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Author Topic: Merit & new rank requirements  (Read 82729 times)
coinlocket$
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May 02, 2018, 06:12:45 PM
 #4301

What do you think about the need to decrease the merit requirement now that the airdop is almost done? Do we need it?

I will post the exact number when the new file will be avaiable. Have they reduced sources to 79? I've missed this change!


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DdmrDdmr
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May 02, 2018, 06:21:43 PM
 #4302

I will post the exact number when the new file will be avaiable. Have they reduced sources to 79? I've missed this change!

Apparently so: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=merit;stats merit sources. I check these quite often, but can’t recall when this one changed specifically.
aleksus
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May 02, 2018, 07:59:13 PM
 #4303

I will post the exact number when the new file will be avaiable. Have they reduced sources to 79? I've missed this change!

Apparently so: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=merit;stats merit sources. I check these quite often, but can’t recall when this one changed specifically.

So does it mean merits will be mostly consentrated in a small number of topics where these merit sources are active, that's sad and for most of the users will mean no upgrade is possible.

DdmrDdmr
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May 02, 2018, 08:37:45 PM
 #4304

So does it mean merits will be mostly consentrated in a small number of topics where these merit sources are active, that's sad and for most of the users will mean no upgrade is possible.

We really cannot really tell, since merit sources are unknown, and the proportion of sMerit given out by the sources out of their maximum is also unknown versus the proportion given out by regular meriters.

There are forum sections more favoured overall than others. That is due, in principal, to the interest those sections provide in general, with some more difficult to understand awarding taking place in bounty threads for example. Some sections, like my local board, are under a severe sMerit drought, but activity is quite low there in comparison.

Where you post obviously has it’s toll on odds, but also thread length and subject, tone, style, information, wit, novelty,  personal opinion, insights, usefulness, etc. Chances add up better the more ingredients you have to enable you to bring a decent dish to the table.
Delphinus
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May 03, 2018, 10:01:14 AM
 #4305

Can you clarify what "getting merit from review 3Ds" means?

I'm struggling to get Merit, so other sources than making posts sounds interesting. At the moment, I'm considering just following known merit sources around and commenting in the threads where they are active, but that can't be the actual idea behind it..

kaicrypzen
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May 03, 2018, 10:06:43 AM
 #4306

Can you clarify what "getting merit from review 3Ds" means?

I think what they meant is "review threads". There are a handful of threads whose original posters offer to review posts that you think deserve to get their sMerit but didn't get merited (enough).

athanz88
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May 03, 2018, 10:45:50 AM
 #4307

Can you clarify what "getting merit from review 3Ds" means?

I think what they meant is "review threads". There are a handful of threads whose original posters offer to review posts that you think deserve to get their sMerit but didn't get merited (enough).

There are many of them right now, and i suggest you to search one from the QuestionAuthority. He has a wide knowledge and good decision on some matters, so if you have a good post you might have a chance to get from merits from him.


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Makkara
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May 03, 2018, 11:14:39 AM
Merited by kaicrypzen (1)
 #4308

what is really needed is some AI algorithm that gives merit automatically based on the post you write, is not science fiction. No way at the current state anyone can keep up spotting good post, beside is often up to personal interpretation if a merited post really deserve merits, this is the work for a machine, we are in the 2018  Roll Eyes

athanz88
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May 03, 2018, 11:55:29 AM
 #4309

what is really needed is some AI algorithm that gives merit automatically based on the post you write, is not science fiction. No way at the current state anyone can keep up spotting good post, beside is often up to personal interpretation if a merited post really deserve merits, this is the work for a machine, we are in the 2018  Roll Eyes

And what are the criteria for a meritorious post? Post length? Number or character in a post? What more? I believe all of that can be cheated easily by all the smart abuser in this forum. With this system now, abuser/alt accounts/cheater/etc can be spotted easily, and those people wont go any further if they dont step up their game to be a good member for this forum, or cheating more. Their choice.
 


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Makkara
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May 03, 2018, 11:59:15 AM
 #4310

what is really needed is some AI algorithm that gives merit automatically based on the post you write, is not science fiction. No way at the current state anyone can keep up spotting good post, beside is often up to personal interpretation if a merited post really deserve merits, this is the work for a machine, we are in the 2018  Roll Eyes

And what are the criteria for a meritorious post? Post length? Number or character in a post? What more? I believe all of that can be cheated easily by all the smart abuser in this forum. With this system now, abuser/alt accounts/cheater/etc can be spotted easily, and those people wont go any further if they dont step up their game to be a good member for this forum, or cheating more. Their choice.
 

i'm talking about something a little more sophisticated here http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3622331/Facebook-s-AI-reading-messages-teach-humans-communicate.html

kaicrypzen
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May 03, 2018, 01:00:17 PM
 #4311

I'm struggling to get Merit, so other sources than making posts sounds interesting. At the moment, I'm considering just following known merit sources around and commenting in the threads where they are active, but that can't be the actual idea behind it..

Can I ask why it's that important to you (or to anybody for that matter) to get Merit? Indeed it's needed for ranking up, yet the rank is not really indicative of anything, or at least shouldn't be ... Is it just about getting more money on signature campaigns (no offense intended)?

Samarkand
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May 03, 2018, 01:42:37 PM
Merited by kaicrypzen (1), TheQuin (1)
 #4312

what is really needed is some AI algorithm that gives merit automatically based on the post you write, is not science fiction. No way at the current state anyone can keep up spotting good post, beside is often up to personal interpretation if a merited post really deserve merits, this is the work for a machine, we are in the 2018  Roll Eyes

Theymos is probably in the final stages of finishing exactly the kind of AI algorithm
that you are talking about  Grin

Jokes apart, I think you are underestimating the difficulty of developing any kind of AI
solution. Even for tasks that are simple for humans it is incredibly hard to develop a
working AI solution.

Just imagine all the pitfalls of developing an automated way of awarding merits.

Here are just a few possible pitfalls:
-how does the algorithm deal with posts in Local boards? It surely can´t be for English posts only...
-how does the algorithm deal with posts that are of very high-quality, but are plagiarism from
other people´s posts or from other websites?
-how does the algorithm deal with posts that are beautifully crafted (think @nullius posting style), but
are completely garbage in terms of content?
...

I agree that we are indeed in 2018 and machines are able to do many marvelous things (e.g.
automatization in the production of technical devices or cars), but the respective industries had to invest
billions of $ into research to even get this far.



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Delphinus
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May 03, 2018, 02:17:05 PM
Merited by kaicrypzen (1)
 #4313

I'm struggling to get Merit, so other sources than making posts sounds interesting. At the moment, I'm considering just following known merit sources around and commenting in the threads where they are active, but that can't be the actual idea behind it..

Can I ask why it's that important to you (or to anybody for that matter) to get Merit? Indeed it's needed for ranking up, yet the rank is not really indicative of anything, or at least shouldn't be ... Is it just about getting more money on signature campaigns (no offense intended)?

I wasn't aware of the "review threads" but I'll certainly look into it. Regarding the reason why it's important, there are a couple for me personally:

1. My main reason is that I want the merit system to become successful. Several of my regular threads are being overrun by scammers with fake accounts. My hope was that the merit system would resolve these issues. I'm expecting that in the longer term, we can set minimum merit requirements for threads, hide posts of people with negative merit, or something similar that would chase away spammers from BCT.
With the lack of merit being given out and the fact that newbie members can still post everywhere, the merit system does not meet my expectations. My main goal is to help improve the merit system into something that adds value.

2. I was looking forward to becoming a Sr. Member, since I was one day away before the new system got implemented (I had like 1 activity point to go). Suddenly I'm 150 merit away and I've been able to gather 2 new ones for the last months. It just "feels" unfair.

3. Merit points feel like "validation" of a post. Never getting any gets frustrating since it feels like my posts are worthless.

4. Definitely also the signature campaigns. The difference between member ranks for me equals around $1000,- per year. That is quite a lot given that I would have reached a higher status long ago with the old rules.

5. Lastly; I honestly believe that I do have the occasional post that would get "upvotes" on other platforms. Either helping people or giving free advice.
For example; I tried to help a project I'm not involved with this morning with some advice:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3379275.msg36188330#msg36188330

It's definitely not the best post ever, but I do think that these type of posts would warrant 1-2 merit on a platform where it's easy to give out.


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May 03, 2018, 05:07:18 PM
 #4314


Haha you are making me laughing out loud man, literally. You do talk like it is easy to make an AI in this time right now. Big company like facebook still need a lot of resources to make one, and even google doesnt have one for now, and you are here suggesting  AI for a forum. You are kidding right?


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Makkara
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Activity: 350
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May 03, 2018, 05:39:34 PM
 #4315


Haha you are making me laughing out loud man, literally. You do talk like it is easy to make an AI in this time right now. Big company like facebook still need a lot of resources to make one, and even google doesnt have one for now, and you are here suggesting  AI for a forum. You are kidding right?

You didn't  even know what i was talking about, if you are not competent or ignorant in something, better to avoid posting about it.  Wink


what is really needed is some AI algorithm that gives merit automatically based on the post you write, is not science fiction. No way at the current state anyone can keep up spotting good post, beside is often up to personal interpretation if a merited post really deserve merits, this is the work for a machine, we are in the 2018  Roll Eyes

Theymos is probably in the final stages of finishing exactly the kind of AI algorithm
that you are talking about  Grin


Just imagine all the pitfalls of developing an automated way of awarding merits.

Here are just a few possible pitfalls:
-how does the algorithm deal with posts in Local boards? It surely can´t be for English posts only...
-how does the algorithm deal with posts that are of very high-quality, but are plagiarism from
other people´s posts or from other websites?
-how does the algorithm deal with posts that are beautifully crafted (think @nullius posting style), but
are completely garbage in terms of content?



they are actually made to solve these problems, it's matter of training with the right data, like if you would need to teach to a child by examples to spot the cases.

Microsoft offer already some service: https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/machine-learning-server/what-is-machine-learning-server
Google as well https://cloud.google.com/products/machine-learning/

Then again i'm not saying it would be easy but, after all this is the place that saw the birth of bitcoin, should be more open to ambitious projects  Grin

kokoska
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Activity: 392
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HumbylCoin is the best sporting token


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May 03, 2018, 06:37:59 PM
 #4316

Hello!
Moderators, you can create a table that will record the number of merit sources that generate sMerit by country in the forum?
For example, the English branch is 10 people, German - 3 people, Brazil-4 people.

InvoKing
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★Bitvest.io★ Play Plinko or Invest!


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May 03, 2018, 07:02:45 PM
 #4317

Hello!
Moderators, you can create a table that will record the number of merit sources that generate sMerit by country in the forum?
For example, the English branch is 10 people, German - 3 people, Brazil-4 people.

What's the point? Let's say for example that Brazilians have 2 moderators, so? Will this change anything?
Even knowing the number of smerit sources for each local sub seems logic, it will only generate pwoblems.



.
.BITVEST DICE.
HAS BEEN RELEASED!


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Rainbot
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Piggy
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May 03, 2018, 07:27:20 PM
 #4318

Subs are completely fucked up, at least i see in the Italian one, there is almost no merit flowing or the sources are not giving enough, as you can see from this graph: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3312945.msg34584678#msg34584678

Others are on the same boat as well




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kokoska
Member
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Activity: 392
Merit: 15

HumbylCoin is the best sporting token


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May 03, 2018, 07:36:24 PM
 #4319

Hello!
Moderators, you can create a table that will record the number of merit sources that generate sMerit by country in the forum?
For example, the English branch is 10 people, German - 3 people, Brazil-4 people.

What's the point? Let's say for example that Brazilians have 2 moderators, so? Will this change anything?
Even knowing the number of smerit sources for each local sub seems logic, it will only generate pwoblems.
I will now explain more details to you. I know 3 languages: Ukrainian 10/10, Russian on 9/10 and English on 8/10.
I want to choose a section where you can communicate more actively, create new interesting topics and develop them.

athanz88
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May 03, 2018, 09:07:17 PM
 #4320

Subs are completely fucked up, at least i see in the Italian one, there is almost no merit flowing or the sources are not giving enough, as you can see from this graph: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3312945.msg34584678#msg34584678

Others are on the same boat as well




Thats a great work. In my opinion there are 2 reasons, first is because merit sources are too few right now, or, second, because the quality of the posts are not good enough based on the sources point of view. So we can not only blame it from one side.


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