Merit & new rank requirements

[tranthidung]

Update:

Time series plots:

(1) Intra-day merits:
Full dataset:

Truncated dataset:

(2) Merits over days of week:
Outliers displayed as red circles.

Outliers non-displayed.

(3) Median and interquartile range of intra-day merits over weeks

(4) Intra-week merits:

For more details, please get them there:
Time Series Analysis on Distributed Merits in the forum (daily, weekly, monthly)
Observation on interquartile range of intra-day merits with time series plot

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[erikalui]

I noticed that since merits given cannot be removed, the merits given for topics that have been deleted also exist in the user's account. Since such deleted posts get deducted from the post count, shouldn't the merits given for such posts also be deducted?

[DdmrDdmr]

<…>

It’s been a topic that has been discussed in the past a few times, for example here:

Merit for Deleted Posts
Disable delete option from merited post
Combine merit abuse with delete post and you are good to go

The current stance remains on not deleting merits on deleted posts. I make merits tied to deleted posts a maximum of 5% of all historical awarded sMerits, and just over 1% of that awarded during 2019 so far.

I figure, if the amount is not too representative, the option taken was to preserve them on the accounts, regardless of the posts being deleted themselves. There are likely many reasons for this to happen (merit abuse hiding prove, deleted thread where you placed a decent post or answer, and so on). Lesser evil prevailed.

I’ve personally received 5 sMerits on what seem to now be deleted posts. I can’t recall the exact posts, but I believe at least one of them was merited after replying to a plagiarized post, which ultimately led to the thread being deleted.

[tranthidung]

I noticed that since merits given cannot be removed, the merits given for topics that have been deleted also exist in the user's account. Since such deleted posts get deducted from the post count, shouldn't the merits given for such posts also be deducted?

Only serious merit abused cases will see actions of theymos (admin) to revert abused merits. However, in such cases, negative number of merits will be shown. I knew there is one merit source removed months ago with reversion of all merit abusements related to that source.

[tspmhack6]

Indeed to receive Merit, there should be quality contributions. So I think why we don't have the "Like" button. Based on the number of Likes, up to one limit the quality of the post user will receive Merit.
Example:  10 Like = 1 Merit
What do you think about that idea?

[Halab]

What do you think about that idea?

Certainly already proposed many times and too easy to abuse by creating an army of alt accounts.
Deal with it, the merit system in its current form is the least worst solution against spam.

[JayJuanGee]

Indeed to receive Merit, there should be quality contributions. So I think why we don't have the "Like" button. Based on the number of Likes, up to one limit the quality of the post user will receive Merit.
Example:  10 Like = 1 Merit
What do you think about that idea?

Seems to me that you are mentally fighting the existing system and the direction that this forum has chosen to take.

The forum is not going to go down the path of either unlimited "likes" or some other untethered mechanism  to allow any account to earn "merits" because such unfetteredness has already proven problematic, so the current merit system is an attempt to get a handle on the unfetteredness that comes from farmed accounts.

In other words, your proposal is not going to go anywhere because it fails/refuses to attempt to address actual issues and motivations behind the current merit system.

What do you think about that idea?

Certainly already proposed many times and too easy to abuse by creating an army of alt accounts.
Deal with it, the merit system in its current form is the least worst solution against spam.

Hahahahaha...

More or less Halab beat me to it.... 

[fillippone]

Indeed to receive Merit, there should be quality contributions. So I think why we don't have the "Like" button. Based on the number of Likes, up to one limit the quality of the post user will receive Merit.
Example:  10 Like = 1 Merit
What do you think about that idea?

Your proposal is very simple and effective.
I think some similar proposal must have been considered by Theymos, but not put in production in the end.
So you are not proposing a improvement, but only supporting a previously discarded inferior option.

[tranthidung]

Three question:
- Why do we need the Like button?
- What are differences between Like button and Merit button?
- Is the Like Button easier to abuse than Merit Button?

Example:  10 Like = 1 Merit

Personally, the Like button purpose is the same as Merit button, but it is easier to abuse, so I don't support the idea.

Your proposal is very simple and effective.
I think some similar proposal must have been considered by Theymos, but not put in production in the end.
So you are not proposing a improvement, but only supporting a previously discarded inferior option.

[TryNinja]

Three question:
- Why do we need the Like button?

I believe it would be some kind of “simpler” merit. Like posts you agree/like, think it’s funny, etc.. not necessarily HQ posts but not spam.

- What are differences between Like button and Merit button?

If 10 likes = 1 merit (I wouldn’t agree with giving merit for likes if they’re unlimited/free for everyone), then likes are a lighter kind of reward or way to show that you agree with the post.

- Is the Like Button easier to abuse than Merit Button?

If it’s unlimited or we give to everybody and they can turn into merit, then yes. Anything that can be used by multi-accounts can easily be abused.

Personally, the Like button purpose is the same as Merit button, but it is easier to abuse, so I don't support the idea.

Your proposal is very simple and effective.
I think some similar proposal must have been considered by Theymos, but not put in production in the end.
So you are not proposing a improvement, but only supporting a previously discarded inferior option.

Yeah, that was the first idea given by a few members before the merit system. There is no way theymos is going to add a like system when the merit system is already out.

[tranthidung]

Additionally, why not suggest sendable Likes ~ sLikes. Then we will have another supplementary Likes and sendable Likes for merit and sMerits.
10 likes ~ 1 merits
10 likes ~ 5 sendable likes that can be sent to another user ~ giving them 0.5 merit (10 likes ~ 1 merit as suggested)
Then the cycle will repeat and likely abused.
Like and Merit buttons will overlap each other, and why do we have to correlate Likes with Merits? Once again, I don't see reasons to have Like button.  

[LoyceV]

If I remember correctly, there were 123 Merit sources yesterday. One dropped out:

Theymos has responded to my request to be removed as a merit source.  No more working for free. 

I think theymos took the opportunity to process new Merit source applications, there are now 130 merit sources with a total merit generation of up to 20605 sMerit per 30 days.
One of them is Coolcryptovator.

[btcsmlcmnr]

I think theymos took the opportunity to process new Merit source applications, there are now 130 merit sources with a total merit generation of up to 20605 sMerit per 30 days.
One of them is Coolcryptovator.

Yes, 123 merit sources remain unchanged for months, and now we see a bull run of merit sources in the forum, that nearly occured simultaneously with bitcoin bull run, and permanent ban bull run. Consequently, we might see a trend of merit source applications come back soon. Origninally, I wrote my suggestion here, but after minutes of rethinking, I decided to create a topic for this suggestion.

Due to LoyceV updated today:

I think theymos took the opportunity to process new Merit source applications, there are now 130 merit sources with a total merit generation of up to 20605 sMerit per 30 days.
One of them is Coolcryptovator.

It means that there are 8 new merit sources added hours ago. For now, I don't know who are new sources, only one mentioned by LoyceV is Coolcryptovator; and theymos actually has never had intention to disclose who are sources. Over next few weeks, we surely can discover new sources by ourselves.
Can I raise my suggestion that all merit source applications that get acceptance from theymos with this wave of adding 7 or 8 new merit sources should lock their merit source applications, since today. I am sure that all merit source applicants actually replied in the topic, so whenever you see my post, please consider about my suggestion, because I don't want to dump Meta board with the new thread and give spammers places to spam, in the topic, and in all accepted merit sources applications.

Locked!

[slocker]

Three question:
- Why do we need the Like button?
- What are differences between Like button and Merit button?
- Is the Like Button easier to abuse than Merit Button?

Example:  10 Like = 1 Merit

Personally, the Like button purpose is the same as Merit button, but it is easier to abuse, so I don't support the idea.

Your proposal is very simple and effective.
I think some similar proposal must have been considered by Theymos, but not put in production in the end.
So you are not proposing a improvement, but only supporting a previously discarded inferior option.

If this is considering to be option, then my opinions on this that this forum will become something like Facebook Instagram or twitter with this like button. This will only bring little mess on this. Consider this many who use Instagram knows that you give like button most of the time just by looking and accidentally pressing it. This could be very easily abused even more then merit system, and if comes to that that certain number of likes get merit then it will be very hard to track all this.

[tranthidung]

If this is considering to be option, then my opinions on this that this forum will become something like Facebook Instagram or twitter with this like button. This will only bring little mess on this. Consider this many who use Instagram knows that you give like button most of the time just by looking and accidentally pressing it. This could be very easily abused even more then merit system, and if comes to that that certain number of likes get merit then it will be very hard to track all this.

If Bitcointalk.org becomes a social media platform, like Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, the Like button might be added.
However:
Why do we actually need another substitute of merit whilst merit fullfils its function very well so far?
Who will manage the coming Like Button? (Mods already are very busy with their works, and I believe they don't want to see another worlkloads from Like button).

[bakasabo]

Additionally, why not suggest sendable Likes ~ sLikes. Then we will have another supplementary Likes and sendable Likes for merit and sMerits.
10 likes ~ 1 merits
10 likes ~ 5 sendable likes that can be sent to another user ~ giving them 0.5 merit (10 likes ~ 1 merit as suggested)
Then the cycle will repeat and likely abused.
Like and Merit buttons will overlap each other, and why do we have to correlate Likes with Merits? Once again, I don't see reasons to have Like button.  

I'm afraid that will turn forum from serious crypto related into decent interest forum. First will be likes, then hearts and broken hearts will introduced.


And in nearest future stickers would appear on the forum (plus some of them will be for extra money)

(Stickers like this)

[tranthidung]

Animated flying hearts, maybe, then the forum will look like a kindergarten. We might see flying-broken-heart overuse in Ban Appeals.
After disable Animated avartars and other things like user stats, will theymos do such funny and annoying thing?

[tranthidung]

Update:

Time series plots:

(1) Intra-day merits:
Full dataset:

Truncated dataset:

(2) Merits over days of week:
Outliers displayed as red circles.

Outliers non-displayed.

(3) Median and interquartile range of intra-day merits over weeks

(4) Intra-week merits:

For more details, please get them there:
Time Series Analysis on Distributed Merits in the forum (daily, weekly, monthly)
Observation on interquartile range of intra-day merits with time series plot

[vfilchef]

I had not written in the forum for a long time, and I was surprised to be a newbie again  .
This system for me is a bullshit and serves the group of spammers in the forum and the group of old users is lost - Satoshi Nakamoto surely he is a newbie and I am proud to be in a group with him   .
In my opinion, merit points must also be earned for each year from the registration of an account.

[DdmrDdmr]

<...>

Looks like you’ve got quite a bit of reading and catching up to do … satoshi has 2016 merits, which are really totally irrelevant in the big picture of things, so how exactly are you on the same group?

You are on the other hand in a larger group of 2.591.651 existing accounts – 28.340 (earned) merited accounts = 2.563.311 accounts that have 0 earned merits …

Edit: Well, now you've abandoned the communards group and entered the group of those that have earned 2 merits or more: 17.419 accounts in that group. Quite a leap …