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Author Topic: Statement about the suspect of recent Bitcoinica hack  (Read 124462 times)
runlinux
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August 03, 2012, 02:47:26 PM
 #1041

Yup, same here...

Haven't had a chance to look at it though.

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zhoutong
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August 03, 2012, 02:49:34 PM
 #1042

Anyone else received the email from Zhou Tong about Bitcoinica too?

I don't have everyone's email address. For those of you who didn't receive the email, you can view the content here:

http://nameterrific.createsend5.com/t/ViewEmail/j/7716A98B996695CD

(Sorry for the "nameterrific" subdomain. I don't have a proper Campaign Monitor account for myself. The email addresses will NOT be used for NameTerrific marketing.)

Founder of NameTerrific (https://www.nameterrific.com/). Co-founder of CoinJar (https://coinjar.io/)

Donations for my future Bitcoin projects: 19Uk3tiD5XkBcmHyQYhJxp9QHoub7RosVb
dishwara
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August 03, 2012, 03:09:25 PM
 #1043

We're unable to find the email you've requested. Please check your URL and try again.
John (John K.)
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Will read PM's. Have more time lately


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August 03, 2012, 03:13:28 PM
 #1044

We're unable to find the email you've requested. Please check your URL and try again.
Use that link above, or read it here (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=97502.msg1076020#msg1076020) and here ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=98349.0)

My BTC Tip Jar: 1Pgvfy19uwtYe5o9dg3zZsAjgCPt3XZqz9 , GPG ID: B3AAEEB0 ,OTC ID: johnthedong
Escrow service is available on a case by case basis! (PM Me to verify I'm the escrow!)

OneEyed
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August 03, 2012, 03:31:11 PM
 #1045

Bitcoinica experienced the third major hack on July 12, 2012. According to Bitcoinica's announcement, 40,000 BTC and $40,000 were stolen.

[…]

Chen Jianhai has agreed to return at least $140,000 and 20,000 BTC under the condition that Bitcoinica LP will not start a police investigation about the hack. I have made it clear to him that I will have zero tolerance on this wrong-doing and if the promised amount is not paid back, I will make his identifiable information available to the police, and possibly public.

Out of curiosity: could you offer him this guarantee? Did you receive this guarantee from Bitcoinica? According to Tihan Seale, none of the board of the directors member was moving or talking, so whose decision was it?

Does this also mean that you do not intend to collaborate with the investigators should a legal action be started, and that you will withhold the identifiable information you possess about Chen Jianhai while you know that he committed the crime and did not return the whole stolen property (especially given today Bitcoin exchange rates) belonging to Bitcoinica creditors? Wouldn't that make you an accessory of the crime?

Quote from: Wikipedia: Accessory (legal term)
To be convicted of an accessory charge, the accused must generally be proved to have had actual knowledge that a crime was going to be, or had been, committed. Furthermore, there must be proof that the accessory knew that his or her action, or inaction, was helping the criminals commit the crime, or evade detection, or escape.

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August 03, 2012, 03:34:26 PM
 #1046

Well, first of all we can forget the alter-ego story. Tihan Seale has confirmed that Zhou indeed is who he says he is, and I see no reason why he should lie.

Does the community accept Tihan Seale as an upstanding member of the community? If so I guess we can accept that ZT is indeed who he says he is?

If the community does accept this, then do the people who believe ZT not to be who he says he is have anything to say to the matter?

Gavin has verified Tihan to be what he says he is, and if Gavin isn't an upstanding member of the community we're in a lot of trouble.


Yes, hence my thread. Dr. Kevin Lim PhD = Zhou Tong.

After you read the OP, let me know exactly which dot I didn't connect.

~Bruno~


The dot that was a stretch to connect was sgitcoin = sgbitcoin. if you do that one, then stevejobs807 = steve_bobs. Connecting them all way, Dr. Kevin Lim PhD = Patrick Strateman. (which at this point, wouldn't even surprise me).

sgitcoin = sgbitcoin is my horse, whilst stevejobs807 = steve_bobs is some others, albeit I use BlowBobs when in an alpaca state of mind.

Granted, sgitcoin = sgbitcoin is somewhat of a stretch, but considering that changing the last two letters of a Lithuanian surname (as) to the common Polish surname ending (i), would not change the fact that the two differently named entities are related when there's mounting evidence linking the two more directly, excluding any two email addresses similarity owned by both.

Connecting Kevin to Patrick would be considered a stretch with such flimsy (neat word!) proof.

Thanks for the comment, bud.

 ~Bruno~
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August 03, 2012, 03:37:04 PM
 #1047

Bitcoinica experienced the third major hack on July 12, 2012. According to Bitcoinica's announcement, 40,000 BTC and $40,000 were stolen.

[…]

Chen Jianhai has agreed to return at least $140,000 and 20,000 BTC under the condition that Bitcoinica LP will not start a police investigation about the hack. I have made it clear to him that I will have zero tolerance on this wrong-doing and if the promised amount is not paid back, I will make his identifiable information available to the police, and possibly public.

Out of curiosity: could you offer him this guarantee? Did you receive this guarantee from Bitcoinica? According to Tihan Seale, none of the board of the directors member was moving or talking, so whose decision was it?

Does this also mean that you do not intend to collaborate with the investigators should a legal action be started, and that you will withhold the identifiable information you possess about Chen Jianhai while you know that he committed the crime and did not return the whole stolen property (especially given today Bitcoin exchange rates) belonging to Bitcoinica creditors? Wouldn't that make you an accessory of the crime?

Quote from: Wikipedia: Accessory (legal term)
To be convicted of an accessory charge, the accused must generally be proved to have had actual knowledge that a crime was going to be, or had been, committed. Furthermore, there must be proof that the accessory knew that his or her action, or inaction, was helping the criminals commit the crime, or evade detection, or escape.

Obviously, I can't. But I sort of made up his mind for him. Even if police investigation has to take place, the punishment will be much less if he can return majority of the funds in a reasonable timeframe.

I believe that in any case I have no liability for offering him this guarantee, regardless of the outcome. I just want the money back, more than anything else. I have never said that I would not co-operate with any investigation.

EDIT:

For me, there's no trust or whatsoever with Chen Jianhai. In my previous dealing with him, all was about his experience in credit card fraud. I acted like sort of a journalist who paid some insiders to know truths.

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August 03, 2012, 04:43:18 PM
 #1048

Bitcoinica experienced the third major hack on July 12, 2012. According to Bitcoinica's announcement, 40,000 BTC and $40,000 were stolen.

[…]

Chen Jianhai has agreed to return at least $140,000 and 20,000 BTC under the condition that Bitcoinica LP will not start a police investigation about the hack. I have made it clear to him that I will have zero tolerance on this wrong-doing and if the promised amount is not paid back, I will make his identifiable information available to the police, and possibly public.

Out of curiosity: could you offer him this guarantee? Did you receive this guarantee from Bitcoinica? According to Tihan Seale, none of the board of the directors member was moving or talking, so whose decision was it?

Does this also mean that you do not intend to collaborate with the investigators should a legal action be started, and that you will withhold the identifiable information you possess about Chen Jianhai while you know that he committed the crime and did not return the whole stolen property (especially given today Bitcoin exchange rates) belonging to Bitcoinica creditors? Wouldn't that make you an accessory of the crime?

Quote from: Wikipedia: Accessory (legal term)
To be convicted of an accessory charge, the accused must generally be proved to have had actual knowledge that a crime was going to be, or had been, committed. Furthermore, there must be proof that the accessory knew that his or her action, or inaction, was helping the criminals commit the crime, or evade detection, or escape.

Obviously, I can't. But I sort of made up his mind for him. Even if police investigation has to take place, the punishment will be much less if he can return majority of the funds in a reasonable timeframe.

I believe that in any case I have no liability for offering him this guarantee, regardless of the outcome. I just want the money back, more than anything else. I have never said that I would not co-operate with any investigation.

EDIT:

For me, there's no trust or whatsoever with Chen Jianhai. In my previous dealing with him, all was about his experience in credit card fraud. I acted like sort of a journalist who paid some insiders to know truths.

If you get the money back, what will you do with it? Pay back customers, or give it to the Intersango boys?

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August 04, 2012, 11:10:44 AM
 #1049

if he can return majority of the funds in a reasonable timeframe.
Hows that going?


BB.
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August 04, 2012, 01:03:25 PM
 #1050

I, for one, wanted to puke at the shameless plugs in that email zhoutong,.

Oh, yeah, where's the damn money? All I see is a bunch more bullshit, and no money.

You perpetuate the joke of a reputation you've developed for yourself. Your whining in that letter was pathetic.

Shut up, and return the stolen money.


Mine at the Maza Club! with ShastaFarEye Prospectors! Mazacoin PPS & P2pool mining, and more services coming soon!
Maza Means Money! Check yours at the mazacha.in!

Please contact me  on my  OTC registered GPG (A54E87F2) Key's email address or guruvan@shastafareye.net  and encrypt all correspondence.
aq
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August 04, 2012, 01:17:45 PM
 #1051

I, for one, wanted to puke at the shameless plugs in that email zhoutong,.

Oh, yeah, where's the damn money? All I see is a bunch more bullshit, and no money.

You perpetuate the joke of a reputation you've developed for yourself. Your whining in that letter was pathetic.

Shut up, and return the stolen money.
Well, both ZT and to some extent Amir (genjix) wanted to make a fast pay back of the funds, which has been prevented by Donald and Patrick. So, if ZT offer to handle this would have not been denied by the this incapable consultancy, the theft would not have happened, because we would have had our money back since ages.
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August 04, 2012, 01:19:45 PM
 #1052

Zouthong: Any update about the claim database backup ? I don't want to bring bad luck, but many mistakes have been made in the past, so maybe it would be a good thing to send this precious backup to several trustworthy persons.
BTW I wanted to thank you for your last email, I found it very moving. I really hope the best for you, it's a shame you're in the front line of this mess, but it's all of your honor to keep trying to sort it out.
Once you'll have overcome this shitstorm, I believe you'll be able to take some good and well deserved rest Smiley
Cheers

“We build but to tear down. Most of our work and resource is squandered. Our onward march is marked by devastation. Everywhere there is an appalling loss of time, effort and life. A cheerless view, but true"
“Most certainly, some planets are not inhabited, but others are, and among these there must exist life under all conditions and phases of development.”

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August 04, 2012, 07:14:20 PM
 #1053

I just leave it here ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOS7-vfFNJQ#t=0m55

Donate me) 16f6iWHHkVEnDReeBQPT9GwCNwUfPTXrp2
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August 04, 2012, 07:37:58 PM
 #1054

Zouthong: Any update about the claim database backup ? I don't want to bring bad luck, but many mistakes have been made in the past, so maybe it would be a good thing to send this precious backup to several trustworthy persons.
BTW I wanted to thank you for your last email, I found it very moving. I really hope the best for you, it's a shame you're in the front line of this mess, but it's all of your honor to keep trying to sort it out.
Once you'll have overcome this shitstorm, I believe you'll be able to take some good and well deserved rest Smiley
Cheers

+1

May I suggest myfreecams.com? It'll do Boy Wonder's body wonder.

~Bruno~
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August 04, 2012, 08:20:27 PM
 #1055

Zhou Tong: Why were there NO BACKUPS of the database?  When I make a website of ANY caliber, I always keep a backup.  I'll save a backup on multiple hard drives on my server so the chance of losing all three or four copies is almost zero.  Even when writing a long email to someone, I'll write it in notepad and save it to my desktop every couple paragraphs because it's SO frustrating to lose even an hour of work on something. 

When your website had passed the $1,000,000 volume mark, you don't think it would have been a good idea to back up your database?Huh

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August 04, 2012, 08:25:31 PM
 #1056

They did have a backup..in the same place so it isn't really a backup heh.

The forums have better backup practices than they did.

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August 04, 2012, 08:26:02 PM
 #1057

Zhou Tong: Why were there NO BACKUPS of the database?  When I make a website of ANY caliber, I always keep a backup.  I'll save a backup on multiple hard drives on my server so the chance of losing all three or four copies is almost zero.  Even when writing a long email to someone, I'll write it in notepad and save it to my desktop every couple paragraphs because it's SO frustrating to lose even an hour of work on something. 

When your website had passed the $1,000,000 volume mark, you don't think it would have been a good idea to back up your database?Huh
Why don't you read the 1000000000 posts about this subject? And BTW, he had backups in cloud, but the hacker deleted those also. I guess ZT learnt that some off-site backups would have been better.
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August 04, 2012, 08:46:08 PM
 #1058

Zhou Tong: Why were there NO BACKUPS of the database?  When I make a website of ANY caliber, I always keep a backup.  I'll save a backup on multiple hard drives on my server so the chance of losing all three or four copies is almost zero.  Even when writing a long email to someone, I'll write it in notepad and save it to my desktop every couple paragraphs because it's SO frustrating to lose even an hour of work on something. 

When your website had passed the $1,000,000 volume mark, you don't think it would have been a good idea to back up your database?Huh
THIS

This and the last hack  (the one about the btc and $ that were on mtgox) is why i think the bitcoinica thing is a epic scam.

I understand the first hack, shit happens, but the no backup and the last hack (lol, why the hell did they keep money on an exchange instead of a cold storage??) are SUSPECT.

Hell, i have much much much less btc and i have better backups than them!
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August 04, 2012, 11:02:46 PM
 #1059

Zhou Tong: Why were there NO BACKUPS of the database?  When I make a website of ANY caliber, I always keep a backup.  I'll save a backup on multiple hard drives on my server so the chance of losing all three or four copies is almost zero.  Even when writing a long email to someone, I'll write it in notepad and save it to my desktop every couple paragraphs because it's SO frustrating to lose even an hour of work on something.  

When your website had passed the $1,000,000 volume mark, you don't think it would have been a good idea to back up your database?Huh
THIS

This and the last hack  (the one about the btc and $ that were on mtgox) is why i think the bitcoinica thing is a epic scam.

I understand the first hack, shit happens, but the no backup and the last hack (lol, why the hell did they keep money on an exchange instead of a cold storage??) are SUSPECT.

Hell, i have much much much less btc and i have better backups than them!

That and the fact that they didn't bother enabling 2factor/yubikey authentication on MtGox nor LastPass (where they kept the master password). They even manually raised the withdrawal limits to the 40K max on the MtGox account. Probably MtGox sent them a couple of yubikeys for free too. (I got one after my account reached 1K). When you are dealing with large amounts of other peoples cash you would think the thought of properly securing it should have crossed their minds.
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August 05, 2012, 01:28:53 AM
 #1060

Zhou Tong: Why were there NO BACKUPS of the database?  When I make a website of ANY caliber, I always keep a backup.  I'll save a backup on multiple hard drives on my server so the chance of losing all three or four copies is almost zero.  Even when writing a long email to someone, I'll write it in notepad and save it to my desktop every couple paragraphs because it's SO frustrating to lose even an hour of work on something.  

When your website had passed the $1,000,000 volume mark, you don't think it would have been a good idea to back up your database?Huh
THIS

This and the last hack  (the one about the btc and $ that were on mtgox) is why i think the bitcoinica thing is a epic scam.

I understand the first hack, shit happens, but the no backup and the last hack (lol, why the hell did they keep money on an exchange instead of a cold storage??) are SUSPECT.

Hell, i have much much much less btc and i have better backups than them!

That and the fact that they didn't bother enabling 2factor/yubikey authentication on MtGox nor LastPass (where they kept the master password). They even manually raised the withdrawal limits to the 40K max on the MtGox account. Probably MtGox sent them a couple of yubikeys for free too. (I got one after my account reached 1K). When you are dealing with large amounts of other peoples cash you would think the thought of properly securing it should have crossed their minds.

^THIS

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