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Author Topic: HashFast announces specs for new ASIC: 400GH/s  (Read 875472 times)
cedivad
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December 25, 2013, 09:59:12 AM
 #4981

If HF claims against us that they where for some reason not producing PCBs at that time, we can easily prove it using that video (google is even worse than facebook, they keep a copy of everything).

But since that i doubt this will happen, we don't need to worry for now.

My anger against what is wrong in the Bitcoin community is productive:
Bitcointa.lk - Replace "Bitcointalk.org" with "Bitcointa.lk" in this url to see how this page looks like on a proper forum (Announcement Thread)
Hashfast.org - Wiki for screwed customers
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December 25, 2013, 10:49:56 AM
 #4982

No need to be in each others hair. If ice is willing to forgive them for late delay,  then that's up to him. But the majority are pissed  because they lied and it hit people at personal level including me. Someone like ceDavid and gmaxwell have put alot of trust and investment in to this company from what I can gather. All they can give back is updates that are not inline  with the customers demands. They know they can find us here. But refuse to comment or send a email to buyers personally,  not even an apology. They dates have come and gone,  they will not ship let's make that clear. Like I said previously enjoy you holiday season and merry Christmas to everyone.
I hope people will take this case to court and win. best of luck to all  Smiley

_HashFast Technologies_28 nm mining
Producer of High Performance ASICS  (IT'S A SCAM)
BabyJets & Sierras On Sale today!
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December 25, 2013, 11:15:11 AM
 #4983

A slightly OT example: For those following along at home who don't get why HF batch 1 customers are so unhappy about their "october" batch 1 units,  compare: Instead of paying 55 BTC months ago for a 400GH HF batch 1 unit with uncertain delivery they could have sat comfortably on their coin and today ordered 3.1 TH/s of antminer for immediate delivery for the same price (or just got 360GH/s for 6.3 BTC).  Even figuring it in terms of USD, the little antminer devices are lower cost per GH/s than hashfast batch 1 devices which are still not shipping.



Bitcoin will not be compromised
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December 25, 2013, 11:49:45 AM
 #4984

A slightly OT example: For those following along at home who don't get why HF batch 1 customers are so unhappy about their "october" batch 1 units,  compare: Instead of paying 55 BTC months ago for a 400GH HF batch 1 unit with uncertain delivery they could have sat comfortably on their coin and today ordered 3.1 TH/s of antminer for immediate delivery for the same price (or just got 360GH/s for 6.3 BTC).  Even figuring it in terms of USD, the little antminer devices are lower cost per GH/s than hashfast batch 1 devices which are still not shipping.

*sigh....

Yes I wish I had an early KnC order and a Batch1 Avalon.  But I didn't.  I had a batch 2/3 and same thing happened to that Batch 3.  Still pissed.  At least I didn't have BFL.

In bitcoin mining one in the hand beats two in the bush any day...  Pre-orders are simply fail, even KnC would have been fail if BTC hadn't appreciated....

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December 25, 2013, 11:53:23 AM
 #4985


95% increase month over month over month? Bullshit. Not gonna happen.

As i stated, right now our average is 94%. Also it has gone up in past months as much as 140%

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December 25, 2013, 04:57:33 PM
 #4986

A slightly OT example: For those following along at home who don't get why HF batch 1 customers are so unhappy about their "october" batch 1 units,  compare: Instead of paying 55 BTC months ago for a 400GH HF batch 1 unit with uncertain delivery they could have sat comfortably on their coin and today ordered 3.1 TH/s of antminer for immediate delivery for the same price (or just got 360GH/s for 6.3 BTC).  Even figuring it in terms of USD, the little antminer devices are lower cost per GH/s than hashfast batch 1 devices which are still not shipping.

*sigh....

Yes I wish I had an early KnC order and a Batch1 Avalon.  But I didn't.  I had a batch 2/3 and same thing happened to that Batch 3.  Still pissed.  At least I didn't have BFL.

In bitcoin mining one in the hand beats two in the bush any day...  Pre-orders are simply fail, even KnC would have been fail if BTC hadn't appreciated....




Don't make the mistake of making equivalence between Avalon and any other supplier.  What Yifu and Ngzhang did was far worse than what any one else has done in this space by a very long distance.

Yifu and Ngzhang stole the batch 2 machines to mine for themselves.  Eventually they delivered the batch 3 machines (months late) to batch 2 and 3 customers.

Hashfast simply followed the BFL model of promising something that couldn't be delivered.  After the BFL example, it was trivial for anyone to know that they were overpromising based on semiconductor fabrication timelines.  Those who bought the first batch without proof of a tapeout knew they were buying into hot air, but greed overwhelmed any rational consideration of doing business on reasonable terms.

Like BFL before them, increases in the exchange rate will bail out Hashfast's early investors.  And BFL and Hashfast will continue to have customers because greed overwhelms all common sense in Bitcoin.
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December 25, 2013, 05:18:44 PM
 #4987

Those who bought the first batch without proof of a tapeout knew they were buying into hot air, but greed overwhelmed any rational consideration of doing business on reasonable terms.
Nah, run the numbers on what return was expected even if everything had gone according to plan. No one who can multiply bought in here because of an abundance of greed, it was never _that_ attractive an offer. The deal needed sweeteners like MPP, refund in BTC, in person meetings, and a partnership with an experienced design house before it sounded attractive.

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December 25, 2013, 05:32:17 PM
 #4988

Those who bought the first batch without proof of a tapeout knew they were buying into hot air, but greed overwhelmed any rational consideration of doing business on reasonable terms.
Nah, run the numbers on what return was expected even if everything had gone according to plan. No one who can multiply bought in here because of an abundance of greed, it was never _that_ attractive an offer. The deal needed sweeteners like MPP, refund in BTC, in person meetings, and a partnership with an experienced design house before it sounded attractive.


Sorry, but greed is the only thing that can rationalize buying hardware in advance of a working prototype for terms that are 100% down payment and no equity position in the company.

Perhaps you were aware of the math that made the offer appear not compelling.  I am willing to bet that most buyers considered 1 Ph/s by this time as very unlikely.  And the 10 Ph/s we actually have would have been considered laughable.

A review of mining bond prices, or cloud hashing prices should make it obvious that the market is still dominated by math challenged fools.

Hopefully this latest debacle will teach people to insist on doing business on reasonable terms.  It has been an intensely frustrating 18 months being driven out of the market by irrational "TAKE MY MONEY NOW!" speculators.
cedivad
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December 25, 2013, 05:40:45 PM
 #4989

I'm sorry entropy, but you are wrong. At least in my case and in many others. It wasn't greed that made me buy from HF, it was stupidity. I knew that a full ROI was improbable to say it at last, but i wanted to mine anyway.

However, accusing us doesn't help HF. Btw, if HF delivered as promised in October, and delivered the MPP as promised, we would be in a good position.

So the problem isn't the stupid customer, the problem is the company of scammers.

My anger against what is wrong in the Bitcoin community is productive:
Bitcointa.lk - Replace "Bitcointalk.org" with "Bitcointa.lk" in this url to see how this page looks like on a proper forum (Announcement Thread)
Hashfast.org - Wiki for screwed customers
ninjarobot
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December 25, 2013, 05:43:51 PM
 #4990

There is enough blame to pass around for everybody. Merry Xmas!
Entropy-uc
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December 25, 2013, 05:46:09 PM
 #4991

I'm sorry entropy, but you are wrong. At least in my case and in many others. It wasn't greed that made me buy from HF, it was stupidity. I knew that a full ROI was improbable to say it at last, but i wanted to mine anyway.

However, accusing us doesn't help HF. Btw, if HF delivered as promised in October, and delivered the MPP as promised, we would be in a good position.

So the problem isn't the stupid customer, the problem is the company of scammers.

Personally, I hope you sue, and get a ruling for a refund in Bitcoin.  It would be a good precedent, and force some sobriety on the supplier side of the table.

But I expect you will take delivery of your machines and shut up, like everyone else in your shoes.

Greed or stupidity; both have the same result.  A market where rational investors are on the sidelines.  (or taking money from the greedy fools - it's a shame I don't have the lack of ethics required for that)
cedivad
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December 25, 2013, 05:53:23 PM
 #4992

But I expect you will take delivery of your machines and shut up, like everyone else in your shoes.
This is the only thing that i can assure you won't happen. Unless they overdeliver and create a new standard for how to compensate the customers that you scammed, but i don't think that it will be the case.
However many told me that what you said will happen - people will just shut up once they have they useless machines. I can just hope this to be wrong.

My anger against what is wrong in the Bitcoin community is productive:
Bitcointa.lk - Replace "Bitcointalk.org" with "Bitcointa.lk" in this url to see how this page looks like on a proper forum (Announcement Thread)
Hashfast.org - Wiki for screwed customers
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December 25, 2013, 06:00:06 PM
 #4993

How long will it take for HashFast gets the Scam Tag?

Bitcoinica still has not given me 50% of my claim of 600 BTC
INTERSANGO can go down with bitcoinica for abandoning customers
Alberto Armandi is a SCAMMER
Syke
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December 25, 2013, 06:05:08 PM
 #4994

How long will it take for HashFast gets the Scam Tag?

Two weeks after BFL does.

Buy & Hold
jspielberg
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December 25, 2013, 06:09:47 PM
 #4995

A judgement of bitcoins against hashfast would most likely kill the company at this point (my guess is they sold the bulk at ~$150).

I find it unlikely that it will drive sobriety into the ASIC producers.

If I had to guess, it will instead foster the development of private self-mines a la 100TH and Asic Miner, and companies selling hardware to the public will be a thing of the past.

cedivad
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December 25, 2013, 06:15:29 PM
 #4996

LOL? Don't sue HF because poor company scamming the public will be things of the past in the future if you do so? Really? And they sold at 150 when everyone else was sure that the price was skyrocketing? Yes, sure.
I sold at the top and doubled my BTC stake myself, do you think that HF wouldn't have been able to do so? I don't believe it.

Marry Christmas everyone.

My anger against what is wrong in the Bitcoin community is productive:
Bitcointa.lk - Replace "Bitcointalk.org" with "Bitcointa.lk" in this url to see how this page looks like on a proper forum (Announcement Thread)
Hashfast.org - Wiki for screwed customers
Bogart
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December 25, 2013, 06:42:51 PM
 #4997

A judgement of bitcoins against hashfast would most likely kill the company at this point (my guess is they sold the bulk at ~$150).

I find it unlikely that it will drive sobriety into the ASIC producers.

If I had to guess, it will instead foster the development of private self-mines a la 100TH and Asic Miner, and companies selling hardware to the public will be a thing of the past.

A deserved death then.  One they brought upon themselves.

I think that such a judgement would indeed serve as a warning to other would-be vendors not to repeat HF's mistakes.  Had this occurred with BFL, HF customers might not be in this position now.

There is nothing inherently wrong with the preorder model.  What's wrong is intentionally misrepresenting the timetable and the risks involved, lying about the progress made, and trying to change the terms of the sale after money has been paid.

"All safe deposit boxes in banks or financial institutions have been sealed... and may only be opened in the presence of an agent of the I.R.S." - President F.D. Roosevelt, 1933
itod
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December 25, 2013, 07:05:44 PM
 #4998

Don't make the mistake of making equivalence between Avalon and any other supplier.  What Yifu and Ngzhang did was far worse than what any one else has done in this space by a very long distance.

Orly? What Yifu did is by order of magnitude more honest than what ScamFast did, and this comes from a both Avalon and HF victim. Eventually we all got full BTC amount back from Yifu, his greatest sin is destroying the dream of small miners to ever get in the fair mining game with the big boys. ScamFast deliberately lied with the intention to keep most of the BTC and never refund them in full to customers. Avalon is greed and incompetence, HF is pure scam, how can Avalon be worse?

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December 25, 2013, 07:06:37 PM
 #4999

...
There is nothing inherently wrong with the preorder model...

As far as miners are concerned, almost everything is wrong with the pre-order model.
It encourages operations like HashFast, players who enter the manufacturing field risking none of their own money.  If their gamble pays off, they become rich.  If it doesn't and the company fails, the actors have lost nothing, while profiting from the money they have paid themselves and their friends in salaries.
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December 25, 2013, 07:10:19 PM
 #5000

The sell at 150 is my speculation... Not fact.  I seem to recall in this thread someone saying that they had a successful sales one weekend... But I would have to go searching.

I seem to recall cypherdoc stating it, though I maybe misremembering.  

Some official information sure would be helpful.

Edit:
I think this was the comment that lead me to believe that they sold a bunch in late August.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=262052.msg3036903#msg3036903

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