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Author Topic: Tau-Chain and Agoras Official Thread: Generalized P2P Network  (Read 237218 times)
yuyu123
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April 01, 2016, 09:51:12 AM
 #621

Wow man, this is like a mexican novel, no offense to mexicans. Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked

Bittrex should roll back all trades with stolen coins. Ohad should recompense them for the amount withdrawn by the scammer and for their fees earned from those trades. 



There is no way to reverse the trades.  By the time we were notified, the coins were dumped and the BTC had been withdrawn

thanks,
richie@bittrex






I second that. If possible, bittrex should make a roll back and get compensated for any financial damage caused by withdrawals and such.


I too agree that this is the best and simplest way to handle this matter.
I second that.

What is the goal?  Reversing the trades is a big task and i don't it's worth it given what I think you are trying to accomplish.  If the goal is to get the 500k back, why not just arrange an off exchange purchase where ohad buys the coins back from the members that purchased them?  It seems like all the majority of the coins ended up at buyers are known on this thread already and are willing to cooperate.

thanks,
Richie

There are only few trades involved with stolen tokens. Why reversing them is a big issue?

There are still 57295.22 token which are in unknown hands.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=950309.msg14378761#msg14378761

Another solution:
Does all the 500,000 stolen AGRS tokens are still in Bittrex? Can you distinguish them from the other (legitimate) AGRS tokens in Bittrex accounts? If true, Ohad can send you replacemnt IDNI tokens only for the legitimate tokens + the amount in bitcoin paid for the stolen tokens. Users that hold stolen tokens will receive the amount they spent in bitcoin, instead of replacement IDNI tokens.   
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April 01, 2016, 01:52:29 PM
 #622

Hi everyone,

I would like to put forward an idea to see what everyone thinks.

We know that Ohad, HMC and co devTeam are working very hard on this groundbreaking project.
It has been announced that Tau will be ready in a few months.
Agoras coin will then take 12months to launch.

My suggestion is that all test coins be allocated to Agoras investors (less scam purchases) as a bonus altcoin.
A two-for-one deal if you like.

Let's say the low utility BetaAgoras (can be renamed) blazes a path (for the 12 month in the future) premier Algoras coin.
It would be sad for investors to see other alt-coins compete on Tau platform with rising mkt caps in this 12 month waiting period.
Ofcourse various other altCoins can be developed on Tau by random individuals, BUT through this strategy we get a head start in  building brand recognition and value that otherwise would be forfeit. Or give unnecessary ground to an Agoras competitor, however inferior and unlikely that may be. Also we gain greater cryptocoin market share overall by existing in BOTH the altcoin space, AND the premier high-utility space.

So in summary holders of Agoras could also receive a second coin BetaAgoras as a free bonus that launch from the genesis of Tau.
I believe that this initiative will help to maximise the creation of wealth from the Tau enabled cryptocurrencies, going to the primary investors associated with the Tau project - the Agoras token holders.

I also believe that for many potential investors the concerns of the 12 month delay will be allayed. Creating a positive and proactive investment platform for a successful pre-sale.

Thoughts?



Note: I am JackPeasant on freenode irc.

freenode#zennet
7:09 PM <JackPeasant>   <HMC_a> at least two coins will come first:
7:11 PM <JackPeasant> If there was a couple of test coins, a betaAgoras - low utility, and deltaAgoras high utility test
7:13 PM <JackPeasant> coins. Could these be issued to agoras token holders (but not those who benefited from scam) ?
7:23 PM <JackPeasant> Their continuation may have residual value as an alt coin in the Tau space. 
7:24 PM <JackPeasant> They would assist in the agoras  presale, countering the concern of having to wait 12months.
7:25 PM <JackPeasant> And tangibly establish the pre-eminent  status of the agoras coin as a shield against quick-start competitors.
7:30 PM <JackPeasant> This in term will create a greater mkt share in the Tau Crypto-currency alt space rewarding Agoras investors.
7:32 PM <JackPeasant> A bonus residual alt coin or two, on top of the Agoras coin.
7:46 PM <JackPeasant> This would regain a very positive footing, generating substantial goodwill, and sales momentum.

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April 01, 2016, 02:20:52 PM
 #623

Hi everyone,

I would like to put forward an idea to see what everyone thinks.

We know that Ohad, HMC and co devTeam are working very hard on this groundbreaking project.
It has been announced that Tau will be ready in a few months.
Agoras coin will then take 12months to launch.

My suggestion is that all test coins be allocated to Agoras investors (less scam purchases) as a bonus altcoin.
A two-for-one deal if you like.

Let's say the low utility BetaAgoras (can be renamed) blazes a path (for the 12 month in the future) premier Algoras coin.
It would be sad for investors to see other alt-coins compete on Tau platform with rising mkt caps in this 12 month waiting period.
Ofcourse various other altCoins can be developed on Tau by random individuals, BUT through this strategy we get a head start in  building brand recognition and value that otherwise would be forfeit. Or give unnecessary ground to an Agoras competitor, however inferior and unlikely that may be. Also we gain greater cryptocoin market share overall by existing in BOTH the altcoin space, AND the premier high-utility space.

So in summary holders of Agoras could also receive a second coin BetaAgoras as a free bonus that launch from the genesis of Tau.
I believe that this initiative will help to maximise the creation of wealth from the Tau enabled cryptocurrencies, going to the primary investors associated with the Tau project - the Agoras token holders.

I also believe that for many potential investors the concerns of the 12 month delay will be allayed. Creating a positive and proactive investment platform for a successful pre-sale.

Thoughts?



Note: I am JackPeasant on freenode irc.

freenode#zennet
7:09 PM <JackPeasant>   <HMC_a> at least two coins will come first:
7:11 PM <JackPeasant> If there was a couple of test coins, a betaAgoras - low utility, and deltaAgoras high utility test
7:13 PM <JackPeasant> coins. Could these be issued to agoras token holders (but not those who benefited from scam) ?
7:23 PM <JackPeasant> Their continuation may have residual value as an alt coin in the Tau space. 
7:24 PM <JackPeasant> They would assist in the agoras  presale, countering the concern of having to wait 12months.
7:25 PM <JackPeasant> And tangibly establish the pre-eminent  status of the agoras coin as a shield against quick-start competitors.
7:30 PM <JackPeasant> This in term will create a greater mkt share in the Tau Crypto-currency alt space rewarding Agoras investors.
7:32 PM <JackPeasant> A bonus residual alt coin or two, on top of the Agoras coin.
7:46 PM <JackPeasant> This would regain a very positive footing, generating substantial goodwill, and sales momentum.





I support the original plan without making such alterations as offered here.
Those who will prefer not to wait for 12 months will just purchase later on and for a higher price.
 

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April 01, 2016, 02:26:22 PM
 #624

Hi everyone,

I would like to put forward an idea to see what everyone thinks.

We know that Ohad, HMC and co devTeam are working very hard on this groundbreaking project.
It has been announced that Tau will be ready in a few months.
Agoras coin will then take 12months to launch.

My suggestion is that all test coins be allocated to Agoras investors (less scam purchases) as a bonus altcoin.
A two-for-one deal if you like.

Let's say the low utility BetaAgoras (can be renamed) blazes a path (for the 12 month in the future) premier Algoras coin.
It would be sad for investors to see other alt-coins compete on Tau platform with rising mkt caps in this 12 month waiting period.
Ofcourse various other altCoins can be developed on Tau by random individuals, BUT through this strategy we get a head start in  building brand recognition and value that otherwise would be forfeit. Or give unnecessary ground to an Agoras competitor, however inferior and unlikely that may be. Also we gain greater cryptocoin market share overall by existing in BOTH the altcoin space, AND the premier high-utility space.

So in summary holders of Agoras could also receive a second coin BetaAgoras as a free bonus that launch from the genesis of Tau.
I believe that this initiative will help to maximise the creation of wealth from the Tau enabled cryptocurrencies, going to the primary investors associated with the Tau project - the Agoras token holders.

I also believe that for many potential investors the concerns of the 12 month delay will be allayed. Creating a positive and proactive investment platform for a successful pre-sale.

Thoughts?



Note: I am JackPeasant on freenode irc.

freenode#zennet
7:09 PM <JackPeasant>   <HMC_a> at least two coins will come first:
7:11 PM <JackPeasant> If there was a couple of test coins, a betaAgoras - low utility, and deltaAgoras high utility test
7:13 PM <JackPeasant> coins. Could these be issued to agoras token holders (but not those who benefited from scam) ?
7:23 PM <JackPeasant> Their continuation may have residual value as an alt coin in the Tau space. 
7:24 PM <JackPeasant> They would assist in the agoras  presale, countering the concern of having to wait 12months.
7:25 PM <JackPeasant> And tangibly establish the pre-eminent  status of the agoras coin as a shield against quick-start competitors.
7:30 PM <JackPeasant> This in term will create a greater mkt share in the Tau Crypto-currency alt space rewarding Agoras investors.
7:32 PM <JackPeasant> A bonus residual alt coin or two, on top of the Agoras coin.
7:46 PM <JackPeasant> This would regain a very positive footing, generating substantial goodwill, and sales momentum.





I support the original plan without making such alterations as offered here.
Those who will prefer not to wait for 12 months will just purchase later on and for a higher price.
 



one of the main tau's req is to begin completely equal without any distinction between the players. then the first users will determine the rules of the network. tau's dev avoids discussing this initial post-genesis process in order not to bias the process.
so, you can raise your idea over tau when ready. on the other hand, bear in mind that tau's power comes from not giving incentive to fork it but to rather share resources and information with the root chain. therefore it'll better not prefer one context over another. but this too is also up to the rules of the network to be determined by the users

Tau-Chain & Agoras
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April 01, 2016, 02:55:02 PM
 #625

Bittrex not willing to cooperate and rollback the trades?  Don't trade there..
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April 01, 2016, 04:15:04 PM
 #626

Bittrex not willing to cooperate and rollback the trades?  Don't trade there..

I will second that. And somehow the crap keeps piling up on Bittrex. Made so many bad experiences over there, I am fed up.

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April 01, 2016, 04:30:26 PM
 #627

Bittrex not willing to cooperate and rollback the trades?  Don't trade there..

I will second that. And somehow the crap keeps piling up on Bittrex. Made so many bad experiences over there, I am fed up.

Sorry, but we are an exchange and did exactly what we are designed to do.  It is not our fault that someone sold legitimate coins here that you want to invalidate.  Do as you please, but I'm not going to do things that are detrimental to our system and users.

richie@bittrex

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April 01, 2016, 04:48:52 PM
 #628

+1 richie

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April 01, 2016, 04:55:42 PM
 #629

Bittrex not willing to cooperate and rollback the trades?  Don't trade there..

I will second that. And somehow the crap keeps piling up on Bittrex. Made so many bad experiences over there, I am fed up.

Bittrex is not responsible for it. If you don't understand that go back to the banking system...
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April 01, 2016, 05:52:38 PM
 #630


I think that the people over at bittrex (richie et al.) could do the roll back if they wanted, but they just chose not to because it is extra work and effort for them and as such does not justify taking further action from their part. I can understand that, even if I do not agree with them in this case (I think they should have accommodated to the special request in this case due to it's special circumstances).
If the exchange solution (best one offered to date) is not a viable option, we should proceed with an adequate alternative (a few have been offered).

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April 01, 2016, 06:02:44 PM
 #631

Bittrex not willing to cooperate and rollback the trades?  Don't trade there..

I will second that. And somehow the crap keeps piling up on Bittrex. Made so many bad experiences over there, I am fed up.

Bittrex is not responsible for it. If you don't understand that go back to the banking system...

+1

Sounds like someone looking for a bail out.
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April 01, 2016, 06:34:05 PM
 #632

friends, the show must go on.
let's reach a consensus or i'll have to simply send all new tokens except the 20.5M.
the exchange suspension strongly harms the project.
let's have a deadline until tomorrow in midnight GMT (~30 hours from now)

Tau-Chain & Agoras
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April 01, 2016, 06:42:22 PM
 #633

Simply burn/devalue the stolen coins. Asking bittrex to rollback is not a good option. The team must act quickly. This is one of the nicely traded coin with great support. It should start trading soon. Many holders are trying to sell in Marketplace and face suspicion from buyers.

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April 01, 2016, 07:02:16 PM
 #634

this user EuZeN recently trying to sell 500K tokens at cheap price
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=111788



as well the theif's address belongs to this wallet
https://www.walletexplorer.com/wallet/11c3fbaa1e320d19/addresses

it can help you to find who was hacker,If you need more help about this I can spend some of my free time to help you guys
A quick investigation shows he is a proven scammer and ponzi operator on bitcointalk
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April 01, 2016, 07:58:39 PM
 #635



If hacker is reading my message(I am 100% sure he is Wink )

Those tokens are useless for hacker, so better he give them back to Ohad to save time of Ohad and others.if he do refund then it can solve the issue a bit.
according to this post
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=950309.msg14378761#msg14378761

436478.75 AGRS in hand of users who are ready to cooperate
so if Ohad gets those 20.5M (from hacker) and 436478.75 AGRS (from buyers) back then he get almost all of them back expect <0.15% tokens that were sold to unknown buyer.

Now its upto hacker what he want to do, keep those useless tokens or give them back to save time of developer and others

tokens can returned to original address that is used to distribute them
14gF3Up7wdRdkxAL4GgQLdnM8CThgDUSHR
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April 01, 2016, 08:02:29 PM
 #636

Bittrex not willing to cooperate and rollback the trades?  Don't trade there..

I will second that. And somehow the crap keeps piling up on Bittrex. Made so many bad experiences over there, I am fed up.

Sorry, but we are an exchange and did exactly what we are designed to do.  It is not our fault that someone sold legitimate coins here that you want to invalidate.  Do as you please, but I'm not going to do things that are detrimental to our system and users.

richie@bittrex

These are your users, we all trade and used to trade on your platform, get your priorities straight.
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April 01, 2016, 08:33:45 PM
 #637



If hacker is reading my message(I am 100% sure he is Wink )

Those tokens are useless for hacker, so better he give them back to Ohad to save time of Ohad and others.if he do refund then it can solve the issue a bit.
according to this post
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=950309.msg14378761#msg14378761

436478.75 AGRS in hand of users who are ready to cooperate
so if Ohad gets those 20.5M (from hacker) and 436478.75 AGRS (from buyers) back then he get almost all of them back expect <0.15% tokens that were sold to unknown buyer.

Now its upto hacker what he want to do, keep those useless tokens or give them back to save time of developer and others

tokens can returned to original address that is used to distribute them
14gF3Up7wdRdkxAL4GgQLdnM8CThgDUSHR

Looks like hacker read my message, I see a recent transaction on 14gF3Up7wdRdkxAL4GgQLdnM8CThgDUSHR
https://blockchain.info/tx/8d28f45701eaa4d54fd5450cfc67d0cb50049e5e6df5802b5e05b3c03290d348

lets wait Ohad for update, I hope all 20.5m coins were returned
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April 01, 2016, 08:44:16 PM
 #638

Bittrex not willing to cooperate and rollback the trades?  Don't trade there..

I will second that. And somehow the crap keeps piling up on Bittrex. Made so many bad experiences over there, I am fed up.

Sorry, but we are an exchange and did exactly what we are designed to do.  It is not our fault that someone sold legitimate coins here that you want to invalidate.  Do as you please, but I'm not going to do things that are detrimental to our system and users.

richie@bittrex

These are your users, we all trade and used to trade on your platform, get your priorities straight.


Richie,

Did you considered my second suggestion, here:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=950309.msg14385736#msg14385736

It is not required a roll-back, and it is very easy to implement. The stolen token are held by 10 users maximum. You can exclude them from the automatic replacement process and handle their accounts manually. I am not seeing why it is a problem to do it.
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April 01, 2016, 08:53:09 PM
 #639

friends, the show must go on.
let's reach a consensus or i'll have to simply send all new tokens except the 20.5M.
the exchange suspension strongly harms the project.
let's have a deadline until tomorrow in midnight GMT (~30 hours from now)



I still hope Bittrex will cooperate with us to distinguish the stolen tokens from the legitimate one, and receive for them BTC instead of replacement IDNI tokens, but if not, Ohad can send Bittrex replacement IDNI tokens only for the legitimate tokens (not for the 500,000 stolen tokens) and the holders of the stolen tokens (I guess, less than 10 users) can contact Ohad to request him the bitcoin amount they paid for the stolen tokens.
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April 01, 2016, 09:16:15 PM
 #640

Looks like hacker read my message, I see a recent transaction on 14gF3Up7wdRdkxAL4GgQLdnM8CThgDUSHR
https://blockchain.info/tx/8d28f45701eaa4d54fd5450cfc67d0cb50049e5e6df5802b5e05b3c03290d348

lets wait Ohad for update, I hope all 20.5m coins were returned

only 10M http://omnichest.info/lookupadd.aspx?address=14gF3Up7wdRdkxAL4GgQLdnM8CThgDUSHR

Tau-Chain & Agoras
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