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Author Topic: [DVC]DevCoin - Official Thread - Moderated  (Read 591264 times)
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ranlo
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August 05, 2013, 10:10:14 PM
 #641

My 2 DVC on the change in payment based on page views.  I haven't worked through the math, but it looks like if I write 1000 words and no one ever reads it, I would get 0.75 share for it.  Correct?  If a lot of people read my work, then I get 1.25 shares.  It strikes me as a decent compromise between rewarding the writing itself (unconditionally) and rewarding writing that many others like. 

Something that needs to be considered.  Rewarding by page views is also rewarding based on author's ability to market his or her work.  Authors who do not market well for whatever reason would lose on the page views unless they arrange to have others do the marketing.  Authors who market well will be rewarded by extra shares regardless of whether or not their writing is objectively better.  This isn't necessarily bad, just something to be aware of.  3/5 of the potential earnings are unaffected by this.

The one thing I would like to have for sure is that when this formula kicks in, that our earnings are shown on the various files that we already use to determine this.  So, if I'm getting .75 share for something, I'd like that to be indicated so that I can plan to write more or market harder during that round.  I can work with this as long as I know what to expect.

thanks!

There's an issue with this that goes deeper. Only a few days worth of marketing will count. I can throw traffic at the site at any point through my various sources, but because it's an external site I won't be able to sustain that. For example, I'd have no issue tossing out 10k+ views (LEGITIMATE TRAFFIC funneled from my news sites) over a period of a day or two, but after that it would drop off. So the marketing is worthless to me unless I were to hit it right at the perfect time. Otherwise I'd be funneling people over, getting absolutely nothing for it, and if it wasn't in that 4-day period where traffic counts, it'd have all been a waste of effort.

Furthermore, only 80k words count regardless, and there are a couple more things to point out to you:

1) The 0.75-1.25 is only for this round. Starting next round it's 0.5-1.5.
2) You can only do 80k words. So essentially your earnings, should you do all 80k, would be anywhere from 40-120 shares starting in the next round. Even if you wrote 500000 million words, you would still be bound to the same thing since it's still only going to count the 80k.

My marketing ability alone would be borderline exploitative with this new system, and that is one reason why I hate it. I have no problems with creating surges of traffic by carefully picking topics and marketing them myself, but those surges are short-lasted. Any long-term marketing I have to do is focused on keeping all of my sites in the ranking #1 and #2 in Google. I really don't like basically having to choose whether I want to sustain my own site or sustain another site in the hopes that I *might* be rewarded on the second; I much prefer guarantees. Furthermore, there are many methods where this could be exploited with non-legitimate traffic, and to the poster that brought up using Google Analytics... those are easily fooled.

Regardless, I'm sticking it out for this round and I will see whether or not it's worth continuing with its latest changes. If nothing else, I'll calm down on the writing and marketing (I've marketed the hell out of the main page since I joined the project, :p) and treat it as more of a side project.

How can you get TEN THOUSAND views?  Wow!
Also, I've been having a bit of a writer's block.  Any interesting topics to write about?

I have sites that get more than that a day easily, :p. I'm an SEO guru though so that plays a huge role in it.

And to answer your question... I really can't help there. Writer's block sucks! When I hit that point I just take a break and do something else.

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August 05, 2013, 11:25:09 PM
 #642

I have sites that get more than that a day easily, :p. I'm an SEO guru though so that plays a huge role in it.

And to answer your question... I really can't help there. Writer's block sucks! When I hit that point I just take a break and do something else.

You should sell SEO stuff for DVC, as well as your editing.  There's some pretty big money in the business!  Smiley
By the way, can you give me a link to one of your sites?  Or a google query so I can see them?

Thanks!

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August 05, 2013, 11:27:54 PM
 #643

I have sites that get more than that a day easily, :p. I'm an SEO guru though so that plays a huge role in it.

And to answer your question... I really can't help there. Writer's block sucks! When I hit that point I just take a break and do something else.

You should sell SEO stuff for DVC, as well as your editing.  There's some pretty big money in the business!  Smiley
By the way, can you give me a link to one of your sites?  Or a google query so I can see them?

Thanks!

I'll PM you. As for selling editing service, I do that as it is, :p. I also do writing services, although I'd like to refrain from writing people's Devtome articles I think (I kind of view it as trying to skirt the rules by indirectly having multiple accounts). I really don't know what the rules would be on me selling articles based on people's requests like I do professionally as it is, so at some point I may try to get with the other admins to clarify that point and see what we can come up with.

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August 06, 2013, 12:28:40 AM
 #644

I have sites that get more than that a day easily, :p. I'm an SEO guru though so that plays a huge role in it.

And to answer your question... I really can't help there. Writer's block sucks! When I hit that point I just take a break and do something else.

You should sell SEO stuff for DVC, as well as your editing.  There's some pretty big money in the business!  Smiley
By the way, can you give me a link to one of your sites?  Or a google query so I can see them?

Thanks!

I'll PM you. As for selling editing service, I do that as it is, :p. I also do writing services, although I'd like to refrain from writing people's Devtome articles I think (I kind of view it as trying to skirt the rules by indirectly having multiple accounts). I really don't know what the rules would be on me selling articles based on people's requests like I do professionally as it is, so at some point I may try to get with the other admins to clarify that point and see what we can come up with.

got your PM, thanks.

Also, has the d.evco.in site been fixed?  I still cannot view the receiver files!

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August 06, 2013, 12:57:27 AM
 #645

My 2 DVC on the change in payment based on page views.  I haven't worked through the math, but it looks like if I write 1000 words and no one ever reads it, I would get 0.75 share for it.  Correct?  If a lot of people read my work, then I get 1.25 shares.  It strikes me as a decent compromise between rewarding the writing itself (unconditionally) and rewarding writing that many others like.  

Something that needs to be considered.  Rewarding by page views is also rewarding based on author's ability to market his or her work.  Authors who do not market well for whatever reason would lose on the page views unless they arrange to have others do the marketing.  Authors who market well will be rewarded by extra shares regardless of whether or not their writing is objectively better.  This isn't necessarily bad, just something to be aware of.  3/5 of the potential earnings are unaffected by this.

The one thing I would like to have for sure is that when this formula kicks in, that our earnings are shown on the various files that we already use to determine this.  So, if I'm getting .75 share for something, I'd like that to be indicated so that I can plan to write more or market harder during that round.  I can work with this as long as I know what to expect.

thanks!

There's an issue with this that goes deeper. Only a few days worth of marketing will count. I can throw traffic at the site at any point through my various sources, but because it's an external site I won't be able to sustain that. For example, I'd have no issue tossing out 10k+ views (LEGITIMATE TRAFFIC funneled from my news sites) over a period of a day or two, but after that it would drop off. So the marketing is worthless to me unless I were to hit it right at the perfect time. Otherwise I'd be funneling people over, getting absolutely nothing for it, and if it wasn't in that 4-day period where traffic counts, it'd have all been a waste of effort.

Furthermore, only 80k words count regardless, and there are a couple more things to point out to you:

1) The 0.75-1.25 is only for this round. Starting next round it's 0.5-1.5.
2) You can only do 80k words. So essentially your earnings, should you do all 80k, would be anywhere from 40-120 shares starting in the next round. Even if you wrote 500000 million words, you would still be bound to the same thing since it's still only going to count the 80k.

My marketing ability alone would be borderline exploitative with this new system, and that is one reason why I hate it. I have no problems with creating surges of traffic by carefully picking topics and marketing them myself, but those surges are short-lasted. Any long-term marketing I have to do is focused on keeping all of my sites in the ranking #1 and #2 in Google. I really don't like basically having to choose whether I want to sustain my own site or sustain another site in the hopes that I *might* be rewarded on the second; I much prefer guarantees. Furthermore, there are many methods where this could be exploited with non-legitimate traffic, and to the poster that brought up using Google Analytics... those are easily fooled.

Regardless, I'm sticking it out for this round and I will see whether or not it's worth continuing with its latest changes. If nothing else, I'll calm down on the writing and marketing (I've marketed the hell out of the main page since I joined the project, :p) and treat it as more of a side project.

Thanks for the more in depth explanation.  When you say "this round" do you mean round 26 or 27?  I'm hoping round 26 stays as it was before, so as not to switch midstream.

Yes, the rewarding for marketing does pose issues, which is why I pointed it out, and clearly you have thought of them as well.  I think it would be better to reward writing and marketing separately, especially since stories can grow in popularity weeks and months after they are written and paid for.  The other thing is that the sort of writing that attracts short term surges of traffic (i.e., stuff lots of people want to read) isn't necessarily going to be the same quality of writing that will last, but I guess that's been a problem for centuries (Mozart died a pauper and yet his music lives on).

I will have to decide as I go if this is workable for me.  I'm a decent writer and a terrible marketer, and I don't really have the time to do both.  Writing for the Devtome so far has been great because it rewarded my writing without depending on my ability to market it, which up to now has been unheard of.  But from the beginning I have viewed this as most likely a temporary opportunity--one to take full advantage of now and not take for granted will always be there.  The couple rounds I have gotten paid for have made a huge difference for me and I'm trying to use my DVC in a way that will make that positive difference continue even if the Devtome opportunity dries up for me.

One factor beyond anyone's control that will impact whether or not the new system is still worth it for me is the DVC/BTC exchange rate.  When the price of DVC is low, you want to be able to earn lots of them.  When the price is high, even earning just a few can go a long way.  But the way the rounds are paid for, you really can't know at the time you're writing what the exchange rate will be in a month to six weeks, so my goal has been to get as many as I could.

Not sure what I will do moving forward, but I will probably have to try writing under the new system to see how it plays out, and then decide if I want to keep going.

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August 06, 2013, 01:13:08 AM
 #646

My 2 DVC on the change in payment based on page views.  I haven't worked through the math, but it looks like if I write 1000 words and no one ever reads it, I would get 0.75 share for it.  Correct?

The worth is based on your total unique page views over your total number of words. That determines the earnings multiplier for all your new words. The earnings multiplier is for the author, not the articles. The assumption is that if the author wrote popular articles in the past, their new articles or words will also be popular.

Quote
The one thing I would like to have for sure is that when this formula kicks in, that our earnings are shown on the various files that we already use to determine this.  So, if I'm getting .75 share for something, I'd like that to be indicated so that I can plan to write more or market harder during that round.  I can work with this as long as I know what to expect.

You can download the example file from:
https://raw.github.com/Unthinkingbit/charity/master/devtome_26.csv

then open it in a spreadsheet. The Bounded Earnings Multiplier column is currently second to last, and the Earnings column is the last.

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August 06, 2013, 01:15:23 AM
 #647

Collation.

I just read http://www.devtome.com/doku.php?id=devtome_writer_rules_read_me_first and found it interesting.

However, I wonder if there is a change in terminology required here. Collation means ordering or sorting. The way I see it described in the Devtome entry doesn't really mesh with sorting. The Devtome entry seems to be defining the use of "citations," which is entirely different from creating order out of other works. Citations are perfectly normal and happen quite frequently, especially in more academic writing where if you are not citing other authorities, then you aren't engaging existing scholarship. A citation is just not the same as collation and certainly is not a category of materials by itself.

IMO, the collation of materials is the refining, extensive editing or the creating of order out of other works. I would also like to suggest that collated (or whatever term is used) material should not exist elsewhere online. We're trying to create better references and resources, right? Making things available for the community at large for common access and improving on materials that are not in digital form. A collection of materials that has no fee attached and can be read or sent digitally.

Just some thoughts.

Thank you for your input! That wasn't meant to be publicly read yet; I sent it off to the other admins to check out and verify before I push it out. With that said, maybe there's a bit of confusion on my part as well. My understanding is that it would have to be something that is written about someone else's work, using quotes from them and such, as doing things like just fixing grammar and spelling in articles has been deemed as against the rules. Here's what I based it on:

"Collated work, which is largely based on another open source article, is also counted, although with a weighting of currently 0.3. The collated work can not be simply a copy of another article, it must have improvements and the type of improvements must be listed in the invoice."

I think we need to get this clarified so I can modify the rule listing if necessary. Also, feel free to pm me if you feel there are any other inconsistencies.

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August 06, 2013, 01:23:51 AM
 #648

..
I looked at the bounty page here http://www.devtome.com/doku.php?id=devcoin_bounty_now and it says that there is a bounty for a logo/symbol and a button (3/5 and 1/5 of a share respectively).

What it says is:
http://www.devtome.com/doku.php?id=devcoin_bounty_now#button

"One fifth of a share for another devcoin button."

and
http://www.devtome.com/doku.php?id=devcoin_bounty_now#symbol

"3/5 of a share for a devcoin symbol."

What you drew is a logo, if you wish you can convert it to a button and get one fifth of a share. Marticps won the logo vote last month, so the logo awards were ended.

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August 06, 2013, 01:35:50 AM
 #649

So what are we doing to mark Devcoin's two year anniversary on August 5th?

I vote we all flock to the bitcoin subreddit on the day and tip random people 10 cents worth (about 1667 devcoins at the moment) - there is an altcoin tipbot that is devcoin enabled - see http://www.reddit.com/r/ALTcointip/comments/1esl7u/altcointip_bot_now_live/

has anyone got any other ideas?


and Wiser wrote:

So what are we doing to mark Devcoin's two year anniversary on August 5th?

I am so glad you mentioned this!

I've been working on a website about Bitcoins and Devcoins (for now, could expand into other currencies later).  It's called Creative Currencies and the url is http://creativecurrencies.cu.cc  I just set up my email list and was thinking of some ways to promote it and entice people to subscribe.  I think I might just hold some sort of DVC giveaway, choose one or two lucky subscribers, in honor of the anniversary.

That will depend on if I get it together in time...

I suggest a bounty of 9 shares for the first person to do something for the anniversary, 6 for the second, and 3 for the third. I recommend that the party organizer keeps half and gives half to the partygoers if there are any, but it's up to them. Any objections, or should anything be changed?

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August 06, 2013, 02:53:21 AM
 #650

I suggest a bounty of 9 shares for the first person to do something for the anniversary, 6 for the second, and 3 for the third. I recommend that the party organizer keeps half and gives half to the partygoers if there are any, but it's up to them. Any objections, or should anything be changed?

OK, I'll bite.  I'm offering some DVCs to everyone who subscribes to my list (and provides a DVC address) before midnight Eastern Standard Time August 6, 2013.  I'll post a thread in the alternative crypto section of this forum and the newbie section.

Here's the article with the subscription form:  http://creativecurrencies.cu.cc/2013/08/05/in-honor-of-devcoins-second-anniversary/

Edit:  I also posted this on the Devtome:  http://devtome.com/doku.php?id=in_honor_of_devcoins_second_anniversary

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August 06, 2013, 02:58:32 AM
 #651

I suggest a bounty of 9 shares for the first person to do something for the anniversary, 6 for the second, and 3 for the third. I recommend that the party organizer keeps half and gives half to the partygoers if there are any, but it's up to them. Any objections, or should anything be changed?

OK, I'll bite.  I'm offering some DVCs to everyone who subscribes to my list (and provides a DVC address) before midnight Eastern Standard Time August 6, 2013.  I'll post a thread in the alternative crypto section of this forum and the newbie section.

Here's the article with the subscription form:  http://creativecurrencies.cu.cc/2013/08/05/in-honor-of-devcoins-second-anniversary/

Joined! What's the inputs.io address needed for btw?

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August 06, 2013, 03:05:30 AM
 #652

I suggest a bounty of 9 shares for the first person to do something for the anniversary, 6 for the second, and 3 for the third. I recommend that the party organizer keeps half and gives half to the partygoers if there are any, but it's up to them. Any objections, or should anything be changed?

OK, I'll bite.  I'm offering some DVCs to everyone who subscribes to my list (and provides a DVC address) before midnight Eastern Standard Time August 6, 2013.  I'll post a thread in the alternative crypto section of this forum and the newbie section.

Here's the article with the subscription form:  http://creativecurrencies.cu.cc/2013/08/05/in-honor-of-devcoins-second-anniversary/

Joined! What's the inputs.io address needed for btw?

At some point (and I'm moving slowly on this) I was thinking I'd offer random "prizes" in BTC and DVC for things like posting good comments and other random things.  I don't want to have a faucet, per se, but figured it might be fun to occasionally "bless" a subscriber with something, and inputs.io makes it easy to send small BTC amounts around without the transaction fees Smiley

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August 06, 2013, 03:21:34 AM
 #653

I suggest a bounty of 9 shares for the first person to do something for the anniversary, 6 for the second, and 3 for the third. I recommend that the party organizer keeps half and gives half to the partygoers if there are any, but it's up to them. Any objections, or should anything be changed?

OK, I'll bite.  I'm offering some DVCs to everyone who subscribes to my list (and provides a DVC address) before midnight Eastern Standard Time August 6, 2013.  I'll post a thread in the alternative crypto section of this forum and the newbie section.

Here's the article with the subscription form:  http://creativecurrencies.cu.cc/2013/08/05/in-honor-of-devcoins-second-anniversary/

Joined! What's the inputs.io address needed for btw?

At some point (and I'm moving slowly on this) I was thinking I'd offer random "prizes" in BTC and DVC for things like posting good comments and other random things.  I don't want to have a faucet, per se, but figured it might be fun to occasionally "bless" a subscriber with something, and inputs.io makes it easy to send small BTC amounts around without the transaction fees Smiley

Awesome idea. Thanks!

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August 06, 2013, 03:56:34 AM
 #654

Awesome idea. Thanks!

I actually got the idea of using inputs.io from you--I clicked through the link in your signature line and liked what I saw Smiley

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August 06, 2013, 06:16:07 AM
 #655

As suggested, I've put up an article about investing in DVC in lieu of trying to sell it. It includes sample earnings from the data at cryptostocks.com.

http://www.devtome.com/doku.php?id=devcoin_stock_purchases

Is the d.evco.in site down?
I can't seem to download the devtome_earnings_26.csv file.

Try this http://devtome.com/doku.php?id=devcoin_block_explorer

The same thing happened to me today. http://darkgamex.ch:2751/chain/DevCoin is working fine right now.

I still can't download the file!
I need it for an article.
get the reciever files from here: http://devcoin.darkgamex.ch/

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BTC/DVC/TRC/FRC: 1K1773RbXRZVRQSSXe9N6N2MUFERvrdu6y ANC/XPM AK1773RTmRKtvbKBCrUu95UQg5iegrqyeA NMC: NK1773Rzv8b4ugmCgX789PbjewA9fL9Dy1 LTC: LKi773RBuPepQH8E6Zb1ponoCvgbU7hHmd EMC: EK1773RxUes1HX1YAGMZ1xVYBBRUCqfDoF BQC: bK1773R1APJz4yTgRkmdKQhjhiMyQpJgfN
FuzzyBear
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August 06, 2013, 03:31:33 PM
 #656

Quote
I have done the calculations for you and edited the article so we are not falsely advertising.  Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong.

Ticker    DVC    Price           Shares           DPS (Last)   30-day Dividend   ROI %
DVB            1000000   185           5405.405405   0.0090654   0.03054563   0.00000305%
ASCMDVCPT    1000000   10000   100                   28.89961953   140.5292372   0.01405292%
P2PDVC            1000000   100.6   9940.357853   0.01                    0.401           0.0000401%
PYRPXYDVC    1000000   900            1111.111111   1111.111111   6.56905504   0.00065691%

I have not changed any of the text so you may want to edit that when you get a chance.

FuzzyBear


Thanks! I went ahead and got to it today. I've updated the explanation and dropped the ROI column (since it's only the same info in the 30-day dividend column moved a few spots to the right). I changed the description to fit. The 30-day dividend column also has additional explanation to show, for example, that one share of P2PDVC will give 0.371029 ''per share'' so that in the example, the investor will have 0.371029*9940.357853 shares, which is much more significant than what I had there previously. I may have had the earlier version mixed up with another chart I was doing. Thanks for the catch.

Seriously dude... please check your maths.... you are soo far out it is unreal.

Starting to think you are either running the P2PDVC listing or you are a shrill for it and just trying to falsely advertise this as being the best investment.

FuzzyBear

if you calculating the 30 day dividends on ASCMDVCPT I make it:
28.93082151 + 27.17240263 + 36.57980507 + 47.87741000 + 28.89961953 = 169.46005874 for last 30 days dividends....

You are saying you have 100 shares in the stock... that means you got paid 16,946.005874 DVC

slight difference from the 28.93082151 you are listing.

P2PDVC calculating dividends as of 2nd August
I made it total dividends paid out of 0.401 DVC for 30 days
you say you have 9940.3578530 stock.... and as fractions of stocks not possible call it 9940
9940 * 0.401 = 3985.94DVC payout....

I have not checked the other listings, but PYPROXYDVC has only ever paid out one dividend so that not too hard, and DVB been up and down in dividends payout so not run the numbers....

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August 06, 2013, 03:39:10 PM
 #657

FuzzyBear,

Where is the math incorrect? Point it out instead of just flying off and getting angry.
Updated my post with figures and calculations... perhaps show your working on the site... or at least how each column is calculated that way you can be sure it is correct and that others are reading it correctly.

Sorry if I "Flew off and got angry" but you failed to show your working and have clearly posted incorrect data twice now... Need I remind anyone of the backlash that came about from someone falsely advertising dvc at $10 a coin?? It only brings bad reputation to the coin, community and devtome, so sorry but I will take a hard line with this.

FuzzyBear

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August 06, 2013, 03:45:23 PM
 #658

FuzzyBear,

Where is the math incorrect? Point it out instead of just flying off and getting angry.

I have to tend to agree with FuzzyBear.   You consistently get the math wrong and always in favor of the one bond in the group.  You do not even point out the differences between bonds and stocks and how valuations of them tend to be treated differently as well.

You wrote the article,  you get dvc for doing that.  Others should not have to keep pointing out you have the basic math glaringly wrong and inconsistent.   You should show your work so we can see where you are getting things so far off.   At least three times now you have created a very misleading chart.  Sad thing is sales of the asset you are pumping have gone up from it.   Guess your obvious errors are not as obvious to all as I would have thought.

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August 06, 2013, 04:07:08 PM
 #659

As a general FYI, I have bought into the P2PDVC bond over the past month at a range of 100.4 to 100.6 a share.  The price hasn't changed all that much.  I see no evidence that it's being pumped.  I'm not super thrilled with the return (it's low) but it seems to be a stable asset so good for capital preservation and a little bit of growth.  I like the daily payouts too.  low risk/low reward  One question/concern I have about it is that if you look at the order book, it appears that there are sell orders that are way larger than the entire issue of shares, which is at 20,000.  EDIT:  Oops, read that wrong--it's 20,000,000 shares issued so the sell orders make more sense.  How does that work?

ASCMDVCPT is the best asset I've encountered as far as return.  For what you put into it, you get a lot more out in dividends, but the price jumps up and down a lot more so you could lose if you try to sell at the wrong time.  That doesn't bother me too much as I buy and hold.  higher risk/higher reward

I'm glad that there are these DVC securities, especially when the DVC price is low like it is now.  I'd love to see more of them Smiley

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August 06, 2013, 04:22:19 PM
 #660

Thank you. I only had listed on single payment from them at IPO. ACSM will be updated to include the information that you've pointed out.

Your edit on my Devtome entry only changed the P2PDVC price and the 30-day cumulative figure. And after going back, I discovered that we were both wrong: The total payout per share for P2PDVC for the last 30 days is 0.40102932 DVC, as of today.


His edit fixed it assuming that you had that column as a per unit price.  It made little sense to list it that way, but that was how you had the majority of them listed.  His edit may have not been 100% accurate depending on your starting and end dates, but it was within a small percentage after that.  You then changed it to again be off by orders of magnitude and again for the same asset.  For the third time, errors happen, but when they happen consistently in one direction for the same result after being pointed out,  they become highly questionable.

Quote
Start to think whatever you want, but your tone is not helpful. I could care less personally, but you make it try to look like I'm plugging it when I'm simply excited about something that NO ONE is even mentioning. Information I would have found useful a few months ago!

You would have found information that is misleading and off by orders of a magnitude useful?     


Quote
And to twobits, that's where you can help, you know. Instead of crying about it, fix it. And I don't care about the differences between bonds and stocks. I care about the return. That was the whole point. I want the DVC doing something. I'm not pumping it either. Look at the chart for P2PDVC, it hasn't even budged in the last week. I started buying in about five days ago or so. I've been the only one buying it. If you're going to throw your twobits in, at least get it right.


What exactly did I get wrong? 

It was fixed, by fuzzy,  to at least be consistent, you then broke it again.   Now I agree that what you started to change it to would make more sense as to what should be in that column, but again you made it that for only one of the assets.  If you are going to try and find the dividend/interest payments for 1million dvc, for a one month period you need to use the same methods of  calculation for all of them.

If you do not care about the difference, then you also do not actually care about return, these differences make up a large part of the total return.   Also for an issue that has 20,000,000 issued, with 62,449 publicly held a pump is going to be reflected in volume not price of course, so you claim it is not being pumped due to no price rise would be a false observation.

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