Phoenix1969
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September 02, 2013, 05:29:40 PM Last edit: September 02, 2013, 06:00:49 PM by Phoenix1969 |
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Right to 400, so where did you hear 350....ever?
I don't know how long you been around, but when they posted the items on the store.. their descriptions were 175/350 (Saturn/Jupiter) so it may of not been in a newsletter.. but then they had this update which changed that Performance improvements to Jupiter and Saturn Here at KnCMiner we have always stated that the final performance of our machines has not been set in stone. We simply do not want to overpromise and then have to correct ourselves later. The performance increase that we can announce today is based on direct feedback from the chip manufacturer who have been working with us for some time now. They have come back to us confirming the performance improvements in our RTL code. So it is with great pleasure that we can finally announce our Jupiter is now a 400 GH/s device and therefore Saturn is a 200 GH/s device.We are now so far down the chip development path that we can safely reveal these figures. There will be further announcements from us about the chip manufacture soon, and we will keep you all informed of all progress ![](https://ip.bitcointalk.org/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FBqITcV9.png&t=665&c=uRK1Wm9tN1kWJQ) I posted this right after your last comment containing the same, as well as the info you just posted. Yet somehow you missed it. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=170332.msg3060719#msg3060719but I don't see how. What are you saying exactly? You don't believe KNC's own news post, or you think I fudged it? Go to the 4/25 news and see for yourself... right at the bottom of this page.. https://www.kncminer.com/news?page=3and PS... How long I've "Been around"... I was the very first paypal order. Granted, IT was 350 for some time, but it was 250 before that. In other words, I bought when specs were 175 & 250 on Sunday, June 2nd, at 830pm Hawaii time. I do believe you when you say it was 350, I remember that now BUT, It doesn't really matter because it obviously began with 250,... although it was 350 at some point for a Jupiter, It was still 250 first as you can see above.
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eiliant
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September 02, 2013, 05:45:55 PM |
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Is it safe for me to say that I will not break-even, taking into account that I've also paid for hosting? My calculations (amateurish probably, but I didn't continue the crazy difficulty growth on the calculator after Janurary ends) show that without hosting there will be a minor profit, while with hosting I will not make ROI. Also, if it matters I'm a Day 1 Jupiter order.
Potentially bad logic, but seeing that difficulty is 26 million at 200Th, and 50 million at 400Th, can I roughly assume that difficulty doubles with the hash rate?
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MrHempstock
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"Don't worry. My career died after Batman, too."
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September 02, 2013, 05:54:58 PM |
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You can borrow my Babel Fish....
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BTCitcointalk 1%ers manipulate the currency and deceive its user community.
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Nemo1024
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September 02, 2013, 05:56:22 PM |
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The really interesting question is: how many will by November units after this announcement right now vs. waiting after the first September/October miners start to ship.
@eiliant: you should break even, especially hosting means you don't have electric costs+PSU to account for.
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“Dark times lie ahead of us and there will be a time when we must choose between what is easy and what is right.” “We are only as strong as we are united, as weak as we are divided.” “It is important to fight and fight again, and keep fighting, for only then can evil be kept at bay, though never quite eradicated.”
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jelin1984
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September 02, 2013, 05:57:08 PM |
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all that doing knc is good but still no asic chip ![Smiley](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/smiley.gif)
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AussieHash
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September 02, 2013, 06:13:04 PM |
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http://thegenesisblock.com/bitfuy-begins-shipping-to-customers/"Bitfury will clearly have a large impact on the network, but the full amount has not been disclosed. Over 400 TH/s are likely from their pre-assembled units over the next two months, but it is likely that any large-scale orders would be through their bulk chip orders. Bitfury sold lots of 3,000 chips (around 9 TH/s total) for $330,000 on August deliveries and $60,000 on October deliveries. Amid Avalon’s two-month delays with few pre-orders arriving out of the 800,000 chip backlog, Bitfury could emerge as the dominant ASIC mining chip manufacturer until companies like HastFash and CoinTerra release their 28nm at the end of this year." Not a mention on KnC wow... I'm sure they mean as a bulk chip supplier. For example the drillbit system is only selling one (sold out) batch if October bitfury boards as the price of future chip reels is going up substantially.
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AMD FTW
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GET IN - Smart Ticket Protocol - Live in market!
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September 02, 2013, 06:14:24 PM |
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I honestly don't think KNC will have all these preorders filled by end of October. I haven't seen a Knc Asic chip yet, and it is already going on September. They'd have to have everything lined up just right if they expect to get chips installed on the board without any issues and everything communicating right. Not to mention to assemble all these units and then ship out all these orders by end of October, they'd need one hell of a team.
Without seeing a chip already, I'd be surprised if they'd even have a physical prototype ready by Oct 1st.
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noodle73
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September 02, 2013, 06:15:08 PM |
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all that doing knc is good but still no asic chip ![Smiley](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/smiley.gif) No chip that they've shown us, but to come up with concrete dates like this they've got to be pretty confident about having chips themselves.
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MrHempstock
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"Don't worry. My career died after Batman, too."
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September 02, 2013, 06:20:01 PM |
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I honestly don't think KNC will have all these preorders filled by end of October. I haven't seen a Knc Asic chip yet, and it is already going on September. They'd have to have everything lined up just right if they expect to get chips installed on the board without any issues and everything communicating right. Not to mention to assemble all these units and then ship out all these orders by end of October, they'd need one hell of a team.
Without seeing a chip already, I'd be surprised if they'd even have a physical prototype ready by Oct 1st.
So many of us that were on the fence about KNC as a company AND their ability to deliver what and when they said they would are now able to make a much better decision thanks to your incredibly informative post. Who else on these forums puts the hard facts together so succinctly and informatively as you? No one, that's who. ::mind blown::
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BTCitcointalk 1%ers manipulate the currency and deceive its user community.
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timmmers
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September 02, 2013, 06:30:02 PM |
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I honestly don't think KNC will have all these preorders filled by end of October. I haven't seen a Knc Asic chip yet, and it is already going on September. They'd have to have everything lined up just right if they expect to get chips installed on the board without any issues and everything communicating right. Not to mention to assemble all these units and then ship out all these orders by end of October, they'd need one hell of a team.
Without seeing a chip already, I'd be surprised if they'd even have a physical prototype ready by Oct 1st.
IT IS september, which is 4 weeks long. End of this month they are due to ship. They aren't likely to be having them assembled in an old folks home , more likely in a factory using robotic machinery. In that case, that's easy. Car manufacturers manage over a 1000 cars a day in such a plant building a much more complex product. By comparison this is easy. Apple sold 12 million iPads in march..again much more complex, but those too are produced in 1000s a day. If KnC have this sorted they won't have a problem.
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DPoS
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September 02, 2013, 06:48:51 PM |
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Right to 400, so where did you hear 350....ever?
I don't know how long you been around, but when they posted the items on the store.. their descriptions were 175/350 (Saturn/Jupiter) so it may of not been in a newsletter.. but then they had this update which changed that Performance improvements to Jupiter and Saturn Here at KnCMiner we have always stated that the final performance of our machines has not been set in stone. We simply do not want to overpromise and then have to correct ourselves later. The performance increase that we can announce today is based on direct feedback from the chip manufacturer who have been working with us for some time now. They have come back to us confirming the performance improvements in our RTL code. So it is with great pleasure that we can finally announce our Jupiter is now a 400 GH/s device and therefore Saturn is a 200 GH/s device.We are now so far down the chip development path that we can safely reveal these figures. There will be further announcements from us about the chip manufacture soon, and we will keep you all informed of all progress ![](https://ip.bitcointalk.org/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FBqITcV9.png&t=665&c=uRK1Wm9tN1kWJQ) I posted this right after your last comment containing the same, as well as the info you just posted. Yet somehow you missed it. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=170332.msg3060719#msg3060719but I don't see how. What are you saying exactly? You don't believe KNC's own news post, or you think I fudged it? Go to the 4/25 news and see for yourself... right at the bottom of this page.. https://www.kncminer.com/news?page=3and PS... How long I've "Been around"... I was the very first paypal order. Granted, IT was 350 for some time, but it was 250 before that. In other words, I bought when specs were 175 & 250 on Sunday, June 2nd, at 830pm Hawaii time. I do believe you when you say it was 350, I remember that now BUT, It doesn't really matter because it obviously began with 250,... although it was 350 at some point for a Jupiter, It was still 250 first as you can see above.right but I had to answer you since you said 350 never existed - they weren't taking orders at 250 which is why I said 'twinkle in their eyes' stage it was the 5/11 newsletter that spelled it all out: Everyone, A lot has happened in the last few weeks, so we thought it was time for a new update. The main focus of this newsletter will be around the following topics: Jupiter’s performance increase. A new product called Saturn. More information on our approach to Litecoin mining devices. Things we are working on in the next few weeks. Update of Jupiter performance https://www.kncminer.com/products/jupiterWe have previously announced that Jupiter will have a minimum performance of 250GH/s. We can now be a little more accurate and say that it will be above 350GH/s. A few improvements have allowed this to happen. One of them is that we are now able to use the 28nm technology in our standard ASIC design. Delivery is also important to our customers so we can also narrow down from saying autumn to the latter part of September 2013. This is still a compressed timeline but we are very confident we can meet our deadline. (Which in terms of Standard cell ASIC design is a very aggressive time frame.) We are able to commit to this deadline because of the experience that ORSoC brings. The last update around Jupiter is the price. We previously stated that it would be between 7000 and 8000 USD per device. The final component costs are all in and we can confirm that the price will be 6995 USD. So to recap. Jupiter now comes with: 350 GH/s. 28nm Standard Cell ASIC chips. Shipment in September 2013. 6995 USD price tag. Announcement of Saturn https://www.kncminer.com/products/saturnWe have had many people asking for a cheaper ASIC device, which would still give great value for money in terms of hashes per dollar. So we have listened. We have created Saturn, Saturn is a 4 blade device. (Jupiter is an 8 blade device) Saturn still offers great value in terms of hash per dollar, but has a much more favorable purchase price of 3795 USD. It will have a minimum performance of 175 GH/s and because it’s based on the same modular design as Jupiter, they will ship alongside each other in September 2013. So to recap on Saturn: 175 GH/s. 28nm Standard Cell ASIC chips. Shipment in September 2013. 3795 USD price tag.
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Phoenix1969
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September 02, 2013, 07:07:20 PM |
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aaah, nice... I understand, and thank you for posting that.
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Anenome5
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September 02, 2013, 07:58:22 PM |
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You want these devices to be profitable longer? Find ways to make bitcoin more generally accepted. Believe it or not, the single greatest way to drive acceptance is for the price to rise considerably. There's no one way to achieve that. Price stabililty is more important than price rise for the general public. Disagree. We're not going to see price stability probably until it's a world-currency worth far more than it is now. Otoh, a larger market cap will tend towards price stability. At only ~$1.5b market cap a few million here or there is still a noticeable blip in the price. At $100b, it's not anymore. The single way to drive acceptance is accessibility. Arguable. I'd say the excitement generated by an increasing price trumps accessibility in terms of uptake and acceptance. Accessibility for the general public to exchange fiat to crypto, as well as vice versa, and known retailer adoption is the greatest hurdle. Hardware wallets need to be ubiquitous first. That's incidentally the area where the greatest profits to be made are. Innovating BTC as a mainstream currency, and payment mechanism. International remittance is the first target.
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Democracy is the original 51% attack.
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Anenome5
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September 02, 2013, 07:59:15 PM |
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Price stabililty is more important than price rise for the general public.
I'm with you on that one - people are more comfortable using a currency if they have a good gut feel about what it's worth. Bitcoin is such a moving target from one month to the next at the moment - you can go on holiday and by the time you come back it's value has changed 50%. I also don't think a coin where one unit is worth several hundred dollars is doing itself any favours either. Suddenly you're talking about needing to get your heads around transactions of 0.05 or, 0.005 (where those sums actually have a real value) and it just looks so different to what you find in the fiat world. If this was the stock market, they'd just do a share split to keep the numbers down - can't do that with Bitcoin. Will it put me off? No but I do think it will slow down mass adoption. You can already set some wallets to display in default mBTC, so that's really a non-issue. It's something you'd get used to actually really quickly.
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Democracy is the original 51% attack.
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btceic
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September 02, 2013, 08:02:14 PM |
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https://www.kncminer.com/news/news-33Store Update
As mentioned in our former newsletters, we are aware of the service we provide to our customers.
Previously we promised to set a precedent in protecting our customers’ share of the network.
Due to your overwhelming support, and part availability, we are forced to announce all new sales will now be delivered from mid-November on wards.
All current paid orders will be shipped no later than October 15th.
All new sales will reflect our November price point of;
· Jupiter at $4,995 · Saturn at $2,995
Mercury has now been discontinued.
There currently exist a few unpaid orders which are marked for October delivery. If these orders remain unpaid, they will become available for purchase again, unless payment is received. The devices will then be added back into our site on a daily bases. The same procedure will also be in place for refunded orders. So keep an eye on our site for any October deliveries.
Furthermore to reduce any concerns regarding loyalty, of course we intend to acknowledge all customers that have supported us. You will all be given preferential treatment with our future generation devices.
We will not forget the support you have given us.
Thanks,
KnCMiner Team.
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ASIC-K
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Hell?
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September 02, 2013, 08:02:50 PM |
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please stop double posting this news...
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Anenome5
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September 02, 2013, 08:07:12 PM |
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...so, quite all of you are saying that I should finalize my two june KNC pre-orders (1 Jupiter + 1 Saturn), both #15xx orders ;P ;P ;P ?!?!?!?!?! It isn't right?!?!? ![Grin](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/grin.gif) cheers!!! ![Smiley](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/smiley.gif) -anykeywhy- Unfilled pre-orders are not valid anymore. You had a bit over a week to do that in June. My orders are still valid and in the order number queue... (plus: as KNC stated, they also have can satisfy other added orders in-time..) If you have any SURE/VERIFIED news, please report it back and I will thank you! ![Wink](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/wink.gif) cheers! ![Smiley](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/smiley.gif) If you buy now your order will be shipping in mid-November.
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Democracy is the original 51% attack.
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Anenome5
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September 02, 2013, 08:09:34 PM |
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It surprises me there is lil more no bets considering such optimism here There were two more 'yes' bets today. What more do you want ![Tongue](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/tongue.gif) Some people are clearly using it to hedge, they have orders with KNC but are betting no anyway. Either way, if KNC ships or doesn't, they lose less.
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Democracy is the original 51% attack.
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jspielberg
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September 02, 2013, 08:10:53 PM |
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You can already set some wallets to display in default mBTC, so that's really a non-issue. It's something you'd get used to actually really quickly.
I like scientific notation... vote for all transactions denominated in Satoshi, DecaSatoshi, HectoSatoshi, KiloSatoshi, MegaSatoshi, GigaSatoshi... etc. A single bitcoin is 100 Megasatoshi (or 10 BTC is 1 GigaSatoshi). Though I think since there are only 21 Million BTC ever, we don't need to go higher than PetaSatoshi. Hmm... Maybe I have to cut down on the decongestants... damn allergies.
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Miner538
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September 02, 2013, 08:17:36 PM |
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It surprises me there is lil more no bets considering such optimism here There were two more 'yes' bets today. What more do you want ![Tongue](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/tongue.gif) Some people are clearly using it to hedge, they have orders with KNC but are betting no anyway. Either way, if KNC ships or doesn't, they lose less Even i made an bet @ sept 1st voting YES, bought an mercury, plus some shares for 1,5 BTC for people buying KNC, i trust KNC because their european, swedish and i have a good feeling about it. Now as far for the chips, i think they have them already but due to the high production / development costs They are not showing it yet, because other MF could copy the basic design of the chips and they don't want that. Maybe im talking bullshit big time here so lets call this my personal speculation (@ least an optimistic one) :-) .
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