NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information

[ZeroTheGreat]

So, this voting system only for gathering opinions.

CfB said it too, but I really don't get it: people'll vote in proportional to their (I know / I don't know / I wanna it, cos / I don't wanna it, cos / I don't know, but curios / etc) competence, but opinions'll be weighted in result table by their wealth. Seems non-useful for reader of table — for doer. Why'd we implement it at all?

Why should we need VS?

Ex-act-ly. Global Voting'd not be implemented, only local votings about created assets into Nxt ecosystem. That's my opinion.

I think there are two completely different views on this. The guy who will implement this should just do it how he sees it's correct. If the chain gets a fork we will see which fork will survive.

As always  

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[admiral.fu]

can someone help me with decompiling?  I unzipped the .jar and see lots of class files there but decompiling them gives no nxt source code.

Which soft are you using for decomp?

[Damelon]

Ok so i decided to write something really quick as a submission for this commercial on lets lets talk bitcoin.

this is a super super super rough draft.

Got a minute for whats next? Written from the ground up with brand new source code in an entirely different programming language, nxt is the first truly second generation crypto. It's 100% proof of stake security model melds short term deterministic predictability with longer term uncertainty to open the floodgates and release a torrent of potential breakthrough innovations to the cryptospace. Foremost among these, the ability to predict future forging nodes allows those nodes to build trust within the community. This trust can be leveraged for things like instantly secure transactions if the merchant accepting the nxt trusts the next several nodes in line. Or visa level transaction load volume via nodes clearing transactions before recording them into the blockchain. Nxt's 100% proof of stake security model eliminates many of the costs associated with blockchain security that are, with bitcoin, presently born by the savers in the form of inflation. Finally unlike bitcoin and its limited time block subsidy, there is no arbitrary date far off in the future where nxt's security model will be put to the final test, if nxt works now, it will work always. Tune in next week where we address some of the legitimate criticisms as well as some of the myths associated with nxt.

what do you guys think. do you like the direction? i know its a little over the limit but thats good because the first step in revision is trimming the fat.

While the content is correct, I think this one is pushing what the average listener can take in to the limit, it least if this needs to be spoken in a minute. The information density is too high.

These three sentences for instance contain a lot of information that would most probably just become lost:

It's 100% proof of stake security model melds short term deterministic predictability with longer term uncertainty to open the floodgates and release a torrent of potential breakthrough innovations to the cryptospace. Foremost among these, the ability to predict future forging nodes allows those nodes to build trust within the community. This trust can be leveraged for things like instantly secure transactions if the merchant accepting the nxt trusts the next several nodes in line.

Í know generally what they mean, but I have been following this thread for a month now. I doubt a listener who only knows vaguely about PoS would understand what it does after this.

Could you "dumb it down" a bit? Not to the lowest average denominator, but say someone who knows a bit about what's it all about, but certainly not all?

[Anon136]

Ok so i decided to write something really quick as a submission for this commercial on lets lets talk bitcoin.

this is a super super super rough draft.

Got a minute for whats next? Written from the ground up with brand new source code in an entirely different programming language, nxt is the first truly second generation crypto. It's 100% proof of stake security model melds short term deterministic predictability with longer term uncertainty to open the floodgates and release a torrent of potential breakthrough innovations to the cryptospace. Foremost among these, the ability to predict future forging nodes allows those nodes to build trust within the community. This trust can be leveraged for things like instantly secure transactions if the merchant accepting the nxt trusts the next several nodes in line. Or visa level transaction load volume via nodes clearing transactions before recording them into the blockchain. Nxt's 100% proof of stake security model eliminates many of the costs associated with blockchain security that are, with bitcoin, presently born by the savers in the form of inflation. Finally unlike bitcoin and its limited time block subsidy, there is no arbitrary date far off in the future where nxt's security model will be put to the final test, if nxt works now, it will work always. Tune in next week where we address some of the legitimate criticisms as well as some of the myths associated with nxt.

what do you guys think. do you like the direction? i know its a little over the limit but thats good because the first step in revision is trimming the fat.

I like it! BUT it ends bad. It leaves a bad feeling. First, I get all pumped up with innovative details and suddenly....

Maybe I'm overreacting.

there is no over reaction in marketing. the way it makes people feel is all that matters. how they ought to have felt is of no consequence. thanks for the feedback, i will probably make changes based on it.

[Damelon]

1. Cryptsy

No more discussion needed for Cryptsy:

https://nextcoin.org/index.php/topic,3557.0.html

I've asked Nikel to get me a few email addresses so I can do the mutual introduction.


2. Vircurex

I can't confirm 100%, however, my guess is high confirmations at initial launch to make sure everything runs correctly.  With a brand new code set, I wouldn't blame them one bit. I'd recommend following up in the next 72 hours a coordinate a request to politely lower the number of required confirmations.


Small steps... small steps. Nikel did a great job at the conference, I was with the whole time showing him the best ways to network at these events. We had some fairly funny moments of politely stalking people until we heard what we needed.   If you haven't taken a look at Nikel's updates yet, it's on Nextcoin.org and I believe he's also moved them to the forum off the official site. 

- JustaBitofTime

They are also here: http://www.nxtcoins.nl/miami-bitcoin-conference-updates-summary/

[Anon136]

Ok so i decided to write something really quick as a submission for this commercial on lets lets talk bitcoin.

this is a super super super rough draft.

Got a minute for whats next? Written from the ground up with brand new source code in an entirely different programming language, nxt is the first truly second generation crypto. It's 100% proof of stake security model melds short term deterministic predictability with longer term uncertainty to open the floodgates and release a torrent of potential breakthrough innovations to the cryptospace. Foremost among these, the ability to predict future forging nodes allows those nodes to build trust within the community. This trust can be leveraged for things like instantly secure transactions if the merchant accepting the nxt trusts the next several nodes in line. Or visa level transaction load volume via nodes clearing transactions before recording them into the blockchain. Nxt's 100% proof of stake security model eliminates many of the costs associated with blockchain security that are, with bitcoin, presently born by the savers in the form of inflation. Finally unlike bitcoin and its limited time block subsidy, there is no arbitrary date far off in the future where nxt's security model will be put to the final test, if nxt works now, it will work always. Tune in next week where we address some of the legitimate criticisms as well as some of the myths associated with nxt.

what do you guys think. do you like the direction? i know its a little over the limit but thats good because the first step in revision is trimming the fat.

While the content is correct, I think this one is pushing what the average listener can take in to the limit, it least if this needs to be spoken in a minute. The information density is too high.

These three sentences for instance contain a lot of information that would most probably just become lost:

It's 100% proof of stake security model melds short term deterministic predictability with longer term uncertainty to open the floodgates and release a torrent of potential breakthrough innovations to the cryptospace. Foremost among these, the ability to predict future forging nodes allows those nodes to build trust within the community. This trust can be leveraged for things like instantly secure transactions if the merchant accepting the nxt trusts the next several nodes in line.

Í know generally what they mean, but I have been following this thread for a month now. I doubt a listener who only knows vaguely about PoS would understand what it does after this.

Could you "dumb it down" a bit? Not to the lowest average denominator, but say someone who knows a bit about what's it all about, but certainly not all?

i intentionally wrote it to be correct but also go over peoples heads a little bit. im trying really hard to make it not sound like a commercial. if the audience doesnt understand every word perfectly than thats ok. it may still pique their interest.

[bithic]

Ok so i decided to write something really quick as a submission for this commercial on lets lets talk bitcoin.

this is a super super super rough draft.

Got a minute for whats next? Written from the ground up with brand new source code in an entirely different programming language, nxt is the first truly second generation crypto. It's 100% proof of stake security model melds short term deterministic predictability with longer term uncertainty to open the floodgates and release a torrent of potential breakthrough innovations to the cryptospace. Foremost among these, the ability to predict future forging nodes allows those nodes to build trust within the community. This trust can be leveraged for things like instantly secure transactions if the merchant accepting the nxt trusts the next several nodes in line. Or visa level transaction load volume via nodes clearing transactions before recording them into the blockchain. Nxt's 100% proof of stake security model eliminates many of the costs associated with blockchain security that are, with bitcoin, presently born by the savers in the form of inflation. Finally unlike bitcoin and its limited time block subsidy, there is no arbitrary date far off in the future where nxt's security model will be put to the final test, if nxt works now, it will work always. Tune in next week where we address some of the legitimate criticisms as well as some of the myths associated with nxt.

what do you guys think. do you like the direction? i know its a little over the limit but thats good because the first step in revision is trimming the fat.

The challenge with this is that people won't have time to think about the technicalities. Unless they're giving it 110% of their concentration, the minute will fly by and they won't retain anything, so I suggest a really simple message with a couple memorable points is necessary, which is what I was trying to do with my submission. I think the number one goal should be to get them curious enough to go to the website/wiki. Tantalize them and then give them the resources to delve deeper. There's no way we can download everything to their minds in a minute. Also, as mindtomatter stressed, a simple, short catch-phrase that can be used each week to quickly define Nxt is necessary. Here's the text of my submission. Feel free to appropriate/edit:

Got a minute for what's Nxt?

This is (insert name), bringing you "The Nxt Minute" - dedicated to Nxt, the first available 2nd generation cryptocurrency. For those who are just being introduced, Nxt is a fresh start, using entirely new source code that benefits from the successes of Bitcoin and opens the door to a new realm of possibility in network speed, transaction volume and long-term sustainability.

Nxt is a rapidly evolving community-led endeavor, and is the first 100% Proof-of-Stake cryptocurrency and platform. Advanced decentralized features, like an alias system, an asset exchange, data transmission and voting are included, but the really big innovation is something called "Transparent Forging". If you're curious, head on over to nxtcrypto.org (that is  n x t  c r y p t o .org) and get acquainted!

Stay tuned for future updates, as we share what’s new with Nxt, in one-minute bites, for the next several months.

*edit* As I discovered while recording, this is already pushing it in terms of length. So it absolutely can't be longer than this.

[starik69]

Forgers — only part of Nxt. System'd not be changed to their (us) benefits only. If users (senders) will go away, there'll be no fees for you to collect (and your NXTs lose many aspects of value very possible as well). So forgers for sure'd speak, but'd listen too.

Every NXTer can forge, we all are forges, there is no "part" here. And if there is no forger, then there is no confirmed transaction.

as 1 million of 10 NXTs-wealthed persons, no matter what.

Oh, it does matter, because we cannot have a proof that they are really 1 million.

[Damelon]

Ok so i decided to write something really quick as a submission for this commercial on lets lets talk bitcoin.

this is a super super super rough draft.

Got a minute for whats next? Written from the ground up with brand new source code in an entirely different programming language, nxt is the first truly second generation crypto. It's 100% proof of stake security model melds short term deterministic predictability with longer term uncertainty to open the floodgates and release a torrent of potential breakthrough innovations to the cryptospace. Foremost among these, the ability to predict future forging nodes allows those nodes to build trust within the community. This trust can be leveraged for things like instantly secure transactions if the merchant accepting the nxt trusts the next several nodes in line. Or visa level transaction load volume via nodes clearing transactions before recording them into the blockchain. Nxt's 100% proof of stake security model eliminates many of the costs associated with blockchain security that are, with bitcoin, presently born by the savers in the form of inflation. Finally unlike bitcoin and its limited time block subsidy, there is no arbitrary date far off in the future where nxt's security model will be put to the final test, if nxt works now, it will work always. Tune in next week where we address some of the legitimate criticisms as well as some of the myths associated with nxt.

what do you guys think. do you like the direction? i know its a little over the limit but thats good because the first step in revision is trimming the fat.

While the content is correct, I think this one is pushing what the average listener can take in to the limit, it least if this needs to be spoken in a minute. The information density is too high.

These three sentences for instance contain a lot of information that would most probably just become lost:

It's 100% proof of stake security model melds short term deterministic predictability with longer term uncertainty to open the floodgates and release a torrent of potential breakthrough innovations to the cryptospace. Foremost among these, the ability to predict future forging nodes allows those nodes to build trust within the community. This trust can be leveraged for things like instantly secure transactions if the merchant accepting the nxt trusts the next several nodes in line.

Í know generally what they mean, but I have been following this thread for a month now. I doubt a listener who only knows vaguely about PoS would understand what it does after this.

Could you "dumb it down" a bit? Not to the lowest average denominator, but say someone who knows a bit about what's it all about, but certainly not all?

i intentionally wrote it to be correct but also go over peoples heads a little bit. im trying really hard to make it not sound like a commercial. if the audience doesnt understand every word perfectly than thats ok. it may still pique their interest.

I think you are far to generous in what is "over people's heads"  

However, I'm using myself as a benchmark here, so I'm curious what others say about it.

[PeercoinEnthusiast]

1. Cryptsy

No more discussion needed for Cryptsy:

https://nextcoin.org/index.php/topic,3557.0.html

I've asked Nikel to get me a few email addresses so I can do the mutual introduction.


2. Vircurex

I can't confirm 100%, however, my guess is high confirmations at initial launch to make sure everything runs correctly.  With a brand new code set, I wouldn't blame them one bit. I'd recommend following up in the next 72 hours a coordinate a request to politely lower the number of required confirmations.


Small steps... small steps. Nikel did a great job at the conference, I was with the whole time showing him the best ways to network at these events. We had some fairly funny moments of politely stalking people until we heard what we needed.   If you haven't taken a look at Nikel's updates yet, it's on Nextcoin.org and I believe he's also moved them to the forum off the official site. 

- JustaBitofTime

They are also here: http://www.nxtcoins.nl/miami-bitcoin-conference-updates-summary/

Everyone, check these out on the Bitcointalk summary!

[admiral.fu]

can someone help me with decompiling?  I unzipped the .jar and see lots of class files there but decompiling them gives no nxt source code.

Which soft are you using for decomp?

Ok, overlooked your answer. Have you tried JAD? It is a great experience working with it, though have not yet tried decompiling NXT. Commandline debugger was enough so far.

[jkoil]

The more NXT someone has, the more right he has to decide. It's natural.

No, it's not. Wealth =/= Competence.

We are not talking about competence or the correct decision here! We are talking about the RIGHT to be able to vote. And the guys which hold a few thousands are able to vote more than the guys which are holding a few cents!

THIS IS NATURAL! If the votes are resulting in bad decisions, these decisions were made by those who will loose the most. But then, let it be this way..

The Wealth =/= Competence  is valid, when voting handles not-so-economical issues.

But if the issues are economical, like companies' meetings, then the vote = f( amount of shares/stocks ). That would have the analogy to NXT's: 1 NXT = 1 Vote.

But, if the issues to be voted are not always economical ...
(this needs thinking:) ... I'd like to see all the suggestions, the vote-discussion in one place)
 

[Anon136]

Ok so i decided to write something really quick as a submission for this commercial on lets lets talk bitcoin.

this is a super super super rough draft.

Got a minute for whats next? Written from the ground up with brand new source code in an entirely different programming language, nxt is the first truly second generation crypto. It's 100% proof of stake security model melds short term deterministic predictability with longer term uncertainty to open the floodgates and release a torrent of potential breakthrough innovations to the cryptospace. Foremost among these, the ability to predict future forging nodes allows those nodes to build trust within the community. This trust can be leveraged for things like instantly secure transactions if the merchant accepting the nxt trusts the next several nodes in line. Or visa level transaction load volume via nodes clearing transactions before recording them into the blockchain. Nxt's 100% proof of stake security model eliminates many of the costs associated with blockchain security that are, with bitcoin, presently born by the savers in the form of inflation. Finally unlike bitcoin and its limited time block subsidy, there is no arbitrary date far off in the future where nxt's security model will be put to the final test, if nxt works now, it will work always. Tune in next week where we address some of the legitimate criticisms as well as some of the myths associated with nxt.

what do you guys think. do you like the direction? i know its a little over the limit but thats good because the first step in revision is trimming the fat.

I think the number one goal should be to get them curious enough to go to the website/wiki. Tantalize them and then give them the resources to delve deeper.

I 100% agree with this. my thought is that a claim + an argument that flies past them is better than a claim with no argument what so ever. I really think that we have to rethink marketing when trying to talk to this community. they are much much much smarter than the marginal citizen.

[Anon136]

Ok so i decided to write something really quick as a submission for this commercial on lets lets talk bitcoin.

this is a super super super rough draft.

Got a minute for whats next? Written from the ground up with brand new source code in an entirely different programming language, nxt is the first truly second generation crypto. It's 100% proof of stake security model melds short term deterministic predictability with longer term uncertainty to open the floodgates and release a torrent of potential breakthrough innovations to the cryptospace. Foremost among these, the ability to predict future forging nodes allows those nodes to build trust within the community. This trust can be leveraged for things like instantly secure transactions if the merchant accepting the nxt trusts the next several nodes in line. Or visa level transaction load volume via nodes clearing transactions before recording them into the blockchain. Nxt's 100% proof of stake security model eliminates many of the costs associated with blockchain security that are, with bitcoin, presently born by the savers in the form of inflation. Finally unlike bitcoin and its limited time block subsidy, there is no arbitrary date far off in the future where nxt's security model will be put to the final test, if nxt works now, it will work always. Tune in next week where we address some of the legitimate criticisms as well as some of the myths associated with nxt.

what do you guys think. do you like the direction? i know its a little over the limit but thats good because the first step in revision is trimming the fat.

While the content is correct, I think this one is pushing what the average listener can take in to the limit, it least if this needs to be spoken in a minute. The information density is too high.

These three sentences for instance contain a lot of information that would most probably just become lost:

It's 100% proof of stake security model melds short term deterministic predictability with longer term uncertainty to open the floodgates and release a torrent of potential breakthrough innovations to the cryptospace. Foremost among these, the ability to predict future forging nodes allows those nodes to build trust within the community. This trust can be leveraged for things like instantly secure transactions if the merchant accepting the nxt trusts the next several nodes in line.

Í know generally what they mean, but I have been following this thread for a month now. I doubt a listener who only knows vaguely about PoS would understand what it does after this.

Could you "dumb it down" a bit? Not to the lowest average denominator, but say someone who knows a bit about what's it all about, but certainly not all?

i intentionally wrote it to be correct but also go over peoples heads a little bit. im trying really hard to make it not sound like a commercial. if the audience doesnt understand every word perfectly than thats ok. it may still pique their interest.

I think you are far to generous in what is "over people's heads"  

However, I'm using myself as a benchmark here, so I'm curious what others say about it.

you are also familiar with the ideas. if you had no familiarity with them than even you may have been taken aback. thats ok though the point is not to create a devotee on the spot. the point is to convince them that it is worth more research.

[admiral.fu]

Forget it. JAD has not been updated for many years. Good memories stick for a long time.

[Sebastien256]

both dgex and nextcoin forum are down. Anyone know what is going on?

[Damelon]

you are also familiar with the ideas. if you had no familiarity with them than even you may have been taken aback. thats ok though the point is not to create a devotee on the spot. the point is to convince them that it is worth more research.

I agree that if someone who is like me would hear this, they would be interested.
I'd be determined to understand what the hell it was about.

Rather similar to what actually happened, really.

[starik69]

but i see no NXT code anywhere

Then what do you mean by NXT code?

Code:

public class Nxt
  extends HttpServlet
{...

[jkoil]

both dgex and nextcoin forum are down. Anyone know what is going on?

DGEX seems to work...

[Sebastien256]

both dgex and nextcoin forum are down. Anyone know what is going on?

DGEX seems to work...

I have this message on both site:

This web page is not available