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Author Topic: Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com  (Read 3039471 times)
dropt
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August 15, 2013, 07:31:54 AM
 #6001

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kingcoin
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August 15, 2013, 07:36:56 AM
 #6002



The Raspberry Pi Foundation tried that with the Raspberry Pi. The Pi also has an external PSU sold separately. But the Pi was delayed due to CE approval.

http://www.techspot.com/news/48006-raspberry-pi-delayed-over-confusion-about-ce-approval.html

The CE certification for the Raspberry Pi  board was a requirement of their distribution partners, not the EU.


http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/852


How many weeks did you say you wanted to delay shipping of the KNCminer products? I am not sure if all the other people here quite heard you.





No the requirements are not set by the distributors. The requirements are set by the EU and the FCC and similar authorities. The distributors would not ditribibute the RPi because they did not want to get into trouble if the units would be stuck in customs, lawsuits if they caused fire, EMC disturbance, etc.

The ASUS motherboard I have in front of me right now has a CE marking even if it does not contain a power supply and only has an ATX connector.

Even if you sell only to business and not to consumers you need certification. You just have to comply with a different class of requirements (B vs A).

The RPi Foundation tried to define the unit as a research kit, but the distributors feared that it would not be accepted by the authorities as they were selling to mostly anybody, just like KnC.

Delays would be minimal if you just allocate time at SEMKO ahead of time when your first fully assembled unit arrive. If you have experience with EMC testing and requirements you should be able to pass the test. ORSoC AB should have experence in this field.

yeemartin
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August 15, 2013, 08:38:23 AM
 #6003

Too many princesses in here. I don't care what it comes in, as long as it is able to hash then it's all good!

Just Show US the Asic Chips.

no, they don't have chips now. Chips are on their way to KnC.




Nemo1024
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August 15, 2013, 08:39:41 AM
 #6004

Honestly this forum is too full of cancer.   Everyone instantly attributes every statement as a scam or as FUD.  All I am saying is, why are more people not concerned with the fact this uses an external power supply?   I have _never_ seen a 4U in a data center with an external power supply.  Further it logistically does not work out with the design of most cabinets, unless you're planning on putting it in a 23" rack.  In any case, you sacrifice density, which means an increase in cost, as space isn't free.  I would also imagine the aesthetics of such an arrangement would not be appreciated by the host.
 

It's not external, it just doesn't come with it's own power supply.  This is likely due to customs reasons, as lots of Avalon customers has their units held up in europe due to their power supplies.  For batch 3 Avalon had an option of shipping without one. It also simplifies their supply chain.

FSM FORBID they actually took into consideration other mining manufacturer's mistakes and preemptively circumvented them.

AMATEURS.

They also dropped the ball on built in wifi or usb slots for wifi cards. Imagine if you have a few of them not in a data center the amount of wires needed, since you will need to be plugged into different outlets.

I currently play around with this TP-Link mini-WiFi router:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/280904946554?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

The amazing things you can do with it, like turning it into a wireless bridge and then run an Ethernet switch off it. Wink

“Dark times lie ahead of us and there will be a time when we must choose between what is easy and what is right.”
“We are only as strong as we are united, as weak as we are divided.”
“It is important to fight and fight again, and keep fighting, for only then can evil be kept at bay, though never quite eradicated.”
eve
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August 15, 2013, 09:16:58 AM
 #6005

Honestly this forum is too full of cancer.   Everyone instantly attributes every statement as a scam or as FUD.  All I am saying is, why are more people not concerned with the fact this uses an external power supply?   I have _never_ seen a 4U in a data center with an external power supply.  Further it logistically does not work out with the design of most cabinets, unless you're planning on putting it in a 23" rack.  In any case, you sacrifice density, which means an increase in cost, as space isn't free.  I would also imagine the aesthetics of such an arrangement would not be appreciated by the host.
 

It's not external, it just doesn't come with it's own power supply.  This is likely due to customs reasons, as lots of Avalon customers has their units held up in europe due to their power supplies.  For batch 3 Avalon had an option of shipping without one. It also simplifies their supply chain.

FSM FORBID they actually took into consideration other mining manufacturer's mistakes and preemptively circumvented them.

AMATEURS.

*cough* pictures of a box with fans, Pre-orders, no proof of working asic-prototype *cough*

SHEEPLE.

The only thing missing is the Asic Chip, anything else is secondary. Show us the Asic Chips.
mtbitcoin
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August 15, 2013, 09:31:16 AM
 #6006

Did the upgrade option just expire for the Saturn->Jupiter? I thought this was only going to be removed tomorrow Friday or did they run into issues?

cheers

EtherScan::Ethereum Block Explorer | BlockScan::Coming Soon
HyperMega
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August 15, 2013, 09:32:08 AM
 #6007

Too many princesses in here. I don't care what it comes in, as long as it is able to hash then it's all good!

Just Show US the Asic Chips.

no, they don't have chips now. Chips are on their way to KnC.






Don't like to disappoint anybody here, but it's technically impossible that the chips are already on their way to KnC, if they did tape-out mid of July.
The wafers are still being processed in the 28nm fab. After that the wafers must be dieced to dies and put in the package, before it is a chip. They will not have chips in their hands before mid of September, earliest, in absolute best case with a perfect supply chain of several 3rd parties, which all have to give the KnC chips the highest priority.  
erk
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August 15, 2013, 09:51:08 AM
 #6008

Too many princesses in here. I don't care what it comes in, as long as it is able to hash then it's all good!

Just Show US the Asic Chips.

no, they don't have chips now. Chips are on their way to KnC.






Don't like to disappoint anybody here, but it's technically impossible that the chips are already on their way to KnC, if they did tape-out mid of July.
The wafers are still being processed in the 28nm fab. After that the wafers must be dieced to dies and put in the package, before it is a chip. They will not have chips in their hands before mid of September, earliest, in absolute best case with a perfect supply chain of several 3rd parties, which all have to give the KnC chips the highest priority.  

Reality doesn't matter, people here will still want to see the chips. I am quite sure that KNCminier will take pictures and tell us when they arrive, I mean they published case photos when it arrived.

Ytterbium
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August 15, 2013, 10:03:44 AM
 #6009

I currently play around with this TP-Link mini-WiFi router:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/280904946554?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

The amazing things you can do with it, like turning it into a wireless bridge and then run an Ethernet switch off it. Wink

Yes, and versions of it can mine at 80-100Gh/s!

Madazam
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August 15, 2013, 11:04:48 AM
 #6010

Did the upgrade option just expire for the Saturn->Jupiter? I thought this was only going to be removed tomorrow Friday or did they run into issues?

cheers

Wondering the same thing bro .....
greenbtc
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August 15, 2013, 11:11:10 AM
 #6011

Did the upgrade option just expire for the Saturn->Jupiter? I thought this was only going to be removed tomorrow Friday or did they run into issues?

cheers

Wondering the same thing bro .....

It's still listed on the site: https://www.kncminer.com/products/saturnjupiter-upgrade

Not sure if you're getting the error past that in the cart or not, though (didn't bother trying).
AFox
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August 15, 2013, 11:11:36 AM
 #6012

Did the upgrade option just expire for the Saturn->Jupiter? I thought this was only going to be removed tomorrow Friday or did they run into issues?

cheers
Actually, it wasn't removed, it was sold out.
Anyways, KNC put 50 more :

My lucky BTC address : 1LoTTerY3WYbGxVRHvh8oDudDdTxFvvqWF
erk
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August 15, 2013, 11:16:51 AM
 #6013

Did the upgrade option just expire for the Saturn->Jupiter? I thought this was only going to be removed tomorrow Friday or did they run into issues?

cheers
Actually, it wasn't removed, it was sold out.
Anyways, KNC put 50 more :

Upgrades use chips too, they have to take them from other allocations.

CMMPro
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August 15, 2013, 11:19:00 AM
 #6014

With this tight of a schedule they may not get the chips individually sent to their offices....if I were them they would go direct to the pcb/assembly and I would get the first few assembled boards sent for validation before authorizing the full run.

Why would you bring the chips, components, bare pcb's etc all to Sweden before sending them back to China, Taiwan or wherever for assembly?
You just lose time in transit that way and risk delays due to customs paperwork.

I seriously doubt they would bother with pcb assembly in Sweden when the pcb houses are the cheapest over there, assembly is cheapest there, components are a magnitude cheaper there. The final assembly into cases etc may be done in Sweden....that I would probably do locally.

My expectation is that by the time they have something to show us it will be video of the first boards hashing, then delivery will begin days after that.

Be patient in the meantime, we can start to act like nervous little girls by the end of Sept if they haven't shown anything by then.

erk
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August 15, 2013, 11:25:11 AM
 #6015

How is the power supply even an issue at this point, this companies been out for what 3-4 months now and has always stated that their product would come without a PSU.

People honestly thought they would have it so EVERYONE that ordered had to open up the case to put the PSU in?

So strange!
It was obvious from day one that the CAD drawings of the units on the order page didn't have the cutout for an ATX supply to be internal.
McGyver
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August 15, 2013, 12:57:32 PM
Last edit: August 15, 2013, 02:49:49 PM by McGyver
 #6016

There are good reasons not to have an internal PSU, additional expense, more heat to get rid off, and there is no problem convincing customs that it's not a mains power device that requires certification. If you need other cases, have them made and perhaps sell them on eBay as well. All the BFL models except the 500GH/s use external power supplies.

- The cost savings between the slightly smaller case can't be all that significant - I bet that any standard configuration, ordered in bulk is <$50.
- A high quality (gold rated) PSU will generate little additional heat inside the case and is obviously easy enough to design for servers with far larger power requirements.
- Customs is either going to want to open the case and look inside or they aren't. I can't imagine the size of the case nor the amount of free space inside will convince them one way or another.
- yes, the components could be moved to a case, but that takes extra time and money that shouldn't be needed. All Avalon units allow for an internal PSU. Yeah, they got stuck in customs - no I have no idea whether this is part of the reason.

I don't buy those reasons as justification - I still see this as a less efficient way to run 100+ of these units in a large operation. For the small miner (myself included) it's no issue - it's the serious mining operations that won't be as thrilled.

Hey, let's be realistic: it's all about squeezing the revenue, rather than having nice and pretty boxes!
 
Someone about to run a 100+ unit operation certainly wouldn't give a sh*t about placement of the PSUs, as long as the machines gave him advantage in terms of hashing power/$ and hashing power/kW. These would be the only two qualities that mattered, really. Yeah, of course there are many important things like warranty, return policy, company transparency and its level of expertise in a field, but certainly not PSU placement!

And if there were actually big money involved in Bitcoin (which there isn't yet), we would be turning whole skycrapers into our custom datacenters rather than worrying about how would our units fit. The HFT guys are doing this already (start watching from 10:37 to get my point):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDaFwnOiKVE

Many thanks LightRider for bringing this eye-opening video to bitcointalk:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=32876.msg415446#msg415446
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August 15, 2013, 02:07:32 PM
Last edit: August 15, 2013, 02:22:10 PM by rizzman
 #6017

Cooling case material and appearance aside.  Here is the real issue.  These were supposed to be professional mining machines.  I have yet to see a 4U machine with an external power supply.  Further, in an average cabinet, where would you put said external power supply and be able to close the door?  Do we just have to eat rackspace and deal with cable management for 3cm bundles per machine?   Seems like a nightmare.  I have to be honest, I've got a fairly sizable order with them and at this point I'm debating asking for a refund and/or selling them.  Their product is starting to look more and more like the cobbled stacks of FPGA boards on stand-offs with fans zip tied to them and USB hubs taped everywhere, not that they're doing this, but it has the design and foresight of.

-1 KnC Miner.

They are not 4RU they are 200mm, they were not designed as rack mount devices. Most data center rack shelves are up to 900mm deep, lots of space for the miner and PSU.  If you can't deal with it, then you shouldn't be putting a mining rig in a data center the first place. These are not for amateurs, you probably don't even understand your insurance obligations.


Who permanently places equipment on shelves?  That's amateurish.  Maybe you should zip tie the PSU to the rail or stack them on stand offs.......

Also, so 5U not 4U...  the point is, what uses an external power supply that is supposed to be rackmounted other than 1U appliances?

Why the hell would this be an issue for anyone??! If anything this was a GOOD IDEA - PSU's puts off fucktons of heat under load, more heat = less efficiency = less hash rate.  Why are you complaining about this?!

Give me an external PSU option any day - this shit ain't for looks.

Also, if you still want to sell your unit, let me know before friday. I'll buy it at for the purchase value + fees via Paypal, This offer is open to anyone else who wants to jump ship as well.
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August 15, 2013, 02:36:58 PM
 #6018

On a side note... Change is a brewin folks..

http://www.coindesk.com/us-senate-committee-initiates-inquiry-into-bitcoin-and-virtual-currencies/

Wonder how this is going to affect the rate in the coming months..  Huh

Also, are their any threads regarding KNC customer pools forming for those not doing the hosting? If so, please link.

If not , would anybody be interested in starting a thread for this?

One of my biggest concerns is being in a pool that actually finds blocks in a timely manner. Been using polmine.pl, however I don't think they are gonna be able to play with all the big dogs taking over, and I have my doubts about 50btc.com
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August 15, 2013, 03:25:21 PM
 #6019

I just wanted to report back(Even though most of you are ass holes) That I just got a Reply back from Knc that they are processing my Refund..


Thank you Knc...


Good luck to the rest of you Suckers......

greenbtc
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August 15, 2013, 03:42:01 PM
 #6020

I just wanted to report back(Even though most of you are ass holes) That I just got a Reply back from Knc that they are processing my Refund..


Thank you Knc...


Good luck to the rest of you Suckers......

At least you could get a refund from them, that in my book is light years ahead of BFL and Avalon's practices.
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