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Author Topic: Statement about the suspect of recent Bitcoinica hack  (Read 124555 times)
tbcoin
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July 29, 2012, 10:06:49 PM
 #461

The funds were sent to the Bitcoin address as requested: http://blockchain.info/address/1FqqBZnemCrcCDbz57Nk7LHLCN42hCHXEV.

Thank you Zhou for your cooperation.

I was asked by some of the creditors and interest holders in Bitcoinica, LP to broker this transaction. Steps are being taken to safely transfer the funds to Bitcoinica, LP so they may be distributed in a fair and expeditious manner to claimants.

Thank you,
Patrick Murck
Principal | Engage Legal PLLC

The address presumably indicated by Patrick Murck was used twice before receive the 15,000 BTC. This indicate the address was not produced exclusively to receive the "stolen funds".

Quote
3023856a550ebb4e9b79a5e80af926f608fddee0749648e70ee3a01bc0f4592c 2012-07-29 07:31:43

14cwNLGkm5PWj5ghdwxs8J84VuryU7h5tq

12FWKX4v6auTnzN1xmxji8SdmtcEC5QdCx

    1FqqBZnemCrcCDbz57Nk7LHLCN42hCHXEV

6.461 BTC

4f47dcd9db5518dc829b9fb6ab0f99f33e54032edc4b508e0deb1f702dcb36b4 2012-07-27 20:41:31

1MSvjiRBFd4WgJusnQWZoyxjfcxbRZwjtE

    1FqqBZnemCrcCDbz57Nk7LHLCN42hCHXEV

0.1 BTC

http://blockchain.info/address/1FqqBZnemCrcCDbz57Nk7LHLCN42hCHXEV

and...

Sorry for my bad english Wink
Bitcoin card for deposit and payment + Little POS
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Once a transaction has 6 confirmations, it is extremely unlikely that an attacker without at least 50% of the network's computation power would be able to reverse it.
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defxor
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July 29, 2012, 10:31:07 PM
 #462

It doesn't fit in my thinking at all. So the screenshot is either fake, or taken by someone who has actually dealt with Chen Jianhai.

Occam's Razor says that the simplest explanation is neither that someone, for no reason, created a screenshot where your QQ-account would start selling LR that when the transactions were made turned out to come from the LR account you yourself stated that the hacker created. Nor is the simplest explanation that you now all of a sudden would start to claim that "Chen" has hacked your QQ account to do deals.

The simplest explanation is that you didn't expect that someone who bought LR from you, the transactions you've so far claimed are completely unrelated and "for a friend", would match up the LR account to information released much later by aurumxchange.

* The Liberty Reserve account used by the hacker is U9236056.

The $40,000 I exchanged at AurumXchange was indeed from a friend. Later I can also post proof that I exchanged another $30,000 at other exchanges during the same period. The total amount far exceeds the stolen amount claimed in the OP. My own Liberty Reserve account number is U7097615.

The hacker registered a Liberty Reserve account U9236056 at Jul 12, 2012 9:42 PM.

vs

I am the owner of www.cnbtcnews.com. I introduce bitcoin to chinese people.
The evidence is from one person of my qq group.
zhoutong sell LR, and he buy LR from zhoutong.

How does this person know for sure Zhou Thong was behind U9236056?

He buy LR from zhoutong ,zhoutong show the LR account and the total fund is $23439.57.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudologia_fantastica

Select quotes:

Quote
The stories told are not entirely improbable and often have some element of truth. They are not a manifestation of delusion or some broader type of psychosis: upon confrontation, the teller can admit them to be untrue, even if unwillingly.

Quote
The stories told tend toward presenting the liar favorably. For example, the person might be presented as being fantastically brave, knowing or being related to many famous people.

Quote
There are many consequences of being a pathological liar. Due to lack of trust, most pathological liars' relationships and friendships fail. If the disease continues to progress, lying could become so severe as to cause legal problems, including but not limited to fraud.
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July 29, 2012, 10:38:03 PM
 #463


The simplest explanation is that you didn't expect that someone who bought LR from you, the transactions you've so far claimed are completely unrelated and "for a friend", would match up the LR account to information released much later by aurumxchange.


So, I have done a deal "for a friend" on AurumXchange using my own account.

And I have also done a deal "for a friend" on QQ using a friend's account?

Both happened before I had any clue of the investigation.

I did the deals, but all in much larger amounts with my own account.

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RoloTonyBrownTown
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July 29, 2012, 10:39:09 PM
 #464

Well as far as I'm concerned there's still zero evidence that thus Chen person even exists.    And now, just to add to the convenience, Zhou is refunding the USD from his own accounts.

Look, if in the future this mystery Chen person is actually arrested for this then I'll happily apologise to Zhou for doubting him, but as things stand now I find that extremely unlikely to happen.  

Is it possible that Zhou is telling the truth, sure, but from all the evidence presented thus far that just simply isn't the likely scenario I'm afraid.    

If all this fantastical stuff actually IS true then the way its gone down is extremely unfortunate for Zhou, as most of the evidence hes posting to exonerate himself just makes him look more guilty.

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July 29, 2012, 10:48:28 PM
 #465

It doesn't fit in my thinking at all. So the screenshot is either fake, or taken by someone who has actually dealt with Chen Jianhai.

Occam's Razor says that

Anyone using that as a postulate in a theorem clearly doesn't actually 'get' Occam's Razor.

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July 29, 2012, 11:04:23 PM
 #466

It doesn't fit in my thinking at all. So the screenshot is either fake, or taken by someone who has actually dealt with Chen Jianhai.

Occam's Razor says that

Anyone using that as a postulate in a theorem clearly doesn't actually 'get' Occam's Razor.

Occam's Razor from wiki:

Quote
Overview

The principle is often incorrectly summarized as "other things being equal, a simpler explanation is better than a more complex one." In practice, the application of the principle often shifts the burden of proof in a discussion.[a] The razor asserts that one should proceed to simpler theories until simplicity can be traded for greater explanatory power. The simplest available theory need not be most accurate. Philosophers point out also that the exact meaning of simplest may be nuanced.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam%27s_razor
Gareth Nelson
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July 29, 2012, 11:06:34 PM
 #467

I have sent 15,000 BTC to an address provided by Patrick Murck.

He or one of his clients will later confirm the receipt of the funds and also the escrow/representation relationship.

The funds were sent to the Bitcoin address as requested: http://blockchain.info/address/1FqqBZnemCrcCDbz57Nk7LHLCN42hCHXEV.

Thank you Zhou for your cooperation.

I was asked by some of the creditors and interest holders in Bitcoinica, LP to broker this transaction. Steps are being taken to safely transfer the funds to Bitcoinica, LP so they may be distributed in a fair and expeditious manner to claimants.

Thank you,
Patrick Murck
Principal | Engage Legal PLLC

I'm just going to comment here to say "Yes, this really is our attorney at BitInstant, and he is a trustworthy guy".

Either Patrick, myself or Charlie will post here in public once the funds have been turned over to the appropriate entity, but for now they are in safe hands with a licensed attorney (Patrick) and any creditors should feel free to call up his firm at Engage Legal if they have any concerns.
kgo
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July 29, 2012, 11:08:05 PM
 #468

Well as far as I'm concerned there's still zero evidence that thus Chen person even exists.    And now, just to add to the convenience, Zhou is refunding the USD from his own accounts.

Look, if in the future this mystery Chen person is actually arrested for this then I'll happily apologise to Zhou for doubting him, but as things stand now I find that extremely unlikely to happen.  

Is it possible that Zhou is telling the truth, sure, but from all the evidence presented thus far that just simply isn't the likely scenario I'm afraid.    

If all this fantastical stuff actually IS true then the way its gone down is extremely unfortunate for Zhou, as most of the evidence hes posting to exonerate himself just makes him look more guilty.

And I can't believe no-one has mentioned this yet, but even if I knew a multi-millionaire gangster was responsible I wouldn't put his name on a public forum.  Such a criminal wouldn't have a problem putting a hit on me or my family members.
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July 29, 2012, 11:28:34 PM
 #469

So, I have done a deal "for a friend" on AurumXchange using my own account.

And I have also done a deal "for a friend" on QQ using a friend's account?

Both happened before I had any clue of the investigation.

I did the deals, but all in much larger amounts with my own account.

So, this deal you did with a "friend's" account just happens to be the same account as "the hacker" created? I'm sorry, but that explanation can't even begin to satisfy your own quest for consonance.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance#The_Belief_Disconfirmation_Paradigm

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July 29, 2012, 11:31:45 PM
 #470

Anyone using that as a postulate in a theorem clearly doesn't actually 'get' Occam's Razor.

Or uses the popular version. I could've stated that in science the hypothesis requiring the least amount of free variables is likely to be correct, I'm just not sure that would've made the point clearer.

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July 29, 2012, 11:39:38 PM
 #471

I have sent 15,000 BTC to an address provided by Patrick Murck.

He or one of his clients will later confirm the receipt of the funds and also the escrow/representation relationship.

The funds were sent to the Bitcoin address as requested: http://blockchain.info/address/1FqqBZnemCrcCDbz57Nk7LHLCN42hCHXEV.

Thank you Zhou for your cooperation.

I was asked by some of the creditors and interest holders in Bitcoinica, LP to broker this transaction. Steps are being taken to safely transfer the funds to Bitcoinica, LP so they may be distributed in a fair and expeditious manner to claimants.

Thank you,
Patrick Murck
Principal | Engage Legal PLLC

I'm just going to comment here to say "Yes, this really is our attorney at BitInstant, and he is a trustworthy guy".

Either Patrick, myself or Charlie will post here in public once the funds have been turned over to the appropriate entity, but for now they are in safe hands with a licensed attorney (Patrick) and any creditors should feel free to call up his firm at Engage Legal if they have any concerns.

Glad to see things finally moving in the good direction.
Thanks guys !

1BestioLC7YBVh8Q5LfH6RYURD6MrpP8y6
dree12
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July 29, 2012, 11:46:38 PM
 #472

It doesn't fit in my thinking at all. So the screenshot is either fake, or taken by someone who has actually dealt with Chen Jianhai.

Occam's Razor says that

Anyone using that as a postulate in a theorem clearly doesn't actually 'get' Occam's Razor.

Occam's Razor from wiki:

Quote
Overview

The principle is often incorrectly summarized as "other things being equal, a simpler explanation is better than a more complex one." In practice, the application of the principle often shifts the burden of proof in a discussion.[a] The razor asserts that one should proceed to simpler theories until simplicity can be traded for greater explanatory power. The simplest available theory need not be most accurate. Philosophers point out also that the exact meaning of simplest may be nuanced.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam%27s_razor
Occam's Razor states that one should proceed assuming the simpler explanation, not that the simpler explanation is correct. And in this case, the more complex explanation has better explanatory power: it explains why the BTC were sold.
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July 29, 2012, 11:49:16 PM
 #473

I have sent 15,000 BTC to an address provided by Patrick Murck.

He or one of his clients will later confirm the receipt of the funds and also the escrow/representation relationship.

The funds were sent to the Bitcoin address as requested: http://blockchain.info/address/1FqqBZnemCrcCDbz57Nk7LHLCN42hCHXEV.

Thank you Zhou for your cooperation.

I was asked by some of the creditors and interest holders in Bitcoinica, LP to broker this transaction. Steps are being taken to safely transfer the funds to Bitcoinica, LP so they may be distributed in a fair and expeditious manner to claimants.

Thank you,
Patrick Murck
Principal | Engage Legal PLLC

I'm just going to comment here to say "Yes, this really is our attorney at BitInstant, and he is a trustworthy guy".

Either Patrick, myself or Charlie will post here in public once the funds have been turned over to the appropriate entity, but for now they are in safe hands with a licensed attorney (Patrick) and any creditors should feel free to call up his firm at Engage Legal if they have any concerns.

I believe so. He handled this matter very professionally and I'm going to continue recovering the fiat money from the hackers.

Founder of NameTerrific (https://www.nameterrific.com/). Co-founder of CoinJar (https://coinjar.io/)

Donations for my future Bitcoin projects: 19Uk3tiD5XkBcmHyQYhJxp9QHoub7RosVb
dree12
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July 29, 2012, 11:50:24 PM
 #474

I have sent 15,000 BTC to an address provided by Patrick Murck.

He or one of his clients will later confirm the receipt of the funds and also the escrow/representation relationship.

The funds were sent to the Bitcoin address as requested: http://blockchain.info/address/1FqqBZnemCrcCDbz57Nk7LHLCN42hCHXEV.

Thank you Zhou for your cooperation.

I was asked by some of the creditors and interest holders in Bitcoinica, LP to broker this transaction. Steps are being taken to safely transfer the funds to Bitcoinica, LP so they may be distributed in a fair and expeditious manner to claimants.

Thank you,
Patrick Murck
Principal | Engage Legal PLLC

I'm just going to comment here to say "Yes, this really is our attorney at BitInstant, and he is a trustworthy guy".

Either Patrick, myself or Charlie will post here in public once the funds have been turned over to the appropriate entity, but for now they are in safe hands with a licensed attorney (Patrick) and any creditors should feel free to call up his firm at Engage Legal if they have any concerns.

I believe so. He handled this matter very professionally and I'm going to continue recovering the fiat money from the hackers.
Do you know the current state of the funds frozen at aurumxchange?
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July 29, 2012, 11:53:26 PM
 #475

I believe so. He handled this matter very professionally and I'm going to continue recovering the fiat money from the hackers.

Zhou,  
Since the Intersango team is actively blocking the recovery process,  can we convince you to take care of the claims process as you originally offered?

You can calculate everything,  and submit the information to Tihan / Patrick Murck for verification and actual payout.

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July 29, 2012, 11:56:54 PM
 #476

Zhou,  
Since the Intersango team is actively blocking the recovery process,  can we convince you to take care of the claims process as you originally offered?

Hey fox, can you watch these chickens for me? Thanks!
repentance
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July 30, 2012, 12:03:26 AM
 #477

Do you know the current state of the funds frozen at aurumxchange?

Bitcoinica MtGox account is also frozen. Knowing the amount of USD/BTC in limbo there would also be useful.

All I can say is that this is Bitcoin. I don't believe it until I see six confirmations.
RoloTonyBrownTown
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July 30, 2012, 12:41:45 AM
 #478

Zhou,  
Since the Intersango team is actively blocking the recovery process,  can we convince you to take care of the claims process as you originally offered?

Hey fox, can you watch these chickens for me? Thanks!

This as I see it is part of the problem.   People just want their money back, and it seems at this point really don't care about "justice" or whatever.    Memorydealers have a lot of money on the line here so I can understand why they don't want to rock the boat and will just swallow whatever story means they get their cash back the soonest.

It's a shame, but I can't really blame them.    I just hope that when phantom Chen pays everyone back (only partly it seems, what a stingey thieving millionaire he is), people will then actually start caring about the main issue here, which is someone stole hundreds of thousands of dollars and shouldn't be allowed to get away with it.

Someone get the police involved already, sheesh Roll Eyes

BitBuster
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July 30, 2012, 12:43:59 AM
 #479

Even though as a community we can determine Chen Jianhai to be the hacker,
No we cannot. You have provided no evidence of this person's existence at all, let alone their actions/implication in this theft. I invite you to do so now.

he hasn't been proven guilty legally yet. That will only happen when he faces a criminal charge.
He hasn't been proven to exist or guilty in any way either. You have invented this person to deflect blame from yourself. Again, I invite you to prove me wrong.

So intuitively I feel that the more the community criticizes me, the more I deserve to actually take possession of the funds and run away (because they penalized me like I did steal the funds, and I didn't).
This is a pathetic attempt of blackmail and to silence your critics without justification, with the retained promise of refund.

I believe so. He handled this matter very professionally and I'm going to continue recovering the fiat money from the hackers.
Well what a wonderful white knight you are. Please, tell me how you, a 14/15/16/17 year old:
1. Were able to gain audience with a prolific and dangerous criminal.
2. Prove his guilt and gain a confession.
3. Strip him of his latest theft.
4. Gain permission to publish his name and incriminate him publicly.
5. Still be able to walk.

I'm just going to comment here to say "Yes, this really is our attorney at BitInstant, and he is a trustworthy guy".... any creditors should feel free to call up his firm at Engage Legal if they have any concerns.
Please provide contact details for this firm and the specific people involved. Also please tell us how much of the recovered funds will be used to pay for whatever legal services have been contracted.


BB.
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July 30, 2012, 12:47:55 AM
 #480

Even though as a community we can determine Chen Jianhai to be the hacker,
No we cannot. You have provided no evidence of this person's existence at all, let alone their actions/implication in this theft. I invite you to do so now.

he hasn't been proven guilty legally yet. That will only happen when he faces a criminal charge.
He hasn't been proven to exist or guilty in any way either. You have invented this person to deflect blame from yourself. Again, I invite you to prove me wrong.

So intuitively I feel that the more the community criticizes me, the more I deserve to actually take possession of the funds and run away (because they penalized me like I did steal the funds, and I didn't).
This is a pathetic attempt of blackmail and to silence your critics without justification, with the retained promise of refund.

I believe so. He handled this matter very professionally and I'm going to continue recovering the fiat money from the hackers.
Well what a wonderful white knight you are. Please, tell me how you, a 14/15/16/17 year old:
1. Were able to gain audience with a prolific and dangerous criminal.
2. Prove his guilt and gain a confession.
3. Strip him of his latest theft.
4. Gain permission to publish his name and incriminate him publicly.
5. Still be able to walk.

I'm just going to comment here to say "Yes, this really is our attorney at BitInstant, and he is a trustworthy guy".... any creditors should feel free to call up his firm at Engage Legal if they have any concerns.
Please provide contact details for this firm and the specific people involved. Also please tell us how much of the recovered funds will be used to pay for whatever legal services have been contrahttp://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/84/Texas_FM_2062.svg/384px-Texas_FM_2062.svg.pngcted.


BB.
Will you cut it out? Some people have lost money here. We can deal with the "whodidit" thing later. This isn't helping anything.
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