[ANN][VRC] VeriCoin Proof of Stake-Time Currency | New Roadmap Released

[CryptoJohn]

Kudos to VRC devs for having the stones to do something and do it quickly.

This will be historic in the crypto timeline and people will continue to disagree if it was the right decision. Crypto is still getting it's legs so things like this will happen. What matter most is we continue to move down the field towards our ultimate goal of mass adoption of crypto.

One of the issues today is the "cool" social status criminals are given. Script kiddies and hackers are just smarter criminals than the guy slinging dope on the corner. Both are part of the problem and should pay for their choices.

All you haters please dump into my buy walls.

When I look to the future I see VRC.

[buy4crypto]

....
That is is you want to have a guaranteed successful 51% attack...than 51% of the total coins STAKING....

barabbas you know that there are systems like PPC NOVA are using to prevent small amounts to make 51% attack
they are preventing it because of stake modyficators time stamps many  other combined solutions that only core coders understand not you...
At the end you have centralized CHECKPOINTs and no 51% attack is possible because of that...
POS system is not like just that you have 51%of stake and you will attack...
look how Nova is preventing 51% attack with having only 25% coins those technologies are known...
in fact when you have centralized checkpoint you are safe from 2x spend cause checkpoint servers will chose right chain for you...
Stop telling how you know POS while you are far away from tech aspects of case.
I am noob too but i know "a little more".


Tech info below ( BC in POS 2.0 pushed even further those security ... )
____________________

http://coinwiki.info/en/Novacoin
Stake generation issues
The main proof-of-stake design problem is that unlike proof-of-work hashing rate, stake weight could be used multiple times without any overhead. It allows potential attacker to repeat his attempts to generate consecutive stakes until he will get lucky enough. And there is high probability to success without holding large stake, 20–25% of total weight (not coins) will be more than enough. Attacker can retry his attempts to generate consecutive stakes 1,000, 50,000, or 1 million times without any problem, using the same outputs.[12][13]
This could be worked around using centralized check-pointing. Novacoin creators resolved this issue using balanced weighting scheme.[14]

Centralized check pointing
As PPCoin ideas descendant, Novacoin is not truly a decentralized currency as it still requires centralized check pointing to avoid several issues.[15] The Novacoin developer has announced however that this check pointing is only a temporary measure which will be removed once the currency grows sufficiently stable. The centralized checkpoints feature could be disabled manually using -nosynccheckpoints option for official client.

Blade, your post is so poorly written I don't understand a single thing you try to say (and, for once, they seem to be some interesting things being intended to be said there), so please try again. Give yourself a bit more time, maybe re-read and then post. I am not being sarcastinc, just read your post and you will see what I mean.

Besides that, it's difficult to understand why would you want me to "Stop telling how you know POS". I only post what I know and tech specs are not it. But I do know that if you control 51% of staking coins, you can perpetrate a 100% successful attack. And that if you have much less than 51% you still can perpetrate attacks that will eventually stand a good chance of being successful. If PPC or Nova have solutions for this, I don't know but I don't doubt it. What I read you posted seem, on first approach, for from an ideal solution -and not much different from rolling back actually-, but I may not "get" it completely...

In any case, you seem to want to avoid addressing the fact that someone or some group controlling 4.5 million (roughly 20% of total VRC and surely over 40, maybe even 50% of VRC STAKING poses a clear and present danger of a 51% attack, thefts and security failures at exchanges notwithstanding. I also would be quite interested in your personal opinion -if I can understand your answer, that is-, about the "generosity" towards VRC, and stake in it, of "Mr Boricua Man" for he played for quite a long time in YOUR field...Oh, and by the way, that field is on its way to extinction, as you are beginning to see now, so as an example to VRC, which is on the way up, up up and just starting, it simply cannot "work"/ Sorry for, as you know, I simply love the logo... but there's nothing else of any value there.

Please remember that Mintpal has stated officially that they don't mint POS coins.

Where does this large % come from?

Its only FUD, not FACT that you say in this case. and keep trying to go on. You are wrong on your principal, so stop before you continue on like its fact.


I see so many % symbols And I dont think 1 of them has any real meaning behind them other than being pulled out of air to make nice stories up.

You are quite confused at this point. That's why you just avoid thinking. It's ok. Things will sink in. Eventually.

Do you understand or not, that the money in Mintpal was NOT being staked? So that your theories are based on nothing factual?

If you can't respond to this, I can't help you anymore. You will continue to lie.

I understand very clearly, thank you. You, on the other hand, cannot understand anything at this point seemingly. Lets go by steps ok?
step one.- forget about the theft and Mintpal.
step two .- there's (was, now it's redistributed in several- ONE wallet with 4.5 million VRCs. It isn't a Mintpal, or Bittrex or Cryptsy wallet.
step three.- 4.5 million VRC are probably more than 50% or currently STAKING coins.
step four.- It doesn't take too much money -for groups such as the Black Hand-, to put together an amount enough to actually control not just 4.5 million VRC but several (millions) more -at current prices-

Does the picture gets less cloudy now?

PS.- I never, ever, lie. Ever.

Do you have PROOF of anything, or speculation based on hopes?


Do you have intimate knowledge that it was a blackhand? Can you PROVE it? or any other nefarious account that was it staking? Could it have been an exchange wallet not staking that had em? photoshop?



Can you give me facts so I can see this account you claim was staking the 4.5 mil?

[weryo]

We've been alerted that there are a couple of forked chains right now still. Please, for safety of your coins, don't move them yet. We are determining the problem.

What will happen to those who made a buy and withdrawal on Poloniex after the wallet update?  Is Poloniex on the right chain?  Same question for Mint.

That's why Poloniex is not yet processing VRC withdrawals. They're making sure they are on the right chain.
From the announcement section: "VRC frozen temporarily while we wait for developers to address a new fork."

[drkman]

Here's another thought: What if the devs didn't agree to a rollback? Do you really think Mintpal could pay back 2 million dollars? What if they just closed up shop and took off with everyone's coins? What would you all be saying then?

This, A thousand times this.  If The Devs had not acted so quickly then these boards would be filled with the very same people screaming at Mintpal and asking if withdrawals of any coins at Mint would ever be turned on again.  the Vericoin community just saved everyone that has any coin at MintGox and it's about time those choosing to FUD realized this.

[Flam]

Why is the updated wallet still not working, when will the second update be released ?
Wtf is this mess since when coins stuck on a exchange are affecting coins in personal wallet ?

[buy4crypto]

Why is the updated wallet still not working, when will the second update be released ?
Wtf is this mess since when coins stuck on a exchange are affecting coins in personal wallet ?

They been up 24 hours working on a fix. It would be advised to be patient and let them work. They know the issue and are working on it.

They had to compile new wallets on the fly in a stressful situation.

[bigc1984]

Kudos to VRC devs for having the stones to do something and do it quickly.

This will be historic in the crypto timeline and people will continue to disagree if it was the right decision. Crypto is still getting it's legs so things like this will happen. What matter most is we continue to move down the field towards our ultimate goal of mass adoption of crypto.

One of the issues today is the "cool" social status criminals are given. Script kiddies and hackers are just smarter criminals than the guy slinging dope on the corner. Both are part of the problem and should pay for their choices.

All you haters please dump into my sell walls.

When I look to the future I see VRC.

"criminal" is just a label governments place on competition as a way of stifling it.

[Flam]

Why is the updated wallet still not working, when will the second update be released ?
Wtf is this mess since when coins stuck on a exchange are affecting coins in personal wallet ?

They been up 24 hours working on a fix. It would be advised to be patient and let them work. They know the issue and are working on it.

They had to compile new wallets on the fly in a stressful situation.

Ok thanks, I feel the double fuckage from Mintpal incoming tbh :/. Fork + no coins back, enjoy.

[barabbas]

....
That is is you want to have a guaranteed successful 51% attack...than 51% of the total coins STAKING....

barabbas you know that there are systems like PPC NOVA are using to prevent small amounts to make 51% attack
they are preventing it because of stake modyficators time stamps many  other combined solutions that only core coders understand not you...
At the end you have centralized CHECKPOINTs and no 51% attack is possible because of that...
POS system is not like just that you have 51%of stake and you will attack...
look how Nova is preventing 51% attack with having only 25% coins those technologies are known...
in fact when you have centralized checkpoint you are safe from 2x spend cause checkpoint servers will chose right chain for you...
Stop telling how you know POS while you are far away from tech aspects of case.
I am noob too but i know "a little more".


Tech info below ( BC in POS 2.0 pushed even further those security ... )
____________________

http://coinwiki.info/en/Novacoin
Stake generation issues
The main proof-of-stake design problem is that unlike proof-of-work hashing rate, stake weight could be used multiple times without any overhead. It allows potential attacker to repeat his attempts to generate consecutive stakes until he will get lucky enough. And there is high probability to success without holding large stake, 20–25% of total weight (not coins) will be more than enough. Attacker can retry his attempts to generate consecutive stakes 1,000, 50,000, or 1 million times without any problem, using the same outputs.[12][13]
This could be worked around using centralized check-pointing. Novacoin creators resolved this issue using balanced weighting scheme.[14]

Centralized check pointing
As PPCoin ideas descendant, Novacoin is not truly a decentralized currency as it still requires centralized check pointing to avoid several issues.[15] The Novacoin developer has announced however that this check pointing is only a temporary measure which will be removed once the currency grows sufficiently stable. The centralized checkpoints feature could be disabled manually using -nosynccheckpoints option for official client.

Blade, your post is so poorly written I don't understand a single thing you try to say (and, for once, they seem to be some interesting things being intended to be said there), so please try again. Give yourself a bit more time, maybe re-read and then post. I am not being sarcastinc, just read your post and you will see what I mean.

Besides that, it's difficult to understand why would you want me to "Stop telling how you know POS". I only post what I know and tech specs are not it. But I do know that if you control 51% of staking coins, you can perpetrate a 100% successful attack. And that if you have much less than 51% you still can perpetrate attacks that will eventually stand a good chance of being successful. If PPC or Nova have solutions for this, I don't know but I don't doubt it. What I read you posted seem, on first approach, for from an ideal solution -and not much different from rolling back actually-, but I may not "get" it completely...

In any case, you seem to want to avoid addressing the fact that someone or some group controlling 4.5 million (roughly 20% of total VRC and surely over 40, maybe even 50% of VRC STAKING poses a clear and present danger of a 51% attack, thefts and security failures at exchanges notwithstanding. I also would be quite interested in your personal opinion -if I can understand your answer, that is-, about the "generosity" towards VRC, and stake in it, of "Mr Boricua Man" for he played for quite a long time in YOUR field...Oh, and by the way, that field is on its way to extinction, as you are beginning to see now, so as an example to VRC, which is on the way up, up up and just starting, it simply cannot "work"/ Sorry for, as you know, I simply love the logo... but there's nothing else of any value there.

Please remember that Mintpal has stated officially that they don't mint POS coins.

Where does this large % come from?

Its only FUD, not FACT that you say in this case. and keep trying to go on. You are wrong on your principal, so stop before you continue on like its fact.


I see so many % symbols And I dont think 1 of them has any real meaning behind them other than being pulled out of air to make nice stories up.

You are quite confused at this point. That's why you just avoid thinking. It's ok. Things will sink in. Eventually.

Do you understand or not, that the money in Mintpal was NOT being staked? So that your theories are based on nothing factual?

If you can't respond to this, I can't help you anymore. You will continue to lie.

I understand very clearly, thank you. You, on the other hand, cannot understand anything at this point seemingly. Lets go by steps ok?
step one.- forget about the theft and Mintpal.
step two .- there's (was, now it's redistributed in several- ONE wallet with 4.5 million VRCs. It isn't a Mintpal, or Bittrex or Cryptsy wallet.
step three.- 4.5 million VRC are probably more than 50% or currently STAKING coins.
step four.- It doesn't take too much money -for groups such as the Black Hand-, to put together an amount enough to actually control not just 4.5 million VRC but several (millions) more -at current prices-

Does the picture gets less cloudy now?

PS.- I never, ever, lie. Ever.

Do you have PROOF of anything, or speculation based on hopes?


Do you have intimate knowledge that it was a blackhand? Can you PROVE it? or any other nefarious account that was it staking? Could it have been an exchange wallet not staking that had em? photoshop?



Can you give me facts so I can see this account you claim was staking the 4.5 mil?

 Do you want forensic evidence or just guidelines for a SUV episode script? Would the wallet id suffice/ the public acknowledgement by Patrick of the existence of that wallet? Or you just would continue in denial no matter what? Everything was posted here -by someone who actually did the work- around July 7th so at least do a bit of homework if yoiu want to even be considered for any serious discussions, ok?

Of, if you provide the subpoena I will gladly provide the forensic evidence. Since you can not, circumstantial and common sense evidence will do.

For most people.

Obviously not for the crooks.

[buy4crypto]

Hearsay. No facts presented.

[alwa1]

Everything  now about what happened is spelation, all we know is how the situation was solved. Dev took a decision and the comunnity stands behind him. So i guess the holders of the coin must decide what do do it?

[onsightit]

Linux wallet is in testing now.

[CryptoJohn]

"criminal" is just a label governments place on competition as a way of stifling it.

Are you slow or something? Please dont quote me for your anti govt rhetoric. You a govt conspiracy klown? Move then, move to somewhere w/o a govt. Govt suck yes but it's a necessary evil. Think society can function without a govt then your living in some bullshit Utopian dream. W/o govt society would self-combust within days.

People that steal from others are criminals and should be put to death...there's no getting around this. "OMG did he say that?" Death too harsh? Ok, then cut off hands. Hackers,script kiddies online scammers should face huge fines and incarceration.

While we are at it lets change the juvenile laws so that kids smart enough to steal from others via electronic measures go to the big house for a little rehabilitation. The parents will scream "little billy didn't know what he was doing". No you incompetent P.O.S parent, you didn't know what little billy was doing. Billy gonna go smoke Bubbas pipe for a few years while he reflects upon how cool it was to dupe others.

Whew! Feel better already...

Now back to making dollars

[eatenbyagrue]

I am not sure why people are arguing about the rollback.  This is a democratic process.  If you do not agree with the rollback fork, do not switch to the new wallet.  If you do agree, switch to the new wallet.  Majority wins.

[BitcoinPorn]

MintPal Exchange Suffers VeriCoin Hack
July 14, 2014

On Sunday, June 13, 2014, the popular cryptocurrency exchange MintPal made an announcement revealing that they had been the victim of an attack which targeted the exchange's VeriCoin wallets [1]. While the amount stolen was not disclosed, MintPal did confirm in the post that they lost "a considerable amount of VeriCoin in the attack". Some rumors suggest that the exchange may have lost roughly 8 million VeriCoin -- or $1,900,000 USD at current market price. While this amount has not yet been verified by MintPal officials, recent transactions on the VeriCoin blockchain confirm that two large transfers in the amount of 5 million and 3 million VRC had taken place [2] [3]. As evidenced by the blockchain, the stolen coins do not appear to have been sold on any exchange.

Community Response
Upon disclosure of this information, MintPal and competing exchanges were quick to suspend trading of VeriCoin. According to the announcement, the exchange plans on pursuing a hard fork which would essentially rollback VeriCoin's blockchain to a position before the attack. This decision would render the stolen coins worthless and restore user’s balances. This news comes as a surprise to many because hard forks are generally considered to be extremely disruptive procedures reserved only for flaws with the core protocol -- not mistakes made by a third party exchange.

Some speculators have raised the point that the decision to roll back a coin at the request of a private corporation undermines the very nature of decentralized cryptocurrencies. While true, it should be noted that this decision can also be largely attributed to the fact that VeriCoin is a Proof-of-Stake coin. A stakeholder with access to 8 million coins (roughly 30% of the total coin count) could compromise the network by executing the nefarious 51% attack (or 30% in this case) [4]. Regardless of the rationale, the decision to hard fork the coin undoubtedly appears to be necessary and the VeriCoin developers seem to agree [5].

Whats Next
It remains to be seen what kind of effect this news will have on VeriCoin's price once markets are re-enabled. While this news certainly calls MintPal's security procedures into question, the VeriCoin community and developers have generally been receptive to the idea of a hard fork and have since successfully forked the coin. It is unclear whether or not MintPal will be reversing any trades prior to the announcement.

1. https://support.mintpal.com/index.php?module=announce&sec=view&id=17

2. http://chainz.cryptoid.info/vrc/address.dws?80779.htm

3. http://chainz.cryptoid.info/vrc/address.dws?80780.htm

4. https://twitter.com/pnosker/status/488355728491819009

5. http://www.vericoin.info/downloads/Statement.pdf

Written by Michael Toth  https://plus.google.com/u/0/106211569656491875003?rel=author


----


Great write up from RapidCX/Michael Toth  @ https://www.rapidcx.com/blog/mintpal-exchange-suffers-vericoin-hack

[Alns]

I am not sure why people are arguing about the rollback.  This is a democratic process.  If you do not agree with the rollback fork, do not switch to the new wallet.  If you do agree, switch to the new wallet.  Majority wins.

This.


The usual people in this thread approve the fork, period.


Haters gonna hate.

[XbladeX]

I purchased VRC daily. If done hardfork, my coins deleted before the hack ?

Don't worry bro, the only one who is losing it's coins is the hacker. Not you. Just stay relaxed and fud the fudsters. Much more fun to do

IF hacker sold that coin rollback will steal coin from people who were innocent merchant/exchanges/individual traders but touched stolen coins...

[lucates]

Kudos to VRC devs for having the stones to do something and do it quickly.

This will be historic in the crypto timeline and people will continue to disagree if it was the right decision. Crypto is still getting it's legs so things like this will happen. What matter most is we continue to move down the field towards our ultimate goal of mass adoption of crypto.

One of the issues today is the "cool" social status criminals are given. Script kiddies and hackers are just smarter criminals than the guy slinging dope on the corner. Both are part of the problem and should pay for their choices.

All you haters please dump into my buy walls.

When I look to the future I see VRC.

+1000 

[pnosker]

I purchased VRC daily. If done hardfork, my coins deleted before the hack ?

Don't worry bro, the only one who is losing it's coins is the hacker. Not you. Just stay relaxed and fud the fudsters. Much more fun to do

IF hacker sold that coin rollback will steal coin from people who were innocent merchant/exchanges/individual traders but touched stolen coins...

The hacker did not sell the coin.

[buy4crypto]

I purchased VRC daily. If done hardfork, my coins deleted before the hack ?

Don't worry bro, the only one who is losing it's coins is the hacker. Not you. Just stay relaxed and fud the fudsters. Much more fun to do

IF hacker sold that coin rollback will steal coin from people who were innocent merchant/exchanges/individual traders but touched stolen coins...

the coin never moved from mintpal, hacker got nothing, thats the whole point of this.

VeriCoin 8million - thief 0