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Author Topic: Why do Atheists Hate Religion?  (Read 893559 times)
BADecker
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February 09, 2016, 06:07:44 PM
 #4681

Atheists don't really hate religion. They are simply deeply envious of religious people. Why is this? Because they lover their atheism, and instinctively know that they are going to Hell because of it. They are jealous of the religious who are going to Heaven. So, it isn't hate. It is deep envy.

You remind me of a scene from The Breakfast Club...

Claire:  Your friends wouldn't mind because they look up to us.
Brian:  You're so conceited, Claire. You're so conceited. You're so, like, full of yourself; why are you like that?
Claire:  [teary] I'm not saying that to be conceited! I hate it! I hate having to go along with everything my friends say!
Brian:  Well, then why do you do it?
Claire:  I don't know, I don't—you don't understand…you don't. You're not friends with the same kind of people that Andy and I are friends with! You know, you just don't understand the pressure that they can put on you!


hint: BADecker = Claire

God is really all there is, and I am so full of God.

Smiley

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February 09, 2016, 06:10:14 PM
 #4682

Atheists don't really hate religion. They are simply deeply envious of religious people. Why is this? Because they lover their atheism, and instinctively know that they are going to Hell because of it. They are jealous of the religious who are going to Heaven. So, it isn't hate. It is deep envy.

You remind me of a scene from The Breakfast Club...

Claire:  Your friends wouldn't mind because they look up to us.
Brian:  You're so conceited, Claire. You're so conceited. You're so, like, full of yourself; why are you like that?
Claire:  [teary] I'm not saying that to be conceited! I hate it! I hate having to go along with everything my friends say!
Brian:  Well, then why do you do it?
Claire:  I don't know, I don't—you don't understand…you don't. You're not friends with the same kind of people that Andy and I are friends with! You know, you just don't understand the pressure that they can put on you!


hint: BADecker = Claire

God is really all there is, and I am so full of God.

You are certainly full of something...

hint: it's not God
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February 09, 2016, 06:20:14 PM
 #4683

Atheists don't really hate religion. They are simply deeply envious of religious people. Why is this? Because they lover their atheism, and instinctively know that they are going to Hell because of it. They are jealous of the religious who are going to Heaven. So, it isn't hate. It is deep envy.

You remind me of a scene from The Breakfast Club...

Claire:  Your friends wouldn't mind because they look up to us.
Brian:  You're so conceited, Claire. You're so conceited. You're so, like, full of yourself; why are you like that?
Claire:  [teary] I'm not saying that to be conceited! I hate it! I hate having to go along with everything my friends say!
Brian:  Well, then why do you do it?
Claire:  I don't know, I don't—you don't understand…you don't. You're not friends with the same kind of people that Andy and I are friends with! You know, you just don't understand the pressure that they can put on you!


hint: BADecker = Claire

God is really all there is, and I am so full of God.

You are certainly full of something...

hint: it's not God

I noticed that you are full of God as well. Shocking. The only time God denies Himself.

Smiley

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BADecker
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February 09, 2016, 08:00:59 PM
 #4684

Atheists don't really hate religion. They are simply deeply envious of religious people. Why is this? Because they lover their atheism, and instinctively know that they are going to Hell because of it. They are jealous of the religious who are going to Heaven. So, it isn't hate. It is deep envy.

Smiley

Ok, let me explain what most Atheists think about religious people.

Most Atheists think religious people are sincere in their delusion.  We as Atheists do understand that you "feel God's love" and you feel good thinking that God created everything and he will take care of you in this life and in afterlife.  Believing in your preferred religion gives you satisfaction, especially when your irrational belief is confirmed by millions of equally irrational people around the world.  Believe me, I do understand that you are happy that you'll not go to hell because you believe.

However, just because you believe and feel God's love in your body, it does not make any difference, your behavior/belief is irrational.  It is still a delusion.

BTW, Atheists do not believe in any of it.  Be it heaven, God, hell, evil spirits, angels etc.  So stop saying we want to go to heaven.

On the other hand, it looks like religious people do not want to investigate for themselves whether their claims are true or not.  They just want to believe what they believe, period.

If you present me with one shred of evidence that God exists, I'll re-consider it.   Believe me Atheists want to believe God exist, but unfortunately we cannot reconcile God with observable reality.

Atheism frees you up.  You know this is the only life you got, so live well.  There is no afterlife.

Alright, I will state that part of what I was saying in my post you quoted above was simply talk, almost for the sake of talking. But let's look at what you say from the other side.

Look at the question, "How do I as an atheist know for a fact that God does not exist? Is my atheism truly logical sense, or is at least part of it merely a wish or desire on my part?

Forget all the mushy feelings that theists might have for God. Forget even the idea of God, and look at the scientific aspect of "cause and effect."

Everything that science has found in nature and the universe so far, has one or more causes that brought it into existence in the form that it exists in. In fact, the greater the scientist, the more he is out to find the "why's" of anything and everything. Why does it exist? What caused it to exist this way? What are the causes that made it happen?

In fact, we are so into finding out the cause of things, that we can't even conceive of anything not having a cause. Everything has a cause, and the cause has a cause, and that cause has a cause, etc., etc.

This brings us to entropy. Entropy at its base and core suggests everything is in dispersal mode. Everything is trying to diffuse itself evenly and equaly throughout all space/time. While there is much theoretical thinking about entropy, nobody has found anything that could be considered reverse entropy.

If entropy had existed forever, everything would have been dispersed and diffused long ago. But we know that this is not the case. How do we know? Because complexity exists. Thus, entropy must have had a beginning... because it couldn't have existed forever. But we don't see anything that looks like a beginning of entropy. Check with science. Science says this.

Complexity is the antithesis of entropy. Entropy is trying to break down complexity. Like as there must have been a beginning to entropy, that beginning must have had much higher complexity than we see around today.

One of the main features that we see in complexity is, nothing that is more complex comes about because of, or from, something less complex. For example. A highly complex snowflake seems to come from a much less complex batch of water molecules. Yet, the conditions of temperature and air movements and dust in the air and solar energy, are actually way more complex than the snowflake that they form out of the less complex water.

The point is, there is something that is so extremely complex, that it could form the complexity of the mind of man, using universal cause and effect, across multitudes of years, in the face of all-pervading entropy, that brought this whole "thing" into existence. If there wasn't, this universe wouldn't exist. It is scientifically self-evident.

----------

The above is standard science. It isn't science theory. It is science fact. You can Google it and read all about it here and there. Or you can delve into the science text books to see it.

Whatever started this whole universe going, whether or not you want to call it God, leaves a whole lot of room for at least the great possibility that God exists. In light of this, staunch atheism turns into a religion, because something that could easily fit the definitions of "God," does exist... or at least existed.

Any atheist who doesn't at least examine this thoroughly and thoughtfully, is doing himself a great disfavor.

Smiley

Don't be afraid to donate Bitcoin >>> 1JDJotyxZLFF8akGCxHeqMkD4YrrTmEAwz !
Gimpeline
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February 09, 2016, 08:03:22 PM
 #4685

Atheists don't really hate religion. They are simply deeply envious of religious people. Why is this? Because they lover their atheism, and instinctively know that they are going to Hell because of it. They are jealous of the religious who are going to Heaven. So, it isn't hate. It is deep envy.

Smiley

Ok, let me explain what most Atheists think about religious people.

Most Atheists think religious people are sincere in their delusion.  We as Atheists do understand that you "feel God's love" and you feel good thinking that God created everything and he will take care of you in this life and in afterlife.  Believing in your preferred religion gives you satisfaction, especially when your irrational belief is confirmed by millions of equally irrational people around the world.  Believe me, I do understand that you are happy that you'll not go to hell because you believe.

However, just because you believe and feel God's love in your body, it does not make any difference, your behavior/belief is irrational.  It is still a delusion.

BTW, Atheists do not believe in any of it.  Be it heaven, God, hell, evil spirits, angels etc.  So stop saying we want to go to heaven.

On the other hand, it looks like religious people do not want to investigate for themselves whether their claims are true or not.  They just want to believe what they believe, period.

If you present me with one shred of evidence that God exists, I'll re-consider it.   Believe me Atheists want to believe God exist, but unfortunately we cannot reconcile God with observable reality.

Atheism frees you up.  You know this is the only life you got, so live well.  There is no afterlife.

Alright, I will state that part of what I was saying in my post you quoted above was simply talk, almost for the sake of talking. But let's look at what you say from the other side.

Look at the question, "How do I as an atheist know for a fact that God does not exist? Is my atheism truly logical sense, or is at least part of it merely a wish or desire on my part?

Forget all the mushy feelings that theists might have for God. Forget even the idea of God, and look at the scientific aspect of "cause and effect."

Everything that science has found in nature and the universe so far, has one or more causes that brought it into existence in the form that it exists in. In fact, the greater the scientist, the more he is out to find the "why's" of anything and everything. Why does it exist? What caused it to exist this way? What are the causes that made it happen?

In fact, we are so into finding out the cause of things, that we can't even conceive of anything not having a cause. Everything has a cause, and the cause has a cause, and that cause has a cause, etc., etc.

This brings us to entropy. Entropy at its base and core suggests everything is in dispersal mode. Everything is trying to diffuse itself evenly and equaly throughout all space/time. While there is much theoretical thinking about entropy, nobody has found anything that could be considered reverse entropy.

If entropy had existed forever, everything would have been dispersed and diffused long ago. But we know that this is not the case. How do we know? Because complexity exists. Thus, entropy must have had a beginning... because it couldn't have existed forever. But we don't see anything that looks like a beginning of entropy. Check with science. Science says this.

Complexity is the antithesis of entropy. Entropy is trying to break down complexity. Like as there must have been a beginning to entropy, that beginning must have had much higher complexity than we see around today.

One of the main features that we see in complexity is, nothing that is more complex comes about because of, or from, something less complex. For example. A highly complex snowflake seems to come from a much less complex batch of water molecules. Yet, the conditions of temperature and air movements and dust in the air and solar energy, are actually way more complex than the snowflake that they form out of the less complex water.

The point is, there is something that is so extremely complex, that it could form the complexity of the mind of man, using universal cause and effect, across multitudes of years, in the face of all-pervading entropy, that brought this whole "thing" into existence. If there wasn't, this universe wouldn't exist. It is scientifically self-evident.

----------

The above is standard science. It isn't science theory. It is science fact. You can Google it and read all about it here and there. Or you can delve into the science text books to see it.

Whatever started this whole universe going, whether or not you want to call it God, leaves a whole lot of room for at least the great possibility that God exists. In light of this, staunch atheism turns into a religion, because something that could easily fit the definitions of "God," does exist... or at least existed.

Any atheist who doesn't at least examine this thoroughly and thoughtfully, is doing himself a great disfavor.

Smiley
More retarded posts from our local village idiot
BADecker
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February 09, 2016, 08:07:03 PM
 #4686

Atheists don't really hate religion. They are simply deeply envious of religious people. Why is this? Because they lover their atheism, and instinctively know that they are going to Hell because of it. They are jealous of the religious who are going to Heaven. So, it isn't hate. It is deep envy.

Smiley

Ok, let me explain what most Atheists think about religious people.

Most Atheists think religious people are sincere in their delusion.  We as Atheists do understand that you "feel God's love" and you feel good thinking that God created everything and he will take care of you in this life and in afterlife.  Believing in your preferred religion gives you satisfaction, especially when your irrational belief is confirmed by millions of equally irrational people around the world.  Believe me, I do understand that you are happy that you'll not go to hell because you believe.

However, just because you believe and feel God's love in your body, it does not make any difference, your behavior/belief is irrational.  It is still a delusion.

BTW, Atheists do not believe in any of it.  Be it heaven, God, hell, evil spirits, angels etc.  So stop saying we want to go to heaven.

On the other hand, it looks like religious people do not want to investigate for themselves whether their claims are true or not.  They just want to believe what they believe, period.

If you present me with one shred of evidence that God exists, I'll re-consider it.   Believe me Atheists want to believe God exist, but unfortunately we cannot reconcile God with observable reality.

Atheism frees you up.  You know this is the only life you got, so live well.  There is no afterlife.

Alright, I will state that part of what I was saying in my post you quoted above was simply talk, almost for the sake of talking. But let's look at what you say from the other side.

Look at the question, "How do I as an atheist know for a fact that God does not exist? Is my atheism truly logical sense, or is at least part of it merely a wish or desire on my part?

Forget all the mushy feelings that theists might have for God. Forget even the idea of God, and look at the scientific aspect of "cause and effect."

Everything that science has found in nature and the universe so far, has one or more causes that brought it into existence in the form that it exists in. In fact, the greater the scientist, the more he is out to find the "why's" of anything and everything. Why does it exist? What caused it to exist this way? What are the causes that made it happen?

In fact, we are so into finding out the cause of things, that we can't even conceive of anything not having a cause. Everything has a cause, and the cause has a cause, and that cause has a cause, etc., etc.

This brings us to entropy. Entropy at its base and core suggests everything is in dispersal mode. Everything is trying to diffuse itself evenly and equaly throughout all space/time. While there is much theoretical thinking about entropy, nobody has found anything that could be considered reverse entropy.

If entropy had existed forever, everything would have been dispersed and diffused long ago. But we know that this is not the case. How do we know? Because complexity exists. Thus, entropy must have had a beginning... because it couldn't have existed forever. But we don't see anything that looks like a beginning of entropy. Check with science. Science says this.

Complexity is the antithesis of entropy. Entropy is trying to break down complexity. Like as there must have been a beginning to entropy, that beginning must have had much higher complexity than we see around today.

One of the main features that we see in complexity is, nothing that is more complex comes about because of, or from, something less complex. For example. A highly complex snowflake seems to come from a much less complex batch of water molecules. Yet, the conditions of temperature and air movements and dust in the air and solar energy, are actually way more complex than the snowflake that they form out of the less complex water.

The point is, there is something that is so extremely complex, that it could form the complexity of the mind of man, using universal cause and effect, across multitudes of years, in the face of all-pervading entropy, that brought this whole "thing" into existence. If there wasn't, this universe wouldn't exist. It is scientifically self-evident.

----------

The above is standard science. It isn't science theory. It is science fact. You can Google it and read all about it here and there. Or you can delve into the science text books to see it.

Whatever started this whole universe going, whether or not you want to call it God, leaves a whole lot of room for at least the great possibility that God exists. In light of this, staunch atheism turns into a religion, because something that could easily fit the definitions of "God," does exist... or at least existed.

Any atheist who doesn't at least examine this thoroughly and thoughtfully, is doing himself a great disfavor.

Smiley
More retarded posts from our local village idiot


Why, Gimpline. You are more retarded than your usual self today. Oh that's right. You haven't learned to read yet. Who does your posting for you... your mother?

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February 09, 2016, 08:44:35 PM
 #4687

...
The holy books are changed over years.... Except the holy Quran...

Why would you want them to change? They are funny, ridiculous  and vile the way they are.

Unless you wanted to add some more ridiculous and funny stuff...

My guess is God did not like science very much.
It is understandable since he was 'born' thousands of years ago.  He just did not know that Earth rotates around the Sun and that there is no dome over it or pillars supporting it.  

He wrote what he knew.

Your guess is wrong dude... The god, who created the entire world, without the permission of god even a single leaf cannot move, you think he doesn't know all those things... He created so wonderful things that are required by us, and we, instead of praising the bounties, complaining...
The human being,  because of his own comfort, changed the holy books over time, but the last holy book is still remained unchanged....

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February 09, 2016, 09:09:28 PM
 #4688

...
The holy books are changed over years.... Except the holy Quran...

Why would you want them to change? They are funny, ridiculous  and vile the way they are.

Unless you wanted to add some more ridiculous and funny stuff...

My guess is God did not like science very much.
It is understandable since he was 'born' thousands of years ago.  He just did not know that Earth rotates around the Sun and that there is no dome over it or pillars supporting it.  

He wrote what he knew.

Your guess is wrong dude... The god, who created the entire world, without the permission of god even a single leaf cannot move, you think he doesn't know all those things... He created so wonderful things that are required by us, and we, instead of praising the bounties, complaining...
The human being,  because of his own comfort, changed the holy books over time, but the last holy book is still remained unchanged....


Which one is the one that remained unchanged?

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February 09, 2016, 09:21:30 PM
 #4689

...
The holy books are changed over years.... Except the holy Quran...

Why would you want them to change? They are funny, ridiculous  and vile the way they are.

Unless you wanted to add some more ridiculous and funny stuff...

My guess is God did not like science very much.
It is understandable since he was 'born' thousands of years ago.  He just did not know that Earth rotates around the Sun and that there is no dome over it or pillars supporting it.  

He wrote what he knew.

Your guess is wrong dude... The god, who created the entire world, without the permission of god even a single leaf cannot move, you think he doesn't know all those things... He created so wonderful things that are required by us, and we, instead of praising the bounties, complaining...
The human being,  because of his own comfort, changed the holy books over time, but the last holy book is still remained unchanged....


Which one is the one that remained unchanged?
thousands of years ago.
The holy Quran is unchanged... It is revealed to the last prophet mohammed saw....
Now please don't speak nonsense about others religion... I respect your religion, even i you are atheist I have no problem with it, and  you should not have problem with others religious views... Smiley

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February 09, 2016, 09:46:48 PM
 #4690

Atheists don't really hate religion. They are simply deeply envious of religious people. Why is this? Because they lover their atheism, and instinctively know that they are going to Hell because of it. They are jealous of the religious who are going to Heaven. So, it isn't hate. It is deep envy.

BTW, Atheists do not believe in any of it.  Be it heaven, God, hell, evil spirits, angels etc.  So stop saying we want to go to heaven.

Good point here... I'm certainly not jealous of heaven...

I don't understand how streets paved with gold is supposed to be tempting... if it's everywhere, it must be worthless, right?

Also, gold is soft... it will develop ruts in no time... I'll probably be the guy who has to re-pave that shit every week...

If you think the pope-mobile is ridiculous, wait til you see the Jesus-mobile try to stop on slippery gold streets... he'll cause a 20-angel pileup...

Heaven sounds like it will need a lot of maintenance already, and I only know 1 "fact" about it... gold streets...

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February 09, 2016, 10:48:07 PM
 #4691

...
The holy books are changed over years.... Except the holy Quran...

Why would you want them to change? They are funny, ridiculous  and vile the way they are.

Unless you wanted to add some more ridiculous and funny stuff...

My guess is God did not like science very much.
It is understandable since he was 'born' thousands of years ago.  He just did not know that Earth rotates around the Sun and that there is no dome over it or pillars supporting it.  

He wrote what he knew.

Your guess is wrong dude... The god, who created the entire world, without the permission of god even a single leaf cannot move, you think he doesn't know all those things... He created so wonderful things that are required by us, and we, instead of praising the bounties, complaining...
The human being,  because of his own comfort, changed the holy books over time, but the last holy book is still remained unchanged....


Which one is the one that remained unchanged?
thousands of years ago.
The holy Quran is unchanged... It is revealed to the last prophet mohammed saw....
Now please don't speak nonsense about others religion... I respect your religion, even i you are atheist I have no problem with it, and  you should not have problem with others religious views... Smiley

Maybe there are some small differences - there's quite a good bit of information here that will interest you, especially the parts about Mohammed forgetting parts of the Quran: http://www.studytoanswer.net/myths_ch1.html




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February 10, 2016, 12:01:59 AM
 #4692

This brings us to entropy. Entropy at its base and core suggests everything is in dispersal mode. Everything is trying to diffuse itself evenly and equaly throughout all space/time. While there is much theoretical thinking about entropy, nobody has found anything that could be considered reverse entropy.

This is a misunderstanding of entropy. There are many examples of a local decrease in entropy, which would result in an increase in entropy elsewhere.

One of the main features that we see in complexity is, nothing that is more complex comes about because of, or from, something less complex. For example. A highly complex snowflake seems to come from a much less complex batch of water molecules. Yet, the conditions of temperature and air movements and dust in the air and solar energy, are actually way more complex than the snowflake that they form out of the less complex water.

This is another misunderstanding of entropy. While it may appear 'simple' to you, a snowflake is much lower entropy (more 'ordered') than the water vapour from which they form.

Summary:
* Entropy can decrease locally
* Complexity does not always correlate with entropy.




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February 10, 2016, 12:03:05 AM
 #4693

Don't believe in good or anything like this unnatural and also consider religion as a problem and main trouble of the world.

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February 10, 2016, 01:30:19 AM
 #4694

Don't believe in good or anything like this unnatural and also consider religion as a problem and main trouble of the world.

The atheism religion caused more deaths in the 1900s than anything other than old age. Virtually all the governments that mass executed their own citizens were atheists.

Smiley

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February 10, 2016, 01:39:39 AM
 #4695

This brings us to entropy. Entropy at its base and core suggests everything is in dispersal mode. Everything is trying to diffuse itself evenly and equaly throughout all space/time. While there is much theoretical thinking about entropy, nobody has found anything that could be considered reverse entropy.

This is a misunderstanding of entropy. There are many examples of a local decrease in entropy, which would result in an increase in entropy elsewhere.

One of the main features that we see in complexity is, nothing that is more complex comes about because of, or from, something less complex. For example. A highly complex snowflake seems to come from a much less complex batch of water molecules. Yet, the conditions of temperature and air movements and dust in the air and solar energy, are actually way more complex than the snowflake that they form out of the less complex water.

This is another misunderstanding of entropy. While it may appear 'simple' to you, a snowflake is much lower entropy (more 'ordered') than the water vapour from which they form.

Summary:
* Entropy can decrease locally
* Complexity does not always correlate with entropy.





Before a farmer shoots grain into his granary the first time for the year, he sweeps the granary clean. Usually there is at least some dust, if not grain shells from the previous season. When he starts sweeping, the job is easy, because there is a lot of garbage to sweep up. But as he gets down to the last little bit, it becomes difficult, simply because there is so little left that he has to work at getting it all.

If you heat a chunk of iron up, and cool another chunk down, and then press the two together, the heat transfer is fast at first. But the closer the chunks get to being the same temperature, the longer it takes for the remaining heat difference to move.

Why would anyone think that entropy needs to remain at a constant throughout the universe? That isn't the point. The point is that entropy exists throughout the universe.

At any place that there seems to be reverse entropy somewhere in the universe, there is greater entropy in whatever caused the appearance of reverse entropy.

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February 10, 2016, 03:06:19 AM
 #4696


You are confusing complexity with order.  You are jumping to the "God is the answer" too quickly.  But here we go:
Not at all. There are many things that can be added to the mix. I simply used complexity to get the understanding across. Complexity fits, but order does not. Why doesn't order fit? Because the greater the complexity, the less the evenness throughout, meaning the appearance of less order. But cause and effect are still acting on everything, meaning that there is complete order in the complex and the simple.



Everything that science has found in nature and the universe so far, has one or more causes that brought it into existence in the form that it exists in. In fact, the greater the scientist, the more he is out to find the "why's" of anything and everything.
Why does it exist? What caused it to exist this way? What are the causes that made it happen?

Answer: Yes.  Scientists study the why?

In fact, we are so into finding out the cause of things, that we can't even conceive of anything not having a cause. Everything has a cause, and the cause has a cause, and that cause has a cause, etc., etc.

Answer: Yes

This brings us to entropy. Entropy at its base and core suggests everything is in dispersal mode. Everything is trying to diffuse itself evenly and equaly throughout all space/time. While there is much theoretical thinking about entropy, nobody has found anything that could be considered reverse entropy.

Answer: Yes.  Entropy cannot decrease.

If entropy had existed forever, everything would have been dispersed and diffused long ago. But we know that this is not the case.

Answer: Entropy is a measure of randomness, or disorder.  This is where you are making a mistake.  Entropy could be increasing until universe exists.
There is no randomness or disorder. Cause and effect are acting perfectly. We are so extremely remote in our ability to see most of the complexity, that we use the randomness idea to try to guess things about the complexity. Quantum Mechanics is simply glorified probability. Probability has to do with randomness, and the only reason we use it is because we can't see the complexity. The thing we call randomness is not really randomness at all. It is glorified guesswork.


Our universe was created 14 billion years ago, entropy is increasing ever since.  Not sure what your point is.
Nobody knows the age of the universe. Anybody who suggests that the universe is 14 billion years old, is basing it on theory or guesswork. Theory should not be considered fact until it is proven.


How do we know? Because complexity exists. Thus, entropy must have had a beginning... because it couldn't have existed forever. But we don't see anything that looks like a beginning of entropy. Check with science. Science says this.

Answer: I think you are confusing complexity with order.  Big-Bang theory is the best we can do to explain how it all started.
Again, cause and effect is acting throughout. Cause and effect keeps order throughout. Cause and effect keeps some of the order to be complex, and some of it to be simple.

Big Bang Theory might be the best theory we have. It is not fact. Until it is proven, it should be part of the realm of fiction. Even if Big Bang were proven to be possible, it still would not have been proven to exist.

IF, if, if, if Big Bang is true, then Big Bang is highly intelligent. Why? Because it caused throughout many ages of cause and effect, intelligence in mankind... in addition to seeing to it that the universe remained orderly through cause and effect for all this time. Starting to sound like God a little.



Complexity is the antithesis of entropy. Entropy is trying to break down complexity. Like as there must have been a beginning to entropy, that beginning must have had much higher complexity than we see around today.

Answer: Not really.  Entropy is a measure of randomness or disorder of the system.  Again it brings us to big-bang theory. Yes, in the beginning entropy was zero or close it it.
Actually, there is no randomness. Cause and effect don't allow for disorder. Because of the complexity, we in our inability, think that we see randomness. There isn't really randomness or disorder.



One of the main features that we see in complexity is, nothing that is more complex comes about because of, or from, something less complex.

Answer: Now, this is just not true.  Our bodies evolved from less complicated life forms.  Once AI takes off, you'll see how less complex life forms can create more complicated life forms.
Since entropy is a reduction in complexity, and since entropy acts throughout, only in the face of a reducing of complexity in one area, is there an increase in complexity in some other area. And the increase in complexity never reaches the height of complexity that was in the area of reduced complexity that created it.

The point is, there is no evidence that our bodies evolved, period. Even though there might be some form of operation called evolution, there is no clear method for going from the inanimate all the way to our bodies. But, even if we had a complete method, there is no way to determine if that was the thing that truly happened. Why not? There might be many other evolution methods... and the creation story might be right. This is why evolution is a theory. We simply don't know for sure.



For example. A highly complex snowflake seems to come from a much less complex batch of water molecules. Yet, the conditions of temperature and air movements and dust in the air and solar energy, are actually way more complex than the snowflake that they form out of the less complex water.

Answer: Not sure what you mean.  Snowflakes are formed by a natural process.
Snowflakes are simple water transformed into complex snowflakes. This looks like simplicity transforming into complexity. The reason why it is not simplicity transforming into complexity is, there are many complex processes causing simple water to form the complex snowflake.



The point is, there is something that is so extremely complex,

Answer: Prove it. You stated that there is something so extremely complex.  I ask you to prove it it exist.  Just because 14 billion years ago our universe
was started with near zero entropy does not mean God created it.  As a matter of fact, if God had interacted with our universe, his entropy would increase
the moment he put his nose into our universe.
Okay. Let's assume the theory of a 14 billion year old universe is correct. The intelligence of mankind is here, 14 billion years after the beginning. Whatever started the universe, took a handful of "gravel," and scattered it so that it would interact among itself to produce intelligence after 14 billion years.

Let's see you do that. Let's see any person do that. Intelligence is complex. No intelligence is simple. As we have been saying above, the only way to get complexity from something simple is to have something more complex cause it.

In addition, look at the vastness of universal complexity. Whatever scattered the materials of the universe at the beginning, to create such complexity through cause and effect, would be the expert pool/billiards player of all time.



that it could form the complexity of the mind of man,

Answer: Human mind is a process of millions of years of evolution.  No evidence that supernatural force was involved.  But there is strong physical evidence supporting evolution.
Again, evolution is theory. Theory means that it is not necessarily fact. Thus you can't factually say that the human mind has evolution behind it. However, the things that I have been showing you regarding science FACT, prove that there is great Intelligence behind the making of mankind and everything else.



using universal cause and effect, across multitudes of years, in the face of all-pervading entropy, that brought this whole "thing" into existence.

Answer: Big-bang started our universe.  Not sure what is your point.
Since Big Bang is theory, and theory is not fact until it is proven fact, believers in Big Bang have themselves a Big Bang of a religion.



From the review at the website you listed:
Quote
One of the few prominent scientists today to have crossed the chasm between science and popular culture, Krauss describes the staggeringly beautiful experimental observations and mind-bending new theories that demonstrate not only can something arise from nothing, something will always arise from nothing.

Notice the words "new theories." Theories are fun, intriguing things that might be great ideas, but are not known to be facts. People can invent theories all day long. But the facts:
1. cause and effect;
2. complex universe;
3. universal entropy;
when combined prove the existence of a "Thing" that matches the definition of God.

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February 10, 2016, 03:13:34 AM
 #4697

Atheists don't really hate religion. They are simply deeply envious of religious people. Why is this? Because they lover their atheism, and instinctively know that they are going to Hell because of it. They are jealous of the religious who are going to Heaven. So, it isn't hate. It is deep envy.

BTW, Atheists do not believe in any of it.  Be it heaven, God, hell, evil spirits, angels etc.  So stop saying we want to go to heaven.

Good point here... I'm certainly not jealous of heaven...

I don't understand how streets paved with gold is supposed to be tempting... if it's everywhere, it must be worthless, right?

Also, gold is soft... it will develop ruts in no time... I'll probably be the guy who has to re-pave that shit every week...

If you think the pope-mobile is ridiculous, wait til you see the Jesus-mobile try to stop on slippery gold streets... he'll cause a 20-angel pileup...

Heaven sounds like it will need a lot of maintenance already, and I only know 1 "fact" about it... gold streets...



The less you understand, the greater your faith... generally. In your case, your lack of understanding blinds you to the faith you live by.

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February 10, 2016, 03:37:47 AM
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Notice the words "new theories." Theories are fun, intriguing things that might be great ideas, but are not known to be facts. People can invent theories all day long.

You mean like theory of gravity. LOL...
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February 10, 2016, 04:19:05 AM
 #4699

This brings us to entropy. Entropy at its base and core suggests everything is in dispersal mode. Everything is trying to diffuse itself evenly and equaly throughout all space/time. While there is much theoretical thinking about entropy, nobody has found anything that could be considered reverse entropy.

This is a misunderstanding of entropy. There are many examples of a local decrease in entropy, which would result in an increase in entropy elsewhere.

One of the main features that we see in complexity is, nothing that is more complex comes about because of, or from, something less complex. For example. A highly complex snowflake seems to come from a much less complex batch of water molecules. Yet, the conditions of temperature and air movements and dust in the air and solar energy, are actually way more complex than the snowflake that they form out of the less complex water.

This is another misunderstanding of entropy. While it may appear 'simple' to you, a snowflake is much lower entropy (more 'ordered') than the water vapour from which they form.

Summary:
* Entropy can decrease locally
* Complexity does not always correlate with entropy.





Before a farmer shoots grain into his granary the first time for the year, he sweeps the granary clean. Usually there is at least some dust, if not grain shells from the previous season. When he starts sweeping, the job is easy, because there is a lot of garbage to sweep up. But as he gets down to the last little bit, it becomes difficult, simply because there is so little left that he has to work at getting it all.

If you heat a chunk of iron up, and cool another chunk down, and then press the two together, the heat transfer is fast at first. But the closer the chunks get to being the same temperature, the longer it takes for the remaining heat difference to move.

Why would anyone think that entropy needs to remain at a constant throughout the universe? That isn't the point. The point is that entropy exists throughout the universe.

At any place that there seems to be reverse entropy somewhere in the universe, there is greater entropy in whatever caused the appearance of reverse entropy.

Smiley


And that is why more ordered things (eg snowflakes) can be created by less ordered things (water vapour, dirt particles). Whichever way you wish to describe complexity, more complex do come about because of, or from, something less complex.


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February 10, 2016, 04:21:48 AM
 #4700

Again, evolution is theory. Theory means that it is not necessarily fact. Thus you can't factually say that the human mind has evolution behind it. However, the things that I have been showing you regarding science FACT, prove that there is great Intelligence behind the making of mankind and everything else.


There is no such thing as a "science FACT" . There are only theories with more or less evidence to back them up.

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