Bitcoin Forum
November 26, 2020, 01:15:07 PM *
News: Latest Bitcoin Core release: 0.20.1 [Torrent]
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register More  
Poll
Question: When ATH?
Nov. 2020 - 47 (36.2%)
Dec. 2020 - 43 (33.1%)
Jan. 2021 - 14 (10.8%)
Feb. 2021 - 5 (3.8%)
Mar. 2021 - 5 (3.8%)
After Mar. 2021 - 16 (12.3%)
Total Voters: 130

Pages: « 1 ... 27202 27203 27204 27205 27206 27207 27208 27209 27210 27211 27212 27213 27214 27215 27216 27217 27218 27219 27220 27221 27222 27223 27224 27225 27226 27227 27228 27229 27230 27231 27232 27233 27234 27235 27236 27237 27238 27239 27240 27241 27242 27243 27244 27245 27246 27247 27248 27249 27250 27251 [27252] 27253 27254 27255 27256 27257 27258 27259 27260 27261 27262 27263 27264 27265 27266 27267 27268 27269 27270 27271 27272 27273 27274 27275 27276 27277 27278 27279 27280 27281 27282 27283 27284 27285 27286 27287 27288 27289 27290 27291 27292 27293 27294 27295 27296 27297 27298 27299 27300 27301 27302 ... 27612 »
  Print  
Author Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion  (Read 24458586 times)
This is a self-moderated topic. If you do not want to be moderated by the person who started this topic, create a new topic. (153 posts by 40 users deleted.)
nullius
Copper Member
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 448
Merit: 2046


Avatar for rent! Min. bid: 20999999.9769 BTC/year.


View Profile WWW
September 15, 2020, 01:13:41 AM

An interesting question just popped in my mind:


How much kWh was used to create the current Blockchain?


Should be somehow possible to calculate it based on the given mining hardware and mining difficulty.

Possible to estimate, yes; but I don’t see how it could be easy.  That would require cost/efficiency estimates for every generation of miners:  CPU (various optimized implementations and CPU models), GPU (ditto), FPGA, every generation of ASIC...

Does a collection of those historical data even exist anywhere?  If you folks discussing this were to gather in the first instance, the effort may be worth a research paper.  Maybe one already exists (with data up to some past point).

Purely from a scientific point of view. And from inception, thus the genesis block.

Would be nice to see(feel) the monumental work and energy that was put to secure the blockchain and to get an impression and a feel of how much power was used to create this distributed ledger.

I don’t think that the historical electricity cost would give a clear view of the current security of the Bitcoin blockchain.  With ASIC hardware, you could easily outrun the whole early CPU-mined Bitcoin network at drastically lower energy cost!  Of course, as you continued rewriting blockchain history, sooner or later, you would slam into the historical point at which the real Bitcoin network’s hashrate exceeded your hardware’s capabilities.  From that point onwards, you would just get further and further behind with your fake blockchain, as the chaintip of the real Bitcoin network keeps advancing faster than you can chase it.*

Still, yes, the energy-cost accounting would be historically interesting.

purely for science

The real kind!

(* And one of the marvellous properties of the Nakamoto Consensus is that the “real” chain can be selected by an isolated node with no information except the block data alleging one or more consensus-rule valid chains.  Most-work (not “longest”) chain wins, and that’s that.  Not even a trustworthy realtime clock source is required.  It is the whole point of how this is supposed to work; but somehow, I often see people missing it—usually when they want to suggest some “improvement” which would break Bitcoin’s security without even achieving what they expect.)



Jay:  Insightful comments that will probably inspire a short essay.

No.... don't do it.


Is that investment advice to avoid shorting my lifetime at high leverage by posting on an Internet forum?  Confirmed math and science calculate that writing on the Internet brings −99.53088288% ROI.
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction. Advertise here.
JayJuanGee
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2450
Merit: 3470


How much alt coin diversification is needed? 0%?


View Profile
September 15, 2020, 01:31:41 AM

Still, yes, the energy-cost accounting would be historically interesting.

No need to worry.  We are in good hands since homer is working on it.  

He is quite detail orientated.  

If anyone can get the job done, that would be xhomerx10.  Wink

Jay:  Insightful comments that will probably inspire a short essay.

No.... don't do it.


Is that investment advice to avoid shorting my lifetime at high leverage by posting on an Internet forum?  Confirmed math and science calculate that writing on the Internet brings −99.53088288% ROI.

Well.  I tried talking you out of it, but you seem determined.  

Difficult to stop the distribution and disturbation of a potentially great and purportedly short essay, whose time has come.
xhomerx10
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2576
Merit: 3397


Go! BTC Go!


View Profile
September 15, 2020, 02:19:11 AM
Last edit: September 15, 2020, 03:02:33 AM by xhomerx10
Merited by vapourminer (1), Hueristic (1), JayJuanGee (1)

Working on it...

 Transferring 10 MB of data uses about the amount of energy in a AA battery which is 0.0039 kWh
Here are the top ten viewed YouTube music videos and the number of times they were viewed (while I compiled this tonight).

Song_Title_Artist__Uniform_Resource_Locator__Number_of_Views_
DespacitoLuis_Fonsi_ft._Daddy_Yankeehttps://youtu.be/kJQP7kiw5Fk6965149726
Baby_SharkPINKFONGhttps://youtu.be/XqZsoesa55w6555048616
Shape_of_YouEd_Sheeranhttps://youtu.be/JGwWNGJdvx84974976171
See_You_AgainWiz_Khalifa_ft._Charlie_Puthhttps://youtu.be/RgKAFK5djSk4721137015
Uptown_FunkMark_Ronson_ft._Bruno_Marshttps://youtu.be/OPf0YbXqDm03945458571
Gangnam_Style_PSYhttps://youtu.be/9bZkp7q19f03782347210
SorryJustin_Bieberhttps://youtu.be/fRh_vgS2dFE3338412458
SugarMaroon_5https://youtu.be/09R8_2nJtjg3281040028
RoarKaty_Perryhttps://youtu.be/CevxZvSJLk83172242295
Thinking_Out_LoudEd_Sheeranhttps://youtu.be/lp-EO5I60KA3072397098

 The average video play time is ~ 4 minutes which equates to about 40 MB of data transfer per video per view.
The total number of views for the 10 songs above is 43808209188.
This translates to 683408063.3328 kWh of energy for the data transfer alone.  

 I'm just warming up.  Thanks for the confidence and the pressure JJG, it will help me to achieve the optimal level of arousal required to complete my mission.

 Wait, should I even bother to include data transfer for pool mining or just the CPU/GPU/FPGA/ASIC power required for hashing?

  Don't worry @Hueristic.  I'll use the network hash rate in my calculation to ensure the energy usage from all miners is included.

edit: SMF seems to insert superfluous breaks when translating BBcode to HTML.
edit2: Wow.  Tables really suck in BBcode.
edit3:  Angry

jojo69
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1946
Merit: 2604


no FOMO


View Profile
September 15, 2020, 02:29:02 AM

megadeth
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 285
Merit: 251

bagholder since 2013


View Profile
September 15, 2020, 02:30:29 AM
Merited by JayJuanGee (1)

Very BIG evening update for the shrewd trader who is into the confirmed math and science of trading:

luv you proudhon. never change
Wexlike
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1444
Merit: 1051



View Profile
September 15, 2020, 02:48:59 AM

This translates to 683408063.3328 kWh of energy for the data transfer alone. 

I'm just warming up.  Thanks for the confidence and the pressure JJG, it will help me to achieve the optimal level of arousal required to complete my mission.

Wait, should I even bother to include data transfer for pool mining or just the CPU/GPU/FPGA/ASIC power required for hashing?

Don't worry @Hueristic.  I'll use the network hash rate in my calculation to ensure the energy usage from all miners is included.


Damn, that's the spirit - awesome !

I was thinking of only the power required to run the hash rate. But if transferring the block chain to thousands of different peers at a specific time (different sizes, varying amount of nodes, etc) makes an extra impact to the total power usage, it would be awesome to include it as well for the big picture.

My main idea is to have a given number to show how much raw power was put into building the blockchain, to show that it is not backed by nothing, but that we are building the new digital pyramids.
AlcoHoDL
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1106
Merit: 1195


Addicted to HoDLing!


View Profile
September 15, 2020, 02:50:41 AM
Merited by El duderino_ (3)

It's pAmping...

Proud, the Honey Badger must be!
Searing
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2646
Merit: 1359


Clueless!


View Profile
September 15, 2020, 02:59:58 AM

Sometimes you haiku.
Other times your ass gets haiku'ed.
Regardless, I hodl.









So the 'purpose' of WO now is to 'taunt' me with 'un-obtainable Women', as well as NOT having the 'huge' pump in BTC/Crypto prices that I desired at the

beginning of this year of 2020. Sad

damn, that is just mean...I mean give me a BTC/Crypto 'pump' to $15k ...and I'd give it a pass...but BOTH....cruel, WO, cruel indeed....Sad

(maybe I need a Cat...Cat people tell me life is better with a Cat...at least you give up the idea of any control in the household with a Cat)...

Brad

 Better get checked for allergies first.  Life with cat if you're allergic sucks ass - trust me.


yeah..allergic to cats.....hot girls allergic to me...the wheel of FUD and despair continues...... ;(

can't even engage in my POW miner addiction anymore of any BTC/Crypto in that makes little sense these days...

oh well, I have WO right? So I'm well adjusted right?
Wexlike
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1444
Merit: 1051



View Profile
September 15, 2020, 03:10:02 AM

xhomerx10, I created a new thread to answer the raw power used to build the Bitcoin blockchain so the discussion won't get buried under thousand of pages.

Would be great if you could contribute your work there !

Here's the thread:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5275873.new#new
Hueristic
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2548
Merit: 1796


Doomed to see the future and unable to prevent it


View Profile
September 15, 2020, 03:40:40 AM
Merited by xhomerx10 (1), JayJuanGee (1)

Working on it...
Don't worry @Hueristic.  I'll use the network hash rate in my calculation to ensure the energy usage from all miners is included.

edit: SMF seems to insert superfluous breaks when translating BBcode to HTML.
edit2: Wow.  Tables really suck in BBcode.
edit3:  Angry



Yeah these tables are rough...

I have no Idea how you can differentiate between base systems, gpu miners, fpgas and asics over time. The overlap is huge and due to locations their profitability is widely varied so you would have to make massive assumptions. Literally this could take a person a lifetime to get within a small tolerance of error.

Not to mention it is widely believed satoshi (and others) used custom FPGAs and how those could be calculated is beyond me.
xhomerx10
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2576
Merit: 3397


Go! BTC Go!


View Profile
September 15, 2020, 03:48:38 AM
Merited by Hueristic (1)

Working on it...
Don't worry @Hueristic.  I'll use the network hash rate in my calculation to ensure the energy usage from all miners is included.

edit: SMF seems to insert superfluous breaks when translating BBcode to HTML.
edit2: Wow.  Tables really suck in BBcode.
edit3:  Angry



Yeah these tables are rough...

I have no Idea how you can differentiate between base systems, gpu miners, fpgas and asics over time. The overlap is huge and due to locations their profitability is widely varied so you would have to make massive assumptions. Literally this could take a person a lifetime to get within a small tolerance of error.

Not to mention it is widely believed satoshi (and others) used custom FPGAs and how those could be calculated is beyond me.

 It's certainly going to take a while to compile the data we'll need but I think we're going to find that recent mining of blocks far outweighs earlier mining in terms of the power requirement.  My hope is that it will be enough of a difference to make the error very small even with the assumptions that will have to be made.
Hueristic
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2548
Merit: 1796


Doomed to see the future and unable to prevent it


View Profile
September 15, 2020, 03:51:40 AM
Merited by El duderino_ (3), JayJuanGee (1)

It's certainly going to take a while to compile the data we'll need but I think we're going to find that recent mining of blocks far outweighs earlier mining in terms of the power requirement.  My hope is that it will be enough of a difference to make the error very small even with the assumptions that will have to be made.


I've been dealing with migraines for awhile now and just trying to think on this is making my head hurt,

Good luck man, I can't wait to see what you come up with! Smiley
philipma1957
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2856
Merit: 2843



View Profile
September 15, 2020, 04:23:06 AM
Last edit: September 15, 2020, 04:34:48 AM by philipma1957
Merited by xhomerx10 (1), Hueristic (1)

It's certainly going to take a while to compile the data we'll need but I think we're going to find that recent mining of blocks far outweighs earlier mining in terms of the power requirement.  My hope is that it will be enough of a difference to make the error very small even with the assumptions that will have to be made.


I've been dealing with migraines for awhile now and just trying to think on this is making my head hurt,

Good luck man, I can't wait to see what you come up with! Smiley

we use 5000 to 7000 megawatts an hour for sept 14 2020

which is 120,000 to 168,000 megawatts a day.

based this on

135eh at 50 watts a th that is 6750megawatts an hour

second estimate based on

135eh at 40 watts a th that is 5400 megawatts. an hour.


add five percent for servers, cooling,and network resources.

maybe 5400+270=.  5670 low
and.     6750+ 330= 7100 high


lots of power.


now lazy sloppy number for all time is 168,000/2 x days we mined and i think it will be too high.
i also think 120000/2 x days we mined is too high.

i get those long estimates by using 0 for day one and 168,000 for today which gives an average of 84,000

or the lower one of 0 + 120,000= 120,000/2 = 60000

i am thinking the life long estimates will not be correct. at all.

but the estimate for today sept 14 is decent.
JayJuanGee
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2450
Merit: 3470


How much alt coin diversification is needed? 0%?


View Profile
September 15, 2020, 05:03:04 AM

Don't worry @Hueristic.  I'll use the network hash rate in my calculation to ensure the energy usage from all miners is included.

Whoaza!!!  Shocked

I am feeling muchos MOAR buddenings of warm and fuzzie tingilies #nohomo finding out no miner left uncalculated, whether s/he, [they](sic), it be block winner or no.   Wink



[earlier contributions edited out]


......


.......

yeah..allergic to cats.....hot girls allergic to me...the wheel of FUD and despair continues...... ;(

I am glad that this back and forth brainstorming session seems to be working towards identifying the problem (which therefore should lead to potential solutions).

In other words, the problem does not appear to be internal to you, Searing.  It's either las chiquitas or perhaps there is some kind of application that you would be able to apply towards solving such real world issues.

In other words, you should be able to employ some of your BTC towards obtaining some kind of remedy, such as a powder, oil or pheromone that causes las chiquitas to magnetize towards you rather than against you... changing the gravitation field or otherwise moving celestial bodies, if you get what I am saying...  (Disclaimer: Surely, don't go full bill cosby on us, only a mild form of bill cosby (Pg-13 form), if necessary, will do).  

Check back in with the WO brainstormers (advisors) once you have acquired such products (not the snake-oil ones) and attempted applying such solutions towards one or more real life chiquitas.  There might be a movie in this.
BobLawblaw
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 356
Merit: 2753


Mostly recovered former angry guy


View Profile
September 15, 2020, 05:46:06 AM
Merited by El duderino_ (2)

Observing some profit taking in the $10.7k range. Looks like we may be in for a bit of sideways action before $11k.

I give it 24 hours.
Cryptotourist
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 770
Merit: 573


Homo Sapiens Bitcoinerthalensis


View Profile
September 15, 2020, 06:24:49 AM

I suppose that that is the difference between a slut and a whore. ;-)

Bingo!

A whore does it for money. She might enjoy or she might not. If it's a male whore - most likely not.
Whereas being a slut, male or female, you do it for the pleasure of things, and the chances of actually enjoying it are exponential.
If you're a whore and a slut, I guess that makes you a model, and I'm no model. Tongue



Speaking of models, where is my shorting star?
I swayed yesterday upon her post, but decided to give it a pass.
SwayStar123
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 782
Merit: 112

Be decentralized, be sovryn


View Profile
September 15, 2020, 06:38:21 AM

Just a reminder: This is an extraordinary shorting opportunity. The higher the leverage the better based on my analysis.

Stop trying to trick naive noobs into parting with their money proudhon. It’s not cool!

I'm doing a great service using the best sources and confirmed analysis using science and maths.

Im waiting to short 10672-10680 but dont all in short 100x lmfao your guarenteed to get rekt

caught nearly the exact top(for now anyway Tongue)! nice

Im in around 60% profit right now, will take some profit to cover fees in case we go back to my entry to stop me out (moved stop to entry)

  We're back at your entry point again.  Try it now!

 


Who cares, I already took profit, it was a short term trade anyway
Karartma1
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2030
Merit: 1273


Be Revolutionary or Die Trying


View Profile WWW
September 15, 2020, 06:38:31 AM

Observing some profit taking in the $10.7k range. Looks like we may be in for a bit of sideways action before $11k.

I give it 24 hours.
Unless some wild Bart Simpson movements will move it up or down in minutes. Let's wait 24 hours: confirmed.
SwayStar123
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 782
Merit: 112

Be decentralized, be sovryn


View Profile
September 15, 2020, 06:42:18 AM

[...] caught nearly the exact top(for now anyway Tongue)! nice

Im in around 60% profit right now, will take some profit to cover fees in case we go back to my entry to stop me out (moved stop to entry)

Playing with FIRE (not the early retirement one). But good luck to you SS123, nice catch.

How am I playing with fire? I already took profits and set my stoploss as such I cannot lose money anymore, and even if I hadn't caught the top, when my stoploss hit I would've only lost 1%

Last of the V8s
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1652
Merit: 4385


Be a bank


View Profile
September 15, 2020, 06:43:28 AM

An interesting question just popped in my mind:
How much kWh was used to create the current Blockchain?
Should be somehow possible to calculate it based on the given mining hardware and mining difficulty.

https://twitter.com/blockbain/status/1305539345991036933



a fair few
Pages: « 1 ... 27202 27203 27204 27205 27206 27207 27208 27209 27210 27211 27212 27213 27214 27215 27216 27217 27218 27219 27220 27221 27222 27223 27224 27225 27226 27227 27228 27229 27230 27231 27232 27233 27234 27235 27236 27237 27238 27239 27240 27241 27242 27243 27244 27245 27246 27247 27248 27249 27250 27251 [27252] 27253 27254 27255 27256 27257 27258 27259 27260 27261 27262 27263 27264 27265 27266 27267 27268 27269 27270 27271 27272 27273 27274 27275 27276 27277 27278 27279 27280 27281 27282 27283 27284 27285 27286 27287 27288 27289 27290 27291 27292 27293 27294 27295 27296 27297 27298 27299 27300 27301 27302 ... 27612 »
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!