Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com

[arbitrage001]

They need to ship out before the network difficulty reach 120m.

Anyone know their refund policy in case of delay?

[Anenome5]

They need to ship out before the network difficulty reach 120m.

Anyone know their refund policy in case of delay?

Ask for a refund and ye shall receive, up until they time they are shipping. One person has already asked for an received a full refund that we know of already.

Also, refund will be priced according to dollars, not BTC (ie, you receive refund say $6,000 in BTC or cash, w/e, not the original amount of BTC you put in, because they've already sold that original btc for cash to pay for the NRE and devices.)

[dhenson]

They need to ship out before the network difficulty reach 120m.

Anyone know their refund policy in case of delay?

Ask for a refund and ye shall receive, up until they time they are shipping. One person has already asked for an received a full refund that we know of already.

Also, refund will be priced according to dollars, not BTC (ie, you receive refund say $6,000 in BTC or cash, w/e, not the original amount of BTC you put in, because they've already sold that original btc for cash to pay for the NRE and devices.)

Make that two.  I asked for a refund on one of my late order Jupiter's.  I applied part of the refund towards hosting and the rest was sent via international bank wire transfer.  They were very accommodating, however don't expect refund via btc or PP.

[gateway]

So its been pretty quite on the KNC front, no newsletters as of late , a bit of info when pushed by several pages of posts about Tape-Out time.. but mums the word.. I'm sure they are waiting just as we are to get stuff to put together, but it would be nice to maybe have an official update that everything is on schedule still, no delays, blah went though this process, we are doing this etc.. it doesn't matter (unless they are going to be really late) if they let people know because they are supposed to ship next month...

anyhow, all this speculation about diff changes, company x cant do thing y.. etc.. KNC if your listing how about an update, instead of posting with pics with Josh sorry that last one was sorta a joke, kinda.

anyhow its late, starting to ramble.. but putting out some feelers..

[Bitcoinorama]

So its been pretty quite on the KNC front, no newsletters as of late , a bit of info when pushed by several pages of posts about Tape-Out time.. but mums the word.. I'm sure they are waiting just as we are to get stuff to put together, but it would be nice to maybe have an official update that everything is on schedule still, no delays, blah went though this process, we are doing this etc.. it doesn't matter (unless they are going to be really late) if they let people know because they are supposed to ship next month...

anyhow, all this speculation about diff changes, company x cant do thing y.. etc.. KNC if your listing how about an update, instead of posting with pics with Josh sorry that last one was sorta a joke, kinda.

anyhow its late, starting to ramble.. but putting out some feelers..

Well you're pretty close with Hashfast now Gateway and you gotta agree Ytterbium nails it here;

Making everyone sign an NDA is pretty stupid.  I requested to go to the open house and was told: 'no' we're full.  Not a huge fan of these guys right now.  We know that they had an open house.  However, we have no clue what was discussed.  So, what was the point of it?

It's kind of annoying.

On the other hand, their main public competition right now is Cointerra, it's probably something of a game of chicken with them, they don't want to put out specs before Cointerra does if it means Cointerra can try to one up them.

Anyway, as far as I'm concerned the hashrate is going to be going up way to quickly to bother buying any more hashpower at this point in time.  We'll have to see where things are in December, and what the prices are.

I'm a little worried people aren't really doing their research or thinking clearly are going to order a ton of product they'll never ROI off of, and at the same time destroy profitability for everyone else as well.

I'd say as much as companies want to be open, now there is competition which hopefully leads to better value for equipment for us over the long term. All that matters for us though are the returns to be made, how soon we can get started, the protection of the network and the integrity of those involved...

[carlotech]

worried about the delay.hope not.

[Bitcoinorama]

worried about the delay.hope not.

What delay? There's not been one.

[timmmers]

worried about the delay.hope not.

What delay? There's not been one.

True.


Some of the stuff here reminds me a lot of Minority Report. Convicting KnC of future crimes

[kingcoin]

Let's be realistic. If they are really going to deliver in September. Then, they should be tweaking some prototype NOW, OR at least show us some photo of their 28nm chips, OR at the very least, some photo of the shinny wafer. But do we see any of those?

What are you talking about?  You design a chip.  Then you send it off to the fab to fabricate, dice, and package. Then you wait three months, and then you get your chips in the mail.

The only way to get "prototype chips" is to do a small order early, test, and then do another order later on. But that process takes 6 months.

If you do your whole order up front, then there are no prototype chips, they are never created in the first place. KnC will get it's first chips in September, and those will be sent out to customers.  

There is a small chance the chips won't work, but that's unlikely.  

If you think they'd have prototype chips at this point you don't understand how ASIC production cycles work.

He's probably thinking about full miner prototypes containing the ASICs.

Actually the first batch of chips are often called prototypes. The vendor will package a smaller amount of chips of your first run. You will receive the packaged chips and you then have to do a prototype approval, which usually means to mount the chips on a PCB and start running SW etc. If everything is OK you will accept and the vendor will continue to package the remainder of your initial order. If you discover a problem you can stop the process and not package the current batch of dies and halt production.  Usually you will have to pay a fine (given in the contract) since the vendor/fab has allocated resources for you, but this will typically cost you less than a full inventory of packaged useless chips. 


Then you have to test the product containing the ASICs, especially pay attention to power and EMC issues. It's not uncommon that you will discover some problems which requires a new PCB update, better shielding of the enclosure, a metal fix for the ASIC, or even a full re-spin (fortunately a miner is a pretty simple design, there is no high speed serial interfaces like PCIe, or DDR3 memory interfaces, typically only a couple clock domains, etc so this might not be likely). Then you will have to take the compete unit to a certified lab to get approvals required by the country where you plan to export the devices.  This process takes several weeks and I would have expected KnC to have their ASICs in house by now (or even for several weeks) in order to be able to ship next month.

[udet4food]

They need to ship out before the network difficulty reach 120m.

Anyone know their refund policy in case of delay?

Refund policy is simple: "All sales are final!"

[Bitcoinorama]

They need to ship out before the network difficulty reach 120m.

Anyone know their refund policy in case of delay?

Refund policy is simple: "All sales are final!"

Who are you? why are you spreading FUD? Why is this your first venture out if newbie forums where you've only ever entered competitions for BTC giveaways??

[PsychoticBoy]

They need to ship out before the network difficulty reach 120m.

Anyone know their refund policy in case of delay?

Refund policy is simple: "All sales are final!"

Let me ask it then?

I dont think it is FUD  

Just massively ask for refunds, they must refund, EU rules !

EU rules say: If you did not recieve your product within 30 days you are lawfully entitled to get a refund!

[CYPER]

EU rules say: If you did not recieve your product within 30 days you are lawfully entitled to get a refund!

30 days from what?

[timmmers]

A little off topic here. I just changed my home contents insurance company and it appears that items over a grand in value need to be declared separately, "attractive items" they call them. Apparently this falls into that category and if you don't tell them about it then it won't be covered.

It may be different for other companies, but it didn't occur to me at all until I was asked to list such things..so maybe worth checking.

BTC competitions? I like competitions and so do loads of my mates...never seen any except for the manufacturer raffles which I managed to miss

[nightengale]

There is a big difference between Sptember 1 and September 30... Maybe time for an update...?

[Bitcoinorama]

They need to ship out before the network difficulty reach 120m.

Anyone know their refund policy in case of delay?

Refund policy is simple: "All sales are final!"

Let me ask it then?

I dont think it is FUD  

Just massively ask for refunds, they must refund, EU rules !

EU rules say: If you did not recieve your product within 30 days you are lawfully entitled to get a refund!

It's FUD because they have a refund policy and the twit stating all sales are final is trolling.

[PsychoticBoy]

EU rules say: If you did not recieve your product within 30 days you are lawfully entitled to get a refund!

30 days from what?

From order date.

[Bitcoinorama]

A little off topic here. I just changed my home contents insurance company and it appears that items over a grand in value need to be declared separately, "attractive items" they call them. Apparently this falls into that category and if you don't tell them about it then it won't be covered.

It may be different for other companies, but it didn't occur to me at all until I was asked to list such things..so maybe worth checking.

BTC competitions? I like competitions and so do loads of my mates...never seen any except for the manufacturer raffles which I managed to miss

There's whole subsections dedicated to raffles in this forum. This is an ASIC Vendor in a race to deliver their, and more importantly our equipment. I'd rather they focused on the task at hand, then Gen 2.

[CYPER]

EU rules say: If you did not recieve your product within 30 days you are lawfully entitled to get a refund!

30 days from what?

From order date.

Which I believe is the case with KNC - they have said before that they will refund anyone unless they have started shipping your order

[canth]

Exactly, if they miss the deadline and you feel that you want a refund. They will give it to you.

They are the only company that is like this, where you can make your bet and have it basically risk free if they don't deliver by the date in your super duper excel mathematical genius bitcoin spreadsheet.

Just to point out, if they miss the deadline horribly and their competition doesn't, causing massive request for refunds, then there is the possibility of a bankrupt operation. Those NRE funds came from our pre-orders and are already at least partially spent. I'm not suggesting that this is going to happen, I just want to point out that there are situations where they don't deliver and people do not get refunds.