Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com

[Bitcoinorama]

There's actually zero risk so long as they stick by their refund policy, and I'm sure at this point they've made way more then enough money to refund every single person who orders for November delivery.  So I don't see much risk.

Then you're just not looking very hard.

Refunds would cause customers to experience exchange losses. Someone who paid 39 Bitcoins for a Saturn two months ago would at most get 32 Bitcoins back, a loss of over $800.

But more importantly, if something gains value and then loses that value, you cannot argue that nobody was harmed. There can be people who bought in the middle, at the inflated price, who now are stuck with much less than they paid. Pro-orders have gained value. Someone who bought the right to a Saturn ordered two months ago for 45 Bitcoins today (which is reasonable) would be out the value of the expected profits that he had paid for, getting 32 Bitcoins back for the 45 Bitcoins he spent.

Loss of future expected value *is* a real present loss because expected values can be sold, traded, borrowed against, and so on. Of course part of the nature of future expected values is that they're accompanied by risk -- lots of risk. Everyone who has a pre-order has future expected value at risk.

C'mon man currencies fluctuate, you know that, and the fact Bitcoin is an emerging currency means that inherent risk is omnipresent until mainstream acceptance and regularatory outlines are more concrete. People need to acknowledge that and factor that into their own risk tolerance, wear big boy pants and assume responsibility for their own actions, no one is forcing them to spend coins, it' not the company's fault, or problem, it's' their own decision to make and standby. If BTC dropped, they sure as hell wouldn't want the coins back, it's a two way street and peeps need to grow a pair.

[rolling]

Did the CGMiner guys ever get their Knc ASIC so they can develop and test yet?  Or are they only going to get 1 day to do that just like Knc is only going to have 1 day to test and ship all the Sept Orders?      

KNC said they didn't need any help.  They modified CGMiner themselves.

[soy]

Could this recent spike in the Hash Rate be KNC testing units??

Under promise over deliver EARLY?? or just my wishful thinking??

https://blockchain.info/charts/hash-rate

The spike was caused by Bitfury as others has said. KNC most likely will be using our pool information from our accounts when they test our units. Just monitor the forum for post from any of those Day 1 and 2 orders. They will be the first to see activity in their pools if KNC does this

So, is the implication that KnC will burn-in our miners using our BTC payout address and preferred pool?  That might work with Eligius given that no password is required but not Slush's.

No, you can enter a worker name and worker password, but they don't currently have a free-form URL field You have to pick from one of the options they give you.  Slush is on the list.

However, I would not use slush if I were you, you don't get paid fully unless a block is found while you are hashing with them for at least 10-20 minutes, and you don't get anything unless a block is found within 20m of you stopping hashing (and almost nothing if it's more then 5m after)

Go with a pool doing a PPLNS or PPS.  Eligius will give you the most interesting stats, but you don't have control over payouts.

A Czech buddy got screwed in family court.  So, what the heck, going with Slush makes me feel better.

[timmmers]

Did the CGMiner guys ever get their Knc ASIC so they can develop and test yet?  Or are they only going to get 1 day to do that just like Knc is only going to have 1 day to test and ship all the Sept Orders?      

Another question answered already. By KnC themselves. Posted on this thread too. Can you read? Or do you just pop by every now and then to stir up some pointless crap?

[600watt]

hm... i guess it is too late & tense to expect love & peace in here.  

[timmmers]

There's actually zero risk so long as they stick by their refund policy, and I'm sure at this point they've made way more then enough money to refund every single person who orders for November delivery.  So I don't see much risk.

Then you're just not looking very hard.

Refunds would cause customers to experience exchange losses. Someone who paid 39 Bitcoins for a Saturn two months ago would at most get 32 Bitcoins back, a loss of over $800.

But more importantly, if something gains value and then loses that value, you cannot argue that nobody was harmed. There can be people who bought in the middle, at the inflated price, who now are stuck with much less than they paid. Pro-orders have gained value. Someone who bought the right to a Saturn ordered two months ago for 45 Bitcoins today (which is reasonable) would be out the value of the expected profits that he had paid for, getting 32 Bitcoins back for the 45 Bitcoins he spent.

Loss of future expected value *is* a real present loss because expected values can be sold, traded, borrowed against, and so on. Of course part of the nature of future expected values is that they're accompanied by risk -- lots of risk. Everyone who has a pre-order has future expected value at risk.

C'mon man currencies fluctuate, you know that, and the fact Bitcoin is an emerging currency means that inherent risk is omnipresent until mainstream acceptance and regularatory outlines are more concrete. People need to acknowledge that and factor that into their own risk tolerance, wear big boy pants and assume responsibility for their own actions, no one is forcing them to spend coins, it' not the company's fault, or problem, it's' their own decision to make and standby. If BTC dropped, they sure as hell wouldn't want the coins back, it's a two way street and peeps need to grow a pair.

..or use their heads and pay in flat which varies very little and removes that problem as a few others. Is there any benefit in paying for a pre-order miner in BTC at all? No protection, massive swings in exchange rates...two of the reasons it's hardly used mainstream never mind on stuff like this.

[kano]

Did the CGMiner guys ever get their Knc ASIC so they can develop and test yet?  Or are they only going to get 1 day to do that just like Knc is only going to have 1 day to test and ship all the Sept Orders?      

Another question answered already. By KnC themselves. Posted on this thread too. Can you read? Or do you just pop by every now and then to stir up some pointless crap?

Oh - did they? Got a link to the post? I missed it.
I'm curious as to what their reply was - they never replied by email.

[Kuroth]

Did the CGMiner guys ever get their Knc ASIC so they can develop and test yet?  Or are they only going to get 1 day to do that just like Knc is only going to have 1 day to test and ship all the Sept Orders?      

Another question answered already. By KnC themselves. Posted on this thread too. Can you read? Or do you just pop by every now and then to stir up some pointless crap?

Oh - did they? Got a link to the post? I missed it.
I'm curious as to what their reply was - they never replied by email.

BURN.......

[rolling]

Did the CGMiner guys ever get their Knc ASIC so they can develop and test yet?  Or are they only going to get 1 day to do that just like Knc is only going to have 1 day to test and ship all the Sept Orders?      

Another question answered already. By KnC themselves. Posted on this thread too. Can you read? Or do you just pop by every now and then to stir up some pointless crap?

Oh - did they? Got a link to the post? I missed it.
I'm curious as to what their reply was - they never replied by email.

https://www.kncminer.com/news/news-32

[xstr8guy]

C'mon man currencies fluctuate, you know that, and the fact Bitcoin is an emerging currency means that inherent risk is omnipresent until mainstream acceptance and regularatory outlines are more concrete. People need to acknowledge that and factor that into their own risk tolerance, wear big boy pants and assume responsibility for their own actions, no one is forcing them to spend coins, it' not the company's fault, or problem, it's' their own decision to make and standby. If BTC dropped, they sure as hell wouldn't want the coins back, it's a two way street and peeps need to grow a pair.

..or use their heads and pay in flat which varies very little and removes that problem as a few others. Is there any benefit in paying for a pre-order miner in BTC at all? No protection, massive swings in exchange rates...two of the reasons it's hardly used mainstream never mind on stuff like this.

Why do we mine for Bitcoin again?  Can someone remind me please?  Because the above post makes it sound quite worthless!  Lol.

[Kuroth]

Did the CGMiner guys ever get their Knc ASIC so they can develop and test yet?  Or are they only going to get 1 day to do that just like Knc is only going to have 1 day to test and ship all the Sept Orders?      

Another question answered already. By KnC themselves. Posted on this thread too. Can you read? Or do you just pop by every now and then to stir up some pointless crap?

Oh - did they? Got a link to the post? I missed it.
I'm curious as to what their reply was - they never replied by email.

https://www.kncminer.com/news/news-32

Interesting..  Kano they even thanked your for the help you did not know you gave them....

LMFAO....

[btceic]

Did the CGMiner guys ever get their Knc ASIC so they can develop and test yet?  Or are they only going to get 1 day to do that just like Knc is only going to have 1 day to test and ship all the Sept Orders?      

Another question answered already. By KnC themselves. Posted on this thread too. Can you read? Or do you just pop by every now and then to stir up some pointless crap?

Oh - did they? Got a link to the post? I missed it.
I'm curious as to what their reply was - they never replied by email.

https://www.kncminer.com/news/news-32

KnCMiner do have boards in our possession to use in the meantime for testing purposes, so having the controller boards printed with the phrase will not delay us in any way, but that design has now been optimised, The order has now been placed and we are very happy with the result.

Secondly with regards to CGminer, and it’s opensource protocol we’ve been able to configure our device unassisted and made a greater than 30% performance increase using the underlying code, for which we would like to thank both kano and ckolivas with their outstanding contribution to the community.

Next we wish to address the concerns surrounding why we have suggested power supplies capable of overcompensating for our promised maximum power consumption = 1.6 W/GH/s. Again, the answer lies within our motto of under-promising, and over-delivering, but this time we wish to extend the margins to yourselves and ensue you have enough power to allow for the additional hashrate our devices are certain to supply.

Finally we wish to confirm that yes we are still on track for our delivery towards the end of September.

[Bitcoinorama]

C'mon man currencies fluctuate, you know that, and the fact Bitcoin is an emerging currency means that inherent risk is omnipresent until mainstream acceptance and regularatory outlines are more concrete. People need to acknowledge that and factor that into their own risk tolerance, wear big boy pants and assume responsibility for their own actions, no one is forcing them to spend coins, it' not the company's fault, or problem, it's' their own decision to make and standby. If BTC dropped, they sure as hell wouldn't want the coins back, it's a two way street and peeps need to grow a pair.

..or use their heads and pay in flat which varies very little and removes that problem as a few others. Is there any benefit in paying for a pre-order miner in BTC at all? No protection, massive swings in exchange rates...two of the reasons it's hardly used mainstream never mind on stuff like this.

Why do we mine for Bitcoin again?  Can someone remind me please?  Because the above post makes it sound quite worthless!  Lol.

I don't mine for Bitcoin to spank on pre-orders by untrustable unknown entities such as we have all seen in the ASIC game, I mine because I believe in the underlying concept of the currency's which I intend to exchange one day with parties I do trust. Pre-orders with BTC have consistently lead to abuse.

[timmmers]

Did the CGMiner guys ever get their Knc ASIC so they can develop and test yet?  Or are they only going to get 1 day to do that just like Knc is only going to have 1 day to test and ship all the Sept Orders?      

Another question answered already. By KnC themselves. Posted on this thread too. Can you read? Or do you just pop by every now and then to stir up some pointless crap?

Oh - did they? Got a link to the post? I missed it.
I'm curious as to what their reply was - they never replied by email.

https://www.kncminer.com/news 

"Secondly with regards to CGminer, and it’s opensource protocol we’ve been able to configure our device unassisted and made a greater than 30% performance increase using the underlying code, for which we would like to thank both kano and ckolivas with their outstanding contribution to the community."

Rude of them not to reply to you I think, although they do thank you in that update.

[Kushedout]

Interesting..  Kano they even thanked your for the help you did not know you gave them....

LMFAO....

They thank him for the code he provided as opensource and they were able to modify it without Kanos assistance, as stated within that link.

With that said, I still hope they compensate Kano somehow.

[kano]

Did the CGMiner guys ever get their Knc ASIC so they can develop and test yet?  Or are they only going to get 1 day to do that just like Knc is only going to have 1 day to test and ship all the Sept Orders?      

Another question answered already. By KnC themselves. Posted on this thread too. Can you read? Or do you just pop by every now and then to stir up some pointless crap?

Oh - did they? Got a link to the post? I missed it.
I'm curious as to what their reply was - they never replied by email.

https://www.kncminer.com/news/news-32

Interesting..  Kano they even thanked your for the help you did not know you gave them....

LMFAO....

LOL

[timmmers]

C'mon man currencies fluctuate, you know that, and the fact Bitcoin is an emerging currency means that inherent risk is omnipresent until mainstream acceptance and regularatory outlines are more concrete. People need to acknowledge that and factor that into their own risk tolerance, wear big boy pants and assume responsibility for their own actions, no one is forcing them to spend coins, it' not the company's fault, or problem, it's' their own decision to make and standby. If BTC dropped, they sure as hell wouldn't want the coins back, it's a two way street and peeps need to grow a pair.

..or use their heads and pay in flat which varies very little and removes that problem as a few others. Is there any benefit in paying for a pre-order miner in BTC at all? No protection, massive swings in exchange rates...two of the reasons it's hardly used mainstream never mind on stuff like this.

Why do we mine for Bitcoin again?  Can someone remind me please?  Because the above post makes it sound quite worthless!  Lol.

If most people are honest..the answer to that is also the reason not to use it to pay for rigs...because we hope they will in time rise in value.
Some people do it from altruism and to bring about a new world order. lmao.

[-ck]

Did the CGMiner guys ever get their Knc ASIC so they can develop and test yet?  Or are they only going to get 1 day to do that just like Knc is only going to have 1 day to test and ship all the Sept Orders?      

Another question answered already. By KnC themselves. Posted on this thread too. Can you read? Or do you just pop by every now and then to stir up some pointless crap?

Oh - did they? Got a link to the post? I missed it.
I'm curious as to what their reply was - they never replied by email.

https://www.kncminer.com/news/news-32

Interesting..  Kano they even thanked your for the help you did not know you gave them....

LMFAO....

LOL

Ooh they thanked me too! I feel all warm and fuzzy.

[xstr8guy]

Kano and cklovis... hopefully Jupiters #1 and #2 will be on your doorstep soon 

[dwdoc]

I peek at the KnCminer portal being designed:

http://forum.kncminer.com/filedata/fetch?photoid=146&type=thumb