[DVC]DevCoin - Official Thread - Moderated

[ranlo]

As an announcement (hopefully this isn't a problem; if it is, please let me know), I am opening myself up to editing jobs. I get so many pm's and send out so many in relation to editing, formatting, etc. that I figure now's the time to make that move! I'd love it if this could be added to the original post as well, if that is allowed.

Essentially what I am willing to offer up is full editing service in return for donations of DVC or anything else that is listed on my official writing thread here. I can also help out with writing, although I don't quite know the rules on that in relation to Devtome so I think it's best to deal with writing elsewhere instead (being that Devtome is for things you personally own that turns in to a grey area). For example, blogs, informational websites, press releases, business proposals, etc.

I can handle just about any topic (off the top of my head I can't think of anything I wouldn't be able to; from these forums alone I've had jobs relating to Tor, cryptos, video games, news, business, press releases and a multitude of other things), so if you're interested in my services feel free to toss me a pm and we'll go from there!

I am also available for anything related to Devtome (things that are not job-related, such as questions and such) so you can toss me a pm at any time!

[smeagol]

In marketing income, what qualifies as a post? Anything on the devcoin thread or an ad thread on bitcointalk about devcoin?

[smeagol]

We now have page view information from google analytics, so the devtome.py script has been modified and popular writers will get paid more per word than unpopular writers. From:
http://www.devtome.com/doku.php?id=earn_devcoins_by_writing#earnings_per_word

"The earnings are calculated according to the popularity of the writer's articles according to google analytics. The number of unique page views are divided by the number of words, then the root of that is taken and the roots of all the writers are normalized. That earnings multipler is multiplied by a goal seeked revenue neutralizing multiplier, then bounded from 0.75 to 1.25, and multiplied by the words to obtain the number of generation shares. To summarize, an unpopular writer will get 0.75 generation shares per thousand words, an average writer will get around a share per thousand words, and a popular writer will get 1.25 shares per thousand words."

The earnings multiplier is from the fourth root of the page views divided by the number of words and it is bounded to a narrow range this round because the payment rule has just been changed. In the next round, round 27, the earnings multiplier will be from the square root of the views over the words, and the multiplier will bounded to the wider range of 0.500001 to 1.499999. I'm using 0.500001 as a lower limit so that even unpopular writers who only write a share will at least get something after the multiplication and rounding. The unique page views will be taken from the four days just before the earnings calculation. The earnings multiplier is only calculated for the writers who have earned at least a share.

The most popular topics were cryptocurrencies:
https://github.com/Unthinkingbit/charity/blob/master/devtome_analytics_26.csv

After running the script, I found that some writers actually didn't get any page views at all, and got the minimum 0.75 multiplier:
https://raw.github.com/Unthinkingbit/charity/master/devtome_26.csv

The above devtome_26 file is just there so people can see popularity and earnings multipliers, it will be calculated officially in about a week. Some of the new writers don't have any page views yet, but will when the script is run next week. For people who write books or screenplays, to boost their page views I recommend making a page for each chapter or scene.

Does popularity roll over?
For example, if you are popular one round but not so much the next, will last round's popularity prevent you from going to low?

[ranlo]

We now have page view information from google analytics, so the devtome.py script has been modified and popular writers will get paid more per word than unpopular writers. From:
http://www.devtome.com/doku.php?id=earn_devcoins_by_writing#earnings_per_word

"The earnings are calculated according to the popularity of the writer's articles according to google analytics. The number of unique page views are divided by the number of words, then the root of that is taken and the roots of all the writers are normalized. That earnings multipler is multiplied by a goal seeked revenue neutralizing multiplier, then bounded from 0.75 to 1.25, and multiplied by the words to obtain the number of generation shares. To summarize, an unpopular writer will get 0.75 generation shares per thousand words, an average writer will get around a share per thousand words, and a popular writer will get 1.25 shares per thousand words."

The earnings multiplier is from the fourth root of the page views divided by the number of words and it is bounded to a narrow range this round because the payment rule has just been changed. In the next round, round 27, the earnings multiplier will be from the square root of the views over the words, and the multiplier will bounded to the wider range of 0.500001 to 1.499999. I'm using 0.500001 as a lower limit so that even unpopular writers who only write a share will at least get something after the multiplication and rounding. The unique page views will be taken from the four days just before the earnings calculation. The earnings multiplier is only calculated for the writers who have earned at least a share.

The most popular topics were cryptocurrencies:
https://github.com/Unthinkingbit/charity/blob/master/devtome_analytics_26.csv

After running the script, I found that some writers actually didn't get any page views at all, and got the minimum 0.75 multiplier:
https://raw.github.com/Unthinkingbit/charity/master/devtome_26.csv

The above devtome_26 file is just there so people can see popularity and earnings multipliers, it will be calculated officially in about a week. Some of the new writers don't have any page views yet, but will when the script is run next week. For people who write books or screenplays, to boost their page views I recommend making a page for each chapter or scene.

Does popularity roll over?
For example, if you are popular one round but not so much the next, will last round's popularity prevent you from going to low?

Popularity is based only on the current round. For example, if you write an article and it is not popular during the time it's written but it does start spiking up in the next round, there is no real benefit to you in that. All that counts is what happens with the current articles in the current round.

[smeagol]

We now have page view information from google analytics, so the devtome.py script has been modified and
Popularity is based only on the current round. For example, if you write an article and it is not popular during the time it's written but it does start spiking up in the next round, there is no real benefit to you in that. All that counts is what happens with the current articles in the current round.

Ok.  Now it'll be really hard for power writers (50k word +) to earn excessive amounts!

[ranlo]

We now have page view information from google analytics, so the devtome.py script has been modified and
Popularity is based only on the current round. For example, if you write an article and it is not popular during the time it's written but it does start spiking up in the next round, there is no real benefit to you in that. All that counts is what happens with the current articles in the current round.

Ok.  Now it'll be really hard for power writers (50k word +) to earn excessive amounts!

That it will. Honestly I don't like the new change, for multiple reasons, but it's not up to me and I respect the decision Unthinkingbit has made.

[worldinacoin]

We have a lot of great writers and poets etc coming in, watch out for their works

[K1773R]

Popularity is based only on the current round. For example, if you write an article and it is not popular during the time it's written but it does start spiking up in the next round, there is no real benefit to you in that. All that counts is what happens with the current articles in the current round.

great, how long will it take until this is being abused? its getting worse and worse @ the dvc "scene"

[smeagol]

As suggested, I've put up an article about investing in DVC in lieu of trying to sell it. It includes sample earnings from the data at cryptostocks.com.

http://www.devtome.com/doku.php?id=devcoin_stock_purchases

Is the d.evco.in site down?
I can't seem to download the devtome_earnings_26.csv file.

[FuzzyBear]

interesting article here.... http://www.devtome.com/doku.php?id=devcoin_stock_purchases

but think the calculation for P2PDVC 30 ROI is wrong... should be 0.31 on long months.... might want to get that changed / checked after the 1dvc apparently worth $10 fiasco

FuzzyBear

[wiser]

My 2 DVC on the change in payment based on page views.  I haven't worked through the math, but it looks like if I write 1000 words and no one ever reads it, I would get 0.75 share for it.  Correct?  If a lot of people read my work, then I get 1.25 shares.  It strikes me as a decent compromise between rewarding the writing itself (unconditionally) and rewarding writing that many others like.  

Something that needs to be considered.  Rewarding by page views is also rewarding based on author's ability to market his or her work.  Authors who do not market well for whatever reason would lose on the page views unless they arrange to have others do the marketing.  Authors who market well will be rewarded by extra shares regardless of whether or not their writing is objectively better.  This isn't necessarily bad, just something to be aware of.  3/5 of the potential earnings are unaffected by this.

The one thing I would like to have for sure is that when this formula kicks in, that our earnings are shown on the various files that we already use to determine this.  So, if I'm getting .75 share for something, I'd like that to be indicated so that I can plan to write more or market harder during that round.  I can work with this as long as I know what to expect.

thanks!

[smeagol]

I just made this banner, would I be eligible to earn marketing income if I used this on my site?


Or would it have to link to devtome?

[smeagol]

As suggested, I've put up an article about investing in DVC in lieu of trying to sell it. It includes sample earnings from the data at cryptostocks.com.

http://www.devtome.com/doku.php?id=devcoin_stock_purchases

Is the d.evco.in site down?
I can't seem to download the devtome_earnings_26.csv file.

Try this http://devtome.com/doku.php?id=devcoin_block_explorer

The same thing happened to me today. http://darkgamex.ch:2751/chain/DevCoin is working fine right now.

I still can't download the file!
I need it for an article.

[smeagol]

My 2 DVC on the change in payment based on page views.  I haven't worked through the math, but it looks like if I write 1000 words and no one ever reads it, I would get 0.75 share for it.  Correct?  If a lot of people read my work, then I get 1.25 shares.  It strikes me as a decent compromise between rewarding the writing itself (unconditionally) and rewarding writing that many others like.  

Something that needs to be considered.  Rewarding by page views is also rewarding based on author's ability to market his or her work.  Authors who do not market well for whatever reason would lose on the page views unless they arrange to have others do the marketing.  Authors who market well will be rewarded by extra shares regardless of whether or not their writing is objectively better.  This isn't necessarily bad, just something to be aware of.  3/5 of the potential earnings are unaffected by this.

The one thing I would like to have for sure is that when this formula kicks in, that our earnings are shown on the various files that we already use to determine this.  So, if I'm getting .75 share for something, I'd like that to be indicated so that I can plan to write more or market harder during that round.  I can work with this as long as I know what to expect.

thanks!

That's a good idea.  Would a script be able to write on users talk pages the stats during that month?
(like word count, shares, popularity, etc.)

Wikipedia has some of those.  (but they are known as bots)

[ranlo]

My 2 DVC on the change in payment based on page views.  I haven't worked through the math, but it looks like if I write 1000 words and no one ever reads it, I would get 0.75 share for it.  Correct?  If a lot of people read my work, then I get 1.25 shares.  It strikes me as a decent compromise between rewarding the writing itself (unconditionally) and rewarding writing that many others like.  

Something that needs to be considered.  Rewarding by page views is also rewarding based on author's ability to market his or her work.  Authors who do not market well for whatever reason would lose on the page views unless they arrange to have others do the marketing.  Authors who market well will be rewarded by extra shares regardless of whether or not their writing is objectively better.  This isn't necessarily bad, just something to be aware of.  3/5 of the potential earnings are unaffected by this.

The one thing I would like to have for sure is that when this formula kicks in, that our earnings are shown on the various files that we already use to determine this.  So, if I'm getting .75 share for something, I'd like that to be indicated so that I can plan to write more or market harder during that round.  I can work with this as long as I know what to expect.

thanks!

There's an issue with this that goes deeper. Only a few days worth of marketing will count. I can throw traffic at the site at any point through my various sources, but because it's an external site I won't be able to sustain that. For example, I'd have no issue tossing out 10k+ views (LEGITIMATE TRAFFIC funneled from my news sites) over a period of a day or two, but after that it would drop off. So the marketing is worthless to me unless I were to hit it right at the perfect time. Otherwise I'd be funneling people over, getting absolutely nothing for it, and if it wasn't in that 4-day period where traffic counts, it'd have all been a waste of effort.

Furthermore, only 80k words count regardless, and there are a couple more things to point out to you:

1) The 0.75-1.25 is only for this round. Starting next round it's 0.5-1.5.
2) You can only do 80k words. So essentially your earnings, should you do all 80k, would be anywhere from 40-120 shares starting in the next round. Even if you wrote 500000 million words, you would still be bound to the same thing since it's still only going to count the 80k.

My marketing ability alone would be borderline exploitative with this new system, and that is one reason why I hate it. I have no problems with creating surges of traffic by carefully picking topics and marketing them myself, but those surges are short-lasted. Any long-term marketing I have to do is focused on keeping all of my sites in the ranking #1 and #2 in Google. I really don't like basically having to choose whether I want to sustain my own site or sustain another site in the hopes that I *might* be rewarded on the second; I much prefer guarantees. Furthermore, there are many methods where this could be exploited with non-legitimate traffic, and to the poster that brought up using Google Analytics... those are easily fooled.

Regardless, I'm sticking it out for this round and I will see whether or not it's worth continuing with its latest changes. If nothing else, I'll calm down on the writing and marketing (I've marketed the hell out of the main page since I joined the project, :p) and treat it as more of a side project.

[FuzzyBear]

interesting article here.... http://www.devtome.com/doku.php?id=devcoin_stock_purchases

but think the calculation for P2PDVC 30 ROI is wrong... should be 0.31 on long months.... might want to get that changed / checked after the 1dvc apparently worth $10 fiasco

FuzzyBear

Thank you. I'll check it out. Might be a day or two.

I have done the calculations for you and edited the article so we are not falsely advertising.  Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong.

Ticker    DVC    Price           Shares           DPS (Last)   30-day Dividend   ROI %
DVB            1000000   185           5405.405405   0.0090654   0.03054563   0.00000305%
ASCMDVCPT    1000000   10000   100                   28.89961953   140.5292372   0.01405292%
P2PDVC            1000000   100.6   9940.357853   0.01                    0.401           0.0000401%
PYRPXYDVC    1000000   900            1111.111111   1111.111111   6.56905504   0.00065691%

I have not changed any of the text so you may want to edit that when you get a chance.

FuzzyBear

[smeagol]

My 2 DVC on the change in payment based on page views.  I haven't worked through the math, but it looks like if I write 1000 words and no one ever reads it, I would get 0.75 share for it.  Correct?  If a lot of people read my work, then I get 1.25 shares.  It strikes me as a decent compromise between rewarding the writing itself (unconditionally) and rewarding writing that many others like.  

Something that needs to be considered.  Rewarding by page views is also rewarding based on author's ability to market his or her work.  Authors who do not market well for whatever reason would lose on the page views unless they arrange to have others do the marketing.  Authors who market well will be rewarded by extra shares regardless of whether or not their writing is objectively better.  This isn't necessarily bad, just something to be aware of.  3/5 of the potential earnings are unaffected by this.

The one thing I would like to have for sure is that when this formula kicks in, that our earnings are shown on the various files that we already use to determine this.  So, if I'm getting .75 share for something, I'd like that to be indicated so that I can plan to write more or market harder during that round.  I can work with this as long as I know what to expect.

thanks!

There's an issue with this that goes deeper. Only a few days worth of marketing will count. I can throw traffic at the site at any point through my various sources, but because it's an external site I won't be able to sustain that. For example, I'd have no issue tossing out 10k+ views (LEGITIMATE TRAFFIC funneled from my news sites) over a period of a day or two, but after that it would drop off. So the marketing is worthless to me unless I were to hit it right at the perfect time. Otherwise I'd be funneling people over, getting absolutely nothing for it, and if it wasn't in that 4-day period where traffic counts, it'd have all been a waste of effort.

Furthermore, only 80k words count regardless, and there are a couple more things to point out to you:

1) The 0.75-1.25 is only for this round. Starting next round it's 0.5-1.5.
2) You can only do 80k words. So essentially your earnings, should you do all 80k, would be anywhere from 40-120 shares starting in the next round. Even if you wrote 500000 million words, you would still be bound to the same thing since it's still only going to count the 80k.

My marketing ability alone would be borderline exploitative with this new system, and that is one reason why I hate it. I have no problems with creating surges of traffic by carefully picking topics and marketing them myself, but those surges are short-lasted. Any long-term marketing I have to do is focused on keeping all of my sites in the ranking #1 and #2 in Google. I really don't like basically having to choose whether I want to sustain my own site or sustain another site in the hopes that I *might* be rewarded on the second; I much prefer guarantees. Furthermore, there are many methods where this could be exploited with non-legitimate traffic, and to the poster that brought up using Google Analytics... those are easily fooled.

Regardless, I'm sticking it out for this round and I will see whether or not it's worth continuing with its latest changes. If nothing else, I'll calm down on the writing and marketing (I've marketed the hell out of the main page since I joined the project, :p) and treat it as more of a side project.

How can you get TEN THOUSAND views?  Wow!
Also, I've been having a bit of a writer's block.  Any interesting topics to write about?

[ranlo]

My 2 DVC on the change in payment based on page views.  I haven't worked through the math, but it looks like if I write 1000 words and no one ever reads it, I would get 0.75 share for it.  Correct?  If a lot of people read my work, then I get 1.25 shares.  It strikes me as a decent compromise between rewarding the writing itself (unconditionally) and rewarding writing that many others like. 

Something that needs to be considered.  Rewarding by page views is also rewarding based on author's ability to market his or her work.  Authors who do not market well for whatever reason would lose on the page views unless they arrange to have others do the marketing.  Authors who market well will be rewarded by extra shares regardless of whether or not their writing is objectively better.  This isn't necessarily bad, just something to be aware of.  3/5 of the potential earnings are unaffected by this.

The one thing I would like to have for sure is that when this formula kicks in, that our earnings are shown on the various files that we already use to determine this.  So, if I'm getting .75 share for something, I'd like that to be indicated so that I can plan to write more or market harder during that round.  I can work with this as long as I know what to expect.

thanks!

There's an issue with this that goes deeper. Only a few days worth of marketing will count. I can throw traffic at the site at any point through my various sources, but because it's an external site I won't be able to sustain that. For example, I'd have no issue tossing out 10k+ views (LEGITIMATE TRAFFIC funneled from my news sites) over a period of a day or two, but after that it would drop off. So the marketing is worthless to me unless I were to hit it right at the perfect time. Otherwise I'd be funneling people over, getting absolutely nothing for it, and if it wasn't in that 4-day period where traffic counts, it'd have all been a waste of effort.

Furthermore, only 80k words count regardless, and there are a couple more things to point out to you:

1) The 0.75-1.25 is only for this round. Starting next round it's 0.5-1.5.
2) You can only do 80k words. So essentially your earnings, should you do all 80k, would be anywhere from 40-120 shares starting in the next round. Even if you wrote 500000 million words, you would still be bound to the same thing since it's still only going to count the 80k.

My marketing ability alone would be borderline exploitative with this new system, and that is one reason why I hate it. I have no problems with creating surges of traffic by carefully picking topics and marketing them myself, but those surges are short-lasted. Any long-term marketing I have to do is focused on keeping all of my sites in the ranking #1 and #2 in Google. I really don't like basically having to choose whether I want to sustain my own site or sustain another site in the hopes that I *might* be rewarded on the second; I much prefer guarantees. Furthermore, there are many methods where this could be exploited with non-legitimate traffic, and to the poster that brought up using Google Analytics... those are easily fooled.

Regardless, I'm sticking it out for this round and I will see whether or not it's worth continuing with its latest changes. If nothing else, I'll calm down on the writing and marketing (I've marketed the hell out of the main page since I joined the project, :p) and treat it as more of a side project.

How can you get TEN THOUSAND views?  Wow!
Also, I've been having a bit of a writer's block.  Any interesting topics to write about?

I have sites that get more than that a day easily, :p. I'm an SEO guru though so that plays a huge role in it.

And to answer your question... I really can't help there. Writer's block sucks! When I hit that point I just take a break and do something else.

[smeagol]

I have sites that get more than that a day easily, :p. I'm an SEO guru though so that plays a huge role in it.

And to answer your question... I really can't help there. Writer's block sucks! When I hit that point I just take a break and do something else.

You should sell SEO stuff for DVC, as well as your editing.  There's some pretty big money in the business! 
By the way, can you give me a link to one of your sites?  Or a google query so I can see them?

Thanks!

[ranlo]

I have sites that get more than that a day easily, :p. I'm an SEO guru though so that plays a huge role in it.

And to answer your question... I really can't help there. Writer's block sucks! When I hit that point I just take a break and do something else.

You should sell SEO stuff for DVC, as well as your editing.  There's some pretty big money in the business! 
By the way, can you give me a link to one of your sites?  Or a google query so I can see them?

Thanks!

I'll PM you. As for selling editing service, I do that as it is, :p. I also do writing services, although I'd like to refrain from writing people's Devtome articles I think (I kind of view it as trying to skirt the rules by indirectly having multiple accounts). I really don't know what the rules would be on me selling articles based on people's requests like I do professionally as it is, so at some point I may try to get with the other admins to clarify that point and see what we can come up with.