Motosport General discussion tread --- Formula1, MotoGP, WTCC, ETCC, DTM.....

[dre1982]

OK I need weekend 

I was checking the stream for the Free Practice for the F1 and find out they weren't live. Then I finally noticed the date. 

[1714286765]

1714286765

[aesma]

The main problem with F1 today is that cars can't evolve enough. It used to be that cars evolved all the time, manufacturers found all kinds of tricks to go quicker during a season, but most of that has been banned, due to rising costs.

Don't get me wrong, it's logical, otherwise running a F1 team would cost 1 billion a year and nobody would do it, but they have not found a way to reduce costs while keeping things as interesting.

Sky News UK commentators want something like a reverse grid to spice things up, I'm not sure that's a good idea though, that would cause more crashes, and crashes are costs, too.

[-CryptoViking-]

The main problem with F1 today is that cars can't evolve enough. It used to be that cars evolved all the time, manufacturers found all kinds of tricks to go quicker during a season, but most of that has been banned, due to rising costs.

Don't get me wrong, it's logical, otherwise running a F1 team would cost 1 billion a year and nobody would do it, but they have not found a way to reduce costs while keeping things as interesting.

Sky News UK commentators want something like a reverse grid to spice things up, I'm not sure that's a good idea though, that would cause more crashes, and crashes are costs, too.

It is not about the crashes though, there would not be any more crashes then they have now, drivers would adapt. Problem is that if you say you are a pinnacle of motorsports and then you do artificial things like reverse grid, limiting tire life, restricting how much fuel can a car use, etc.

F1 should go back to original core values, not attempt to create a show for noobs.

[coinlocket$]

OK I need weekend  

I was checking the stream for the Free Practice for the F1 and find out they weren't live. Then I finally noticed the date.  

Yep I was doing the same earlier.

Code:

Portugal 	        Algarve 	                25 Oct 	
Emilia Romagna 	        Imola 	                        1 Nov 	
Turkey 	                Istanbul 	                15 Nov 	
Bahrain               	Bahrain 	                29 Nov 	
Sakhir 	                Bahrain 	                6 Dec 	
Abu Dhabi 	        Yas Marina 	                13 Dec

Source: https://www.autosport.com/f1/calendar

Next gp in 8 days and it will be in Portugal and it seems a nice track for overtaking.

[Koal-84]

At time at MotoGP Qualification looks like Yamaha land, all Ducati must at Q1 that's wonder me.   It looks for a Yamaha front row, but i hope for the race another manufacture crash the Yamaha front row.

Sorry for Rossi, the Yamaha looks really good at Aragon for bis 200 podium.

[coinlocket$]

So Redbull asked for buying the technology of Honda's Engines but they want to stop the progress in motors after the 2022.

Mercedes said, "yes sure, why not  "
Ferrari said "Not at all"

Redbull asked for Mercedes engines

Mercedes said, "yes sure, free engines so you can maybe win something, just kidding! NO"
Ferrari said "maybe probably no"

How it will end?

[aesma]

Basically they want to build engines but not develop them. Or maybe have Honda still build them, then RedBull run them, but Honda wouldn't be doing any development, so RedBull is asking for a freeze.

We were just talking above about how freezing everything in F1 is what makes it less entertaining...

In other news,

Vietnam's first Formula One grand prix has been officially cancelled due to the COVID-19 pandemic, organisers said on Friday.

The Vietnamese Grand Prix was originally scheduled to take place in April on the streets of Hanoi as the third race of the season, but sources told Reuters in March that it was under threat.

I visited Hanoi a couple years ago, too bad they had to cancel. I wonder if that's because Vietnam has so few cases and don't want foreigners bringing the virus, or if the virus is more widespread there than is officially admitted...

[RealMalatesta]

The main problem with F1 today is that cars can't evolve enough. It used to be that cars evolved all the time, manufacturers found all kinds of tricks to go quicker during a season, but most of that has been banned, due to rising costs.

Don't get me wrong, it's logical, otherwise running a F1 team would cost 1 billion a year and nobody would do it, but they have not found a way to reduce costs while keeping things as interesting.

Sky News UK commentators want something like a reverse grid to spice things up, I'm not sure that's a good idea though, that would cause more crashes, and crashes are costs, too.

There isn't that much of an improvement in the car world neither, that could be one of the main reasons. Instead of making cars that could break sound barrier or however fast it could get, people are focusing on making cheaper and more efficient cars.

Look at the most hyped new car, it is tesla (well others are still famous, tesla is just up and comer) and that is not as fast as super race cars, usually the ones that got interest was lambo type of cars, now it is electric, we actually have formula electric cars as well so that is the direction we are going and they do have decent improvements. Think about the difference between cars from 1940 to 1950, or even at 1970 to 1980, but take a look at 2010 to 2020, sure there were some improvements no doubt but not as much as those days.

[aesma]

Well the Tesla roadster, or even just the new model S plaid, is faster than pretty much anything road legal out there, on a track. Not in top speed, because there is no real point.

How long you can "attack" with such a car compared to a Ferrari/Lambo, I don't know. These burn quite a lot of fuel when you're attacking so they might not go that far either. I think at the Le Mans 24h race for example, GT cars burn about 40 liters for 100Km !

I think F1 should embrace efficiency, and have a rule to reduce fuel consumption each year, 5 liters less per race for example. The problem is that to do that, they should have the possibility to improve their engine, ERS etc.

In fact what would be great would be no rule on drivetrain other than the quantity and type of fuel, say 100l of E85. The battery must not be charged externally, so the only energy you get is from these 100l of fuel, now do whatever you want to win races. Have a 3 cylinder or a V12, or maybe a fuel cell ? 4 wheel drive ? Go for it !

[coinlocket$]

Well the Tesla roadster, or even just the new model S plaid, is faster than pretty much anything road legal out there, on a track. Not in top speed, because there is no real point.

Are you sure about it?

Tesla Roadster, 0-100 3.9 sec Max speed 200kmh
Ferrari f90 stradale, Hybrid:  0-100 2.5 sec Max speed >340km/h
Porsche 918 Hybrid:  0-100 2.5 sec > Max speed >340km/h


Ferrari ofcourse is using the tech from the F1 car.

[Koal-84]

Well the Tesla roadster, or even just the new model S plaid, is faster than pretty much anything road legal out there, on a track. Not in top speed, because there is no real point.

Are you sure about it?

Tesla Roadster, 0-100 3.9 sec Max speed 200kmh
Ferrari f90 stradale, Hybrid:  0-100 2.5 sec Max speed >340km/h
Porsche 918 Hybrid:  0-100 2.5 sec > Max speed >340km/h


Ferrari ofcourse is using the tech from the F1 car.

I think Ferrari is the only team who use the technic from Formula1 also in his Hyper Sports Cars all other is for mainstream not suitable. For cost reduction the Formula1 must go back to simplified drive units that are cheaper to develop and research. Electric have no future in the motorsport for all other the already have the Electric-series or interesting as esports. Why not better engines with synthetic fuel?

[swogerino]

I also think that Ferrari is great in road cars as they are not robot built like other cars or at least Ferrari claims so.This means they have a higher engineering precision as everything is mounted from real persons,again as per Ferrari claims.

I would love to add the Nisan Skyline Gtr here as they are doing pretty good in top speed but I am not sure for 0-100 how fast they can be.

[Koal-84]

I also think that Ferrari is great in road cars as they are not robot built like other cars or at least Ferrari claims so.This means they have a higher engineering precision as everything is mounted from real persons,again as per Ferrari claims.

I would love to add the Nisan Skyline Gtr here as they are doing pretty good in top speed but I am not sure for 0-100 how fast they can be.

Official the Skyline is dead or the name, at time i think all "Skyline" were sold under Nissan GT-R?

Actually the Nissan GT-R "Nismo" have a time from 0 - 100km/h 2,8 sec.Max speed ~ 315 km/h

Source: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nissan_GT-R


Back to the MotoGP race yesterday, 10 races and 8 different winners, the World Cup couldn't be more exciting. Yamaha apparently had serious problems with the tires in the race after a perfect qualifying.

https://www.motorsport-magazin.com/motogp/saison-2020.html

So the current leader in the championship is Suzuki driver Mir, Mir have a very good race pace this year, also the brother from Marc surprise me the last 2 races. 

[aesma]

Well the Tesla roadster, or even just the new model S plaid, is faster than pretty much anything road legal out there, on a track. Not in top speed, because there is no real point.

Are you sure about it?

Tesla Roadster, 0-100 3.9 sec Max speed 200kmh
Ferrari f90 stradale, Hybrid:  0-100 2.5 sec Max speed >340km/h
Porsche 918 Hybrid:  0-100 2.5 sec > Max speed >340km/h

Ferrari ofcourse is using the tech from the F1 car.

I'm talking about the new Tesla Roadster coming out next year, with sub 2s 0-100Km/h and 400Km/h top speed. https://www.tesla.com/roadster

Don't get me wrong if I had the money I would take a Ferrari or a Porsche (in fact I'm looking at a used Porsche Boxster S 987 as they're quite cheap), but Tesla having that kind of halo car, and letting you buy a very fast cheaper car (Model 3 Performance) will focus the minds of people on electric cars not just being environmentally friendly but also the epitome of performance. It has already happened with plenty of Tesla beating very powerful gas cars in drag races.

[coinlocket$]

The main problem with F1 today is that cars can't evolve enough. It used to be that cars evolved all the time, manufacturers found all kinds of tricks to go quicker during a season, but most of that has been banned, due to rising costs.

Yes but even now if it is less expensive because the limitation and even from 2021 we will have the "salary" cap, teams are not interest in joining in.
As always Honda will leave next year because according to them "we will already have the tech we wanted from the F1 so we are leaving".

Why new teams should joining in if they don't need the tech?

Porsche is doing great hybrid supercars and they are not in F1 for example.

[Koal-84]

The main problem with F1 today is that cars can't evolve enough. It used to be that cars evolved all the time, manufacturers found all kinds of tricks to go quicker during a season, but most of that has been banned, due to rising costs.

Yes but even now if it is less expensive because the limitation and even from 2021 we will have the "salary" cap, teams are not interest in joining in.
As always Honda will leave next year because according to them "we will already have the tech we wanted from the F1 so we are leaving".

Why new teams should joining in if they don't need the tech?

Porsche is doing great hybrid supercars and they are not in F1 for example.

The powertrain is simply too complicated from Formula 1 and far too expensive for normal cars, Ferrari can afford that in their most expensive cars and customers want something very exclusive and they also demand it. Porsche has had LeMan's experience with hybrids ( LMP1) for years and is also building this into their sports cars, which I think makes sense, and after the development Porsche also leave the LMP1.

[aesma]

F1 is publicity. You don't need F1 cars to relate to street cars, in practice. It has never really been the case, anyway. But you need F1 to be good publicity, not bad. That's why I'm suggesting "bio" fuels for example.

[Koal-84]

F1 is publicity. You don't need F1 cars to relate to street cars, in practice. It has never really been the case, anyway. But you need F1 to be good publicity, not bad. That's why I'm suggesting "bio" fuels for example.

Thats's correct but i prefer "synthetic" fuel not "bio". To Ferrari the have no commercial car in his portfolio, a Ferrari brand car is unaffordable for a large part of the population and Ferrari is one of the only manufacture there also use the Formula 1 technic in his street cars like LaFerrari with his HY-KERS support the V12 engine. For publicity the Formula is very good for Mercedes and Ferrari when all drive about victorys.

[Koal-84]

At the Haas Formula 1 team, both cockpit seats will be vacant next year.

https://us.motorsport.com/f1/news/grosjean-leaves-haas-2021-/4895417/
https://us.motorsport.com/f1/news/kevin-magnussen-haas-exit-grosjean/4895449/

I think Ferrari will install another talent there (assume that Mick Schumacher, Kimi's new team-mate, will be) and an experienced driver will take his place at his side, possibly Perez?

The laste state of the driver market at Formula 1 (Oct 19, 2020).

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/the-latest-state-of-play-in-f1s-2021-driver-market/4894355/

[LTU_btc]

At the Haas Formula 1 team, both cockpit seats will be vacant next year.

https://us.motorsport.com/f1/news/grosjean-leaves-haas-2021-/4895417/
https://us.motorsport.com/f1/news/kevin-magnussen-haas-exit-grosjean/4895449/

I think Ferrari will install another talent there (assume that Mick Schumacher, Kimi's new team-mate, will be) and an experienced driver will take his place at his side, possibly Perez?

The laste state of the driver market at Formula 1 (Oct 19, 2020).

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/the-latest-state-of-play-in-f1s-2021-driver-market/4894355/

I'm surprised that Grosjean and Magnusen stayed in F1 for so long. They had good seasons in early yers of career, but in recent years they haven't achieved anything significant, I can only remember crashes.
I would like to see Perez and Hulkenberg in Haas, but it won't happen. Only one of them probably will join Haas and I think it will be Perez - he have rich sponsors behind him.
Yeah, I expect that Mick Schumacher will replace Giovinazzi in Alfa Romeo. So, another young driver from F2 will join Haas. Who it can be? Shwatrzman, Ilott, maybe Mazepin.
I just hope it won't be rich sponsored driver without talent like Latifi.