margin terminal is now FREE - bots for over 30 exchanges

[hackbyte]

For those that are having problems running Leo (crashes, errors, etc...) I highly recommend running on Raspberry Pi. I’ve been up and running constantly for two and a half weeks with no problems whatsoever. It’s a great little machine and pretty simple to setup. If ya got an extra $40 and a little time to set it up it’s kind of a no brainer. Just a thought for those having issues constantly. Several of us on here are using it and we’d be more than happy to help anyone that wants to give it a go.

I have to say, that your statement only makes half way sense.

While it is true, that a clean and otherwise unused linux setup on a raspberry might work somewhat better in the first place, you are still way more limited with what you can do overall.

So, yeah, i too recommend to have leonArdo running on a dedicated installation/computer which has _as few background tasks running as possible_, because that's more or less the key to give it as much CPU and spare I/O for networking and disk access (writing logs and saving stats as well as access it's own local database).

But even on a raspberry 3 you have some problems because of the not optimal performance of your micro SD card, the Ethernet going over your USB and maybe even having your additional storage on the same USB bus.

Let me explain a bit with my actual machine where i run leonArdo as an example.
I have a Asrock q1900-itx board, which is a based on bay fail Intel® Quad-Core Processor J1900 (a celeron class cpu), including intels very own 7th generation (Gen 7) graphics. On this board are 2x Kingston 8GB DDR3L S0DIMM so this machine has plenty of ram to run leonArdo.

Sadly, i'm not able to have this machine running exclusively only for leonArdo and that is where a part of my problems begin.

I actually "just" use it as a media watching/listening device which is a bit ... lets say sloppy at all because the onboard GPU eats up a lot of I/O bandwith because of some bugs preventing it from using powersaving safely at all and some other (bay fail related) problems, which is sad but, meh.
(see https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=109051 for explanation).

On this machine is an actual and steadily updated Ubuntu Artful Aardvark (17.10) installation running with a lubuntu "lighter desktop" (using LXDE and such).

As long as i have _ONLY_ leonArdo running on this machine - using remote display on my primary workstation - everything is _very fine_ and running smoothly.

As soon as i have VLC or chromium with youtube running, things change drastically.

leonArdo _and the GPU usage_ eat up so much I/O, that i get a jump-around mouse cursor when using X11vnc and x2vnc to remotely control this machine from my workstation (which is anyways a very cool trick to use one keyboard and mouse for more than one machine).

Just recently, i had to find out that it is not (just) leonArdo (alone) which creates this behavior but really my usage of the GPU on that machine. As i said, as soon as i have VLC or Chromium whith youtube running, everything is no longer fine.

It actually goes up to the point that, when i re-start leonArdo for some reason, having 4 open exchanges with avg 10, 6, 6, 4 pairs (on bitfinex, binance, hitbtc and poloniex in exactly that order;)), it actually thinks it looses network connectivity for a brief moment _whilst still starting up and connect to the exchange APIs_.

But, as i said, that's _not_ leonArdos fault but the fault of the not so performant I/O on that machine at all.....

To get back to your raspberry recommendation. Imagine to scale _that_ setup down to a arm based machine which has a comparable but a bit less CPU performance on the CPU side ... and on top of that truly really _less I/O performance_ on the connection to storage and the outside world (remember, SDcard - ethernet via USB, maybe even additional storage on the same usb bus..).

So ... for a "power user" like me, this raspberry variant will never work at all with the amount of stuff (exchanges/pairs) i have running usually.

BUT! Things might actually change in the near future regarding that case.

There are some upcoming new SBCs (based on Rockchips RK3399) which provide - on some planned boards - _native SATA_ via PCI express and native ethernet w/o having USB in between. Additionally they have up to 8 cores and (again up to) 4gig of ram. Which really make them a probably good choice for a dedicated leonArdo box. On some you can even find an M.2 SSD socket, which makes the whole thing even more performant than any sd-card or usb-storage solution ever can be. (And let's not forget, they will have mostly USB3, which will additionally boost performance a bit, even if you use USB3 based storage.)

In the end, it's all about free (I/O) resources and timings.

Having faster storage means that every transfer from or to the storage takes less time and so blocks your I/O for a less amount of time. Which goes nearly for all components of your SBC.

So ... to come back to the main point. Yes, if you only use one exchange and very few open pairs, a fresh, clean and otherwise unused linux on a raspberry, it _will help_ to have it better running. But as soon as you have more than one exchange open and overall more than, let's say and average of 6 to 8 pairs, this advantage will actually be eaten up completely and make things worse. Sadly. - at least, for now.

On top of that, you have to consider which Raspberry you use for this task. An older Raspi 1 will surely fail on you, even a Pi Zero W might not make you happy.

Starting on a Raspi 2 or 3, things get better but you will still be limited due to poor I/O on that machine.
As you can see above, even having a nice and cool running celeron quadcore will not make things so much better, but again, that's not leonArdos fault at all.

Let's not forget, we talk about a truly professional tool here which _needs_ some amount of resources to be able to work at all, and most of that is network traffic and low latencies for the inet uplink.. And sadly, there is no way to cheat physics to get more out of a small machine at all.....

Well .. HTH even for other users which think about buying/building a dedicated leonArdo machine.

So, now i'm going to install another ubuntu on an (otherwise) unused HP laptop to have _it_ running exclusively leonArdo whilst still scripting some weird debugging wrapper because i'm still not happy with what i actually have now (well, around 600 lines of bash but well documented and very verbose at all. )

Greetings,

Hacky

[1713955660]

1713955660

[1713955660]

1713955660

[1713955660]

1713955660

[1713955660]

1713955660

[1713955660]

1713955660

[1713955660]

1713955660

[TheDay]

Thanks a lot for all your detailed answers! Helps a lot! 

[money4good]

Hacky, I know you have a unique situation. I was mainly posting for regular “joe” user like myself. But I do hope you find a good solution for your issues. I feel like you are pulling Leo in an even more progressive and robust direction, which is great for all of us. Power users are constantly pushing the limits and capabilities of the software. In the long run this is a benefit for all. I hope you keep it up and don’t get too frustrated because it really is a service to everyone using the product. Thanks!

[leonArdo@margin]

Hey Hacky,

couple points there. Yes, I was glad but also a bit surprised to hear the Pi being recommended as the ideal platform but OTOH, the thing about such SBCs, as you've hinted at, is that they are so affordable that you can use them as single-purpose machines which helps a lot with a lot of applications, including leonArdo. We definitely don't recommend doing anything besides running leonArdo on a Pi.

I have the nagging feeling, however, that us strongly recommending swapspace for the Pi also has something to do with things running so smoothly there. We're still seeing those memory fragmentation issues that drive up memory usage over time, so having basically unlimited swap space will help on every machine but on the Pi, it's an absolute necessity to have ample swap space. So bottom line, just install swapspace when running leonArdo, because why not.

The Pi 1 and Zero you mentioned don't support ARMv7, so they don't run leonArdo anyway! But yes, part of the reason why we didn't even consider them is the fact that the resources will be even more restricted and the Pi 3 is really affordable anyway. I haven't looked into the RK3399 you mentioned but if you're looking for a board that you can buy right now, the Banana Pi M2 and M3 have SATA and they're proven to run leonArdo. I also just got a Rock64 on my desk and while I haven't gotten around to testing leonArdo on it, with Gigabit Ethernet and eMMC I think it's quite promising. Excited to try it anyway!

General note in case anyone's still reading: we're always interested in hearing your stories with different setups, especially when they're ARM! But be aware that ARM is such a diverse ecosystem that you never know how things turn out and while we want to hear how things go for you, we can't really support you with anything but the Raspberry Pi. So ARM is very much a "only if you know what you're doing" kind of affair!

Best,

Christian

[leonArdo@margin]

leonArdo is rebranding as ...

Visit us here: https://margin.de

We are excited to announce the upcoming rebranding of leonArdo as margin and the release of a new website. This entails a number of changes for our existing hero customers and we want to run through them here.

We will switch the existing early adopter lifetime license model to a subscription-based model. Although we saw incredible growth last year and grew our team to 9 people, in order to be able to add all the great features we have in our pipeline and maintain a sustainable software company, necessitates this change.


What does it mean for existing customers?
First off, you can, of course, keep your existing version of leonArdo for life. You will also be able to use margin on the Standard plan for free for 6 months as a non-Ultra customer and for a year as an Ultra customer. At the end of that period, you have the choice to revert back to your old version of leonArdo or to support our project by adding a subscription plan.

Edit: As a leonArdo customer you will also be entitled to a 50% discount on all future margin terminal subscription payments. The offer will kick in if you sign up for a subscription within a month of your free period ending.

Edit: There seems to be some confusion so I'd like to clear it up. All leonArdo customers, even those who buy in the next couple of weeks before the switch, are considered Hero early adopter customers.

Pricing
We have 3 different plans that fit the needs of all kinds of traders. The plans are mainly distinguished by the allowable balance (overall estimated USD balance) per exchange. For example, on the Standard plan you can have a balance of up to 100K USD per exchange.

What else changes?
You will no longer have to contact support to get a new API key added to the product. You will just have to add it yourself in your account area on the website and it should be immediately active! As security remains a top priority, we still only require half your secret to be given to us. margin, like leonArdo, will also connect directly to the exchanges and no orders will be routed through our servers. That's none of our business! In addition, the new website will feature a whole new Help Center with many helpful videos and articles that will provide valuable help on understanding the capabilities of margin and this will be added to and updated regularly. We are sure you’ll love the new look and feel of the website!

Our commitment
For all our subscribers our commitment is to release a new version of margin on average every 6 weeks and to continue to improve margin with new exchanges, bots, technical indicators, reporting and other cool thus far unannounced developments we have in the pipeline. We also reaffirm our commitment to offering all of our customers world class support.

Timeline
We expect margin and our new web platform to go live within the next two weeks.

We hope that we can count on your continued support and that you will stick with us over the next months and years. We are confident that we can build on the already excellent technical basis of leonArdo to make margin the default choice for cryptocurrency traders.

Thanks so much everyone!

The margin team

Edit: After discussing what we could do for our Hero early adopter customers, in recognition of the fact that you guys got us to this point, we have decided to give a special status of Hero to every leonArdo customer going forward. It won't just be that you have a Hero badge in your version of margin, but it entitles you to a 50% discount on all future margin terminal subscription payments. The offer will kick in if you sign up for a subscription within a month of your free period ending.

We wanted to also make the point that switching to a subscription based model is absolutely necessary for us. We are a real company, with real employees who have families and mortgages and have to be paid at the end of each month. If the market only saw month on month growth then it might be possible to survive by sticking to the lifetime license model, but this is not the case. Catastrophic events like what happened in mid January, where a lot of cryptos lost up to 70% of their value, have a huge effect on our revenue. This puts everything we have built up in danger and if not dealt with could mean us having to close for business - which would also mean no updates for leonArdo. This was not a decision we took lightly, rather one we couldn't avoid.

[CTShaman]

How would multiple APIs per exchange be utilized?

[RYXES]

How in the world have I only just discovered this?

[Amaralluis]

I am disappointed with this announcement.

Leonardo/Margin will not fit my needs anymore as a very small investor.
Its a shame I really liked it and will continue using Leonardo until it stops working altogether.

[RiSK6]

"I am disappointed with this announcement.

Leonardo/Margin will not fit my needs anymore as a very small investor.
Its a shame I really liked it and will continue using Leonardo until it stops working altogether.
"

Agreed. I too am a very small investor. Will probably do the same as well

Bummer

[ofnadave]

I am disappointed with this announcement.

Leonardo/Margin will not fit my needs anymore as a very small investor.
Its a shame I really liked it and will continue using Leonardo until it stops working altogether.

Same!

[leonArdo@margin]

"I am disappointed with this announcement.

Leonardo/Margin will not fit my needs anymore as a very small investor.
Its a shame I really liked it and will continue using Leonardo until it stops working altogether.
"

Agreed. I too am a very small investor. Will probably do the same as well

Bummer

I am sorry, but if we didn't take this step then we would risk not being able to stay competitive. This was necessary to ensure that we could expand and do all the things we want to.

We think that the Starter plan which costs $180 a year is reasonable for small investors.

But of course, everyone will have to make up their own mind.

All the best,
Jonathan

[yhbae]

How do you enable the display of buy/sell vertical column chart at specific prices on the right side of the main chart?

On a different note - what do you get for the 'Starter Plan'?

Thanks.

[leonArdo@margin]

How would multiple APIs per exchange be utilized?

Some customers have asked for this. Some want to be able to run more than a single instance of margin connecting to their exchange account on different machines. One example would be someone who is running margin on a machine at home 24/7 and wants to check in on things at work using a different machine. But there are other cases.

The main point of that plan is the unlimited balance per exchange.

Best wishes,
Jonathan

[leonArdo@margin]

How do you enable the display of buy/sell vertical column chart at specific prices on the right side of the main chart?

On a different note - what do you get for the 'Starter Plan'?

Thanks.

You can configure leonArdo by clicking in the top left hand corner and choosing "Add Tools Window".

The Starter plan allows you connect to 1 exchange on which your balance does not exceed $3000. Other than that there are no restrictions. You can run as many bots as you like for example.

Best wishes,
Jonathan

Edit
Or perhaps, you mean the depth-chart?
You can show this by right-click dragging the chart to the left!

best,
Christof

[money4good]

I, for one, will continue to support Team Margin. I've been very pleased with the product and I think it will be well worth the extra money. These folks have been working their asses off to support us with limited resources and I think helping them scale up will be a benefit to everyone in the long run. I understand that this will upset some people but you have to decide if you think there's a better product/dev team at a cheaper price. IMO, no.

[CTShaman]

How would multiple APIs per exchange be utilized?

Some customers have asked for this. Some want to be able to run more than a single instance of margin connecting to their exchange account on different machines. One example would be someone who is running margin on a machine at home 24/7 and wants to check in on things at work using a different machine. But there are other cases.

The main point of that plan is the unlimited balance per exchange.

Best wishes,
Jonathan

Wow, that was unexpected, I had considered that as a possibility, but a long shot. Thanks for the explanation.

Instance to instance awareness will need to be incorporated, sounds grizzly. I'd want to throw a lot of testing at that. 

Thanks for ensuring leonArdo/margin has a bright future.

[rothcom65]

"I am disappointed with this announcement.

Leonardo/Margin will not fit my needs anymore as a very small investor.
Its a shame I really liked it and will continue using Leonardo until it stops working altogether.
"

Agreed. I too am a very small investor. Will probably do the same as well

Bummer

I am sorry, but if we didn't take this step then we would risk not being able to stay competitive. This was necessary to ensure that we could expand and do all the things we want to.

We think that the Starter plan which costs $180 a year is reasonable for small investors.

But of course, everyone will have to make up their own mind.

All the best,
Jonathan

I understand. At least there should be some sort of discount or promotion for early adopters like us who paid for the lifetime license.

[yhbae]

How do you enable the display of buy/sell vertical column chart at specific prices on the right side of the main chart?

On a different note - what do you get for the 'Starter Plan'?

Thanks.

You can configure leonArdo by clicking in the top left hand corner and choosing "Add Tools Window".

The Starter plan allows you connect to 1 exchange on which your balance does not exceed $3000. Other than that there are no restrictions. You can run as many bots as you like for example.

Best wishes,
Jonathan

Edit
Or perhaps, you mean the depth-chart?
You can show this by right-click dragging the chart to the left!

best,
Christof

In my case, the balance will exceed 3k for sure... What's the plan above this one and how much?

[drnkk]

How do you enable the display of buy/sell vertical column chart at specific prices on the right side of the main chart?

On a different note - what do you get for the 'Starter Plan'?

Thanks.

You can configure leonArdo by clicking in the top left hand corner and choosing "Add Tools Window".

The Starter plan allows you connect to 1 exchange on which your balance does not exceed $3000. Other than that there are no restrictions. You can run as many bots as you like for example.

Best wishes,
Jonathan

Edit
Or perhaps, you mean the depth-chart?
You can show this by right-click dragging the chart to the left!

best,
Christof

Jumping from 3k usd per 1 exchange to 100k usd per multiple exchange seems to be huge difference between two options.
You should consider something between IMHO.

Best Regards

[kriojenic]

leonArdo is rebranding as ...

http://www.marginsoftware.de/forum-images/final-margin-logo-white-background.png

We are excited to announce the upcoming rebranding of leonArdo as margin and the release of a new website. This entails a number of changes for our existing hero customers and we want to run through them here.

We will switch the existing early adopter lifetime license model to a subscription-based model. Although we saw incredible growth last year and grew our team to 9 people, in order to be able to add all the great features we have in our pipeline and maintain a sustainable software company, necessitates this change.


What does it mean for existing customers?
First off, you can, of course, keep your existing version of leonArdo for life. You will also be able to use margin for free for 6 months as a non-Ultra customer and for a year as an Ultra customer. At the end of that period, you have the choice to revert back to your old version of leonArdo or to support our project by adding a subscription plan.

Pricing
We have 3 different plans that fit the needs of all kinds of traders. The plans are mainly distinguished by the allowable balance (overall estimated USD balance) per exchange. For example, on the Standard plan you can have a balance of up to 100K USD per exchange.

http://www.marginsoftware.de/forum-images/SaaS-Pricing.png

What else changes?
You will no longer have to contact support to get a new API key added to the product. You will just have to add it yourself in your account area on the website and it should be immediately active! As security remains a top priority, we still only require half your secret to be given to us. margin, like leonArdo, will also connect directly to the exchanges and no orders will be routed through our servers. That's none of our business! In addition, the new website will feature a whole new Help Center with many helpful videos and articles that will provide valuable help on understanding the capabilities of margin and this will be added to and updated regularly. We are sure you’ll love the new look and feel of the website!

Our commitment
For all our subscribers our commitment is to release a new version of margin on average every 6 weeks and to continue to improve margin with new exchanges, bots, technical indicators, reporting and other cool thus far unannounced developments we have in the pipeline. We also reaffirm our commitment to offering all of our customers world class support.

Timeline
We expect margin and our new web platform to go live within the next two weeks.

We hope that we can count on your continued support and that you will stick with us over the next months and years. We are confident that we can build on the already excellent technical basis of leonArdo to make margin the default choice for cryptocurrency traders.

Thanks so much everyone!

The margin team

http://www.marginsoftware.de/forum-images/margin-small.png

This is a shitty way to thank your early adopters man, I believed in your product and advertise it to countless people. Gotten a few referrals out of them and many I didn't bother giving my email for the ref bonus because that's not why I advertised it. I bought the ultra license even though I'm nowhere near close to maxing my apis, I probably never will, I just wanted to support the development. Now you decide to rebrand - but ditch the old product? A year of service of the new "rebranded" product is a shitty way of saying thank you to your older supporters, especially those who got here before the price hike. Not to mention this isn't "lifetime" product anymore either. I get it you need to stay competitive and fund the company but at least reward the people with a real lifetime subscription to those who allowed you to get to where you are by funding you. I see you guys going far, but this is a shitty move.