Devcoin

[alyssa85]

I don't think the long term prospects of Devcoin are very bright. The more people who write, the less pie there is for writers? That means it's a zero sum game. Why are people actually trying to attract more writers if the case is that quality will go down and so will the pay? It doesn't seem to be good for Devcoin either.

Long term the quality of articles of Devcoin will begin to reflect what writers are paid to write them.
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You may end up being correct.  This is truly a unique experiment for a business plan.  On the surface it's almost ideal but the big question is:  can it be sustained and will quality improve or worsen as time goes on and shares shrink.  

MarkM, made a good point that people won't rush out to just write anything cause the shares are large.  At the same time you're correct too, one would expect quality to worsen as talented or educated people rather spend their time where they can maximize their earnings potential.  

It remains to be seen.  I'm excited to see what happens.

My opinion is, if you reduce the pay so that it's no longer worth it to truly dig deep to write something great then less great works will be created. Rewarding writers only per word is too limited. Why not allow a rating system so that highly rated works get bonus shares? Also why are works essentially set per round? Over time when the shares shrink smaller and smaller they claim a lot of people just will stop writing as if everyone is of the same class as them or has the same amount of money? The people who need money the most will write whether the shares are $10 or $500 and I think globally those people vastly outnumber those of privilege who can write as they feel like it.

I do think quality will go down but it doesn't have to. The only change necessary to keep the quality writers is to change the system so that quality is rewarded. This can be accomplished by allowing readers to link a vote to an email address and then rate each article they read. The way to allow this is to link it either by verified email, or by Bitcointalk username and let people vote and maybe even pay them in Devcoins to review/vote.

Most revenue-sharing sites reward per visitor, not per upvote or per word (the per word thing is a hangover from print journalism).

Upvotes can be manipulated (remember how the old Digg had cliques who upvotes each other's stuff to get to the home page).

The only reliable measure of whether a piece is any good is visitors - are people reading it, is Google featuring it in their search engine, are people sharing it on reddit? If you use an analytics package like Google analytics, which filters out all the bot hits and only counts the views from a browser, you can get a pretty reliable idea of which articles are popular.

[Dexter44]

I agree 100% on it.

[marticps]

What about the logo contest?

[Dexter44]

AFAIK and remember, it is planned for july.

[emfox]

Also sadly, it seems that the original goal of paying for open source development is falling to the wayside as well, as the value of shares plummets. I was thinking about trying for the forum bounty (still might when I'm done with finals), but at this point, 12 shares for all that work seems like nothing compared to the hundreds of shares people are getting for writing.

I have totally the same feeling! I've been busy recently and planned to hold some of my developing activities on till mid-June, such as adding bitcointalk feature of the devcoin faucet, and a btc-dvc-accepting gamble site, and probably a new exchange, etc. but when I back, I checked the shares for round 24 and found there's nearly a thousand, good, I thought, we have more new developers... but holy shit, most of them are writers for devtome! Does we devcoin is DEVcoin but not WRITEcoin ? could we have more sane way to promote devtome and not destroy the developer community? I feel despire, 'cause no matter how hard of my work, I just get 2 or 6 or 12 shares, from those develop work, but those writers could easily write 12000 word at 2 or 3 nights and get the same.

I've no aggression to the writers, but just want to make our community to notice this thing, is devtome more important than open source developers? I'd suggest some way, e.g. to limit the shares on devtome not exceed the half of whole shares, or as others said, use read times or vote links, instead of just words to distribute shares. just some random thoughts, not thinking very carefully, and forgive my english for I'm not native speaker.

[marticps]

Also sadly, it seems that the original goal of paying for open source development is falling to the wayside as well, as the value of shares plummets. I was thinking about trying for the forum bounty (still might when I'm done with finals), but at this point, 12 shares for all that work seems like nothing compared to the hundreds of shares people are getting for writing.

I have totally the same feeling! I've been busy recently and planned to hold some of my developing activities on till mid-June, such as adding bitcointalk feature of the devcoin faucet, and a btc-dvc-accepting gamble site, and probably a new exchange, etc. but when I back, I checked the shares for round 24 and found there's nearly a thousand, good, I thought, we have more new developers... but holy shit, most of them are writers for devtome! Does we devcoin is DEVcoin but not WRITEcoin ? could we have more sane way to promote devtome and not destroy the developer community? I feel despire, 'cause no matter how hard of my work, I just get 2 or 6 or 12 shares, from those develop work, but those writers could easily write 12000 word at 2 or 3 nights and get the same.

I've no aggression to the writers, but just want to make our community to notice this thing, is devtome more important than open source developers? I'd suggest some way, e.g. to limit the shares on devtome not exceed the half of whole shares, or as others said, use read times or vote links, instead of just words to distribute shares. just some random thoughts, not thinking very carefully, and forgive my english for I'm not native speaker.

+1

[jackjack]

Also sadly, it seems that the original goal of paying for open source development is falling to the wayside as well, as the value of shares plummets. I was thinking about trying for the forum bounty (still might when I'm done with finals), but at this point, 12 shares for all that work seems like nothing compared to the hundreds of shares people are getting for writing.

I have totally the same feeling! I've been busy recently and planned to hold some of my developing activities on till mid-June, such as adding bitcointalk feature of the devcoin faucet, and a btc-dvc-accepting gamble site, and probably a new exchange, etc. but when I back, I checked the shares for round 24 and found there's nearly a thousand, good, I thought, we have more new developers... but holy shit, most of them are writers for devtome! Does we devcoin is DEVcoin but not WRITEcoin ? could we have more sane way to promote devtome and not destroy the developer community? I feel despire, 'cause no matter how hard of my work, I just get 2 or 6 or 12 shares, from those develop work, but those writers could easily write 12000 word at 2 or 3 nights and get the same.

I've no aggression to the writers, but just want to make our community to notice this thing, is devtome more important than open source developers? I'd suggest some way, e.g. to limit the shares on devtome not exceed the half of whole shares, or as others said, use read times or vote links, instead of just words to distribute shares. just some random thoughts, not thinking very carefully, and forgive my english for I'm not native speaker.

+1
I just checked and looks like I should be entitled to be in the Bitcoin dev list as I'm actively developping pywallet again for more than 2 months. I'm not sure I'd receive anything from that though with all the writing shares.
That's not a problem though as it's Unthinkingbit's coin and it's normal he chooses the priority. But whatever the priority is (writing/developping/other), I'd just like it to be stated clearly

[prdkojistic]

The only reliable measure of whether a piece is any good is visitors - are people reading it, is Google featuring it in their search engine, are people sharing it on reddit? If you use an analytics package like Google analytics, which filters out all the bot hits and only counts the views from a browser, you can get a pretty reliable idea of which articles are popular.

I would prefer some mix of these measurements. It would be great to motivate authors to create quality content that someone will really read/use/need. Rather than pages with funny pictures that are attracting visitors .

[alyssa85]

Regarding why Unthinkingbit rewards writers - I understand there is a project to develop online devcoin advertising. The idea being that the advertising revenue will then be added to the coins yield from mining - so that even though the number of share lines is increasing, the pot as a whole is growing too and not limited to what the miners produce.

Advertising has to be attached to content, hence the content development. However advertisers need eyeballs - they won't pay to advertise on a page no-one reads. Unthinkingbit has tried to address this with the marketing share - but that's limited to a few places. There is no bonus for a link from reddit for instance.

The simplest way is to switch to writing shares based on visitors. By definition if you have readers you have been doing some promotion. Writers of fantasy and fan fiction can promote on those dedicated forums. Article writers can try to get their pages ranked on Google, to get search traffic, and so on.

I guess there's no hurry to change the share model because the advertising network hasn't been developed yet. But the issue of visitors will become an issue once it does.

[alyssa85]

writers could easily write 12000 word at 2 or 3 nights and get the same.

Just wanted to address this - it's not possible to write 12,000 words in "2 or 3 nights". It takes about four hours to write a good quality 1000 word article. Hemmingway used to manage just 500 words a day.

You might see people uploading fairly long stories - but it's unlikely they wrote it in a couple of nights - more likely they sweated blood writing it over many months and sometimes years, and then found they could publish on devtome so uploaded their existing work.

[worldinacoin]

Where original articles are concerned it takes as much efforts as programming, as an Engineer that had done development work in FPGA and firmware, I must say that writers have their own challenges, as much as programmers have their own challenges.  Can't say which is easier which is harder.

[emfox]

writers could easily write 12000 word at 2 or 3 nights and get the same.

Just wanted to address this - it's not possible to write 12,000 words in "2 or 3 nights". It takes about four hours to write a good quality 1000 word article. Hemmingway used to manage just 500 words a day.

You might see people uploading fairly long stories - but it's unlikely they wrote it in a couple of nights - more likely they sweated blood writing it over many months and sometimes years, and then found they could publish on devtome so uploaded their existing work.

Yes, I may say as a ideal situation your opinion is right and i admit that, but as you say it should be "good quality", someone may write diary and also got the same shares... and it's hard (no good automatic method) to tell whether good or not an article is, while we could easily distingush good and average softwares from bad ones, because they should at least runs and works right... right?

[jasinlee]

From the Bitcoin Education Project:

We'd like for someone from the Devcoin community to record a video lecture on Devcoin for our free community built course on Bitcoin:

https://www.udemy.com/bitcoin-or-how-i-learned-to-stop-worrying-and-love-crypto/

We have nearly 2,000 subscribers in about six weeks and we are on target for 10,000 by the end of the Summer thus this would be an excellent opportunity for you guys to share devcoin with a much broader audience.

Here is our project's website:

http://btcedproject.org/

I'm looking for an introductory 15-30 minute lecture that answers the following questions:

What is Devcoin?
What does Devcoin seek to accomplish?
How can I acquire and use devcoins?
Where are the Devcoin communities?
How can I help the Devcoin community?

Ok, I got this PM, and was discussing possible animation or other options to avoid one of our ugly mugs being permanently attached to devcoin. Perhaps a script even if it does end up being one person just talking on screen. But this should be done with proper lighting, makeup, etc lets get this done professionally. I have no idea what a bounty for this would be worth, but I would suggest one be issued for the hard work that will go into this.

Edit: Finshaggy, are you in contact with that mon corpus or whatever, a pretty face never hurts with gaining public attention.

[odolvlobo]

From the Bitcoin Education Project:

We'd like for someone from the Devcoin community to record a video lecture on Devcoin for our free community built course on Bitcoin:

https://www.udemy.com/bitcoin-or-how-i-learned-to-stop-worrying-and-love-crypto/

We have nearly 2,000 subscribers in about six weeks and we are on target for 10,000 by the end of the Summer thus this would be an excellent opportunity for you guys to share devcoin with a much broader audience.

Here is our project's website:

http://btcedproject.org/

I'm looking for an introductory 15-30 minute lecture that answers the following questions:

What is Devcoin?
What does Devcoin seek to accomplish?
How can I acquire and use devcoins?
Where are the Devcoin communities?
How can I help the Devcoin community?

Ok, I got this PM, and was discussing possible animation or other options to avoid one of our ugly mugs being permanently attached to devcoin. Perhaps a script even if it does end up being one person just talking on screen. But this should be done with proper lighting, makeup, etc lets get this done professionally. I have no idea what a bounty for this would be worth, but I would suggest one be issued for the hard work that will go into this.

The presentation doesn't have to show someone speaking. Like the others, it could be a "powerpoint" presentation.

[jasinlee]

Agreed, but it is quite simple to green screen a powerpoint behind a person. (can be done from home) if someone would like to put a small amount of production value into it, that may be worth the time.

[weisoq]

...Why is it generating a new DVC address (leaving the original one) every 2 days?
Now I have something like other 8 addresses, apart from the one I normally use.
Going on this way I will have 100 addresses by end of the year.
Does anybody know how to fix the issue?
Thankx

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=34586.msg1988973#msg1988973

[weisoq]

From the Bitcoin Education Project...
Ok, I got this PM, and was discussing possible animation or other options to avoid one of our ugly mugs being permanently attached to devcoin. Perhaps a script even if it does end up being one person just talking on screen. But this should be done with proper lighting, makeup, etc lets get this done professionally. I have no idea what a bounty for this would be worth, but I would suggest one be issued for the hard work that will go into this.

Edit: Finshaggy, are you in contact with that mon corpus or whatever, a pretty face never hurts with gaining public attention.

Great idea. Beauty is in the eye...reckon a graphic/visual with voiceover would probably be better too.

Edit: to be clear, if by mon corpus you mean the youtube girl, that part's not what I meant by great idea. But I have no better suggestions as graphic presentations are not my thing.

[jasinlee]

From the Bitcoin Education Project...
Ok, I got this PM, and was discussing possible animation or other options to avoid one of our ugly mugs being permanently attached to devcoin. Perhaps a script even if it does end up being one person just talking on screen. But this should be done with proper lighting, makeup, etc lets get this done professionally. I have no idea what a bounty for this would be worth, but I would suggest one be issued for the hard work that will go into this.

Edit: Finshaggy, are you in contact with that mon corpus or whatever, a pretty face never hurts with gaining public attention.

Great idea. Beauty is in the eye...reckon a graphic/visual with voiceover would probably be better too.

Unthinkingbit, ideas on bounty amounts to be awarded for staring/voicing in the video or presentation? We could "hire" that mon corpus off youtube for this kind of thing since she already seems to have an interest I would think in dvc.

[weisoq]

If getting it done is time sensitive, with the rate of growth in receiver lines may work better with an actual dvc bounty rather than propective shares. If so I'd be willing to chip in for that to get something decent made (if anyone has experience in that area).

[metazilla]

I just checked and looks like I should be entitled to be in the Bitcoin dev list as I'm actively developping pywallet again for more than 2 months. I'm not sure I'd receive anything from that though with all the writing shares.
That's not a problem though as it's Unthinkingbit's coin and it's normal he chooses the priority. But whatever the priority is (writing/developping/other), I'd just like it to be stated clearly

Hey jackjack, I'm in charge of adding people to the developer share lists. Here are some general guidelines on whether or not you would be eligible: http://www.devtome.com/doku.php?id=devcoin#developer

The best way to see if you qualify to be on the list is to PM me or post a link to the project thread. If you have 10 posts a month from users, then the project is definitely popular enough to be included. My instinct is that pywallet will qualify easily. I know I've used it in the last month, and I'm guessing so have several others in this thread.

I've no aggression to the writers, but just want to make our community to notice this thing, is devtome more important than open source developers? I'd suggest some way, e.g. to limit the shares on devtome not exceed the half of whole shares, or as others said, use read times or vote links, instead of just words to distribute shares. just some random thoughts, not thinking very carefully, and forgive my english for I'm not native speaker.

I agree 100%. Unthinkingbit and other administrators: is there a way we can make some decision on this?