Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP.

[vokain]

I can't wait to see this in 3-20 years.

Some of us might be dead by then.

maybe not so
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2013/oct/21/dna-body-clock-ageing

[1715276952]

1715276952

[1715276952]

1715276952

[cypherdoc]

I can't wait to see this in 3-20 years.

Some of us might be dead by then.

maybe not so
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2013/oct/21/dna-body-clock-ageing

Excellent!

Now I can offer discounts for 20 year subs!

[vokain]

I can't wait to see this in 3-20 years.

Some of us might be dead by then.

maybe not so
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2013/oct/21/dna-body-clock-ageing

Excellent!

Now I can offer discounts for 20 year subs!

can i just be your apprentice?

edit: actually this was the link i wanted to post about reversing aging, not the Guardian article. The tedtalk is much more informative
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMAwnA5WvLc

[Spaceman_Spiff]

I can't wait to see this in 3-20 years.

Some of us might be dead by then.

maybe not so
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2013/oct/21/dna-body-clock-ageing

Yeah, I wouldn't put too much hope in that article, I am pretty confident it is mostly just a reaction of the body to aging (an effect instead of the cause).  Articles about "the one magic compound or pill that controls aging" are just selling stories. Nevertheless, aging IS curable, imo the best effort out there is SENS : http://sens.org/ .

Sorry for going off-topic, but I have some strong opinions on the matter, and I am hoping somewhat that some of the brighter out-of-the-box thinkers that you might find here might become intrigued by this as well  .

[NewLiberty]

I can't wait to see this in 3-20 years.

Some of us might be dead by then.

maybe not so
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2013/oct/21/dna-body-clock-ageing

Yeah, I wouldn't put too much hope in that article, I am pretty confident it is mostly just a reaction of the body to aging (an effect instead of the cause).  Articles about "the one magic compound or pill that controls aging" are just selling stories. Nevertheless, aging IS curable, imo the best effort out there is SENS : http://sens.org/ .

Sorry for going off-topic, but I have some strong opinions on the matter, and I am hoping somewhat that some of the brighter out-of-the-box thinkers that you might find here might become intrigued by this as well  .

I've had the pleasure of hanging out with Aubrey de Grey, Ph.D. (SENS Chief Science Officer and Co-founder) a few times and can attest that he is *very lively* for a man of his years.

[notme]

I can't wait to see this in 3-20 years.

Some of us might be dead by then.

maybe not so
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2013/oct/21/dna-body-clock-ageing

Yeah, I wouldn't put too much hope in that article, I am pretty confident it is mostly just a reaction of the body to aging (an effect instead of the cause).  Articles about "the one magic compound or pill that controls aging" are just selling stories. Nevertheless, aging IS curable, imo the best effort out there is SENS : http://sens.org/ .

Sorry for going off-topic, but I have some strong opinions on the matter, and I am hoping somewhat that some of the brighter out-of-the-box thinkers that you might find here might become intrigued by this as well  .

That's exactly what this research is... they were trying to improve the methods of measuring aging, not trying to find the cause.

[thezerg]

40X!!!    

Just in case newbies to this thread do not understand, this posting periodically compares the buying power of gold vs. bitcoin if you had bought one vs the other in March 2012.  

For example, you had bought $1000 in gold on that date, you'd have a bit more than a half ounce worth around $780 today.  If you had bought bitcoin, you would have 185 coins worth 35 THOUSAND bucks!!!

the silverbox update (comparison from the beginning of this thread, March 13th, 2012, gold=1690, nasdaq=3055, Bitcoin=5.4):
Bitcoin is 192.11 (177.44 btcChina in USD).  Gold is 1318.00.  Nasdaq is 3922.00
Bitcoin: 3457.59% (3185.93%)
Gold:    -22.01%
Nasdaq:  28.38%
Gold Diff:   4462% advantage Bitcoin
Nasdaq Diff:  2671% advantage Bitcoin
4561.708256055753

Stop rubbing it in.

40 bagger deserves some celebration. ...

[cypherdoc]

40X!!!    

Just in case newbies to this thread do not understand, this posting periodically compares the buying power of gold vs. bitcoin if you had bought one vs the other in March 2012.  

For example, you had bought $1000 in gold on that date, you'd have a bit more than a half ounce worth around $780 today.  If you had bought bitcoin, you would have 185 coins worth 35 THOUSAND bucks!!!

the silverbox update (comparison from the beginning of this thread, March 13th, 2012, gold=1690, nasdaq=3055, Bitcoin=5.4):
Bitcoin is 192.11 (177.44 btcChina in USD).  Gold is 1318.00.  Nasdaq is 3922.00
Bitcoin: 3457.59% (3185.93%)
Gold:    -22.01%
Nasdaq:  28.38%
Gold Diff:   4462% advantage Bitcoin
Nasdaq Diff:  2671% advantage Bitcoin
4561.708256055753

Stop rubbing it in.

40 bagger deserves some celebration. ...

you know i'm just kidding.  keep it up.

btw, only 1 day in BTC history where the price has closed higher than now.

[cypherdoc]

btw, only 1 day in BTC history where the price has closed higher than now.

was that $230?

yeah.

the future is very bright.

[oakpacific]

it doesn't matter who's right.

the point is, production and stock is fuzzy; and it always will be.  which is precisely why i switched to BTC investment back in early 2011.  Bitcoin is easily trackable according to the protocol by anyone. it's brutally defined.  and time is proving it's uncrackable.

just one of the many reasons i've been arguing to switch publicly since Gold: I Smell A Trap.

Very good point. You can't track the total supply of PMs world wide. You can only make estimations of the total.

Never thought of that until now.

This is why/how PM is anonymous, and Bitcoin isn't.

Anonymous until you want to claim your ownership, in which case Bitcoin is still more anonymous.

Claiming ownership?  Not sure what you mean.
Physical PM is always anonymous.  It is as anonymous as the change in your pocket.
Which is more anonymous than the bills in your pocket which are each uniquely numbered and easily tracked (easier even than bitcoins).

Yeah, so nobody knows they are yours, until you show a link between them and your real world identity(like they are in your safe or some bank vaults rented by you). Such anonymity is pretty useless in many situations.

Bitcoin, OTOH, provides reasonable pseudononymity/anonymity along with nearly indisputable ownership proof all at the same time.

[tvbcof]

Yeah, so nobody knows they are yours, until you show a link between them and your real world identity(like they are in your safe or some bank vaults rented by you). Such anonymity is pretty useless in many situations.

Bitcoin, OTOH, provides reasonable pseudononymity/anonymity along with nearly indisputable ownership proof all at the same time.

I would not feel confident to evaluate the level of anonymity of Bitcoin until a lot more is known about both the system, and especially about the methods and capabilities of the attackers.

OTOH, the level of 'plausible deniability' of Bitcoin is outstanding because there have been so many losses, accidents, thefts, frauds, etc.  It would be completely believable to claim a loss of control of BTC through a lot of means.

In jurisdictions which do not rely on secret courts and summery justice, this 'plausible deniability' aspect of the system could likely be leveraged very effectively.

[justusranvier]

OTOH, the level of 'plausible deniability' of Bitcoin is outstanding because there have been so many losses, accidents, thefts, frauds, etc.  It would be completely believable to claim a loss of control of BTC through a lot of means.

Imagine a Bitcoin-related business that operates at a loss for two years, and becomes profitable on the third.
.
Unfortunately, right before the third tax accounting period ends, the business is hacked and loses a significant portion of their bitcoins.

Fortunately they have enough left to pay creditors and return customer funds, but all their profit and working capital is gone.

I guess they'd just have to give up, close the business, and try again.

[cypherdoc]

[oakpacific]

Yeah, so nobody knows they are yours, until you show a link between them and your real world identity(like they are in your safe or some bank vaults rented by you). Such anonymity is pretty useless in many situations.

Bitcoin, OTOH, provides reasonable pseudononymity/anonymity along with nearly indisputable ownership proof all at the same time.

I would not feel confident to evaluate the level of anonymity of Bitcoin until a lot more is known about both the system, and especially about the methods and capabilities of the attackers.

OTOH, the level of 'plausible deniability' of Bitcoin is outstanding because there have been so many losses, accidents, thefts, frauds, etc.  It would be completely believable to claim a loss of control of BTC through a lot of means.

In jurisdictions which do not rely on secret courts and summery justice, this 'plausible deniability' aspect of the system could likely be leveraged very effectively.

In jurisidictions relying on proper procedures, simply encrypting your password would be enough, as nobody can prove whether the encrypted content is Bitcoin wallet password or something else, thus unable to force you to reveal the password for the decryption.

In jurisidctions which would not hesitate to resort to coercion to open your mouth, Bitcoin can technically still be made much safer from confiscation than pretty much any other asset, by carefully hiding your trails and utilizing brainwallet or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deniable_encryption .

[majamalu]

I can't believe this is not your avatar.

[wachtwoord]

Yeah, so nobody knows they are yours, until you show a link between them and your real world identity(like they are in your safe or some bank vaults rented by you). Such anonymity is pretty useless in many situations.

Bitcoin, OTOH, provides reasonable pseudononymity/anonymity along with nearly indisputable ownership proof all at the same time.

I would not feel confident to evaluate the level of anonymity of Bitcoin until a lot more is known about both the system, and especially about the methods and capabilities of the attackers.

OTOH, the level of 'plausible deniability' of Bitcoin is outstanding because there have been so many losses, accidents, thefts, frauds, etc.  It would be completely believable to claim a loss of control of BTC through a lot of means.

In jurisdictions which do not rely on secret courts and summery justice, this 'plausible deniability' aspect of the system could likely be leveraged very effectively.

In jurisidictions relying on proper procedures, simply encrypting your password would be enough, as nobody can prove whether the encrypted content is Bitcoin wallet password or something else, thus unable to force you to reveal the password for the decryption.

In jurisidctions which would not hesitate to resort to coercion to open your mouth, Bitcoin can technically still be made much safer from confiscation than pretty much any other asset, by carefully hiding your trails and utilizing brainwallet or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deniable_encryption .

And by nesting your encryption volumes like a Russian Matryoshka doll. They'll never know when they reached the final layer of encryption

[justusranvier]

1) Have trustworthy friends.
2) Make sure some of them reside on different continents than you.
3) Keep your savings in an m-of-n output, where the cooperation of one or more of your friends is needed to spend them.
4) You are now protected from rubber hose cryptography.

[notme]

1) Have trustworthy friends.
2) Make sure some of them reside on different continents than you.
3) Keep your savings in an m-of-n output, where the cooperation of one or more of your friends is needed to spend them.
4) You are now protected from rubber hose cryptography.

But that doesn't protect you from rubber hoses

[wachtwoord]

1) Have trustworthy friends.
2) Make sure some of them reside on different continents than you.
3) Keep your savings in an m-of-n output, where the cooperation of one or more of your friends is needed to spend them.
4) You are now protected from rubber hose cryptography.

Sadly, this is not a trust free system and I don't trust anyone enough. Do you? 

[justusranvier]

The only problem is it doesn't work for people who can't make friends.