IOTA - Unmoderated thread

[SatoNatomato]

I don't think IOTA's business plan was to charge transaction fees. Try again?

Do not feed the troll. He didnt say anything of value.

[e-coinomist]

Let me teach you a few things about your project, my retarded litte padawan. Even though IOTA might have been a good idea at first; you are fucking too late. Byteball basically assimilated your whole business plan and left you with a still unfinished product. Time to market is everything and you Sir, royally fucked up.

I don't think IOTA's business plan was to charge transaction fees. Try again?

Laaanguage, you Wookies! Watch your language.
Well, IOTA seems to be struggling behind now. But there are some differences between those two, and the newcomer isn't even distributed between the interested parties so far. Estimates are ranging for another >12 monthes up to 1 1/2 year.
Enough time to surprise us, devs! Both got a reason to exist. Do it.

[Snowykingdom]

iotatoken=david=shit
IOTA=SCAM

so fuckin simple, just watch and learn at their moderated forum.

[SteveoMB]

iotatoken=david=shit
IOTA=SCAM

so fuckin simple, just watch and learn at their moderated forum.

"scam" implies a malicious intention, where people are deliberately subjected to fraud, theft, whatever.
You think all foundation-members, like mathematicians, entrepreneurs, professors from around the globe are dumb enough to participate in such a project?
Get off your fucking hillbilly-high-horse and face the facts: you missed the opportunity to invest in an incredible piece of technology, or even worse, you just don't have the IQ to understand what it's about.
So all you have left is trolling in the most unimportant space of the Internet, Bitcointalk.
Congratulations for this masterful achievement.
You are the pride of creation!
If that's all, you may continue your crusade of douchebags somewhere else. Maybe at home, on the street or wherever the fuck you want because here, you are less beneficial than athlete's foot.

[Snowykingdom]

iotatoken=david=shit
IOTA=SCAM

so fuckin simple, just watch and learn at their moderated forum.

"scam" implies a malicious intention, where people are deliberately subjected to fraud, theft, whatever.
You think all foundation-members, like mathematicians, entrepreneurs, professors from around the globe are dumb enough to participate in such a project?
Get off your fucking hillbilly-high-horse and face the facts: you missed the opportunity to invest in an incredible piece of technology, or even worse, you just don't have the IQ to understand what it's about.
So all you have left is trolling in the most unimportant space of the Internet, Bitcointalk.
Congratulations for this masterful achievement.
You are the pride of creation!
If that's all, you may continue your crusade of douchebags somewhere else. Maybe at home, on the street or wherever the fuck you want because here, you are less beneficial than athlete's foot.

https://i.imgur.com/9yDaRlG.png

GO TO HELL, SCAMMER

[SatoNatomato]

iotatoken=david=shit
IOTA=SCAM

so fuckin simple, just watch and learn at their moderated forum.

"scam" implies a malicious intention,

Great point.

Now Id say its not a real scam, its just incompetence. The scam is an opportunity, not originally planned for.

IoT is very attractive, its an enterprise buzzword, so of course it attracts real people with real good skills, but the founders and leaders, are just incompetent, both technically and socially obviously, and are delivering vapor, "almost-good" "we will have it ready soon" "from day 1 we knew we have to build asics and sell that duh".

The train is in full steam ahead, the crash wont be spectacular, good parts will fall out of IOTA. But it wont be the one and only machine economy infrastructure or anything like that at all.

[SteveoMB]

iotatoken=david=shit
IOTA=SCAM

so fuckin simple, just watch and learn at their moderated forum.

"scam" implies a malicious intention,

Great point.

Now Id say its not a real scam, its just incompetence. The scam is an opportunity, not originally planned for.

IoT is very attractive, its an enterprise buzzword, so of course it attracts real people with real good skills, but the founders and leaders, are just incompetent, both technically and socially obviously, and are delivering vapor, "almost-good" "we will have it ready soon" "from day 1 we knew we have to build asics and sell that duh".

The train is in full steam ahead, the crash wont be spectacular, good parts will fall out of IOTA. But it wont be the one and only machine economy infrastructure or anything like that at all.

may I ask for your qualification?
you seem to be better than every genius in the iota-team

[SteveoMB]

iotatoken=david=shit
IOTA=SCAM

so fuckin simple, just watch and learn at their moderated forum.

"scam" implies a malicious intention, where people are deliberately subjected to fraud, theft, whatever.
You think all foundation-members, like mathematicians, entrepreneurs, professors from around the globe are dumb enough to participate in such a project?
Get off your fucking hillbilly-high-horse and face the facts: you missed the opportunity to invest in an incredible piece of technology, or even worse, you just don't have the IQ to understand what it's about.
So all you have left is trolling in the most unimportant space of the Internet, Bitcointalk.
Congratulations for this masterful achievement.
You are the pride of creation!
If that's all, you may continue your crusade of douchebags somewhere else. Maybe at home, on the street or wherever the fuck you want because here, you are less beneficial than athlete's foot.

https://i.imgur.com/9yDaRlG.png

GO TO HELL, SCAMMER

do you understand English? you have no point. you are literally crying for no reason like a baby.

[iotatoken]

iotatoken=david=shit
IOTA=SCAM

so fuckin simple, just watch and learn at their moderated forum.

"scam" implies a malicious intention,

Great point.

Now Id say its not a real scam, its just incompetence. The scam is an opportunity, not originally planned for.

IoT is very attractive, its an enterprise buzzword, so of course it attracts real people with real good skills, but the founders and leaders, are just incompetent, both technically and socially obviously, and are delivering vapor, "almost-good" "we will have it ready soon" "from day 1 we knew we have to build asics and sell that duh".

The train is in full steam ahead, the crash wont be spectacular, good parts will fall out of IOTA. But it wont be the one and only machine economy infrastructure or anything like that at all.

Hahahaha the level of trolling has depreciated. Inflation of trolling ;\

[SatoNatomato]

iotatoken=david=shit
IOTA=SCAM

so fuckin simple, just watch and learn at their moderated forum.

"scam" implies a malicious intention,

Great point.

Now Id say its not a real scam, its just incompetence. The scam is an opportunity, not originally planned for.

IoT is very attractive, its an enterprise buzzword, so of course it attracts real people with real good skills, but the founders and leaders, are just incompetent, both technically and socially obviously, and are delivering vapor, "almost-good" "we will have it ready soon" "from day 1 we knew we have to build asics and sell that duh".

The train is in full steam ahead, the crash wont be spectacular, good parts will fall out of IOTA. But it wont be the one and only machine economy infrastructure or anything like that at all.

may I ask for your qualification?
you seem to be better than every genius in the iota-team

Let me explain like this,

Even if I cannot paint like Picasso, I can still tell that your painting looks like shit and Picassos doesnt.

Even you should be able to see Iota for what it is, if you had not invested in it and now your critical-thinking is malfunctioning. You just want it to happen you just want it to work. You just want the damn money. And you and I both know, IoT micro-transactions market exists, corporations are dying for it even today, they want it. They want to sell their sensors data in automated fashion.

Look at it from a different perspective, if you are developer of IoT applications, from all the developer platforms out there, and all the chips, how many support the non-existent Jinn-machine/power-hungry ASIC? How many chips today need a power-hungry ASIC, extra-chip integrated on a micro-controller, in order to "broadcast txs to other nodes" for anyway not receiving any protection? I am telling you, 0, zero, none. You do not need it, in fact it is an extra cost, both in integrating it with micro controllers, and various IoT platforms, maintaining it, and in your application - all for what? "Zero-fee transactions"? For not having any more protection of your "IoT nodes" txs than SSL/TLS already today offers if you anyway talk to a full node under your trust.

Byteball does it better, and it does it much better. The fees are minuscule to what you can do, if you have 1Gigabytes, you can do 826 000 txs, and if you dont want your IoT device to "run out of balance to send txs", a declarative smart contract away puts the fee of 580 bytes on the buyer of your sensor-data.

That is all it takes, a declarative smart contract in Byteball, a very light wallet, put 600bytes on all your IoT devices, and sell their data at market prices. Buyer would pay 600bytes (tx fee) plus your set amount to buy say weather or such data. When you receive it, your IoT devices give that. Byteball also supports Oracles so all this can be done decentralized.  If you dont want the very light wallet on IoT device (to develop it now), or to put any bytes on each device, you can use already made HTTPS API in all IoT development platforms and talk to your full node wallet. It cant get any simpler than this.

But anyway, good luck with it all.

[LiQio]

[...]
But anyway, good luck with it all.

Thanks. See you around.

[SteveoMB]

iotatoken=david=shit
IOTA=SCAM

so fuckin simple, just watch and learn at their moderated forum.

"scam" implies a malicious intention,

Great point.

Now Id say its not a real scam, its just incompetence. The scam is an opportunity, not originally planned for.

IoT is very attractive, its an enterprise buzzword, so of course it attracts real people with real good skills, but the founders and leaders, are just incompetent, both technically and socially obviously, and are delivering vapor, "almost-good" "we will have it ready soon" "from day 1 we knew we have to build asics and sell that duh".

The train is in full steam ahead, the crash wont be spectacular, good parts will fall out of IOTA. But it wont be the one and only machine economy infrastructure or anything like that at all.

may I ask for your qualification?
you seem to be better than every genius in the iota-team

Let me explain like this,

Even if I cannot paint like Picasso, I can still tell that your painting looks like shit and Picassos doesnt.

Even you should be able to see Iota for what it is, if you had not invested in it and now your critical-thinking is malfunctioning. You just want it to happen you just want it to work. You just want the damn money. And you and I both know, IoT micro-transactions market exists, corporations are dying for it even today, they want it. They want to sell their sensors data in automated fashion.

Look at it from a different perspective, if you are developer of IoT applications, from all the developer platforms out there, and all the chips, how many support the non-existent Jinn-machine/power-hungry ASIC? How many chips today need a power-hungry ASIC, extra-chip integrated on a micro-controller, in order to "broadcast txs to other nodes" for anyway not receiving any protection? I am telling you, 0, zero, none. You do not need it, in fact it is an extra cost, both in integrating it with micro controllers, and various IoT platforms, maintaining it, and in your application - all for what? "Zero-fee transactions"? For not having any more protection of your "IoT nodes" txs than SSL/TLS already today offers if you anyway talk to a full node under your trust.

Byteball does it better, and it does it much better. The fees are minuscule to what you can do, if you have 1Gigabytes, you can do 826 000 txs, and if you dont want your IoT device to "run out of balance to send txs", a declarative smart contract away puts the fee of 580 bytes on the buyer of your sensor-data.

That is all it takes, a declarative smart contract in Byteball, a very light wallet, put 600bytes on all your IoT devices, and sell their data at market prices. Buyer would pay 600bytes (tx fee) plus your set amount to buy say weather or such data. When you receive it, your IoT devices give that. Byteball also supports Oracles so all this can be done decentralized.  If you dont want the very light wallet on IoT device (to develop it now), or to put any bytes on each device, you can use already made HTTPS API in all IoT development platforms and talk to your full node wallet. It cant get any simpler than this.

But anyway, good luck with it all.

And in the end, it's all a competition for you. That's the point. I don't see Byteball as a competitor. Not one iota. You reveal your intentions. Wasted energy, srsly man. All for nothing. 
BB doesn't aim for the IoT. easy. It's human applications, value shifting between two people. IOTAs field is different. Why is this even discussed?

Concerning your picasso:
I'm in IOTA for ~one year now. I studied the tech, the people, the everyday development, which is transparent btw. There are flaws, and everyone would lie if he told otherwise, but that's the process of development.
But up till now, I never saw anyone lying on purpose, no one was trying to hype IOTA and for the most time, we were told to stop hyping as IOTA wasn't interested in cryptoland but in real world application and adoption.
So where are issues with credibility here? I see none, and I doubt you can judge anyone, because you're not a real part of that community.

concerning your asic-example:
they will use IOTA nonetheless because some things can't be done without it. ever heard about winternitz otss?
the ternary system? monte carlo random walk?
too many advantages NOT to use it.
And once, JINN are built in a higher number, they get cheaper, the common circle of industrial processes.
so, it can be done simpler with https api, but a quantum computer will take control in 0.0001 s. not to forget all advantages of a tangle as such are gone. like decentralization etc.

concerning your fees: they disrupt nanopayments as such. you cannot buy sensordata for prices  + fees equal to your bytes used because you would generated a GIGANTIC amount of fees. this thought is no fucking rocketscience, this is kindergarten.

and last but not least: if you really like byteball but dislike IOTA, why would you, a person whos a self-appointed expert in cryptos, waste your precious time on discrediting IOTA? Do you discredit komodo, ethereum, dogecoin, fucking potcoin or any other asset?
why not investing, and caring about life, like drinking beer, eating icecream and swinging your balls?
you LIKE to discredit IOTA because you have personal, emotional interest in harming it, because you were banned by David for trolling and for flaming without proper reasons. I see no value in that. Not even for your own sake. my life is more important than wasting time on such a worthless bullshit like these conversations here. srsly, I'm not going to elaborate any further on bullshit like this.

[SatoNatomato]

iotatoken=david=shit
IOTA=SCAM

so fuckin simple, just watch and learn at their moderated forum.

"scam" implies a malicious intention,

Great point.

Now Id say its not a real scam, its just incompetence. The scam is an opportunity, not originally planned for.

IoT is very attractive, its an enterprise buzzword, so of course it attracts real people with real good skills, but the founders and leaders, are just incompetent, both technically and socially obviously, and are delivering vapor, "almost-good" "we will have it ready soon" "from day 1 we knew we have to build asics and sell that duh".

The train is in full steam ahead, the crash wont be spectacular, good parts will fall out of IOTA. But it wont be the one and only machine economy infrastructure or anything like that at all.

may I ask for your qualification?
you seem to be better than every genius in the iota-team

Let me explain like this,

Even if I cannot paint like Picasso, I can still tell that your painting looks like shit and Picassos doesnt.

Even you should be able to see Iota for what it is, if you had not invested in it and now your critical-thinking is malfunctioning. You just want it to happen you just want it to work. You just want the damn money. And you and I both know, IoT micro-transactions market exists, corporations are dying for it even today, they want it. They want to sell their sensors data in automated fashion.

Look at it from a different perspective, if you are developer of IoT applications, from all the developer platforms out there, and all the chips, how many support the non-existent Jinn-machine/power-hungry ASIC? How many chips today need a power-hungry ASIC, extra-chip integrated on a micro-controller, in order to "broadcast txs to other nodes" for anyway not receiving any protection? I am telling you, 0, zero, none. You do not need it, in fact it is an extra cost, both in integrating it with micro controllers, and various IoT platforms, maintaining it, and in your application - all for what? "Zero-fee transactions"? For not having any more protection of your "IoT nodes" txs than SSL/TLS already today offers if you anyway talk to a full node under your trust.

Byteball does it better, and it does it much better. The fees are minuscule to what you can do, if you have 1Gigabytes, you can do 826 000 txs, and if you dont want your IoT device to "run out of balance to send txs", a declarative smart contract away puts the fee of 580 bytes on the buyer of your sensor-data.

That is all it takes, a declarative smart contract in Byteball, a very light wallet, put 600bytes on all your IoT devices, and sell their data at market prices. Buyer would pay 600bytes (tx fee) plus your set amount to buy say weather or such data. When you receive it, your IoT devices give that. Byteball also supports Oracles so all this can be done decentralized.  If you dont want the very light wallet on IoT device (to develop it now), or to put any bytes on each device, you can use already made HTTPS API in all IoT development platforms and talk to your full node wallet. It cant get any simpler than this.

But anyway, good luck with it all.

And in the end, it's all a competition for you. That's the point. I don't see Byteball as a competitor. Not one iota. You reveal your intentions. Wasted energy, srsly man. All for nothing. 

Now, dude seriously? It was just an example, I might have as well used SPECTRE or any other shit coin in the example - of alternative solution. Just because it has Iot in its name doesnt mean its the best suited for it.

Value shifting between two humans happen when exchanging paper-notes or coins or mobile-phones or rocks, all else in digital crypto is machine-to-machine communication. Just because it doesnt "aim for", doesnt mean it wont be most applied there - see Linux, mostly applied on servers and super-computers, while it was "aimed for" hobby geeks PCs.

The issue with credibility, is with the developers/leaders/founders - Ive explained before here their treatment of me when attempting to join Iota community. They arent socially skilled to lead a project of the vision of Iota - they are the weakest point, worse than the asic idea.

Issue with credibility - censoring/deleting my posts from here in the main IOTA thread for asking the same shit I ask here. That is lying. Hiding information/questions from others.

Yes, heard about those buzzwords, ever heard of Markov chain? Oooh sooo fancy. Ternary? Please, it was attempted even in 1960s.

Jinn will get cheaper? So your entire investment in IOTA rests on a still-magical hardware to get cheaper. Cheaper than IoT microcontroller which costs $1 ?

So you want post-quantum crypto/openssl, a google away is https://github.com/open-quantum-safe/liboqs that wasnt hard.

you cannot buy sensordata for prices

LOL, ok then wtf would you buy it for if not a price?

A gigantic, like really humungus gigantic amount? How much is gigantic for you? Do you have difficult writing the word trillion? Show examples or go home. Anyway my example was just to wake you up and see a different perspective it was not a "think before write" example, its okay if you dont want to think of anything else than what IOTA are selling you.

Yes, yes I do discredit any other piece of shit technology/idea I see. Ethereum and TheDAO scandal in particular, I laughed at it before its launch (Full Turing machine... like fucking okay dude, tell me how that wont fail exactly) and I continue chuckling even now, which is how I live my life. What is my motive? Excellence, just that, elegance and excellence in software-industry, I dont want to be surrounded by scumbag IoT devices using more power than they need, polluting the environment even more for no gain at all - my motive against iota asics is environmental protection, and against iota founders/"developers" scamming people of money, just like that because I am a good guy. Im the type of guy to open and hold a door for you, even you Steveo, and Im here telling all "investors" watch out.

Simple enough - watch out! They gonna grab your money!

And if you think of investing in Byteball - dont do it, its not even 1 month in "production". Invest in a new perfume and go out get drunk instead.

[SteveoMB]

all I see is a bored chauvinist who has time to troll but no real interest in checking facts, which makes you a liar. I guess you heard that term before. the more people you meet, the more you trigger, it's your nature. you're a dick.
see ya, boring guy

[SatoNatomato]

all I see is a bored chauvinist who has time to troll but no real interest in checking facts, which makes you a liar. I guess you heard that term before. the more people you meet, the more you trigger, it's your nature. you're a dick.
see ya, boring guy

Yeah thanks for the nice welcome to iota community bro.  

Great arguments you have as well, "chauvinist troll liar dick", if you want Ill give you a dictionary of adjectives and insults which you can use to describe future critics of Iota. Iota community seems to be running out of insults for me so far.

[SteveoMB]

all I see is a bored chauvinist who has time to troll but no real interest in checking facts, which makes you a liar. I guess you heard that term before. the more people you meet, the more you trigger, it's your nature. you're a dick.
see ya, boring guy

Yeah thanks for the nice welcome to iota community bro.  

Great arguments you have as well, "chauvinist troll liar dick", if you want Ill give you a dictionary of adjectives and insults which you can use to describe future critics of Iota. Iota community seems to be running out of insults for me so far.

a little bit of self-reflection would help "bro". you don't even see your mistakes or insults. that's what a chauvi does.

[SatoNatomato]

all I see is a bored chauvinist who has time to troll but no real interest in checking facts, which makes you a liar. I guess you heard that term before. the more people you meet, the more you trigger, it's your nature. you're a dick.
see ya, boring guy

Yeah thanks for the nice welcome to iota community bro.  

Great arguments you have as well, "chauvinist troll liar dick", if you want Ill give you a dictionary of adjectives and insults which you can use to describe future critics of Iota. Iota community seems to be running out of insults for me so far.

a little bit of self-reflection would help "bro". you don't even see your mistakes or insults. that's what a chauvi does.

Why are you even so upset? Did I call you a chauvanistic dick liar or anything at all?

Dont be upset at me, be upset at IOTA devs who fooled you.

Im just the messenger dude, and if you still so strongly believe in IOTA you can just say "thats like your opinion man", and be done with it, no need for personal attacks. 

[SteveoMB]

all I see is a bored chauvinist who has time to troll but no real interest in checking facts, which makes you a liar. I guess you heard that term before. the more people you meet, the more you trigger, it's your nature. you're a dick.
see ya, boring guy

Yeah thanks for the nice welcome to iota community bro.  

Great arguments you have as well, "chauvinist troll liar dick", if you want Ill give you a dictionary of adjectives and insults which you can use to describe future critics of Iota. Iota community seems to be running out of insults for me so far.

a little bit of self-reflection would help "bro". you don't even see your mistakes or insults. that's what a chauvi does.

Why are you even so upset? Did I call you a chauvanistic dick liar or anything at all?

Dont be upset at me, be upset at IOTA devs who fooled you.

Im just the messenger dude, and if you still so strongly believe in IOTA you can just say "thats like your opinion man", and be done with it, no need for personal attacks. 

I'm not upset, I'm bored. Have a good life man. Do something about that persecution complex.

[SatoNatomato]

all I see is a bored chauvinist who has time to troll but no real interest in checking facts, which makes you a liar. I guess you heard that term before. the more people you meet, the more you trigger, it's your nature. you're a dick.
see ya, boring guy

Yeah thanks for the nice welcome to iota community bro.  

Great arguments you have as well, "chauvinist troll liar dick", if you want Ill give you a dictionary of adjectives and insults which you can use to describe future critics of Iota. Iota community seems to be running out of insults for me so far.

a little bit of self-reflection would help "bro". you don't even see your mistakes or insults. that's what a chauvi does.

Why are you even so upset? Did I call you a chauvanistic dick liar or anything at all?

Dont be upset at me, be upset at IOTA devs who fooled you.

Im just the messenger dude, and if you still so strongly believe in IOTA you can just say "thats like your opinion man", and be done with it, no need for personal attacks. 

I'm not upset, I'm bored. Have a good life man. Do something about that persecution complex.

If youre not upset, then check up your hostility/aggression centre of your brain, may be a tumor.

[drays]

@NatoSatomato: man, I understand your admiration for Byteball, and I agree it is fantastic technology.

But, with all the respect, what I really cannot understand is why you spend so much time and energy attacking IOTA? Let those guys do what they are doing, and lets see what they would achieve. There are problems with IOTA (I don't want to go into details, as I know nobody actually asks for them, and everyone sees them differently), there are issues to overcome, but as far as I understand its none of your (and mine too) business. There are people who work on that. and they sincerely try to make it succeed. Let them do their job.

If you indeed like BB so much, why don't you join BB development team, and use your SW development talents to help Tonych and the BB to progress faster? That would be much more productive way to spend your time, than wasting it here basing IOTA, isn't it? And I would tell - it would be much more rewarding in all terms, as you will get much more appreciation, and enjoyment from what you are doing!


Part 2 (if the part 1 above seems reasonable to you, you could skip part 2 at all)
One more, unrelated thought... What I really like in IOTA, and what I see as an undoubtful advantage of it over anything else - are the zero fees.  You tell BB fees are small, and that (along with other benefits) allows BB to replace IOTA... Well, as per my observations in different areas, zero fees is something hugely  more attractive than just small fees. Its like "FREE" software, its is always thousand times more popular than even extremely cheap one. Or look at the markets with zero fees - you see huge transaction volume there.
Small fee is still a fee. Zero fee is something of completely different ligue. The fact of being "FREE" opens completely new doors, and usage cases.

This is how I see it... I know you will disagree, that's is what you like doing the most . Thats ok, but I am sure as an intelligent person you will see the point of what I wrote above