[XMR] Monero Speculation

[GingerAle]

i may or may not fully understand union sets

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_(set_theory)

but I do believe that cash is not digital.. i mean I guess it is? Maybe? some form of it?

[generalizethis]

i may or may not fully understand union sets

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_(set_theory)

but I do believe that cash is not digital.. i mean I guess it is? Maybe? some form of it?

Maybe leave the dollar half-in/half-out of digital to illustrate that it can't be digital and private?

[Hueristic]

Add a credit card on top of the dollar. Or swap it out completely. Also and you could add fungible in the gold / xmr center. MEh, CC not private but neither is cash.

[americanpegasus]

but I do believe that cash is not digital.. i mean I guess it is? Maybe? some form of it?

 
  
Yeah, I meant credit cards.  Ok, so I should change the hard dollar to a credit card, but it's still based on dollars which was my point.  

Maybe leave the dollar half-in/half-out of digital to illustrate that it can't be digital and private?

 
  
I am thinking of replacing it with a credit card and putting quote symbols around it to show it is "kind" of private.  Perhaps then the actual dollar goes down into the "private" bubble by itself because it's not decentralized or digital. 
 
Perhaps the term of wasta would fit into the category of just decentralized and no others.  After all, if you have a reputation for being generous with your time and resources that might not be directly controlled by anyone but it sure can't be private.   
 
As for what would be digital without being the other two?  That would be a large and centrally controlled register of property that anyone can view - I suppose owning large amounts of stock in a company would qualify as this.  You have to publicly disclose all your moves to the public and so its not private or decentralized. 

[ArticMine]

I would split the dollar into two very different types of money.

1) Cash
2) Debits and credits on a database held by "trusted" third parties. This includes bank accounts, credit / debit cards, funds on deposit with an exchange such as Mt Gox or Cryptsy etc.

2) Of course can also apply to the other forms of money in the diagram such as Bitcoin, Monero and gold.

[XMRpromotions]

I would split the dollar into two very different types of money.

1) Cash
2) Debits and credits on a database held by "trusted" third parties. This includes bank accounts, credit / debit cards, funds on deposit with an exchange such as Mt Gox or Cryptsy etc.

2) Of course can also apply to the other forms of money in the diagram such as Bitcoin, Monero and gold.

I agree with this clarification. To avoid any confusion you could also use the term "physical cash" instead of cash.

[jehst]

Gold has been digitized. Everything's been digitized

[smooth]

Gold has been digitized. Everything's been digitized

Not really. A gold-linked or gold-backed derivative can be digitized. Physical gold can't.

[luigi1111]

Gold has been digitized. Everything's been digitized

Not really. A gold-linked or gold-backed derivative can be digitized. Physical gold can't.

I sense a non-believer here. #itscoming

[americanpegasus]

I used this three circle technique to explain to someone at work today why Monero is so special, and even being someone unfamiliar with cryptocurrency they seemed to "get it" and their next immediate response was "There's no way the government is going to allow something like this to exist!" 
 
   
 
That's how you know they "get it".  Their eyes widen, and they immediately realize how 'dangerous' it is.    This should be seen as a victory since it was also the reaction that many people made upon learning about Bitcoin for the first time back in 2011. 
 
The only change I used was following you guys' suggestion of making it clear that the "digital dollar" was the half-step between digital and privacy, not the physical dollar. 
 
I'm so pleased with this illustration that I think I will incorporate it into an upcoming video.  I want to create a 10 minute, semi-serious video about "Why Monero is the next generation of money" that aims to explain to someone unfamiliar with cryptocurrency in 10 minutes why Bitcoin was a very big deal, but why Monero is even bigger.  I hope to model it a little after Wences' "New Gold Standard" video (https://youtu.be/yPIvqJsCOSo), and spend about 3 minutes talking about the history of money, segue into a few ways of understanding why cryptocurrency is a game changer, and the last 3 minutes talking about why Monero is the most important cryptocurrency that has ever been created. 
 
I have an 'assistant' that will be here this weekend so I'll get their help and borrow a conference room at work to film it (even though I know the couch will be missed  ). 

[ArticMine]

The digital dollar is digital but not private. It is also not decentralized.
The paper cash dollar is private but not digital. One can argue it is decentralized because once it is issued the US Government has no control over its use.

Just ask someone in Greece what the difference is between cash "in the bank" (digital Euros) and cash "in you pocket" (paper Euros).

I would put the US Dollar bill in the private alone or private / decentralized category, and the digital representation of USD in the digital alone category.

Edit: The key is that USD cannot be both digital and private at the same time.

[tifozi]

15K Ask wall almost chewed up.  

Those who gamble trade based on indicators and charts are probably scratching their heads as none of anything applies at the moment. I have never believed in them anyways but I know some use it because of the herd mentality.

[Fontas.]

Reality check.


No matter how far anon tech goes the government can still fuck you if they want. Anon coins will never be legal tender so you will need to put fiat in and out and explain where that came from. Governments can't decrypt the tech but they can still control every place where you can exchange $ to BTC.


And also it's terrible for speculation as no serious trader would touch this stinky shit.



It's some form of fucked up dream-world you've made up for yourselves where you can talk about privacy and freedom trading nickels where the other libertarian sharing your views across the board will fuck you for a foot long sandwich.

[GingerAle]

Don't you understand? None of that will matter in a crypto currency based economy.

The only reason you need to deal with fiat now is because few accept crypto, and none pay crypto.

Think beyond 10 years. Think beyond 20.

[Fontas.]

Don't you understand? None of that will matter in a crypto currency based economy.

The only reason you need to deal with fiat now is because few accept crypto, and none pay crypto.

Think beyond 10 years. Think beyond 20.

A crypto currency based economy would still not be exempt from all laws. And if laws can't be imposed it will be illegal. And if it is illegal then you will see no 'crypto currency based economy'. Wake up.

[onemorexmr]

Don't you understand? None of that will matter in a crypto currency based economy.

The only reason you need to deal with fiat now is because few accept crypto, and none pay crypto.

Think beyond 10 years. Think beyond 20.

A crypto currency based economy would still not be exempt from all laws. And if laws can't be imposed it will be illegal. And if it is illegal then you will see no 'crypto currency based economy'. Wake up.

governments are not almighty.
they havent forbidden cash (ok some are trying to limit it)
they havent forbidden gold

as soon as an economy is using it, they want to tax it - and not forbid it

[americanpegasus]

Edit: The key is that USD cannot be both digital and private at the same time.

 
  
I hear you, but by your rules *nothing* can be digital and private at the same time, because simply by moving through a 'trusted third party' privacy is broken.  
  
I am arguing that the digital dollar is "private for all intents and purposes" with a disclaimer that nothing that isn't decentralized can ever truly be private, because it must pass through a trusted third party who can spy on you if they like.  
  
But for most of the population they are used to thinking of their dollars as private, and in some respects they are more private than bitcoin which has a totally public ledger.  But as I said, I agree that digital dollars are never truly private (nor is any asset stored by a trusted third party).  
  
I think the comparison holds as long as you make that very clear.  

[smoothie]

For those who want a "gentle" intro to elliptic-curve cryptography and how it works etc, here is a video with Daniel J Burnstein who from what I understand is the person who chose the constants for the elliptic-curve used in Monero/cryptonote. Also one of the people who helped develop Ed25519 and Curve25519.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l6jTFxQaUJA

Class is in session! 

[jehst]

That was the most pathetic bitcoin "bubble" in the history of bitcoin

[americanpegasus]

That was the most pathetic bitcoin "bubble" in the history of bitcoin

 
  
But seriously, this could still be part of a giga-move.  If you look at previous run ups, there was nasty, nasty volatility right before the big moves.  Who knows exactly why, but the price did a slingshot from a fresh new high down to unthinkable lows right before it went into orbit.  

Class is in session!  

 
  
Thanks!  I am always looking to learn more!

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Malor: 47c3nbJoD3x9gRCWu6LhD51CKvVfUtXus12UgsPD6eYzUtvRZp2tobiL1xusLoMsWSP6dPAXMKosjdN 1KxT1g16UHvKvL4n