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Author Topic: Merit & new rank requirements  (Read 159394 times)
RivAngE
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April 12, 2018, 09:54:59 AM
 #4061

It's stupid really. The merit system does not take away the need for newbies to create post quantity. It only adds a presumed post quality. So you now get newbies posting for quantity on the one side and posting for quality on the other. The same type of low quality posting is still going on. The merit system didn't solve anything. I only made a few Legendary members happy because they see stake competition obstructed.

Well not only legendary member, i am happy too because all the cheaters in sig or bounty (even though i did not join bounty) slowed down to reach higher rank. This system is suitable for people who only focus to one account now, unless they already have a lot of high rank account before, but even though they have a lot of it, i think there will be many adjustment in sig or bounty requirement in the future regarding merit, like, minimal merit required to join sig or bounty, not only ranks. They will be forced to up their game too, or if they cheat, it will be easily spotted.

Usually people who whines a lot are :
1. Dont believe in theirself they can get merit.
2. People who are new and want to farm account.
3. People who just want easy money from sig and bounty even though the job is already an easy one (come on, posting is not a hard task, please)

4. People who feel the unfairness of having limitations because you were a reader with no account for 6 months and an active member for 5 months, yet spammers who made accounts earlier and people who buy merits seem to be above us and can freely farm signature campaigns.

PS: Was that too specific to my situation? Grin
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TheQuin
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April 12, 2018, 10:20:10 AM
 #4062

4. People who feel the unfairness of having limitations because you were a reader with no account for 6 months and an active member for 5 months, yet spammers who made accounts earlier and people who buy merits seem to be above us and can freely farm signature campaigns.

PS: Was that too specific to my situation? Grin

So you feel unfairness because you arrived too late?

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RivAngE
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April 12, 2018, 10:32:15 AM
Merited by OriginTrain (2)
 #4063

4. People who feel the unfairness of having limitations because you were a reader with no account for 6 months and an active member for 5 months, yet spammers who made accounts earlier and people who buy merits seem to be above us and can freely farm signature campaigns.

PS: Was that too specific to my situation? Grin

So you feel unfairness because you arrived too late?


Hmm... not exactly... the problem is that a lot of people I've noticed are less active than me, more spammy and aggressive in their posts... yet they have 500+ more merits than me. The only reason for that is because they joined a few months ago.
I created an account here when I was experienced enough to have something to post but if I had created an account earlier spamming "moon moon" here and there I'd have higher rank and I'd be rewarded with sig campaigns. Isn't this unfair?

They should at least start everyone from the same level. Older members should have sMerit to give but not tons of merit.
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April 12, 2018, 10:36:30 AM
 #4064

If I had bought more Bitcoin when I first started to read about it, I would be a multi-millionaire now. I didn't, so I'm not - does that mean that the Bitcoin system is unfair?

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April 12, 2018, 10:42:26 AM
 #4065

Hmm... not exactly... the problem is that a lot of people I've noticed are less active than me, more spammy and aggressive in their posts... yet they have 500+ more merits than me. The only reason for that is because they joined a few months ago.
I created an account here when I was experienced enough to have something to post but if I had created an account earlier spamming "moon moon" here and there I'd have higher rank and I'd be rewarded with sig campaigns. Isn't this unfair?

There was nothing to stop you posting something constructive even if you didn't have experience. Just reading and then asking questions that weren't fully explained in what you had read.
You're bitter because those that came before you had an easier ride. That's just part of life.

They should at least start everyone from the same level. Older members should have sMerit to give but not tons of merit.

It would have been better if this system was always in place but it wasn't needed then as this forum was used by Bitcoin enthusiasts to meet and discuss relevant issues. Over the years there has been an influx of people that have heard they can make money from posting here. That meant this change was necessary and some way of transitioning to it was required. Grandfathering in existing members is common practice when changes like this are made and that's because it is the fairest way to do. Taking something away from people that they have already earned can never be fair. The fact that it is more difficult to earn it now you'll just have to live with.



If I had bought more Bitcoin when I first started to read about it, I would be a multi-millionaire now. I didn't, so I'm not - does that mean that the Bitcoin system is unfair?

Me too.





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April 12, 2018, 11:21:14 AM
 #4066

If I had bought more Bitcoin when I first started to read about it, I would be a multi-millionaire now. I didn't, so I'm not - does that mean that the Bitcoin system is unfair?

Along that theme, if your Aunt had balls she'd be your uncle!   Wink
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April 12, 2018, 11:28:39 AM
 #4067

snip

There was nothing to stop you posting something constructive even if you didn't have experience. Just reading and then asking questions that weren't fully explained in what you had read.
You're bitter because those that came before you had an easier ride. That's just part of life.

snip

It would have been better if this system was always in place but it wasn't needed then as this forum was used by Bitcoin enthusiasts to meet and discuss relevant issues. Over the years there has been an influx of people that have heard they can make money from posting here. That meant this change was necessary and some way of transitioning to it was required. Grandfathering in existing members is common practice when changes like this are made and that's because it is the fairest way to do. Taking something away from people that they have already earned can never be fair. The fact that it is more difficult to earn it now you'll just have to live with.



If I had bought more Bitcoin when I first started to read about it, I would be a multi-millionaire now. I didn't, so I'm not - does that mean that the Bitcoin system is unfair?

Me too.






The level of bitcoin unfairness for me is too high too.  Cry

Quote from: for RivAnge
Do you have older siblings? is it unfair when he is in high school with bad grades and got higher allowance (say 100usd a month, just example) and you only have half of it while you are a middle schooler with good grade just because he was born years earlier before you?

And once again, signature campaign is not a reward. This forum doesnt have any obligation to reward you in any way. It is a privilige and people earn it, it is not given. Previous system made it easier to earn it, now you have to play by the rules of merit to earn that privilege.
RivAngE
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April 12, 2018, 12:15:27 PM
Last edit: April 12, 2018, 01:37:13 PM by RivAngE
 #4068

Do you have older siblings? is it unfair when he is in high school with bad grades and got higher allowance (say 100usd a month, just example) and you only have half of it while you are a middle schooler with good grade just because he was born years earlier before you?

And once again, signature campaign is not a reward. This forum doesnt have any obligation to reward you in any way. It is a privilige and people earn it, it is not given. Previous system made it easier to earn it, now you have to play by the rules of merit to earn that privilege.

I don't have any siblings to be honest but this whole conversation has gone off trails with examples of how unfair the whole world is!

Just because "A" is unfair, it doesn't mean we should stop thinking of ways to make "B" more fair. We're in a forum that's all about a new technology and moving the world forward after all!
But okay I get it, a lot of you seem to agree that it's the better of two evils, it's a bit unfair but it's better than not having it at all. I believe that having this system with a different implementation that wouldn't create such huge gaps would be better.

For example, a 1 year old member can have 500 more merits than a member registered today. For this system to be called 100% fair in my simple mind, the new member should be able to get 500 merits in one year if he's as much active as the other members with 500 merits were in average and with quality posting. Am I mistaken about the amount of merits 1 year old active members have? I'm not sure but I believe I'm right. The merit system is almost 4 months old, have you seen anyone with 166 merits? I doubt there's even A SINGLE ONE.

So no, I'm not bitter because it's a bit unfair, I'm bitter because it's very unfair, I'm in the wrong side and it'd be easy to be done better but they're not updating the system.
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April 12, 2018, 12:22:21 PM
Last edit: April 12, 2018, 12:36:16 PM by TheQuin
Merited by RivAngE (1)
 #4069

The merit system is almost 4 months old, have you seen anyone with 166 merits? I double there's even A SINGLE ONE.

The system started on the 24th January so it is less than 3 months old.

This guy has 109 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1554927
This guy has 717 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=976210

I started with 250 and now have 532

There's many more if you look around.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=merit;stats=topusersat

Edit:
I just stumbled on a Full Member with 290. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=182284
By finding his thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3301314.msg34467837#msg34467837

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April 12, 2018, 12:55:25 PM
 #4070

snip

I don't have any siblings to be honest but this whole conversation has gone off trails with examples of how unfair the whole world is!

Just because "A" is unfair, it doesn't mean we should stop thinking of ways to make "B" more fair. We're in a forum that's all about a new technology and moving the world forward after all!
But okay I get it, a lot of you seem to agree that it's the better of two evils, it's a bit unfair but it's better than not having it at all. I believe that having this system with a different implementation that wouldn't create such huge gaps would be better.

For example, a 1 year old member can have 500 more merits than a member registered today. For this system to be called 100% fair in my simple mind, the new member should be able to get 500 merits in one year if he's as much active as the other members with 500 merits were in average and with quality posting. Am I mistaken about the amount of merits 1 year old active members have? I'm not sure but I believe I'm right. The merit system is almost 4 months old, have you seen anyone with 166 merits? I double there's even A SINGLE ONE.

So no, I'm not bitter because it's a bit unfair, I'm bitter because it's very unfair, I'm in the wrong side and it'd be easy to be done better but they're not updating the system.

Unfairness is just a simple thinking on how to escape reality that you are a loser who can not take any blame on you like, why :
1. didnt i join forum earlier?
2. didnt i buy bitcoin earlier?
3. didnt i make a move before to make me rich?
It creates a lot of "if only", and instead of taking up those blame to yourself, you blame people who did it earlier than you and when things changed, you called it unfair.

And no, your suggestion is just the same as activity point like the past system.
RivAngE
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April 12, 2018, 01:42:45 PM
 #4071

The merit system is almost 4 months old, have you seen anyone with 166 merits? I doubt there's even A SINGLE ONE.

The system started on the 24th January so it is less than 3 months old.

This guy has 109 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1554927
This guy has 717 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=976210

I started with 250 and now have 532

There's many more if you look around.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=merit;stats=topusersat

Edit:
I just stumbled on a Full Member with 290. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=182284
By finding his thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3301314.msg34467837#msg34467837


And you have one more merit from me for getting into all this trouble to find people who had success with this system! lol
The second guy though is registered from a year ago and the last one is registered since 2013, so ofcourse they had free merits and that's why they stand high on points. Nevertheless, you beat my argument that there's probably not even one member who's close to the speed at which members used to obtain ranks before.

For the record, I still believe it's an unfair system and it could become better if the thresholds were lowered, but that's my opinion so call me spoiled and ignore me (Not addressing a specific member)! Grin
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April 12, 2018, 01:52:37 PM
 #4072

And you have one more merit from me for getting into all this trouble to find people who had success with this system! lol
The second guy though is registered from a year ago and the last one is registered since 2013, so ofcourse they had free merits and that's why they stand high on points. Nevertheless, you beat my argument that there's probably not even one member who's close to the speed at which members used to obtain ranks before.

For the record, I still believe it's an unfair system and it could become better if the thresholds were lowered, but that's my opinion so call me spoiled and ignore me (Not addressing a specific member)! Grin

Thanks. Yeah, I know nullius is a bit special but the last guy must have started with no more than 100.

There's a full list compiled by LoyceV weekly (last one 2 days ago).

Total number of users who received 1 or more Merit: 13366
Click for the full list (format: "Merit username (#userID)")
Sample:
Code:
1931 theymos (#35)
847 satoshi (#3)
713 nullius (#976210)
688 Lutpin (#520313)
478 pitipawn (#1076869)
468 Lauda (#101872)
420 TMAN (#98986)
404 Vod (#30747)
374 LoyceV (#459836)
369 Last of the V8s (#479624)
345 explorder (#1108331)
332 GameKyuubi (#26945)
.......
.......
.......
1 1C6fV5DtakfKANLJ8GUV7hCaA (#1167035)
1 1453eko (#1431103)
1 13ex07 (#1207068)
1 13abyknight (#153359)
1 13Winter13 (#919666)
1 123tm (#848549)
1 123exo123 (#1919155)
1 11:11pas (#1306783)
1 110110101 (#122406)
1 0xrocketscience (#1159304)
1 0x1Knowledge (#2000899)
1 0verseer (#1116853)
1 0RajA0 (#1151527)
1 063Myxa (#1432563)
1 -droid- (#196457)
1 -Redacted- (#129075)
1 -Night- (#878210)
1 -HK- (#1133384)
1 -BDan- (#1751855)
1 --Encrypted-- (#219961)

Have a look at that list as you'll be surprised how many people are getting Merit faster than 1 day. That's roughly what they need to rank up at the same pace as before.

I think the balance is right and most importantly fits with what was written in the OP of this thread.

I'm hoping that this system will increase post quality by:
 - Forcing people to post high-quality stuff in order to rank up. If you just post garbage, you will never get even 1 merit point, and you will therefore never be able to put links in your signature, etc.
 - Highlighting good posts with the "Merited by" line.

It's doing what it was meant to.


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April 12, 2018, 02:04:11 PM
 #4073

The merit system is almost 4 months old, have you seen anyone with 166 merits? I double there's even A SINGLE ONE.

The system started on the 24th January so it is less than 3 months old.

This guy has 109 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1554927
This guy has 717 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=976210

I started with 250 and now have 532

There's many more if you look around.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=merit;stats=topusersat

Edit:
I just stumbled on a Full Member with 290. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=182284
By finding his thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3301314.msg34467837#msg34467837


Those accounts are literary high knowledge in crypto currencies, aside on that maybe they growth in digitalization why they have high understanding  regarding bitcoin and other crypto currencies. Sometimes when I see nullius accounts i was thinking that it is real that he is a newly participants or it was a sub account of one higher rank in bitcointalk. Maybe they born with high intelligence gift that's why they can easily go with the flow in this sites
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April 12, 2018, 02:07:24 PM
 #4074

Those accounts are literary high knowledge in crypto currencies, aside on that maybe they growth in digitalization why they have high understanding  regarding bitcoin and other crypto currencies. Sometimes when I see nullius accounts i was thinking that it is real that he is a newly participants or it was a sub account of one higher rank in bitcointalk. Maybe they born with high intelligence gift that's why they can easily go with the flow in this sites

It's a Bitcoin forum so it is natural that people with knowledge will write more informative posts and get more merit. Isn't that how it should be?

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cryptocommoner
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April 12, 2018, 04:51:19 PM
 #4075

Those accounts are literary high knowledge in crypto currencies, aside on that maybe they growth in digitalization why they have high understanding  regarding bitcoin and other crypto currencies. Sometimes when I see nullius accounts i was thinking that it is real that he is a newly participants or it was a sub account of one higher rank in bitcointalk. Maybe they born with high intelligence gift that's why they can easily go with the flow in this sites

It's a Bitcoin forum so it is natural that people with knowledge will write more informative posts and get more merit. Isn't that how it should be?


I certainly think so.  That's why the whole merit system was created.  It is to encourage better quality posts.

However, when you look over those linked above and where they received the majority of their merit, you see it is mostly from threads on merit.  If you look, you can see that there are a TON of threads on merit.  I have posted here and there on this thread, but gave up as there seems to be a never-ending supply of people that want to complain about it.  I can't recall, but I think I may have even have been one of them (sad to say). 
Then, I realized that it is really for the best and the ranks don't mean much unless you are concerned with signature campaigns.  I'm not overly concerned with merit myself these days and tend to frequent threads where a lot of the posts are overlooked.  The one reason that merit would matter to me is if somebody overlooked my post simply because of my rank.

Anyways, carry on with the complaints from the opponents and the justifications of the proponents on this thread.  Cool
easemypain
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April 12, 2018, 07:59:28 PM
 #4076

one important question, how do i get my sendable merit to increase my rank on Bitcoin forum?

MINTER - WE MINT COINS AND CREATE THE INTERNET OF MONEY
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https://www.minter.networ
BTCeminjas
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April 12, 2018, 08:18:12 PM
 #4077

one important question, how do i get my sendable merit to increase my rank on Bitcoin forum?
In service section, there is much thread that offering their smerit if you are deserving to have it.
Or even here, or anywhere in the forum if you post or make a genuine thread.

I almost forgot the merit system when I did not get a smerit for this month, instead, I enjoyed my self just to sharing an idea with others.
As what athanz88 said above that what if I am earlier here in the forum before merit system was implemented, but now I accept and face this new rule as a challenge and motivated me to have a good and constructive post.
mer110
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April 12, 2018, 10:30:26 PM
 #4078

My opinion is that the newcomer and the already hard to master large volumes of information, and here to write posts to earn merit . You look at the professionals they write based on their experience. What can a newbie write? What incentive does he have to work?
The majority of beginners go to bounty and are not the same company. It is not always possible, it takes a lot of time to check and submit reports. On the study of new information. A lot of time out, month after month passes. And income does not grow and the incentive to work is lost.
 
So it turns out, those who sat in the first car, they go further, and those who did not have time, goodbye, you were not the lot.
 Write posts if I find time and money for free, and if you know the topic you want to write. Don't know, maybe I have a little experience in all this, but it's frustrating to sit for days and no growth for some months, it is in no income, and the saddest thing may not be.
In my opinion, if people try to work, conduct bounties, managers have to reward merits because it is unfair in relation to newcomers. Work must be rewarded and in my opinion, not only posts make forum forum number one, but and work specialists in bounty companies. Need to think a little respect and reward the work of the participants of this process.
Duallimit
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April 12, 2018, 11:51:53 PM
 #4079

The merit system is almost 4 months old, have you seen anyone with 166 merits? I double there's even A SINGLE ONE.

The system started on the 24th January so it is less than 3 months old.

This guy has 109 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1554927
This guy has 717 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=976210

I started with 250 and now have 532

There's many more if you look around.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=merit;stats=topusersat

Edit:
I just stumbled on a Full Member with 290. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=182284
By finding his thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3301314.msg34467837#msg34467837



Seriously? Dude. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=178336.msg34534874#msg34534874  This is quality post that cost couple of merites? That's what i am talking about, we have totally different understanding of what does it mean "quality post".


It will change nothing, except price of merit at black market. And you will se more shit threads and "gimme gimme one, pleaaasee".

Don't worry, buying and trading merit will not be possible in the near future. Most users will run out completely from merit in the next few months and only sources will be able to send it.
People sending more than 10 smerit to their folks for posts containing "hohoho i am a stupid illiterate spammer" are not trustworthy and should receive a negative trust even that theymos isn't totally agree with it...

And what will it change? Then the price for accounts will grow and the number of their thefts will increase. And the newcomers will lose even a meager chance to get a merit from somewhere except sources.  Grin
soulcancer
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April 13, 2018, 03:09:08 AM
Last edit: April 13, 2018, 03:57:23 AM by soulcancer
 #4080

I am sorry...I was drunk last week...so, I took a week off...now I read over the posts and I am that much "sorrier"...jesus christ...all I have seen is people begging for merit and people giving reasons for not giving it...."ummm, your grammar is incorrect"...."if only you would have used THIS word"..."youre just a whiner...stop talking bad about the merit system and you can advance"........I thought the whole point WAS TO KEEP SPAMMERS AND BOTS FROM ADVANCING!!....nope!...just another chance for someone to use their power to get another person to beg and bow.....wow, this is TOTALLY new in the world....not one person addressed my post about what questionauthority said about merit...just keep flexing...you will be big in your own mind as long as you don't think too much about it.........btw, go ahead and delete this one too

edit: I just looked back and saw that someone actually told me that regardless of "learning, HELPING  or sharing my experiences", I would not be advancing without the right attitude about the new merit system.....do you see it yet??
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