Why I'm an atheist

[af_newbie]

Bitcoin is different from God.  I see the benefits of Bitcoin because I understand it (as I did in 2011, LOL).

Nobody can even define what God is.

Start with that.

PS. Just because you are ignorant of science, it is not an excuse to invent answers to your questions.

Thank you for defining God for us. As you defined, God is an Entity Who is so great that He is undefinable.

How can you assign any additional attributes to some abstract construct that cannot be even defined?

You don't even know what you believe and why?

God is undefined and non-detectable.  Just like anything that does not exist.

Here is what you are missing.

You define attributes to people you can't see, by looking at the results of their actions. For example. You received your hands and arms for free. But if you lose them, there isn't any replacing of them. But if science figures out how to make you regrow them, science will want a lot of money from you to give them back to you. And even then science will be using the machinery of God that God placed in the universe.

God has given your hands and arms to you free... at least the first time around. And when you consider the greatness of the universe that He gave you and all people, you can see that at least part of the definition of God is great love. And when you see that He continues His love for you even though you want to reject Him, you are being shown that the definition of God is great love that bends over backwards to love you.

We make all our machines from examples of the machinery of the universe. Machines have makers. Machine-universe was made by Someone Who was great enough to make such machinery. The definition of Someone great enough to make machine-universe is the definition that we have of God.

And you are not hearing me.  I do not see any results of God's actions.

What you are doing is building up your delusion to justify it.

There is absolutely no proof that the universe was made by "Someone".  Universe is the way it is just like sand dunes.
No active agent created them, yet they seem to be designed and made by someone.


Atoms in your body were naturally formed in an ancient supernova millions of light-years away from here.  You have evolved from a single cell organism, which also formed naturally.

Hard to believe, I know, but Earth is not flat an it is much older than billion of years, so is the universe.

[BADecker]

And you are not hearing me.  I do not see any results of God's actions.

What you are doing is building up your delusion to justify it.

There is absolutely no proof that the universe was made by "Someone".  Universe is the way it is just like sand dunes.
No active agent created them, yet they seem to be designed and made by someone.


Atoms in your body were naturally formed in an ancient supernova millions of light-years away from here.  You have evolved from a single cell organism, which also formed naturally.

Hard to believe, I know, but Earth is not flat an it is much older than billion of years, so is the universe.

If you were there to see the way the formation of atoms happened, then you would be a super-being, yourself. Or are you really stating that you were there, or that anyone else was there to see it - LOL. Nobody living was there to see it happen. The science that suggests what you are saying is only speculation, not fact, and not anywhere near fact.

Are you not hearing me? No matter the method whereby the universe was formed, the universe is a machine made up of machines. We know this because absolutely all of our machines are made from the examples of the operating machines of and in the universe. All of our human experience shows that machines have makers. Anybody Who can make a machine of machines like our universe, fits our definition of "God."

The universe is a machine. All machines have makers. The Maker of machine-universe fits our definition of "God."

The funny thing is that you are elevating yourself to god over God by suggesting that He doesn't exist. The science of machines and machine operation shows that God exists, simply in the fact of the existence of the universe as it is.

Are you not hearing me? Or is it that you can't really think at all?

[af_newbie]

And you are not hearing me.  I do not see any results of God's actions.

What you are doing is building up your delusion to justify it.

There is absolutely no proof that the universe was made by "Someone".  Universe is the way it is just like sand dunes.
No active agent created them, yet they seem to be designed and made by someone.


Atoms in your body were naturally formed in an ancient supernova millions of light-years away from here.  You have evolved from a single cell organism, which also formed naturally.

Hard to believe, I know, but Earth is not flat an it is much older than billion of years, so is the universe.

If you were there to see the way the formation of atoms happened, then you would be a super-being, yourself. Or are you really stating that you were there, or that anyone else was there to see it - LOL. Nobody living was there to see it happen. The science that suggests what you are saying is only speculation, not fact, and not anywhere near fact.

Are you not hearing me? No matter the method whereby the universe was formed, the universe is a machine made up of machines. We know this because absolutely all of our machines are made from the examples of the operating machines of and in the universe. All of our human experience shows that machines have makers. Anybody Who can make a machine of machines like our universe, fits our definition of "God."

The universe is a machine. All machines have makers. The Maker of machine-universe fits our definition of "God."

The funny thing is that you are elevating yourself to god over God by suggesting that He doesn't exist. The science of machines and machine operation shows that God exists, simply in the fact of the existence of the universe as it is.

Are you not hearing me? Or is it that you can't really think at all?

Your explanation is much worse than mine.  Your watchmaker needs to have a watchmaker, who needs to have a watchmaker, this continues ad infinitum.  This does not explain anything.

Your maker raises more questions than it answers.  Never mind that it is just one big, culturally driven conjecture.  Nothing to do with objective observation and analysis.

What we observe is that life forms go through a natural progression from less complex ones to more complicated ones, sometimes with cruel results of producing human children without fully enclosed spines, two cojoined heads or other genetic disorders. Some watchmaker, LOL.

By the way, the universe is not a machine, it is a violent, inhospitable place where life has very little chance to form.  As far as we can tell, it was created by a violent expansion of spacetime from quantum fluctuations.  Galaxies, including our own, are on a collision course with each other.  Violent collisions are happening all the time, black holes colliding, supernovas going off, comets and asteroids colliding with the nearby planets and stars. Is this the "machine" you are talking about?  Or you are just talking about your garden on a flat disk. LOL

Physics to deal with Planck's lengths and times has not been discovered yet.  So we don't know how our local universe has started.  Maybe it didn't, maybe it was always there in one form or the other.

People were buying your explanation more than 100 years ago when most of us were ignorant and fearful.  Education, new advances in science and technology eradicates these superstitions and pushes them to the footprints of psychiatric manuals.
 

[BADecker]

And you are not hearing me.  I do not see any results of God's actions.

What you are doing is building up your delusion to justify it.

There is absolutely no proof that the universe was made by "Someone".  Universe is the way it is just like sand dunes.
No active agent created them, yet they seem to be designed and made by someone.
https://st.depositphotos.com/1009986/2191/i/950/depositphotos_21916683-stock-photo-sand-dune-abstract.jpg

Atoms in your body were naturally formed in an ancient supernova millions of light-years away from here.  You have evolved from a single cell organism, which also formed naturally.

Hard to believe, I know, but Earth is not flat an it is much older than billion of years, so is the universe.

If you were there to see the way the formation of atoms happened, then you would be a super-being, yourself. Or are you really stating that you were there, or that anyone else was there to see it - LOL. Nobody living was there to see it happen. The science that suggests what you are saying is only speculation, not fact, and not anywhere near fact.

Are you not hearing me? No matter the method whereby the universe was formed, the universe is a machine made up of machines. We know this because absolutely all of our machines are made from the examples of the operating machines of and in the universe. All of our human experience shows that machines have makers. Anybody Who can make a machine of machines like our universe, fits our definition of "God."

The universe is a machine. All machines have makers. The Maker of machine-universe fits our definition of "God."

The funny thing is that you are elevating yourself to god over God by suggesting that He doesn't exist. The science of machines and machine operation shows that God exists, simply in the fact of the existence of the universe as it is.

Are you not hearing me? Or is it that you can't really think at all?

Your explanation is much worse than mine.  Your watchmaker needs to have a watchmaker, who needs to have a watchmaker, this continues ad infinitum.  This does not explain anything. - Watchmaker? How do you know I have a watch? But if I had a watch, why would you think my watchmaker needs a watchmaker. What does he need a watchmaker for? He makes watches. As you say, talking about watchmakers doesn't explain anything. So, why do you even add it >>> off topic.

Your maker raises more questions than it answers.  Never mind that it is just one big, culturally driven conjecture.  Nothing to do with objective observation and analysis. - The Universe Maker answers some of the basic questions. Part of the reason science is making AI and quantum computers is that people aren't built to understand the answers to deep universe questions. Best leave that up to God.

What we observe is that life forms go through a natural progression from less complex ones to more complicated ones, sometimes with cruel results of producing human children without fully enclosed spines, two cojoined heads or other genetic disorders. Some watchmaker, LOL. - Wrong! What you find is this:
1. Some people say the thing that you said; other people say the opposite;
2. All complexity is programmed in by cause and effect. Even though it appears at times that more complex comes from less complex, the less complex just happened to be the carrier of the programming for the more complex.

The genetic programming that you talked about shows that the whole process of cause and effect is way more complex than you easily understand.

By the way, the universe is not a machine, it is a violent, inhospitable place where life has very little chance to form.  As far as we can tell, it was created by a violent expansion of spacetime from quantum fluctuations.  Galaxies, including our own, are on a collision course with each other.  Violent collisions are happening all the time, black holes colliding, supernovas going off, comets and asteroids colliding with the nearby planets and stars. Is this the "machine" you are talking about?  Or you are just talking about your garden on a flat disk. LOL - Actually, all the violence in all the nuclear bombs ever detonated precisely followed the laws of physics. Just because you might call it chaos because you can't track the violence, doesn't mean that any of it - even one electron or photon - acted outside the precise laws of physics.

All pandemonium acts entirely according to the laws of physics via a succession of cause-and-effect activities... just like any complex machine. You know that you can't understand all this, so why do you keep on trying to say that there is no God who programmed all the cause and effect to happen exactly as it has? Since you admit that you don't understand this stuff, what makes you think that you can understand that there isn't any God?... especially in the light of the logical machine-Maker analogy?

Physics to deal with Planck's lengths and times has not been discovered yet.  So we don't know how our local universe has started.  Maybe it didn't, maybe it was always there in one form or the other. - Just because we haven't discovered all the laws of physics, doesn't mean they don't exist. All you are saying is that we are very ignorant compared with the knowledge that is packed into the universe. We don't have a factual example of dumb nature making any of it. And since you admit that we don't know, why are you so against the logical idea that God made it?

People were buying your explanation more than 100 years ago when most of us were ignorant and fearful.  Education, new advances in science and technology eradicates these superstitions and pushes them to the footprints of psychiatric manuals.
  

People never bought the explanation of God. The explanation is around for everyone to observe and have freely... throughout the nature machine.

The education you are talking about is simply dogma of the science religion. After all, science theory can change on a moment's notice. That's why it is theory. But you would rather stand believing the shifting sands of science theory than on the fact of the machine universe with its Machine Maker - God? What you have is a religion of science. By believing the way you do, you are causing yourself to miss out on the exact thing you are looking for.

[philipma1957]

Oh god why oh why must we talk about believing in god or no god why don’t we simply tell the truth.

We have not a clue. As to the non existentence or existence of god. And move on to the next question is the earth really a ball in space or a flat plain under a dome for giants to play with.

Something like the LEGO movie? Or is it more? I want to know. Don’t you.

[af_newbie]

And you are not hearing me.  I do not see any results of God's actions.

What you are doing is building up your delusion to justify it.

There is absolutely no proof that the universe was made by "Someone".  Universe is the way it is just like sand dunes.
No active agent created them, yet they seem to be designed and made by someone.
https://st.depositphotos.com/1009986/2191/i/950/depositphotos_21916683-stock-photo-sand-dune-abstract.jpg

Atoms in your body were naturally formed in an ancient supernova millions of light-years away from here.  You have evolved from a single cell organism, which also formed naturally.

Hard to believe, I know, but Earth is not flat an it is much older than billion of years, so is the universe.

If you were there to see the way the formation of atoms happened, then you would be a super-being, yourself. Or are you really stating that you were there, or that anyone else was there to see it - LOL. Nobody living was there to see it happen. The science that suggests what you are saying is only speculation, not fact, and not anywhere near fact.

Are you not hearing me? No matter the method whereby the universe was formed, the universe is a machine made up of machines. We know this because absolutely all of our machines are made from the examples of the operating machines of and in the universe. All of our human experience shows that machines have makers. Anybody Who can make a machine of machines like our universe, fits our definition of "God."

The universe is a machine. All machines have makers. The Maker of machine-universe fits our definition of "God."

The funny thing is that you are elevating yourself to god over God by suggesting that He doesn't exist. The science of machines and machine operation shows that God exists, simply in the fact of the existence of the universe as it is.

Are you not hearing me? Or is it that you can't really think at all?

Your explanation is much worse than mine.  Your watchmaker needs to have a watchmaker, who needs to have a watchmaker, this continues ad infinitum.  This does not explain anything. - Watchmaker? How do you know I have a watch? But if I had a watch, why would you think my watchmaker needs a watchmaker. What does he need a watchmaker for? He makes watches. As you say, talking about watchmakers doesn't explain anything. So, why do you even add it >>> off topic.

Your maker raises more questions than it answers.  Never mind that it is just one big, culturally driven conjecture.  Nothing to do with objective observation and analysis. - The Universe Maker answers some of the basic questions. Part of the reason science is making AI and quantum computers is that people aren't built to understand the answers to deep universe questions. Best leave that up to God.

What we observe is that life forms go through a natural progression from less complex ones to more complicated ones, sometimes with cruel results of producing human children without fully enclosed spines, two cojoined heads or other genetic disorders. Some watchmaker, LOL. - Wrong! What you find is this:
1. Some people say the thing that you said; other people say the opposite;
2. All complexity is programmed in by cause and effect. Even though it appears at times that more complex comes from less complex, the less complex just happened to be the carrier of the programming for the more complex.

The genetic programming that you talked about shows that the whole process of cause and effect is way more complex than you easily understand.

By the way, the universe is not a machine, it is a violent, inhospitable place where life has very little chance to form.  As far as we can tell, it was created by a violent expansion of spacetime from quantum fluctuations.  Galaxies, including our own, are on a collision course with each other.  Violent collisions are happening all the time, black holes colliding, supernovas going off, comets and asteroids colliding with the nearby planets and stars. Is this the "machine" you are talking about?  Or you are just talking about your garden on a flat disk. LOL - Actually, all the violence in all the nuclear bombs ever detonated precisely followed the laws of physics. Just because you might call it chaos because you can't track the violence, doesn't mean that any of it - even one electron or photon - acted outside the precise laws of physics.

All pandemonium acts entirely according to the laws of physics via a succession of cause-and-effect activities... just like any complex machine. You know that you can't understand all this, so why do you keep on trying to say that there is no God who programmed all the cause and effect to happen exactly as it has? Since you admit that you don't understand this stuff, what makes you think that you can understand that there isn't any God?... especially in the light of the logical machine-Maker analogy?

Physics to deal with Planck's lengths and times has not been discovered yet.  So we don't know how our local universe has started.  Maybe it didn't, maybe it was always there in one form or the other. - Just because we haven't discovered all the laws of physics, doesn't mean they don't exist. All you are saying is that we are very ignorant compared with the knowledge that is packed into the universe. We don't have a factual example of dumb nature making any of it. And since you admit that we don't know, why are you so against the logical idea that God made it?

People were buying your explanation more than 100 years ago when most of us were ignorant and fearful.  Education, new advances in science and technology eradicates these superstitions and pushes them to the footprints of psychiatric manuals.
  

People never bought the explanation of God. The explanation is around for everyone to observe and have freely... throughout the nature machine.

The education you are talking about is simply dogma of the science religion. After all, science theory can change on a moment's notice. That's why it is theory. But you would rather stand believing the shifting sands of science theory than on the fact of the machine universe with its Machine Maker - God? What you have is a religion of science. By believing the way you do, you are causing yourself to miss out on the exact thing you are looking for.

Google the watchmaker argument.  Your watchmaker will be more complicated than anything he has created and would require another watchmaker to explain its existence, and so on.

If you follow the watchmaker argument to its logical conclusion you will end up with more questions and no answers. That is why it is useless.

I do understand your psychological infirmity and your need for firm answers, however, I urge you to study how the science is actually done.
You seem to be quite fuzzy on this particular subject.

I am confident that you will be able to understand how science works despite your innate shortcomings and the barrage of indoctrination you have been subjected to since you started to walk on your own.

[BADecker]

Google the watchmaker argument.  Your watchmaker will be more complicated than anything he has created and would require another watchmaker to explain its existence, and so on.

If you follow the watchmaker argument to its logical conclusion you will end up with more questions and no answers. That is why it is useless.

I do understand your psychological infirmity and your need for firm answers, however, I urge you to study how the science is actually done.
You seem to be quite fuzzy on this particular subject.

I am confident that you will be able to understand how science works despite your innate shortcomings and the barrage of indoctrination you have been subjected to since you started to walk on your own.

The flaw in the "anti-God" watchmaker arguments is, all known machines are designed and have makers.

How many man-made machines are there in the world? Loads of them, right? We know that the man-made machines are all man-made. Not one of them is not man-made, right?

Second, all the man-made machines are made from examples from the universe, right? In addition, they all use universe parts to make them work, right?... the raw materials of the earth, which themselves act like machines, right?

Since the machines all come from the same place, the difference is either:
1. Machines are not machines, or;
2. Machines are machines.

There isn't even one example of a man-made machine making itself, or being made by accident without a maker-man. So, even if we don't know who or what made the universe machines, it obviously was something that was exceedingly capable. The capability is such that it fits our dictionary definitions of God.

Why would anyone think that machines make themselves, or come into existence by accident? There is not one example of such happening. But there are tons of examples of machines being made on purpose.

Make all the guesses that you want about where the machines of the universe came from. But don't rule out the most logical choice... God. Of course, when you do rule God out, you have a religion going for yourself, because you are using the least logical idea.

Btw, science works by the choice of the scientist. If he chooses to embrace the least logical, then that's what he embraces, whether it's true or not.

[Magkirap]

You know, if you listen to your beloved Science, a man can become a women, or two faggot can become married, and they call this the liberty...

I suppose the opposite of discrimination is liberty?

What do you have against science?  That's crazy how you write derogatorily about it... Do you dislike science? Why?

Treating homosexuals with equality has nothing to do with science... Its a philosophy/moral/logic issue

When you cross the mark of the natural normalness and that it is tolarated, even encouraged, there's definitely something weird. The pro-gays say that they're common humans and brand their actions as the fight for the liberty.

It seems that you did not listened to any socialist leader recently. They say that the forgot ism is something fully natural, and thus should exist, and thus should exist. It is heavily positively branded and encouraged.

About the science : even if I admire some science theories, a big part of them are dumb and desparated anti-religion crusades.

There is no need to argue about. Religion was there always there. There is always different side in every subject, different People different perception but after all these differences, what we need to do is to respect each other. Actually before, Science and Religion are helping each other to know the truth but today they both hate each other.

[BADecker]

There is no need to argue about. Religion was there always there. There is always different side in every subject, different People different perception but after all these differences, what we need to do is to respect each other. Actually before, Science and Religion are helping each other to know the truth but today they both hate each other.

Actually, basic religion is much the same in everyone. Nobody knows for a fact what will happen to him, even in the next minute. He only believes or hopes that it will be something good, or at least that he will survive it. But he doesn't know. So, it is by religion that we live, because we believe and hope, but we don't know.

religion
[ ri-lij-uh n ]

noun

...

6. something one believes in and follows devotedly; a point or matter of ethics or conscience:
to make a religion of fighting prejudice.

[inanilujimi]

just like the flow of electricity that can turn on a light bulb like that God has the power to turn on and off humans.
he is not visible to the eye but his role is clear in the world.
if you see the sun can you make it rise at night ??
of course not, all the universe and its contents have been arranged by God.

[af_newbie]

just like the flow of electricity that can turn on a light bulb like that God has the power to turn on and off humans.
he is not visible to the eye but his role is clear in the world.
if you see the sun can you make it rise at night ??
of course not, all the universe and its contents have been arranged by God.

Why can't he just come here and type one post in this thread and click on the "Post" button?

Pray to him that he turns me 'off'.

See you tomorrow, lol.

[johnpaul94]

I believe every man is entitled to believe what he wants to believe in,. However,  there is an insatiable quest to come to the understanding of the creator of this universe... Hence the defense of science. But even science doesn't know it all

[BADecker]

just like the flow of electricity that can turn on a light bulb like that God has the power to turn on and off humans.
he is not visible to the eye but his role is clear in the world.
if you see the sun can you make it rise at night ??
of course not, all the universe and its contents have been arranged by God.

Why can't he just come here and type one post in this thread and click on the "Post" button?

Pray to him that he turns me 'off'.

See you tomorrow, lol.

Christians are extensions of God here on Earth. God's idea isn't to turn you off. God wants you to live with Him, so that you and He can enjoy each other's company throughout eternity. After all, eternity can seem like a long time. When you resist Him like you are doing, you are turning yourself off. Be happy that it takes as long as it does, because it won't be fun for you in the resurrection.

[Rmcdermott927]

just like the flow of electricity that can turn on a light bulb like that God has the power to turn on and off humans.
he is not visible to the eye but his role is clear in the world.
if you see the sun can you make it rise at night ??
of course not, all the universe and its contents have been arranged by God.

Why can't he just come here and type one post in this thread and click on the "Post" button?

Pray to him that he turns me 'off'.

See you tomorrow, lol.

Christians are extensions of God here on Earth. God's idea isn't to turn you off. God wants you to live with Him, so that you and He can enjoy each other's company throughout eternity. After all, eternity can seem like a long time. When you resist Him like you are doing, you are turning yourself off. Be happy that it takes as long as it does, because it won't be fun for you in the resurrection.

I'm a personal believer that when you die, it's just like before you were born.   Do you remember that?   Me neither.   This consciousness is the only life you have so live it to it's fullest.

[BADecker]

just like the flow of electricity that can turn on a light bulb like that God has the power to turn on and off humans.
he is not visible to the eye but his role is clear in the world.
if you see the sun can you make it rise at night ??
of course not, all the universe and its contents have been arranged by God.

Why can't he just come here and type one post in this thread and click on the "Post" button?

Pray to him that he turns me 'off'.

See you tomorrow, lol.

Christians are extensions of God here on Earth. God's idea isn't to turn you off. God wants you to live with Him, so that you and He can enjoy each other's company throughout eternity. After all, eternity can seem like a long time. When you resist Him like you are doing, you are turning yourself off. Be happy that it takes as long as it does, because it won't be fun for you in the resurrection.

I'm a personal believer that when you die, it's just like before you were born.   Do you remember that?   Me neither.   This consciousness is the only life you have so live it to it's fullest.

I might not remember before I was born too clearly, but I DO remember before I was conceived. I remember being a fuzzy ball of light with other fuzzy balls of light all around me. There was a Great Light above us all. It was too bright to look at.

I was uncertain about taking a position down here. But I had waited for a long time, watching many others go to Earth and be born. Then the Great Light seemed to indicate that there was an opening that I should fill. I was hesitant, but I made the move.

And here I am.

[af_newbie]

just like the flow of electricity that can turn on a light bulb like that God has the power to turn on and off humans.
he is not visible to the eye but his role is clear in the world.
if you see the sun can you make it rise at night ??
of course not, all the universe and its contents have been arranged by God.

Why can't he just come here and type one post in this thread and click on the "Post" button?

Pray to him that he turns me 'off'.

See you tomorrow, lol.

Christians are extensions of God here on Earth. God's idea isn't to turn you off. God wants you to live with Him, so that you and He can enjoy each other's company throughout eternity. After all, eternity can seem like a long time. When you resist Him like you are doing, you are turning yourself off. Be happy that it takes as long as it does, because it won't be fun for you in the resurrection.

I'm a personal believer that when you die, it's just like before you were born.   Do you remember that?   Me neither.   This consciousness is the only life you have so live it to it's fullest.

I might not remember before I was born too clearly, but I DO remember before I was conceived. I remember being a fuzzy ball of light with other fuzzy balls of light all around me. There was a Great Light above us all. It was too bright to look at.

I was uncertain about taking a position down here. But I had waited for a long time, watching many others go to Earth and be born. Then the Great Light seemed to indicate that there was an opening that I should fill. I was hesitant, but I made the move.

And here I am.

If you truly believe what you just said actually happened, you might be are clinically insane.

[BADecker]

I might not remember before I was born too clearly, but I DO remember before I was conceived. I remember being a fuzzy ball of light with other fuzzy balls of light all around me. There was a Great Light above us all. It was too bright to look at.

I was uncertain about taking a position down here. But I had waited for a long time, watching many others go to Earth and be born. Then the Great Light seemed to indicate that there was an opening that I should fill. I was hesitant, but I made the move.

And here I am.

If you truly believe what you just said actually happened, you might be are clinically insane.

It's my memory. Was it implanted by someone? I don't know. But, it is my memory.

Consider that clinically insane is something that is decided by those who often have memories that would make them appear to be clinically insane.

Think about the firm Jewish believers, and the Christians who strictly believe the Bible. Jews are a stubborn lot with regard to keeping records. They believe that the books that Moses wrote back about 3500 years ago are the truth... some of which was taken from other records that go back to the creation. In other words, the universe and the earth are about 6000 years old. They literally believe this.

But science has found that the universe is about 13.5 billion years old. That's a difference of about 13.5 billion years from what the Jews believe.

The Jews believe their written records, while science makes all kinds of assumptions about the way things were. Kinda seems that scientists are the clinically insane here. After all, there is no reason to assume that things of the past acted like they do today. There might be any number of ways that the universe came about in a short period of time, like God creating it in 6 days.

Personally, I believe the written records of the Jews. If you want to believe the assumptions of the scientists, go ahead and remain clinically unsane.

[af_newbie]

I might not remember before I was born too clearly, but I DO remember before I was conceived. I remember being a fuzzy ball of light with other fuzzy balls of light all around me. There was a Great Light above us all. It was too bright to look at.

I was uncertain about taking a position down here. But I had waited for a long time, watching many others go to Earth and be born. Then the Great Light seemed to indicate that there was an opening that I should fill. I was hesitant, but I made the move.

And here I am.

If you truly believe what you just said actually happened, you might be are clinically insane.

It's my memory. Was it implanted by someone? I don't know. But, it is my memory.

Consider that clinically insane is something that is decided by those who often have memories that would make them appear to be clinically insane.

Think about the firm Jewish believers, and the Christians who strictly believe the Bible. Jews are a stubborn lot with regard to keeping records. They believe that the books that Moses wrote back about 3500 years ago are the truth... some of which was taken from other records that go back to the creation. In other words, the universe and the earth are about 6000 years old. They literally believe this.

But science has found that the universe is about 13.5 billion years old. That's a difference of about 13.5 billion years from what the Jews believe.

The Jews believe their written records, while science makes all kinds of assumptions about the way things were. Kinda seems that scientists are the clinically insane here. After all, there is no reason to assume that things of the past acted like they do today. There might be any number of ways that the universe came about in a short period of time, like God creating it in 6 days.

Personally, I believe the written records of the Jews. If you want to believe the assumptions of the scientists, go ahead and remain clinically unsane.

Uneducated people believed and still believe in all kinds of things. Some are delusional, some are just uninformed.

The issue was that you personally think to have a memory of what happened to you before you and your brain was formed.  That is what is insane.  Some people believe they were Napoleon, Julius Caesar, etc.  There is no clinical distinction between your "before birth" memories and someone who has memories of being Napoleon.

Your "before birth" memories are just part of your religious delusion.  You have lost your marbles.

[BADecker]

I might not remember before I was born too clearly, but I DO remember before I was conceived. I remember being a fuzzy ball of light with other fuzzy balls of light all around me. There was a Great Light above us all. It was too bright to look at.

I was uncertain about taking a position down here. But I had waited for a long time, watching many others go to Earth and be born. Then the Great Light seemed to indicate that there was an opening that I should fill. I was hesitant, but I made the move.

And here I am.

If you truly believe what you just said actually happened, you might be are clinically insane.

It's my memory. Was it implanted by someone? I don't know. But, it is my memory.

Consider that clinically insane is something that is decided by those who often have memories that would make them appear to be clinically insane.

Think about the firm Jewish believers, and the Christians who strictly believe the Bible. Jews are a stubborn lot with regard to keeping records. They believe that the books that Moses wrote back about 3500 years ago are the truth... some of which was taken from other records that go back to the creation. In other words, the universe and the earth are about 6000 years old. They literally believe this.

But science has found that the universe is about 13.5 billion years old. That's a difference of about 13.5 billion years from what the Jews believe.

The Jews believe their written records, while science makes all kinds of assumptions about the way things were. Kinda seems that scientists are the clinically insane here. After all, there is no reason to assume that things of the past acted like they do today. There might be any number of ways that the universe came about in a short period of time, like God creating it in 6 days.

Personally, I believe the written records of the Jews. If you want to believe the assumptions of the scientists, go ahead and remain clinically unsane.

Uneducated people believed and still believe in all kinds of things. Some are delusional, some are just uninformed.

The issue was that you personally think to have a memory of what happened to you before you and your brain was formed.  That is what is insane.  Some people believe they were Napoleon, Julius Caesar, etc.  There is no clinical distinction between your "before birth" memories and someone who has memories of being Napoleon.

Your "before birth" memories are just part of your religious delusion.  You have lost your marbles.

You can educate people to believe anything. Science educates by teaching people some real facts, and then extrapolating other potentially fake facts off the real facts. Examples of the potentially fake facts are: the scientific age of the universe; evolution of life; that cause and effect are philosophical rather than real; knowledge of what black holes really are; that stars are nuclear. When scientists teach like this, they are treating science like a religion.

When science says that there is no soul or spirit, or God for that matter, because they haven't technologically figured out a way to observe these things technologically, they are placing themselves into a position of admitted ignorance.

Just because science hasn't found soul/spirit memory that is distinctly separate from physical, brain memory, doesn't mean that it doesn't exist. After all, science would have to find the soul or spirit, first, and check it out for its memory. Science that claims these things don't exist, is claiming that cars and airplanes and computers and space rockets don't exist, because they are placing themselves into a class of people who have to know everything about something before they will admit to understanding that it exists.

What would Aristotle say if he had been introduced to cars and airplanes and computers and space rockets? Would he have said that they don't exist simply because he knew nothing about them? You are placing yourself into a position of self-maintained, self-desired ignorance when you talk the way you do.

[pandafly]

I too am an atheist and I believe only in the existence of extraterrestrials