Merit & new rank requirements

[InvoKing]

Just from this thread, the merit system is already broke from the start. This needs to be done away with. Just a opinion.

No it isn't.
The concept is good and will eventually stop rewarding the shitposters, however it will affect also regular posters slightly depending from their actual activity, at least for those who cares about their ranks. Contribute and you will get a reward.

Yes, the concept is great, however I think people need to get more used for giving some merit to posts that deserve it. It's very hard to get some - I've started quite an active thread about privacy coins and contributed quite a lot to it, but only got 3 merits - and there are required to go from Member to Full Member. Is there anybody who succeeded in getting higher rank since the merits were introduced?

It is possible but it will require longer waiting time.
If you find any of your topics/posts useful but it didn't get its chance then you can simply highlight it in a dedicated topics where the OP there will give sMerit for quality posts. You can find those topics in the services sub generally.

[suchmoon]

Just from this thread, the merit system is already broke from the start. This needs to be done away with. Just a opinion.

No it isn't.
The concept is good and will eventually stop rewarding the shitposters, however it will affect also regular posters slightly depending from their actual activity, at least for those who cares about their ranks. Contribute and you will get a reward.

Yes, the concept is great, however I think people need to get more used for giving some merit to posts that deserve it. It's very hard to get some - I've started quite an active thread about privacy coins and contributed quite a lot to it, but only got 3 merits - and there are required to go from Member to Full Member. Is there anybody who succeeded in getting higher rank since the merits were introduced?

Stop micromanaging it. Judging the system by one post or one thread is meaningless.

Look at it from another angle: if your thread gave you lots of merits, would you be creating new threads like that every week? If you made a funny post with a meme and got merits for it, would you be posting only memes from now on?

Forget merits, find what interests you most in this forum - something you know a lot about, something you want to learn, etc - and participate in the discussion. Merits will find their way to you.

[mrelich]

Just from this thread, the merit system is already broke from the start. This needs to be done away with. Just a opinion.

No it isn't.
The concept is good and will eventually stop rewarding the shitposters, however it will affect also regular posters slightly depending from their actual activity, at least for those who cares about their ranks. Contribute and you will get a reward.

Yes, the concept is great, however I think people need to get more used for giving some merit to posts that deserve it. It's very hard to get some - I've started quite an active thread about privacy coins and contributed quite a lot to it, but only got 3 merits - and there are required to go from Member to Full Member. Is there anybody who succeeded in getting higher rank since the merits were introduced?

It is possible but it will require longer waiting time.
If you find any of your topics/posts useful but it didn't get its chance then you can simply highlight it in a dedicated topics where the OP there will give sMerit for quality posts. You can find those topics in the services sub generally.

Hi,
thanks for a response. I'll have a look for these topics. The way to get higher rank seems to be very long, but I am not saying that it's bad. With the total sMerit amount increasing from Merit sources and with users getting used to give merits to good posts, perhaps the speed of getting Merits for everyone should increase.  
Anyway, if anyone wants to evaluate if my list of privacy coins  deserves some merit, please have a look  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2869616.0
Best regards

[seven2smoke1]

Just from this thread, the merit system is already broke from the start. This needs to be done away with. Just a opinion.

No it isn't.
The concept is good and will eventually stop rewarding the shitposters, however it will affect also regular posters slightly depending from their actual activity, at least for those who cares about their ranks. Contribute and you will get a reward.

Yes, the concept is great, however I think people need to get more used for giving some merit to posts that deserve it. It's very hard to get some - I've started quite an active thread about privacy coins and contributed quite a lot to it, but only got 3 merits - and there are required to go from Member to Full Member. Is there anybody who succeeded in getting higher rank since the merits were introduced?

It is possible but it will require longer waiting time.
If you find any of your topics/posts useful but it didn't get its chance then you can simply highlight it in a dedicated topics where the OP there will give sMerit for quality posts. You can find those topics in the services sub generally.

Hi,
thanks for a response. I'll have a look for these topics. The way to get higher rank seems to be very long, but I am not saying that it's bad. With the total sMerit amount increasing from Merit sources and with users getting used to give merits to good posts, perhaps the speed of getting Merits for everyone should increase.  
Anyway, if anyone wants to evaluate if my list of privacy coins  deserves some merit, please have a look  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2869616.0
Best regards

If you want to get some merit points by reviewing your posts, you should see the post of pugman here.

[TheQuin]

Forget merits, find what interests you most in this forum - something you know a lot about, something you want to learn, etc - and participate in the discussion. Merits will find their way to you.

This comment should be stickied somewhere everyone can see it.

[krishnaverma]

Just from this thread, the merit system is already broke from the start. This needs to be done away with. Just a opinion.

What is the opinion based on ? We are already see new members making constructive posts after this merit system was implemented. Also, if you are to read replies in this tread and other threads in meta about merit system, you would have realized that the decision is not going to be taken back. In fact, some signature campaigns are now requiring some merits from applicants.

[athanz88]

Just from this thread, the merit system is already broke from the start. This needs to be done away with. Just a opinion.

What is the opinion based on ? We are already see new members making constructive posts after this merit system was implemented. Also, if you are to read replies in this tread and other threads in meta about merit system, you would have realized that the decision is not going to be taken back. In fact, some signature campaigns are now requiring some merits from applicants.

Same, i wanted to know how this member can make that conclusions too. Hope he will be here to explain.
Yeah merit system already kicks in into another crucial things for the spammer, which is a campaign, just look at my campaign now, it requires a lot of merit to apply. I guess other campaign will be like this in the future. With this implementation, the spammer must step up their game or they will be left behind. And yes, merit wont be taken back from the system.

[krishnaverma]

Same, i wanted to know how this member can make that conclusions too. Hope he will be here to explain.
Yeah merit system already kicks in into another crucial things for the spammer, which is a campaign, just look at my campaign now, it requires a lot of merit to apply. I guess other campaign will be like this in the future. With this implementation, the spammer must step up their game or they will be left behind. And yes, merit wont be taken back from the system.

Only issue with such members is that they do not read more.  Only when you are read threads/replies by other members, you can be aware of the latest happenings in the forum. Thereafter, you can make helpful replies to queries of other members. If a member is just reading the posts here, he will get a lot of ideas regarding how to benefit from the forum without breaking the rules.

[mahekfatimag]

In addition to activity, everyone now has a merit score, and you need both a certain activity level and a certain merit score in order to reach higher member ranks. The required scores are:

Rank	Required activity	Required merit
Brand new	0	0
Newbie	1	0
Jr Member	30	0
Member	60	10
Full Member	120	100
Sr. Member	240	250
Hero Member	480	500
Legendary	Random in the range 775-1030	1000

You get merit points when someone sends you some for one of your posts. Additionally, when someone sends you merit points, half of those points can be sent by you to other people.

Certain users are designated as "merit sources". They can create new merit out of nothing, up to a limited number per month (which differs per source). I will not be posting a definitive list of merit sources (so that people don't bug them too much), though you'll soon figure out who they are if you pay attention.

There is currently no such thing as a "demerit". I'm hoping that the positive merits alone will be fine. I could add demerits pretty easily later on if necessary, though.

I'm hoping that this system will increase post quality by:
 - Forcing people to post high-quality stuff in order to rank up. If you just post garbage, you will never get even 1 merit point, and you will therefore never be able to put links in your signature, etc.
 - Highlighting good posts with the "Merited by" line.

While we will not be directly moderating this, I encourage people to give merit to posts that are objectively high-quality, not just posts that you agree with.

Do not beg for merit excessively.

Useful infographics

Forum users have helpfully created some infographics to explain the merit system:
paxmao's infographic
ibminer's infographic
8Habits's infographic
JetSet11's infographic
zentdex's infographic
alia_armelle's infographic

If you want to be a merit source:

 1. Be a somewhat established member.
 2. Collect TEN posts written in the last couple of months by other people that have not received nearly enough merit for how good they are, and post quotes for them all in a new Meta thread. The point of this is to demonstrate your ability to give out merit usefully.
 3. We will take a look at your history and maybe make you a source.

I am especially eager to have merit sources in sub-communities such as the local sections.

Trivia:

For current members, your initial merit score is equal to the minimum required to your rank. Of that, a certain amount (less than the usual half) is spendable. The spendable amount was calculated based on your current rank and the number of activity points you earned in the last year. A Legendary member who hasn't posted in the last year would still be Legendary, but would not have any spendable merit.

If someone sends you 1 merit, the 0.5 sMerit is not wasted; it is just not shown until you get another merit point.

There are stats here, and you can find someone's merit summary by clicking the "merit" link on their profile.

I think and I wish, it would be better if the Merit button is just clickable like the "LIKE button on Facebook - clicked and stay on the same place in the page". It is very annoying when someone click on merit button, he/she run away from the current post.

[avreli]

I think and I wish, it would be better if the Merit button is just clickable like the "LIKE button on Facebook - clicked and stay on the same place in the page". It is very annoying when someone click on merit button, he/she run away from the current post.

That is a kind of confirmation being asked. I think it is there to prevent incidence where someone may merit a post by mistake.

[katin-skl]

Forum is the pursuit of merits now. Will live strong and persistent. Natural selection.
Merit will not appreciate the quality. Merit should not be the basis of a new rank. Merit is the gratitude of users. Not everyone can get it in the right amount. The number of merits is too large to move to new ranks.
I can not give a merits to anyone, but there are many topics that are useful to me. Beginners can not give gratitude. It is not right

[JayJuanGee]

I think and I wish, it would be better if the Merit button is just clickable like the "LIKE button on Facebook - clicked and stay on the same place in the page". It is very annoying when someone click on merit button, he/she run away from the current post.

That is a kind of confirmation being asked. I think it is there to prevent incidence where someone may merit a post by mistake.

That is a decent point, avreli, and also as we know this forum merit system is somewhat different from the "like" function on Facebook.  There is a kind of warning that describes what it means to give an SMerit and it informs you of how many you have, and in the end, giving an smerit is not reversible... Once you do it, it is done, and it does not even matter if the post gets deleted later, your smerit sticks to the person who received the smerit and generates 1 merit plus .5 smerits for the recipient.

[JayJuanGee]

Forum is the pursuit of merits now. Will live strong and persistent. Natural selection.
Merit will not appreciate the quality. Merit should not be the basis of a new rank. Merit is the gratitude of users. Not everyone can get it in the right amount. The number of merits is too large to move to new ranks

How do you know so much about how the merit system of the forum is going to play out? 

You have been a member of the forum for about 1 month.  The merit system was implemented 1 week after you registered your account.

I suppose that if you do not like this new merit system, then you don't have to use it, right?  You have only one month invested into the forum, so far, right?

[katin-skl]

Forum is the pursuit of merits now. Will live strong and persistent. Natural selection.
Merit will not appreciate the quality. Merit should not be the basis of a new rank. Merit is the gratitude of users. Not everyone can get it in the right amount. The number of merits is too large to move to new ranks

How do you know so much about how the merit system of the forum is going to play out? 

You have been a member of the forum for about 1 month.  The merit system was implemented 1 week after you registered your account.

I suppose that if you do not like this new merit system, then you don't have to use it, right?  You have only one month invested into the forum, so far, right?

Thank you for your reply. I completed the message. I'm not complaining about the system. But beginners can not give a measure, because it is not. But a lot of useful on the forum and I would also like to thank for useful topics

[thesavoyard]

This new merit system doesn't work. The only thing it serves is to make people even more factional than before. Logic gets shot down for loyalty.

[albos]

This new merit system doesn't work. The only thing it serves is to make people even more factional than before. Logic gets shot down for loyalty.

I agree with this post. Merit sistem really does not work.

[thesavoyard]

Forum is the pursuit of merits now. Will live strong and persistent. Natural selection.
Merit will not appreciate the quality. Merit should not be the basis of a new rank. Merit is the gratitude of users. Not everyone can get it in the right amount. The number of merits is too large to move to new ranks

How do you know so much about how the merit system of the forum is going to play out? 

You have been a member of the forum for about 1 month.  The merit system was implemented 1 week after you registered your account.

I suppose that if you do not like this new merit system, then you don't have to use it, right?  You have only one month invested into the forum, so far, right?

Says the guy who only had to hang out and post to increase his rank.

[JayJuanGee]

Forum is the pursuit of merits now. Will live strong and persistent. Natural selection.
Merit will not appreciate the quality. Merit should not be the basis of a new rank. Merit is the gratitude of users. Not everyone can get it in the right amount. The number of merits is too large to move to new ranks

How do you know so much about how the merit system of the forum is going to play out? 

You have been a member of the forum for about 1 month.  The merit system was implemented 1 week after you registered your account.

I suppose that if you do not like this new merit system, then you don't have to use it, right?  You have only one month invested into the forum, so far, right?

Thank you for your reply. I completed the message. I'm not complaining about the system. But beginners can not give a measure, because it is not. But a lot of useful on the forum and I would also like to thank for useful topics

ok.. you are still a beginner to the forum, and I have been on the forum for four years, and during those first four years, we were not able to give merits.  During that time, sometimes I wished that I could "like" a post, but the remedy ended up being responding to the post, and attempting to interact with the person on the other end, if the subject is interesting for you, and if you believe that you have a meaningful contribution that you can make.

There's is almost no chance that you are going to get me to argue that this newly implemented merit system is perfect, but from some angle, it is what it is, and Theymos already decided what he was going to implement, and he did it in such a way that he thought was fair while attempting to get this newly implemented system to attempt to remedy some issues that are developing on the forum with both a giant influx of new members but also questions of shitty posts and farmed accounts. 

Whether this newly implemented system adequately addresses those issues and does not raise it's own problems is still to be seen.  There are going to be anticipated problems and unanticipated problems and perhaps there will be some need for Theymos to tweak aspects of the merit system.. perhaps?

As you may realize, he has already decided to limit the number of sources of merits, so everyone does not receive a source of merits on a regular basis unless you 1) received some sources during the transition based on your rank and activity level in the past year, 2) receive merits from other members.   

You are likely correct that there are going to be fewer merits circulating around amongst the lower ranks, but so in that regard, you may need to attempt to figure out ways to earn merits by making interesting posts and attempting to interact with members who may be able to give merits - either by reading your post or by their showing appreciation for interacting with you... so yes, it could take some time to earn enough merits to rank up to full member.. regular member may be a bit easier to accomplish, but certainly not going to be earned without any effort.

[katin-skl]

Forum is the pursuit of merits now. Will live strong and persistent. Natural selection.
Merit will not appreciate the quality. Merit should not be the basis of a new rank. Merit is the gratitude of users. Not everyone can get it in the right amount. The number of merits is too large to move to new ranks

How do you know so much about how the merit system of the forum is going to play out? 

You have been a member of the forum for about 1 month.  The merit system was implemented 1 week after you registered your account.

I suppose that if you do not like this new merit system, then you don't have to use it, right?  You have only one month invested into the forum, so far, right?

Thank you for your reply. I completed the message. I'm not complaining about the system. But beginners can not give a measure, because it is not. But a lot of useful on the forum and I would also like to thank for useful topics

ok.. you are still a beginner to the forum, and I have been on the forum for four years, and during those first four years, we were not able to give merits.  During that time, sometimes I wished that I could "like" a post, but the remedy ended up being responding to the post, and attempting to interact with the person on the other end, if the subject is interesting for you, and if you believe that you have a meaningful contribution that you can make.

There's is almost no chance that you are going to get me to argue that this newly implemented merit system is perfect, but from some angle, it is what it is, and Theymos already decided what he was going to implement, and he did it in such a way that he thought was fair while attempting to get this newly implemented system to attempt to remedy some issues that are developing on the forum with both a giant influx of new members but also questions of shitty posts and farmed accounts. 

Whether this newly implemented system adequately addresses those issues and does not raise it's own problems is still to be seen.  There are going to be anticipated problems and unanticipated problems and perhaps there will be some need for Theymos to tweak aspects of the merit system.. perhaps?

As you may realize, he has already decided to limit the number of sources of merits, so everyone does not receive a source of merits on a regular basis unless you 1) received some sources during the transition based on your rank and activity level in the past year, 2) receive merits from other members.   

You are likely correct that there are going to be fewer merits circulating around amongst the lower ranks, but so in that regard, you may need to attempt to figure out ways to earn merits by making interesting posts and attempting to interact with members who may be able to give merits - either by reading your post or by their showing appreciation for interacting with you... so yes, it could take some time to earn enough merits to rank up to full member.. regular member may be a bit easier to accomplish, but certainly not going to be earned without any effort.

You're right. Now I see that the merit system works like this https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2818350.msg30462833#msg30462833

This is true? My opinion is no. This is not one example. Of course there are many well-deserved awards, but much is in doubt

[JayJuanGee]

Forum is the pursuit of merits now. Will live strong and persistent. Natural selection.
Merit will not appreciate the quality. Merit should not be the basis of a new rank. Merit is the gratitude of users. Not everyone can get it in the right amount. The number of merits is too large to move to new ranks

How do you know so much about how the merit system of the forum is going to play out? 

You have been a member of the forum for about 1 month.  The merit system was implemented 1 week after you registered your account.

I suppose that if you do not like this new merit system, then you don't have to use it, right?  You have only one month invested into the forum, so far, right?

Says the guy who only had to hang out and post to increase his rank.

What's up your butt?  Look I am using nice language, here?   

Your coming into the conversation to get in your two cents, makes you come off as a bit bitter and envious, no?   

Do you think that I had anything to do with implementing the new merit system? 

Here, I am merely talking about it, and you can proclaim my bias.. blah blah blah.. but that likely reflects more on your bad attitude rather than anything to do with me.

Accordingly, the content of your posts suggest that you are unwilling or unable to understand or accept both concepts of system changes and the concept of employing a grandfathering clause type arrangement in order to attempt to fairly transition members from the existing system into the new system. 

If you were attempting to make another point, then I am all ears, but mostly what I got from you was a weak-ass diversion attempt at an ad hominem attack rather than attempting to deal with actual substantive matters related to the merit system.