roadmap goals, communication, and how teams deal with issues. Captain did not want to meet that criteria (which was discussed frequently and grouped in with exchange discussions), and was unwilling to explore Serena’s option further, proclaimed John “the best”, and opted instead for the John McAffee route. This is an example of Serena making a gentle, and valid suggestion regarding a legitimate company, and having it passed over entirely. (1/3 https://imgur.com/a/IRzOFes 2/3 https://imgur.com/a/O3Dgzk1 3/3 https://imgur.com/a/I2eKS94)

On July.3/2018 I, Serena, spoke internally directly with Captain, obviously not for the first time, to explain there were communication issues, disregard for the community, and things needed to change. (https://imgur.com/a/35o4rGn).

On July.4/2018, the following day Serena stated exasperation with the communication issues, Captain announced information to the public that he deemed the team did not need to know early, and when we started out concern again, it was again brushed aside. (https://imgur.com/a/HPuZt8G)

As the communication issues, and general disregard for the community got worse, so did the concern from Mojo and Serena. Captain was making an entirely centralized decision regarding who would be added to the DERO Community Advisory Board, and Serena spent hours trying to explain that was not appropriate for the DERO core team (Captain 100% exclusively) to form this for the community with the intention of controlling membership. Serena also showed deep concern when she asked “What will the DERO core team do in the event of a strong disagreement with the DCAB when they have an overwhelming consensus?”. This question went unanswered after multiple attempts to gain an answer. This is just an example of the type of very valid and simple questions that went chronically unanswered nearly 100% of the time for both DERO community members. (1/2 https://imgur.com/a/tN5M5hd 2/2 and Captain claiming the DCAB is decentralized https://imgur.com/a/7VDrmQ8)

In fact, many of the core members including Mojo and Serena had no idea who even joined the DCAB as Captain invited people at will without so much as mentioning he would be doing so to the DERO community team.

Core member spends 1 full month building http://stats.atlantis.dero.live/ for free and Captain won’t even bother to respond to him (https://imgur.com/a/3O5XxMh). More long term members with no knowledge even after the DCAB formed (1/2 https://imgur.com/a/IZvW8bh 2/2 https://imgur.com/a/4rTAmxu)

Captain blatantly lying to the entire communication for no reason regarding the reason Serena left (to prove a valid point) - https://imgur.com/a/pyfMIhu

Captain ignoring ongoing communication issues as it relates to a Bittrex listing and ultimately refuses to change his way to the detriment of the community - https://imgur.com/a/c0vHBsl

Serena discovers that DERO had a 3.07 minute block time for 204 days from launch until Atlantis released on the mainnet. Serena has been trying to solve core issues quietly since the first day she joined with ethical and polite disclosure, and even with offers of proof, her discovery of major flaws is ignored on more than one occasion. (https://imgur.com/a/XQND80b) - this resulted in somewhere around a 35% reduction in block rewards for all miners from Day 1 to Day 204 and Captain refused to acknowledge, fix the problem, or even inform the community.

A similar issue exists in Atlantis in a new form. Captain had originally announced that they expected the topoheight (side blocks) to increase at a rate of around 10% - 15% faster than the “block height”. In reality, the network is producing around 30 - 50% more side blocks (topoheight) than normal blocks, and distributing the associated additional rewards. Further, Captain publicly stated that the developers would change the DERO emission curve to make it less profitable for current ASIC miners giving others a greater opportunity in the future. These changes unfortunately never went into effect, or were so minimal that we have an increased emission rate, not a decreased one. This is on top of the 3.07 minute block times we had for 204 days. (https://imgur.com/a/WWVaWF1)

This is Serena and Mojo informing the community that we’ve been trying to work on things politely and internally since day 1 of each of us joining DERO respectively. However, since Captain is going to spend the premine early, and change the originally stated terms, we felt that this showed the ultimate disrespect for the community collectively, their ideals, and the individuals who support DERO.

Serena - DERO community manager
Mojo - DERO team
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