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Author Topic: HashFast announces specs for new ASIC: 400GH/s  (Read 875472 times)
1l1l11ll1l
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January 03, 2014, 04:35:34 PM
 #6121



The MPP was based on the amount of BTC invested in the machine not a $ amount or the $5,600 MPP program would last 2 weeks and no one would have been interested. All HF works in BTC : they work on the BTC market, create BTC mining machine, create an MPP based on BTC, and only accepted BTC as a form of payment at the time I purchased and now they want to reimburse partial payment in a fiat currency?






THIS. If anything should be converted, it really should be the people who paid in USD, since their purchase was converted into BTC so it could be calculated for the MPP. I move that everyone, including people who paid in USD, be repaid the BTC amount of the purchase.

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GlapLaw
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January 03, 2014, 05:08:26 PM
 #6122

Can someone clarify what -- if any -- refunds are being offered?

Are they saying that they'll refund you the amount of Bitcoins at the current exchange rate equivalent to the USD amount of Bitcoins at the time you made the purchase?

I.e. if you paid 50 BTC when 50 BTC were worth $75, and a BTC is worth $750 on the date of your refund, they'd be offering to refund 5 BTC?

Do I have that right?

Anything contained in the above post should NOT be taken to constitute the establishment of an Attorney-Client relationship. Anything in the above post should NOT be taken as legal advice, either generally, or for your specific situation. Anything contained in the above post should NOT be taken to indicate my opinion on any legal strategy or approach, or the viability of any legal claims.
GodHatesFigs
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January 03, 2014, 05:09:15 PM
 #6123

BFL 2.0 - in before "2 more weeks." Feeling bad for you guys  Undecided
minternj
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January 03, 2014, 05:10:18 PM
 #6124

Can someone clarify what -- if any -- refunds are being offered?

Are they saying that they'll refund you the amount of Bitcoins at the current exchange rate equivalent to the USD amount of Bitcoins at the time you made the purchase?

I.e. if you paid 50 BTC when 50 BTC were worth $75, and a BTC is worth $750 on the date of your refund, they'd be offering to refund 5 BTC?

Do I have that right?

giap - here are the terms to refund.

http://hashfast.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/Batch-1-Refund-and-Release-Hashfast-Technologies-FINAL.pdf

Warning about Nitrogensports.eu
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=709114.0
itod
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January 03, 2014, 05:11:40 PM
 #6125

I have a question for you all? ? ? ? ? ?

How many of you would still be whining and crying asking for BTC refunds and refusing USD refunds if When you paid for your BJ1 orders BTC had a USD value of $10.00 But then 2 weeks later it dropped to $1.00 and has been there ever since, how many of you folks would still be asking for the same BTC refund if you had the chance to get the FULL Original Value of your Order Back in USD ? ? ? ?

If there would be a chance that BTC would loose it's value 10x for a longer period I would not by any mining equipment, I would sell all my BTC. ScamFast customers knew better, BTC value will in the long run gain value for a long, long time, years from now. HashFast offered BTC refunds also knowing this fact, and scammed everyone to preorder from a company with sub-par references. We thought we were safe - either they deliver or we get only currency we care about back. I don't care what's the current temporary BTC/US$ rate, or what was the rate at the day of the purchase.

The only thing I blame myself for is that I payed without written confirmation that full BTC amount would be returned. Can't believe we collectively where that stupid that we don't have that explicit word "full" in writing. Scammers worded every single communication that way to distract our attention from that fact to some unimportant stuff like MPP, etc.

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frank93
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January 03, 2014, 05:11:47 PM
 #6126

I.e. if you paid 50 BTC when 50 BTC were worth $75, and a BTC is worth $750 on the date of your refund, they'd be offering to refund 5 BTC?
Do I have that right?
yes.
GlapLaw
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January 03, 2014, 05:17:18 PM
 #6127

How much did these machines cost? Sorry, I know I could probably dig through and find the answers, but this is a long thread.

Anything contained in the above post should NOT be taken to constitute the establishment of an Attorney-Client relationship. Anything in the above post should NOT be taken as legal advice, either generally, or for your specific situation. Anything contained in the above post should NOT be taken to indicate my opinion on any legal strategy or approach, or the viability of any legal claims.
frank93
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January 03, 2014, 05:24:10 PM
 #6128

How much did these machines cost? Sorry, I know I could probably dig through and find the answers, but this is a long thread.
between 40 and 60 BTC, depending on when you bought it.
mgio
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January 03, 2014, 05:28:13 PM
 #6129

How much did these machines cost? Sorry, I know I could probably dig through and find the answers, but this is a long thread.

On day 1, August 8, they were $5,600. Shipping for me was $169.57. Total cost in BTC was 61.0864.
minternj
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January 03, 2014, 05:28:46 PM
 #6130

How much did these machines cost? Sorry, I know I could probably dig through and find the answers, but this is a long thread.

Priced at USD equivalent of $5,600 .

Warning about Nitrogensports.eu
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=709114.0
joshv06
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January 03, 2014, 05:29:31 PM
 #6131

Where are my B1 rigs? Sad


 
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GlapLaw
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January 03, 2014, 05:34:13 PM
 #6132

How much did these machines cost? Sorry, I know I could probably dig through and find the answers, but this is a long thread.

On day 1, August 8, they were $5,600. Shipping for me was $169.57. Total cost in BTC was 61.0864.

So, if my math is right, BTC were around 1 BTC = $94 when you purchased. They're now $800. So under their policy, your refund would be around 7 BTC?

Anything contained in the above post should NOT be taken to constitute the establishment of an Attorney-Client relationship. Anything in the above post should NOT be taken as legal advice, either generally, or for your specific situation. Anything contained in the above post should NOT be taken to indicate my opinion on any legal strategy or approach, or the viability of any legal claims.
minternj
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January 03, 2014, 05:37:05 PM
 #6133

How much did these machines cost? Sorry, I know I could probably dig through and find the answers, but this is a long thread.

On day 1, August 8, they were $5,600. Shipping for me was $169.57. Total cost in BTC was 61.0864.

So, if my math is right, BTC were around 1 BTC = $94 when you purchased. They're now $800. So under their policy, your refund would be around 7 BTC?

No read the refund policy in the pdf i linked. Under thier polcy you would get USD 5600 in a bank wire.

Warning about Nitrogensports.eu
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=709114.0
GlapLaw
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January 03, 2014, 05:42:40 PM
 #6134

How much did these machines cost? Sorry, I know I could probably dig through and find the answers, but this is a long thread.

On day 1, August 8, they were $5,600. Shipping for me was $169.57. Total cost in BTC was 61.0864.

So, if my math is right, BTC were around 1 BTC = $94 when you purchased. They're now $800. So under their policy, your refund would be around 7 BTC?

No read the refund policy in the pdf i linked. Under thier polcy you would get USD 5600 in a bank wire.

Apologies, I was working from the email on page 280.

Thank you.

Looking at it now, though, the second option (beginning "OPTIONAL") would seem to be what I'm addressing, while the first option would be the wire transfer in USD.

Anything contained in the above post should NOT be taken to constitute the establishment of an Attorney-Client relationship. Anything in the above post should NOT be taken as legal advice, either generally, or for your specific situation. Anything contained in the above post should NOT be taken to indicate my opinion on any legal strategy or approach, or the viability of any legal claims.
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January 03, 2014, 05:52:05 PM
 #6135

If there would be a chance that BTC would loose it's value 10x for a longer period I would not by any mining equipment, I would sell all my BTC.
Right, if a customer believed BTC was at all likely to under go a major loss in value they'd sell some or all of their BTC and certainly not buy an expensive producing machine.  

Keep in mind HF's refunds only kicked in if they delivered more than two months after their "target" dates. Even if you were crazy enough to think that buying a mining machine was a good way to hedge against a decline in BTC valuations, and somehow misunderstood HF's multiple statements to Batch 1 buyers about their terms, a HF purchase would not have been a good buy for that purpose... since if you believed HF you were likely to receive the machines.

It's also worth pointing out that HF's competition was offering product at less than half the price per GH/s (which was later, but still during batch 1 sales, changed to _one fifth_ the price per GH/s), but without the suggestion of October delivery or a full refund of BTC paid (although the promise of a hashrate bump for very late delivery).


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minternj
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January 03, 2014, 05:57:46 PM
 #6136

If you go for the optional refund, then the answer is no idea. Since no one can predict when what the BTC will be "at the exchange rate quoted by Bitstamp on the day
HashFast provides such Bitcoins." That can be 3 years from now, or 20. Maybe 50? What a terribly written legal document.

Also there is some wording about receiving 5% above your refund amount. I'm suprised no one mentioned that in here.


Warning about Nitrogensports.eu
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=709114.0
ninjarobot
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January 03, 2014, 06:24:07 PM
 #6137

IANAL, But all you need to know about refunds is right there in the ToS and Order Confirmation. These two documents are the binding contract you and HF agreed to at the time of the sale.

The ToS defines the payment as:
Quote
Payments are due in the amounts, in the currency, and at the time stated in the order or confirmation sent by Hashfast, or if not so stated: (a) paid in Bitcoin

The Order Confirmation quantifies and confirms the payment. In my case:
Quote
HashFast Technologies has received your order and payment in BTC for 1 Baby Jets. TOTAL BTC 59.7987

The Order Confirmation also clearly states your right to a refund of the payment in case the customer requests a refund before Jan 15 after failure to deliver by the guaranteed delivery date:
Quote
HashFast will issue a full refund the payment for the units that Buyer purchased but did not receive and cancelled.

So the payment is the payment and that is what is due unless you sign into a new agreement with HF by using the 'refund form'.

In other news I received the following letter today:

mgio
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January 03, 2014, 06:32:30 PM
 #6138

It would be really funny if BTC dropped to $100 or so, and everyone submitted a refund request because we would all get our full BTC back and hashfast would quickly go out of business...

The ONLY thing that is saving them right now is the fact that BTC is nearly 10 times to price it was when most of the orders were placed.
GlapLaw
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January 03, 2014, 06:33:55 PM
 #6139

Section J of the TOS:

"(j)       REFUNDS.  Any refunds due to Buyer will be made in United States Dollars, and for the purposes of calculating refunds, amounts paid in Bitcoin or other virtual currencies will be deemed paid in United States Dollars at the exchange rate given by Hashfast to its customers on the order date.  Refunds for partial order cancelations or returns will be adjusted for any discounts previously given to Buyer for volume purchases."

Was this always there?

Edit: using the wayback machine, I see that it was not.

Anything contained in the above post should NOT be taken to constitute the establishment of an Attorney-Client relationship. Anything in the above post should NOT be taken as legal advice, either generally, or for your specific situation. Anything contained in the above post should NOT be taken to indicate my opinion on any legal strategy or approach, or the viability of any legal claims.
mgio
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January 03, 2014, 06:34:10 PM
 #6140

Another thing that is bothering me is if someone does fight HashFast and HashFast agrees to give them their full BTC back, they will likely ask them to sign something that says they are not allowed to disclose the terms of the settlement publicly. That means we'll probably never know if someone wins the fight and if it is worth going after HashFast Sad.
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