Showdown: Trump Vs Haley. Bitcoin betting on the 2024 US Presidential Election

[FanEagle]

People need to realize that Trump lost the elections and he is at risk of being jailed for the crimes he did and STILL the biggest republican candidate, nobody with a big name is even trying to get it because when you lose once you are usually out.

However, the reason why Trump is getting the nomination was the fact that even if you lose, if you won before and became president that means you are going to be the nominee again, he ran and won once and Biden ran and won and the elected current sitting president, those two will be the candidates and unless one of them is in jail or the other dead, then we are going to see these two running for it. That's it, there is no more talk, we would need one of the candidates not be able to run for them to lose, if they are running, they are winning.

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[Hispo]

People need to realize that Trump lost the elections and he is at risk of being jailed for the crimes he did and STILL the biggest republican candidate,

... That's it, there is no more talk, we would need one of the candidates not be able to run for them to lose, if they are running, they are winning.

That is one thing people in the United States have not been able to realize, Trump and his administration, the way he behaves and the things he says have downgraded the minimum standards the American people have for a person to be a president.

I have said it before, in the 2000s any of the stuff Trump has done would have been considered serious enough so we would have ended his political career in a legacy of disgrace. The American voters have been subjected to inappropriate behavior since the beginning of his candidacy, to the point of the standards to go down and down.

Remember when he started with the "grab her by the puss*" thing?

It was just the beginning of the process getting people used to unacceptable politics.

[Sithara007]

People need to realize that Trump lost the elections and he is at risk of being jailed for the crimes he did and STILL the biggest republican candidate, nobody with a big name is even trying to get it because when you lose once you are usually out.

However, the reason why Trump is getting the nomination was the fact that even if you lose, if you won before and became president that means you are going to be the nominee again, he ran and won once and Biden ran and won and the elected current sitting president, those two will be the candidates and unless one of them is in jail or the other dead, then we are going to see these two running for it. That's it, there is no more talk, we would need one of the candidates not be able to run for them to lose, if they are running, they are winning.

There is hardly any competition to Biden and Trump from their respective parties, due to very different reasons. Biden is preferred by the Democrat establishment, because the other candidate in the race (Robert F. Kennedy Jr.) is widely regarded as a fringe element and anti-establishment. Also, other available options such as Kamala Harris and Amy Klobuchar are not able to attract the independent and moderate vote. In case of Trump, it is entirely different. No other candidate can be considered, because if Trump doesn't win the nomination then he will make sure that his supporters sit at home on the election day.

[nullama]

People need to realize that Trump lost the elections and he is at risk of being jailed for the crimes he did and STILL the biggest republican candidate, nobody with a big name is even trying to get it because when you lose once you are usually out.

However, the reason why Trump is getting the nomination was the fact that even if you lose, if you won before and became president that means you are going to be the nominee again, he ran and won once and Biden ran and won and the elected current sitting president, those two will be the candidates and unless one of them is in jail or the other dead, then we are going to see these two running for it. That's it, there is no more talk, we would need one of the candidates not be able to run for them to lose, if they are running, they are winning.

The thing is that even if Trump is convicted and sent to jail, the US allows to have a president being elected from jail, so there's no problem with that.

It would be an unprecedented event, but also I think some people would vote for Trump just to see that happening.

[FanEagle]

Basically it is all about Trump is a "criminal", we know this now, you can believe it or not but that's the official fact, you can consider this as just "they are attacking him" or whatever, but he has been indicted and officially on the record as a criminal. This means that, "democracy", as in we can vote whoever we want, is working if Trump is nominated, but is it really what everyone needs?

By this logic, could they have voted for Dahmer as well, I am talking about in theory, if a criminal is capable of being elected, by that logic Dahmer could have been voted, he was a criminal too, why the difference? If someone committed treason while they are on the job, then I am sorry but this is beyond democracy, he shouldn't be allowed to be elected at all.

[TwitchySeal]

If the Republican cannot find another alternative for Trump, I reckon they should wish the Democrats nominate Joe Biden as their presidential candidate hehehe. He might be easier to beat. Biden after 4 years has much political failures that any candidate from the Republicans can use to blame for the present situation in their country and economy.

In any case, the Democratic party presidential primaries is on August 2024. There is much time for Robert Kennedy to gather support for his campaign while the people witness more failures from the Biden administration. There are some people in this forum who consider Robert Kennedy a loser because of his low ratings today, however, he should not be underestimated.

Well.. I am not sure whether I can agree with you 100%.

Obviously Kennedy is more electable when compared to Biden. But then, the chances of Kennedy winning the Democrat nomination is near-zero. Other options such as Harris and Klobuchar are likely to lose against Trump by a bigger margin. Biden is always hailed as someone who is capable of attracting the moderate votes and it is claimed that his policies are more towards the center (although I disagree with that opinion). And from what I have seen in the recent opinion polls, Trump is leading the independent and moderate vote.

I very much disagree that Robert Kennedy's nomination is near zero. The Democtratic party's primaries is 1 year from today. There is enough time for RFK and his campaign team to work and get more supporters behind him. Joe Biden might also be helping him by just being sleepy Joe Biden hehehehe. The American economy is suffering because of Bidenomics. This is an example where putting your name with the word economics might not be a very good idea hehehe.

- Rfk has no chance.

- The primaries start in 6 months.

- The US economy is only doing poorly if your metric is what right wing media wants you to think. If your metrics are gdp growth, jobs, unemployment, or even inflation, the economy is outperforming all expectations from the end of the pandemic.  It's also outperforming most countries and pretty much each of those metrics I just listed.

Interest rates are high,  That's really the only negative at the moment, and it's a fair tradeoff considering inflation is under control.

Of course things could change between now and the election in 15 months, but right now the economy is objectively doing extremely well when you consider the effects of the pandemic.

[Sithara007]

- Rfk has no chance.

- The primaries start in 6 months.

- The US economy is only doing poorly if your metric is what right wing media wants you to think. If your metrics are gdp growth, jobs, unemployment, or even inflation, the economy is outperforming all expectations from the end of the pandemic.  It's also outperforming most countries and pretty much each of those metrics I just listed.

Interest rates are high,  That's really the only negative at the moment, and it's a fair tradeoff considering inflation is under control.

Of course things could change between now and the election in 15 months, but right now the economy is objectively doing extremely well when you consider the effects of the pandemic.

Agreed on Kennedy. He had a slight chance if he was participating in the GOP primaries. But in Democrat party, it is impossible to win nomination without establishment support (we saw this in 2016, when Bernie Sanders was running against Hillary Clinton). It is entirely another topic if Kennedy decides to run as an independent. But in that case, it would hurt Trump more than it would hurt Biden. Kennedy voters are not exactly at the left of political spectrum. Now coming to economy, lower crude oil prices are helping Biden, but this can change at anytime.

[Hispo]

Basically it is all about Trump is a "criminal", we know this now, you can believe it or not but that's the official fact, you can consider this as just "they are attacking him" or whatever, but he has been indicted and officially on the record as a criminal. This means that, "democracy", as in we can vote whoever we want, is working if Trump is nominated, but is it really what everyone needs?

By this logic, could they have voted for Dahmer as well, I am talking about in theory, if a criminal is capable of being elected, by that logic Dahmer could have been voted, he was a criminal too, why the difference? If someone committed treason while they are on the job, then I am sorry but this is beyond democracy, he shouldn't be allowed to be elected at all.

Legally Trump is not a criminal, he is a defendant. He is not guilty until proven otherwise by a jury of his peers in a fair trial.
Though, I understand your point, he is being politically attacked by his foes both in national TV and in speeches for the crimes he is being indicted for and sadly that is how news and social media work nowadays.

The hosts on TV are more interested to label Trump as a criminal (before there is a final judgment) and convince their viewers about it than presenting facts and events in a neutral manner.

Let us not commit a mistake, though. Trump is far from being a good person, but the political left can be equally as extreme as their political opponents when it is about throwing dirt on them.  

[bittraffic]

Basically it is all about Trump is a "criminal", we know this now, you can believe it or not but that's the official fact, you can consider this as just "they are attacking him" or whatever, but he has been indicted and officially on the record as a criminal. This means that, "democracy", as in we can vote whoever we want, is working if Trump is nominated, but is it really what everyone needs?

By this logic, could they have voted for Dahmer as well, I am talking about in theory, if a criminal is capable of being elected, by that logic Dahmer could have been voted, he was a criminal too, why the difference? If someone committed treason while they are on the job, then I am sorry but this is beyond democracy, he shouldn't be allowed to be elected at all.

Legally Trump is not a criminal, he is a defendant. He is not guilty until proven otherwise by a jury of his peers in a fair trial.
Though, I understand your point, he is being politically attacked by his foes both in national TV and in speeches for the crimes he is being indicted for and sadly that is how news and social media work nowadays.

The hosts on TV are more interested to label Trump as a criminal (before there is a final judgment) and convince their viewers about it than presenting facts and events in a neutral manner.

Let us not commit a mistake, though. Trump is far from being a good person, but the political left can be equally as extreme as their political opponents when it is about throwing dirt on them.  

He is less evil though. During his time, he fought no war. Media prosecution is just too much and Biden is winning that battle but in social media, it's a different platform where the legacy media has almost no influence. It's just facebook and twitter trying to censor those posts and ban users.

Even when the time Trump was the president a single tiny mistake is magnified by the media but in the time of Biden where evidence shows how corrupt the big man is, the media just ignores it.

[Hispo]

Basically it is all about Trump is a "criminal", we know this now, you can believe it or not but that's the official fact, you can consider this as just "they are attacking him" or whatever, but he has been indicted and officially on the record as a criminal. This means that, "democracy", as in we can vote whoever we want, is working if Trump is nominated, but is it really what everyone needs?

By this logic, could they have voted for Dahmer as well, I am talking about in theory, if a criminal is capable of being elected, by that logic Dahmer could have been voted, he was a criminal too, why the difference? If someone committed treason while they are on the job, then I am sorry but this is beyond democracy, he shouldn't be allowed to be elected at all.

Legally Trump is not a criminal, he is a defendant. He is not guilty until proven otherwise by a jury of his peers in a fair trial.
Though, I understand your point, he is being politically attacked by his foes both in national TV and in speeches for the crimes he is being indicted for and sadly that is how news and social media work nowadays.

The hosts on TV are more interested to label Trump as a criminal (before there is a final judgment) and convince their viewers about it than presenting facts and events in a neutral manner.

Let us not commit a mistake, though. Trump is far from being a good person, but the political left can be equally as extreme as their political opponents when it is about throwing dirt on them.  

He is less evil though. During his time, he fought no war. Media prosecution is just too much and Biden is winning that battle but in social media, it's a different platform where the legacy media has almost no influence. It's just facebook and twitter trying to censor those posts and ban users.

Even when the time Trump was the president a single tiny mistake is magnified by the media but in the time of Biden where evidence shows how corrupt the big man is, the media just ignores it.

For sure, If cocaine was found in the white house during trump's administration or if Trump had a son who was a proven former addict to crack cocaine and his nude picture ended up on internet, the media would slash at him very hard.

I recall back then all news were about Trump and how he was bad and not suitable for the presidency, even though I don't like the guy, one must be aware of how biased media can be in both sides.

Btw, I am kind of surprised that these arrests have not led to substantial change over Trump's odd on the bet markets.

[Yogee]

[....]
Btw, I am kind of surprised that these arrests have not led to substantial change over Trump's odd on the bet markets.

I think he's guilty of the felony charge of "willful retention" of national security information after leaving the Whitehouse but I'm not that surprised that he's still popular. I guess that's because they are also good at capitalizing on Biden's "baggage". We'll probably see substantial change during the trial. Live broadcast won't be allowed inside but I'm pretty sure the media will try everything to present their 'unbiased' opinion hehe.

[Hispo]

[....]
Btw, I am kind of surprised that these arrests have not led to substantial change over Trump's odd on the bet markets.

I think he's guilty of the felony charge of "willful retention" of national security information after leaving the Whitehouse but I'm not that surprised that he's still popular. I guess that's because they are also good at capitalizing on Biden's "baggage". We'll probably see substantial change during the trial. Live broadcast won't be allowed inside but I'm pretty sure the media will try everything to present their 'unbiased' opinion hehe.

To be honest, I think his trial should be public and broadcast on TV.
When there is a tragic mass shooting in the United States, for example, and the perpetrator survives and gets arrested by police, usually their trial is public and can even be watched on YouTube and other places. It is usually done because the case is high profile and there is high public interest about it.

Since we are talking about a candidate for the presidency who is currently likely to win, then there is obvious public interest. If he thinks he is actually not guilty, he would not mind the whole thing to be recorded.

Though, I am aware that some may rather to keep the trial closed, to avoid increasing the division among voters and fuel more theories

[OgNasty]

I’m starting to have my doubts that Biden will even run again. It’s clear he can be nowhere near any sort of debate. I think everyone is well aware he isn’t mentally competent to be the President of the United States. Even if he wasn’t accepting bribes, I don’t think any sane person could feel good about voting for him. With a close eye on the next election, I don’t think he has a chance.

[Yogee]

[....]
Btw, I am kind of surprised that these arrests have not led to substantial change over Trump's odd on the bet markets.

I think he's guilty of the felony charge of "willful retention" of national security information after leaving the Whitehouse but I'm not that surprised that he's still popular. I guess that's because they are also good at capitalizing on Biden's "baggage". We'll probably see substantial change during the trial. Live broadcast won't be allowed inside but I'm pretty sure the media will try everything to present their 'unbiased' opinion hehe.

To be honest, I think his trial should be public and broadcast on TV.
When there is a tragic mass shooting in the United States, for example, and the perpetrator survives and gets arrested by police, usually their trial is public and can even be watched on YouTube and other places. It is usually done because the case is high profile and there is high public interest about it.

Since we are talking about a candidate for the presidency who is currently likely to win, then there is obvious public interest. If he thinks he is actually not guilty, he would not mind the whole thing to be recorded.

Though, I am aware that some may rather to keep the trial closed, to avoid increasing the division among voters and fuel more theories

I'm not sure which specific cases you're referring to but the court currently doesn't allow live broadcast for Federal criminal cases from what I know. There are calls to change that since it's of national and public interest as you said but I doubt they will rule for an exception to this.

[Sithara007]

I’m starting to have my doubts that Biden will even run again. It’s clear he can be nowhere near any sort of debate. I think everyone is well aware he isn’t mentally competent to be the President of the United States. Even if he wasn’t accepting bribes, I don’t think any sane person could feel good about voting for him. With a close eye on the next election, I don’t think he has a chance.

Well.. he is still giving speeches all around the country. I am not sure whether he is being helped by teleprompter or not, but his health condition seems to be at the same point as of 2020. And with whom he will be debating? In all probability it is going to be Donald Trump on the other side. These two have gone through presidential debates in 2020, and therefore both of them know what to expect. If Biden's health was not an issue in 2020, I don't think that it will be an issue now. Anyway, Trump is also not much younger when compared to Biden.

[beerlover]

- Rfk has no chance.

- The primaries start in 6 months.

- The US economy is only doing poorly if your metric is what right wing media wants you to think. If your metrics are gdp growth, jobs, unemployment, or even inflation, the economy is outperforming all expectations from the end of the pandemic.  It's also outperforming most countries and pretty much each of those metrics I just listed.

Interest rates are high,  That's really the only negative at the moment, and it's a fair tradeoff considering inflation is under control.

Of course things could change between now and the election in 15 months, but right now the economy is objectively doing extremely well when you consider the effects of the pandemic.

Agreed on Kennedy. He had a slight chance if he was participating in the GOP primaries. But in Democrat party, it is impossible to win nomination without establishment support (we saw this in 2016, when Bernie Sanders was running against Hillary Clinton). It is entirely another topic if Kennedy decides to run as an independent. But in that case, it would hurt Trump more than it would hurt Biden. Kennedy voters are not exactly at the left of political spectrum. Now coming to economy, lower crude oil prices are helping Biden, but this can change at anytime.

That was the thing that made me question a lot as well, I always thought he was a republican and not democrat, we know wildly that anti-vaxxers are mostly republicans, we have seen this plenty of times and even though there were democrat places that didn't get the vaccination, they were silent minority that just didn't do it themselves but didn't want to cause chaos for everyone else, whereas republicans were mocking people who got the vaccination, vast difference.

Kennedy is a known anti-vaxxer as well and I think it's quite important to remember that Democrats and DNC would not look to that lightly. He has absolutely zero chance to win, if he ran republican and Trump got jailed, maybe he would have a small chance.

[Sithara007]

That was the thing that made me question a lot as well, I always thought he was a republican and not democrat, we know wildly that anti-vaxxers are mostly republicans, we have seen this plenty of times and even though there were democrat places that didn't get the vaccination, they were silent minority that just didn't do it themselves but didn't want to cause chaos for everyone else, whereas republicans were mocking people who got the vaccination, vast difference.

Kennedy is a known anti-vaxxer as well and I think it's quite important to remember that Democrats and DNC would not look to that lightly. He has absolutely zero chance to win, if he ran republican and Trump got jailed, maybe he would have a small chance.

The question is what will happen in case he runs as an independent? If Kennedy is unable to secure Democrat nomination, then there is a good chance that he will run as an independent candidate. But if that happens, who will benefit? Although nominally Kennedy is a Democrat, he is likely to poach more votes from the Republican leaning voters. And this is going to be bad news for Donald Trump (in case he manages to secure the GOP nomination for the 2024 POTUS elections). Another remote chance is that Kennedy will be offered VP post by Trump. 

[Betwrong]

People need to realize that Trump lost the elections and he is at risk of being jailed for the crimes he did and STILL the biggest republican candidate, nobody with a big name is even trying to get it because when you lose once you are usually out.

However, the reason why Trump is getting the nomination was the fact that even if you lose, if you won before and became president that means you are going to be the nominee again, he ran and won once and Biden ran and won and the elected current sitting president, those two will be the candidates and unless one of them is in jail or the other dead, then we are going to see these two running for it. That's it, there is no more talk, we would need one of the candidates not be able to run for them to lose, if they are running, they are winning.

Yes. That's what I'm trying to say all the time. Trump is at risk of being jailed. It's serious and must be taken into account. And it's not like: he's not elected if he's jailed. He won't be elected anyway, because the process will reveal facts that will make his supporters turn away from him. Now 35% of Americans view Trump favorably, but I think in the next few months his supporters will amount to less than 30%.

And it looks like bettors know it.



Biden is getting more and more support recently.

[nullama]

~snip~
Well.. he is still giving speeches all around the country. I am not sure whether he is being helped by teleprompter or not, but his health condition seems to be at the same point as of 2020. And with whom he will be debating? In all probability it is going to be Donald Trump on the other side. These two have gone through presidential debates in 2020, and therefore both of them know what to expect. If Biden's health was not an issue in 2020, I don't think that it will be an issue now. Anyway, Trump is also not much younger when compared to Biden.

One thing that most people don't mention is that neither Trump or Biden have ever drunk alcohol.

I think that alone is probably the biggest reason why they are still doing relatively OK at such an age.

[Timelord2067]

At close to 99 years of age, President Jimmy Carter is or was a Baptist Minister a very long time ago and likewise abstained from alcohol (and is still alive close to forty-two years after his one term in office)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Carter