Official Thread: AMT

[clenell]

No, I said anything you say about them now is going to have a negative bias because of how you were treated. And because you were treated so poorly by them you have a right to be upset which would obviously come through in your posts. That was the and rightly so.

Are you so blinded by anger that you think everyone is out to get ya? Do you think I would endorse their brand of customer service?

I've specifically mentioned multiple times in this thread that I don't like the way they have run the front of house. Ignoring your customers and lying are not acceptable things, which I've mentioned a multitude of times.

my bad. i apologize. i misunderstood you.

[1714759024]

1714759024

[1714759024]

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[clenell]

i would like to predict AMT will file for bankruptcy. Remember you heard it here first.

[FrictionlessCoin]

I will be going the small claims court route today.   

I have given them the weekend to respond on a refund and they have not done so.

Companies that are this late in delivering should be making the extra effort to accommodate their customers, not the exact opposite.

[Biffa]

Looks like Bitmine will stop shipping its Rev.2 systems.

http://bitmine.ch/?p=5402

Same kind of system that AMT has yet to ship a single unit of.

Reads to me like Georgio, Joshua Zipkin and Tyler Lummis are off to Amsterdam.

also on the same day as the other news that was posted here about bitmine.

http://bitmine.ch/?p=5329

and

http://bitmine.ch/?p=5404

Doesn't look like Georgio is going anywhere. Can't say the same for AMT.

I wish someone else in was in the PA area who could make a quick trip.

LOL pictures taken on the 27th Feb.

[rik_khaos]

I will be going the small claims court route today.   

I have given them the weekend to respond on a refund and they have not done so.

Companies that are this late in delivering should be making the extra effort to accommodate their customers, not the exact opposite.

I'd still send a certified letter with return receipt prior to filing. It's solid documented proof that you sent a request and they received it as it actually has to be signed for, then if they don't respond it should help strengthen the case. I don't know how e-mails would be treated by the court nor forum posts. But a collection of all of the above couldn't hurt. Good luck in your case. Let us know how long it takes,if it's worth the effort and if you ever get your money back.

I wonder if people will end up suing AMT, Bitmine, and the chip manufacturer? They are all complicit in the miners being received in an untimely manner. Obviously it would be a bitch of a time since they are foreign companies.

[rik_khaos]

Looks like Bitmine will stop shipping its Rev.2 systems.

http://bitmine.ch/?p=5402

Same kind of system that AMT has yet to ship a single unit of.

Reads to me like Georgio, Joshua Zipkin and Tyler Lummis are off to Amsterdam.

also on the same day as the other news that was posted here about bitmine.

http://bitmine.ch/?p=5329

and

http://bitmine.ch/?p=5404

Doesn't look like Georgio is going anywhere. Can't say the same for AMT.

I wish someone else in was in the PA area who could make a quick trip.

LOL pictures taken on the 27th Feb.

I'm not exactly sure whats funny about assembly that was happening on the 27th of february, perhaps you can let me in on the joke.

The picture in the next post of the Rev 3 board was taken on 3/12? I'm assuming this is a knee slapper as well.

[rik_khaos]

http://smallbusiness.chron.com/company-sue-goes-bankrupt-do-64339.html

I'm waiting for the first lawsuit to hit, then they declare bankruptcy then no one can sue.

Unless you can prove the defrauded you.

blacks law dictionary defines

Defraud: http://thelawdictionary.org/defraud/

and

Deceit http://thelawdictionary.org/deceit/

Looks like this could be the case unless they can prove that they have the mining equipment and were honestly attempting to get it out, but met delays that took the company down.

[captin crunch]

"In bitmine's news update Georgio said that they are looking to 1300W PSU to run the 1 th coincraft desk and they are running into sourcing issues. I wonder if AMT is experiencing a  similar issue and is just waiting on a shipment of PSUs to complete a backlog of otherwise assembled miners. Then they can claim they weren't lying about assembly ( though it would be a half truth)."


This is very plausible, but if this wee the case all they would need to do is communicate this to their customers and a lot would understand. However their sporadic updates of non-factual information with little to no fallow up has left a lot of us in the position where we can't believe a word they say.

[captin crunch]

http://smallbusiness.chron.com/company-sue-goes-bankrupt-do-64339.html

I'm waiting for the first lawsuit to hit, then they declare bankruptcy then no one can sue.

Unless you can prove the defrauded you.

blacks law dictionary defines

Defraud: http://thelawdictionary.org/defraud/

and

Deceit http://thelawdictionary.org/deceit/

Looks like this could be the case unless they can prove that they have the mining equipment and were honestly attempting to get it out, but met delays that took the company down.

Here is the problem. I have been on the losing end of a few business's going bankrupt. the only group of people to come out on top are the lawyers as they get paid no matter what the outcome.
With AMT's business model it is clear they have already spent our money and need to con more people and make more sales to complete their backlog.

[sirminesalot]

Rik: You're grasping at straws. Read back, you'll see they threw Clennel under the bus for inquiring about his order.

I'll give it another week before you come to your senses and stop defending AMT at every turn.

[captin crunch]

I got bored this weekend and decided to go back and read the beginning of this thread again. AMT has edited their posts to the point where it is hard to fallow the conversation.

If you want a good nervous laugh read this edited 1st post. the best part is their warning to newbies to do their homework and not order from a scam company. I hope people heed their warning and avoid the situation we here find ourselves in.

Hi All,   (updated 2/1/2014)

We're Advanced Mining Technologies and we're located in Haverford, PA.

We design, build, assemble and ship Asic miners. We've worked with Bitfury, Avalon, and now the coincraft A1 chip for our terrahash miners.

We accept most forms of payment. Local pickup is an option for sure. Our pricing vs lead time is the best in the industry. We're real and when you call the office someone usually picks up.

Below are some key factors that separate us from most other asic manufacturers.

1. We've actually shipped miners and have been doing so since November 2013.
2. We speak to our customers directly and we are trying to improve our customer service everyday.
3. You can find our products on Amazon and buy them with a credit card.
4. We're American and proud to build our miners in America and not China.
5. We deliver on time if the situation is in our immediate control.
6. We take checks, and all forms of checks too, even personal.
7. We offer customer support for guys that are just starting in the mining industry.
8. Our hardware is built to be upgradable, you can add more GH/s to each of our machines accept the 80ghs (as of now).
9. We're in this for the long haul and we've filed with the IRS.
10. We don't mine.

We are working very hard, and we're usually over tired and kinda out there, but your free to come see us at our administrative office anytime you'd like. We are located at:
355 lancaster Ave, Bldg E1, Haverford, PA 19041.  If your coming from  downtown Philly or I95, take 476 to cityline ave and then after a few miles make a right on Lancaster.

To newbies:  There are a lot of scams out there, please take your time and evaluate each seller/company/manufacturer before buying. Even if the deal seems great or the buying opportunity seems to be limited.

There are a few decent companies in America, and a few decent companies in Europe that actually sell, build and ship miners, but most foreign companies are  complete scams.



 

[Biffa]

Looks like Bitmine will stop shipping its Rev.2 systems.

http://bitmine.ch/?p=5402

Same kind of system that AMT has yet to ship a single unit of.

Reads to me like Georgio, Joshua Zipkin and Tyler Lummis are off to Amsterdam.

also on the same day as the other news that was posted here about bitmine.

http://bitmine.ch/?p=5329

and

http://bitmine.ch/?p=5404

Doesn't look like Georgio is going anywhere. Can't say the same for AMT.

I wish someone else in was in the PA area who could make a quick trip.

LOL pictures taken on the 27th Feb.

I'm not exactly sure whats funny about assembly that was happening on the 27th of february, perhaps you can let me in on the joke.

The picture in the next post of the Rev 3 board was taken on 3/12? I'm assuming this is a knee slapper as well.

Well posting pictures from 3 weeks ag that are supposed to show news related to the current situation doesn't seem strange to you? Why not post some pictures that directly relate to the news? Unless the news is really old news. Or that its not possible to take new pictures for some reason or another. Dunno, but seems a bit strange to me.

3 Weeks is a long time in bitcoin world and even longer for the poor people waiting for their promised hardware. If the photos are supposed to be representative of the "50 rigs a day" or whatever it is now, being produced then photos more indicative of a recent "Ramp up" would be more apt don't you think?

As to the other picture, not really interested of the boards that the Chinese Dragon 1T miner manufacturers helped them design because they were incapable of doing it themselves. Thats old news.

[clenell]

I got bored this weekend and decided to go back and read the beginning of this thread again. AMT has edited their posts to the point where it is hard to fallow the conversation.

If you want a good nervous laugh read this edited 1st post. the best part is their warning to newbies to do their homework and not order from a scam company. I hope people heed their warning and avoid the situation we here find ourselves in.

Hi All,   (updated 2/1/2014)

We're Advanced Mining Technologies and we're located in Haverford, PA.

We design, build, assemble and ship Asic miners. We've worked with Bitfury, Avalon, and now the coincraft A1 chip for our terrahash miners.

We accept most forms of payment. Local pickup is an option for sure. Our pricing vs lead time is the best in the industry. We're real and when you call the office someone usually picks up.

Below are some key factors that separate us from most other asic manufacturers.

1. We've actually shipped miners and have been doing so since November 2013.
2. We speak to our customers directly and we are trying to improve our customer service everyday.
3. You can find our products on Amazon and buy them with a credit card.
4. We're American and proud to build our miners in America and not China.
5. We deliver on time if the situation is in our immediate control.
6. We take checks, and all forms of checks too, even personal.
7. We offer customer support for guys that are just starting in the mining industry.
8. Our hardware is built to be upgradable, you can add more GH/s to each of our machines accept the 80ghs (as of now).
9. We're in this for the long haul and we've filed with the IRS.
10. We don't mine.

We are working very hard, and we're usually over tired and kinda out there, but your free to come see us at our administrative office anytime you'd like. We are located at:
355 lancaster Ave, Bldg E1, Haverford, PA 19041.  If your coming from  downtown Philly or I95, take 476 to cityline ave and then after a few miles make a right on Lancaster.

To newbies:  There are a lot of scams out there, please take your time and evaluate each seller/company/manufacturer before buying. Even if the deal seems great or the buying opportunity seems to be limited.

There are a few decent companies in America, and a few decent companies in Europe that actually sell, build and ship miners, but most foreign companies are  complete scams.

it's fucking nuts! AMT knows exactly what they should NOT be doing. However, they choose to do the very things they warn people about here?

FUCK YOU AMT MINERS YOU LYING ASSHOLES.

[rik_khaos]

Rik: You're grasping at straws. Read back, you'll see they threw Clennel under the bus for inquiring about his order.

I'll give it another week before you come to your senses and stop defending AMT at every turn.

Defending no, I think they are a terrible company. I saw that exchange actually. Though it usually takes a few attempts I've ended up getting responses. Sadly they don't answer all of my questions, but I've never personally been treated rudely by anyone associated with the company. I don't know if it's because I might phrase my e-mails in different ways but the company has never attacked me or been anything less than polite in the few phone calls I've had with them (I've talked to at least two people there on the phone).

I came in late in the game, I ordered and I'm going to wait it out until my advertised shipping date the 31st + 1-3 days for delivery, and at that time I'll take any steps necessary for recovery. Right now I have nothing to claim against them. I am completely understanding of people who ordered in November or December and are waiting for their orders, if I were in there shoes I would be upset too. The fact is delays were inevitable  at a stage before AMT could even really have the chance to fuck anything up. I'm sure people have been virtually banging down their doors since december threatening to sue them, e-mailing them and calling them fucking scum at a point where there was nothing they could do about it. If the chips weren't produced then there isn't any miner, that's just the facts of the matter.

What they failed to do was develop a professional relationship with their customer base. I've never receive an e-mail update that wasn't prompted by me. There was a period of time where they didn't bother to update their news section. Well at least until they did it in a shady way by back-dating post to make it look like there was communication all along. And posting pictures for something on the tenth of feb that wasn't taken until the 22nd of feb.

But still none of this means their intent is to scam anyone. There just isn't enough proof of that to call it a fact. What can be proved by fact ( through a limited number of pictures) is that things are progressing just not at the rate that everyone here, or there probably wants them to. Using GPS data we can locate at least the supplier of their backplane. Using GPS we can see they had the chips in their possession in haverford as of pictures taken at 2/1/14 at 3:51 am. Why would a company who wasn't going to produce anything that set itself up as a scam put that much capital into it. That would make them the worst scam artists of all time.

So, no I'm not defending them at every turn. I'm looking at things rationally and level headed and seeing what the logical conclusion is. I believe that conclusion is that AMT is a company that is in way over their heads. I think they didn't anticipate they would have the same issues as everyone else because they were not the company designing the chip. I think they don't know what to do about hundreds of people probably asking for refunds when that money is tied up in parts for the miners, they have a liquidity issue. And I don't think they anticipated that they wouldn't have things shipped at this point.

Now I get it, everyone in this business is going to freak out about a shifting time tables because profitability is directly linked to when you start operations. But you've seen many companies at this point who are not getting things out on time. We are at stage where we are prefunding the tech with our pre orders. Because that is what they are pre-orders. We made conscious decisions to send money to a company who did not even have the materials in hand to create the product we were purchasing. 

So I'm not going to blow up for no reason when I don't have the machine in my hand the second I want it. I'm not going to blow up when my miner is inevitably delayed by forces beyond the control of the company that I pre-ordered the product from. I don't care for the dishonesty and poor customer service I've seen them give others. But I'm not going to start calling them names and accusing their family members and starting conspiracy theories because none of that helps the situation. If that is defending them at every turn then we have a different definition of defending.

I would love it if everyone before me canceled their pre-order and I had a miner that much sooner but that isn't going to happen. If I ask for a refund I'm probably just one of a couple hundred getting ignored or getting the runaround. I have no ability to take legal action as my order isn't even late yet. So I'll sit here and wait, calm and collected while everyone else runs around screaming "Fire!" I'll progress as necessary when it comes to that time. 

[Syke]

I'll give it until the date they said my miner will ship by + the 1-3 days for expedited shipping. If it's not at my house I'll request a refund. If I do not receive one I'll show up in person, and make sure I either leave with a miner or my money. My branch has a bank in town and I'll escort someone from AMT right there to deposit the money. Then I'll turn around and buy an Bitmain S2 and a few S1s

LOL. Good luck with that. You'll show up at their door, and no one will be home. They're not ever at their "office". Then what?

I'd still send a certified letter with return receipt prior to filing. It's solid documented proof that you sent a request and they received it as it actually has to be signed for, then if they don't respond it should help strengthen the case.

Again, useless. They won't sign for it. People have tried visiting them. They're not there.

[FrictionlessCoin]

I'll give it until the date they said my miner will ship by + the 1-3 days for expedited shipping. If it's not at my house I'll request a refund. If I do not receive one I'll show up in person, and make sure I either leave with a miner or my money. My branch has a bank in town and I'll escort someone from AMT right there to deposit the money. Then I'll turn around and buy an Bitmain S2 and a few S1s

LOL. Good luck with that. You'll show up at their door, and no one will be home. They're not ever at their "office". Then what?

I'd still send a certified letter with return receipt prior to filing. It's solid documented proof that you sent a request and they received it as it actually has to be signed for, then if they don't respond it should help strengthen the case.

Again, useless. They won't sign for it. People have tried visiting them. They're not there.

I don't think you should discourage people from doing what they need to do to get a refund.

[Syke]

I don't think you should discourage people from doing what they need to do to get a refund.

True. It's a good first step. You can use the returned letter in your small claims court suit.

[opieum2]

Rik: You're grasping at straws. Read back, you'll see they threw Clennel under the bus for inquiring about his order.

I'll give it another week before you come to your senses and stop defending AMT at every turn.

Defending no, I think they are a terrible company. I saw that exchange actually. Though it usually takes a few attempts I've ended up getting responses. Sadly they don't answer all of my questions, but I've never personally been treated rudely by anyone associated with the company. I don't know if it's because I might phrase my e-mails in different ways but the company has never attacked me or been anything less than polite in the few phone calls I've had with them (I've talked to at least two people there on the phone).

I came in late in the game, I ordered and I'm going to wait it out until my advertised shipping date the 31st + 1-3 days for delivery, and at that time I'll take any steps necessary for recovery. Right now I have nothing to claim against them. I am completely understanding of people who ordered in November or December and are waiting for their orders, if I were in there shoes I would be upset too. The fact is delays were inevitable  at a stage before AMT could even really have the chance to fuck anything up. I'm sure people have been virtually banging down their doors since december threatening to sue them, e-mailing them and calling them fucking scum at a point where there was nothing they could do about it. If the chips weren't produced then there isn't any miner, that's just the facts of the matter.

What they failed to do was develop a professional relationship with their customer base. I've never receive an e-mail update that wasn't prompted by me. There was a period of time where they didn't bother to update their news section. Well at least until they did it in a shady way by back-dating post to make it look like there was communication all along. And posting pictures for something on the tenth of feb that wasn't taken until the 22nd of feb.

But still none of this means their intent is to scam anyone....

@rik

your level headed approach is exactly what this thread needs. For my part I have been trying to do the same. I do agree the communications practices AMT has can use alot of work. In my own interactions they have generally been good. But I do imagine they are getting slammed with emails and phone calls left and right. But I am in the same boat you are. Waiting it out until I see what my options are. Ideally it would behoove AMT to provide some shipping status update at least to save face. But not likely happening at this point. But yea the crazy theories and insults to anyone who isn't part of the troll mosh pit gets trolled. Again its simpler to just add those trolls to the ignore list with a couple of exceptions. Makes the thread readable.

I wrote up an open letter to them hoping that they do actually communicate with users with some kind of status update. Right now ANY communication on that front is better than silence. If people mass request refunds from them it wont work well for any of us. The shortsighted thinking of others ultimately affects everyone. Of course for those who had timelines and were told X date and it was not shipped by then are well within their right to request a refund. Its poor form for any company to say one date and not deliver on it with no explanation. Even BFL for their delayed (I use them as the turd standard) products even gives some explanation is to whats going on and why.

[sirminesalot]

i would like to predict AMT will file for bankruptcy. Remember you heard it here first.

+1

Although I must say that I originally brought this up as a possibility. I have seen it happen with other pre-order based companies in the past. End of the day, the customers lose in this scenario.

[sirminesalot]

Rik: You're grasping at straws. Read back, you'll see they threw Clennel under the bus for inquiring about his order.

I'll give it another week before you come to your senses and stop defending AMT at every turn.

Defending no, I think they are a terrible company. I saw that exchange actually. Though it usually takes a few attempts I've ended up getting responses. Sadly they don't answer all of my questions, but I've never personally been treated rudely by anyone associated with the company. I don't know if it's because I might phrase my e-mails in different ways but the company has never attacked me or been anything less than polite in the few phone calls I've had with them (I've talked to at least two people there on the phone).

I came in late in the game, I ordered and I'm going to wait it out until my advertised shipping date the 31st + 1-3 days for delivery, and at that time I'll take any steps necessary for recovery. Right now I have nothing to claim against them. I am completely understanding of people who ordered in November or December and are waiting for their orders, if I were in there shoes I would be upset too. The fact is delays were inevitable  at a stage before AMT could even really have the chance to fuck anything up. I'm sure people have been virtually banging down their doors since december threatening to sue them, e-mailing them and calling them fucking scum at a point where there was nothing they could do about it. If the chips weren't produced then there isn't any miner, that's just the facts of the matter.

What they failed to do was develop a professional relationship with their customer base. I've never receive an e-mail update that wasn't prompted by me. There was a period of time where they didn't bother to update their news section. Well at least until they did it in a shady way by back-dating post to make it look like there was communication all along. And posting pictures for something on the tenth of feb that wasn't taken until the 22nd of feb.

But still none of this means their intent is to scam anyone....

@rik

your level headed approach is exactly what this thread needs. For my part I have been trying to do the same. I do agree the communications practices AMT has can use alot of work. In my own interactions they have generally been good. But I do imagine they are getting slammed with emails and phone calls left and right. But I am in the same boat you are. Waiting it out until I see what my options are. Ideally it would behoove AMT to provide some shipping status update at least to save face. But not likely happening at this point. But yea the crazy theories and insults to anyone who isn't part of the troll mosh pit gets trolled. Again its simpler to just add those trolls to the ignore list with a couple of exceptions. Makes the thread readable.

I wrote up an open letter to them hoping that they do actually communicate with users with some kind of status update. Right now ANY communication on that front is better than silence. If people mass request refunds from them it wont work well for any of us. The shortsighted thinking of others ultimately affects everyone. Of course for those who had timelines and were told X date and it was not shipped by then are well within their right to request a refund. Its poor form for any company to say one date and not deliver on it with no explanation. Even BFL for their delayed (I use them as the turd standard) products even gives some explanation is to whats going on and why.

I disagree with your assessment of them being hammered by nonstop emails and phone calls. Not only is it speculation, but it doesn't excuse their COMPLETE lack of communication. The fact that they have been withholding updates has probably compounded the overload of emails/phone calls - everyone wants to know what the deal is. Even if they had TONS of emails to respond to: they could send out a mass email with an update to everyone. This would take no more than 20 minutes to write up.

Updating the community at large with a single post, and directing callers and emailers here would of been the right way to go. This FORUM could of been a great asset to the AMT team to update everyone, instead they told us to 'fuck off' and that they would be creating their own forums, and updating customers there (never happened).

The worst part of all of this, is that when there HAVE been updates - they have been completely falsified. Every update has been "your order is shipping shortly" - this started over a month ago. So even if they were better at giving us updates, who's to know if what they are saying is even true?

AMT has no credibility anymore due to non-stop lying to their customers, in an attempt to buy time or put peoples' minds at ease.