Coronavirus Outbreak

[SaltySpitoon]

With regards to risk analysis, its a game of balancing the risk and reward. The convenience of motor vehicles is something we've agreed is worth taking the risk of dying in a car crash, but we wear seat belts and strive for higher safety engineering. 1 in 900,000 people will choke to death this month. Last month, 1 in 82,500 died of Covid. So far this month it was 1 in 6600. Absolutely, certain things in life are unavoidable. We live surrounded by dogs, vehicles, fast food, bath tubs all things that can kill you. You can't live paralyzed by fear, but we typically strive to make the best possible choices for our own well being.

You brought up an interesting point about the asymptomatic thing. On one hand, we may consider ourselves lucky that Covid doesn't have the 35% mortality rate of MERS. On the other hand, when you catch the flu, you know within a day or two and are then on your couch eating soup until you're feeling better. With Covid, you're running around feeling fine exposing other people who may or may not end up feeling fine. You could go out for a jog and then go chat with Grandma or little Timmy, and then they've croaked. The death statistics are important, but the hospitalization rate is also incredibly important. Assuming medical care is available, its not cheap. The things that put you in the high risk category for Covid aren't just rare lung diseases or being 97 years old. They're things like obesity, asthma, high blood pressure, and diabetes, things that effect more than 50% of Americans. There are essentially four outcomes with Covid, either you are asymptomatic and don't get sick at all, you get a really shitty but not life threatening two week illness, you end up in the hospital with a mountain of medical bills, or you die (and still wrack up medical bills). Three out of four of those are bad options, and option #1 isn't fantastic either for the sake of spread of contagion.

Every decision we will ever make is based on predictions. We predicted and are still predicting the effects of Covid, time will tell how things end up, but its typically better to contain the problem rather than try to deal with it later if its possible to at all. We can both throw out a million what if scenarios, what if we had shut down all international travel in January, or if New York's travel restrictions weren't put in place and we had hundreds of thousands of people traveling from New York to our states today? What I'm finding interesting is that people want to compare based on the results right this moment rather than the predictions. There were 4000 deaths last month, 50,000 so far this month, shouldn't we wait until the number stops jumping before we start drawing conclusions about mission success? I'm glad it hasn't been climbing exponentially to this point  but what number next month do you think would justify the current measures? If we stay level and tack on another 50,000 next month would we be winning the battle? If it hops up to 500,000 are we losing?

I'd have to look at a lot of data before making a statement about empty hospitals, that hasn't been my experience, but I'm also looking at the mid Atlantic to northeast corridor, not the country as a whole in depth. We've got fancy statistics here on hospital capacity, death demographics and all sorts of other interesting things if you'd like to take a look. https://coronavirus.maryland.gov/

Ah, quick final thought, its a prediction that having covid right now will leave you immune next month. Its a fairly new development that covid is causing blood clots in patients. We don't know for certain whether covid will become a seasonal thing like the flu, we don't know if it'll be convenient like the flu and give us a full year before a new strain makes its way around, we don't know know for certain that this isn't a one and done situation.

*edit*

Would you mind sharing where you're finding hospital bed availability data? I'm trying to search by state, in general, but I'm not finding anything besides buzzfeed articles from March.

*edit edit*

When I say I'm supporting a unified effort, I mean this is acceptable: https://www.whitehouse.gov/openingamerica/#criteria
I'm good with following this plan. What I'm not content with is disregarding the plan because individuals decide for themselves that they're tired of staying home and the beaches are nice this time of year. Letting individuals pick and choose what criteria they feel like following puts the entire country's health in jeopardy. The white house put together their team, they made a plan of action for how we can tell we're ready to reopen and how to safely reopen and monitor to make sure it stays within expectations. If things start getting out of hand, we step backward rather than jumping to stage 3 right now and then spending the next year playing containment and dealing with collateral damage.

*edit edit edit*

So I did find some information on hospital bed availability. https://covidtracking.com/data this site redirects you to each individual state's "best current data source for ____" and maybe half or so have information on availability of hospital beds. I'm seeing pretty consistent 33-50% availability in non heavily impacted states. Colorado, Illinois, Alaska, Indiana, etc.

[BADecker]

A state mandate however is literally force, as in if you disobey it men with guns come and force you comply.
.......
Yes, those precious stats you have so much confidence in are flawed. That is right. Some one who was a car accident, but tested positive for COVID, then later died of the trauma injuries is counted as a COVID death.

1. state mandate is not the same as marshal law
no michigans go shot by cops during protests

2. no, someone involved in a road traffic accident will not be classed as a covid death if the only covid symptom is a cough and they die due to injurys from road accident.
you have been watching the same crap as badecker and i debunked his ignorance many times
here is the summary
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5240262.msg54301190#msg54301190

3. no one is forcing you to stay home. you can actually adapt your 'business' to tender to people during this event

#2...

Nobody knows what will happen in any specific car accident until it happens.

Del Bigtree isn't good enough to create a video of Dr. Deborah Brix telling people and doctors to call it Covid-19 if they aren't sure.

Since the CDC absolutely DID publish information telling doctors to call it Covid-19 (as Bigtree and others showed) no matter what it was, this STILL doesn't control what any individual doctor will do. Perhaps every doctor will disregard what Dr. Brix and the CDC said, and will do the honest thing.

The point that TECSHARE and I have been attempting to point out, doesn't have anything to do with what a doctor will do. Rather, it has to do with what they are instructed by the CDC and Dr. Brix to do.

Since we don't know what the conscience and honesty of any doctor will cause him to do - obey his superiors, or simply be honest - there is no way we can tell for sure what the Covid-19/Coronavirus death count really is... not in the USA, anyway.

So, answer three simple questions for me:
1. Will the doctors obey their superiors and call it Covid-19 no matter what it is?
2. Or will they obey their conscience and call it what it really looks like it is to them?
3. How do you know for a fact? I mean, we need facts, not unknowns, like the real Covid-19 death-count is... an unknown.

^^^ TECSHARE showed you the proof links. But you are so set in your ways that the proof could jump right up and bite you in the eyeball, and it wouldn't phase you in the least.

Proof that he is an avid reader of conspiracy/pseudo science blogs.  Right up your alley.

 

So, if it doesn't fit your nice little idea of what the world really is, it has to be a conspiracy, right?

The following quote, or some variation thereof, has often been attributed to Lord Kelvin:

    There is nothing new to be discovered in physics now. All that remains is more and more precise measurement.

Kelvin supposedly said this some time around 1900, just before the foundations of physics were profoundly shifted by the two revolutions of relativity and quantum mechanics. Famous last words word, huh?

Charles H. Duell was the Commissioner of US patent office in 1899. Mr. Deull's most famous attributed utterance is that "everything that can be invented has been invented."

Don't you think that it is about time you get out of your lockdown long enough to find out that you are hiding the facts from yourself? I say this under the assumption that you are a reasonably honest  person, and not some government/medical troll out to further the pandemic scam.

^^^ TECSHARE showed you the proof links. But you are so set in your ways that the proof could jump right up and bite you in the eyeball, and it wouldn't phase you in the least.

https://www.theonion.com/u-s-blowjobless-rate-at-all-time-high-1819567963

Proof:

Fine, how about the best middle ground reasonable compromise that I can think of because we really aren't going to change each others minds and we're just going to frustrate each other. Don't listen to me or any official reports or media be it what I'd consider credible media or what you consider credible media. Talk to someone directly involved in this that you 100% absolutely trust, be it your personal doctor/nurse that I hope you've built up a long relationship with, or a trusted family friend/neighbor that happens to be a first responder, just someone from an involved field.

No egghead statisticians, TV producers, incomprehensible evil scientists or government lackeys, just someone you personally know with firsthand experience. If they tell you its all a bunch of nonsense then go with it.

Check out Ernie Hancock and the gang at Freedom's Phoenix - http://www.freedomsphoenix.com/. Ernie is the guy who coaxed Ron Paul into running for President in '08. Ernie and his team find some of the best info around.

Don't change what you believe. Stay ignorant, and away from the real world. There are enough crackpots out there, who don't know what is going on. You'd simply make the conspiracy worse than it is, if you thought you had found out that it was all a conspiracy.

[SaltySpitoon]

Check out Ernie Hancock and the gang at Freedom's Phoenix - http://www.freedomsphoenix.com/. Ernie is the guy who coaxed Ron Paul into running for President in '08. Ernie and his team find some of the best info around.

Don't change what you believe. Stay ignorant, and away from the real world. There are enough crackpots out there, who don't know what is going on. You'd simply make the conspiracy worse than it is, if you thought you had found out that it was all a conspiracy.

You're right, those guys are gems.





I'm sure I'll get yelled at for throwing shade when its way more funny than insulting but this was reported on a month ago https://local.theonion.com/man-just-buying-one-of-every-cleaning-product-in-case-t-1842493766

[BADecker]

^^^ I take it back... much of what I said about you. Here you are, advertising for Freedom's Phoenix. Keep up the good work.

[franky1]

Since the CDC absolutely DID publish information telling doctors to call it Covid-19 (as Bigtree and others showed) no matter what it was, this STILL doesn't control what any individual doctor will do. Perhaps every doctor will disregard what Dr. Brix and the CDC said, and will do the honest thing.

The point that TECSHARE and I have been attempting to point out, doesn't have anything to do with what a doctor will do. Rather, it has to do with what they are instructed by the CDC and Dr. Brix to do.

no no no and no
bigtree did not understand, read and reiterate what the CDC advice actually said
you conspiracy idiots drummed up that fake narrative

and it has become very obvious now that trump and his advisers get their info from conspiracy websites and fox news..
yep trump stupidly advising brix to investigate injecting bleach into patients.
yep brix not being sure. she is not a scientist.
trump has been shown to just repeat fox news stupidity, near word for word


the CDC report is clear to list the actual symptoms a person suffers from
you have been shown links and quotes and many times of the actual report.

yet your ingorance only wants to follow bigtree's mis-information

[tvbcof]

Some social distancing stuff out of Peru.

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rWgO8gTq2Y

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CyrTP9ipuqM

Interesting (and pitiful and shameful to see what the peeps have been reduced to.)

I could not help but notice in the second video the particularly heavy looking EMF towers that the drone picked up on it's way in.  The '2 meter seperation' always seemed to me more of a triangulation/tracking MIMO cell technology thing than an epidemiological thing to me, and many doctors say that it is stupid in the context of biologicals.  It would be interesting to note if there is a correlation between places where 5G is ready for testing and where 'social distancing' is heavily enforced.  A friend of mine just sent me a picture from Baguio City in the Philippines, and I recall that Baguio and Clark were going to be the first test cities for 5G.

I didn't (and don't) think that 5G is causing the 'pandemic' mostly because I don't think that 5G would be cranked up yet or that dangerous power levels, formed beams, and frequency ranges in places where it is installed.  Not yet.  But then I also don't think that there is an actual pandemic caused by coronavirus or anything else.

That said, amidst the storm of crazy information/mis-information flying around, certain things which are supposed to represent 'covid-19' do seem a much better match for EMF injury than anything seen of any coronavirus yet studied.  This would include

 - 'crushed glass lung'
 - hemoglobin molecule damage
 - loss of taste/smell
 - toe lesions,
 - and most recently, blood clots.

I very well could imagine certain of these being a result of small-scale system testing of the 5G systems which are clearly being super-fast-tracked in the media induced panic of 'covid-19'.

[20kevin20]

~

Dude, that thing in the 2nd vid looks massive.. are you sure it is a 5G tower/mast?

These markings and lines are pathetic to say the least.. It looks like they're some sheeps or slaves waiting in line.. The insane number of misinformation flying around us is shared on purpose imo, it's to confuse us constantly and reminds me of the video from BBC about non-linear warfare very well.

We've been confused so well we have been perfectly steered away from the truth. We have arguments for any narrative: you have arguments for any of the theories about what caused COVID, you can argue about the pandemic being real or fake, about microchipping being on its way or not etc.

It's a big strategy and I think it's the same one they have been using for a long time (the non-linear warfare) now. If we did not have everything in contradiction, we, as a community, could've headed towards the truth long time ago. But we just can't. And it's gonna be more confusing the deeper we get into the rabbit hole.

[tvbcof]

~

Dude, that thing in the 2nd vid looks massive.. are you sure it is a 5G tower/mast?

I think it safe to say that the big daddy is generally NOT (and that's why I chose the term EMF instead of 5G.)  The reason being that it is dominated by parabolic antenna.  These would be high bandwidth point-to-point links which is cheaper and easier than laying fiber.

I did spot stories of 5G in some city in Peru since it was a bone of contention with the Huawai kerfuffle, but I didn't cross reference to see if this was even the same city.

An interesting note is that I was buying some land recently and in the research I noticed that a big strip was claimed by the telco.  It was maybe half a kilometer from one of these types of towers and up-hill.  The tower was not on top of a hill as they usually are.  I got to analyzing this and decided that perhaps the power levels in that area exceeded a safe level and the telco wanted/needed a legal out in case people got injured.  To test this hypothesis, I drew a line and followed it and just as I expected, about 20 km there was another tower right in line.

It should be noted that no where in any sort of publicly accessible documentation from the planing/zoning people or anywhere else was there any mention of the area, and there were houses all over the place.  It was right in the middle of the city.  The FCC had no useful information at all, and in fact when I talked to an FCC person later, the lady had no concept of what a power level even was.

These markings and lines are pathetic to say the least.. It looks like they're some sheeps or slaves waiting in line.. The insane number of misinformation flying around us is shared on purpose imo, it's to confuse us constantly and reminds me of the video from BBC about non-linear warfare very well.

We've been confused so well we have been perfectly steered away from the truth. We have arguments for any narrative: you have arguments for any of the theories about what caused COVID, you can argue about the pandemic being real or fake, about microchipping being on its way or not etc.

It's a big strategy and I think it's the same one they have been using for a long time (the non-linear warfare) now. If we did not have everything in contradiction, we, as a community, could've headed towards the truth long time ago. But we just can't. And it's gonna be more confusing the deeper we get into the rabbit hole.

Here's the key to not going mad:  Plan to KNOW almost nothing.  Go back to the way post-enlightenment science is supposed to work.  Just:

 - understand and entertain a lot of hypotheses which are often enough mutually exclusive.
 - go about absorbing information and making observations.
 - make pattern matches about what observations fall into the bins of which hypotheses
 - kick out the hypotheses which can be excluded based on observation
 - DON'T kick out hypotheses which cannot reasonably be exclude (even if you get called a 'conspiracy theorist'.)

This is elementary analysis.  It is not taught in school for the same reason that fiat monetary theory isn't.  Namely, you are a better and safer sheep-person if you DON'T think about these things.

[franky1]

there are 2 reasons why telco companies buy strips of land
and ill hint now. its not about danger of intense power levels

the actual reasonss are this

for radio broadcasts they dont want people building inthg in the line of sight between antennas
again not due to human risk of illness.. but due to blocking the signals line of sight if suddenly a large building was put in the way.

as for underground cabling. they dont want to have to seek permission from a private land owner to dig his land to replace cables. if its their land they can dig as they please.

si before trying to assume its due to worries of signal intensity harming people. its not. its about logistics of not wanting to have delays/interuptions of their service/repair plans

[tvbcof]

...
An interesting note is that I was buying some land recently and in the research I noticed that a big strip was claimed by the telco.  It was maybe half a kilometer from one of these types of towers and up-hill.  The tower was not on top of a hill as they usually are.  I got to analyzing this and decided that perhaps the power levels in that area exceeded a safe level and the telco wanted/needed a legal out in case people got injured.  To test this hypothesis, I drew a line and followed it and just as I expected, about 20 km there was another tower right in line.

It should be noted that no where in any sort of publicly accessible documentation from the planing/zoning people or anywhere else was there any mention of the area, and there were houses all over the place.  It was right in the middle of the city.  The FCC had no useful information at all, and in fact when I talked to an FCC person later, the lady had no concept of what a power level even was.
...

there are 2 reasons why telco companies buy strips of land
and ill hint now. its not about danger of intense power levels

the actual reasonss are this

for radio broadcasts they dont want people building inthg in the line of sight between antennas
again not due to human risk of illness.. but due to blocking the signals line of sight if suddenly a large building was put in the way.

as for underground cabling. they dont want to have to seek permission from a private land owner to dig his land to replace cables. if its their land they can dig as they please.

si before trying to assume its due to worries of signal intensity harming people. its not. its about logistics of not wanting to have delays/interuptions of their service/repair plans

Neither of the two reasons you think you 'know' about apply here.  The strip was well away from the tower and was not between the two towers.  The strip was not contiguous with the land upon which the tower sat, nor was it in any very feasible path for future buried utility work.

As a matter of fact, if you go 20km away to the other tower and sight strait from the top of it to the top of the tower in question, the land claimed by the telco was exactly the patch of land which would be hit by a beam which missed the target by a part of a degree.  Because of the topography it was a relatively long and narrow patch on the surface of the terrain.

I had a friend with special access to GIS data which is the only reason I knew about the strip.  Otherwise it was just covered with houses and buildings like any other part of the 'highly urbanized area'.  The property I was looking at was partly in this strip which is why I was pulling the claims and what-not.

This story is actually a classic example of testing a hypothesis by making a prediction, and that's one of the strongest kinds of tests.  I predicted that I would find a tower along a certain line at a fair distance, and it was EXACTLY what I found.  Over a period of time when these kinds of things happen with a particular hypothesis it grows in strength.

[Tash]

NYC ventilator is euthanasia claims nurse
https://archive.org/details/nurse_testifies_COVID_murder_in_hospitals

[tvbcof]

NYC ventilator is euthanasia claims nurse
https://archive.org/details/nurse_testifies_COVID_murder_in_hospitals

RCode has some great stuff on their channel, and archive.org generally doesn't suffer censorship gladly unlike the corp/govs such as youtube and facebook

  https://archive.org/details/@rcode

I had not seen the full vid of the mainstream fake nurse actor getting caught red-handed.

[Tash]

NYC ventilator is euthanasia claims nurse
https://archive.org/details/nurse_testifies_COVID_murder_in_hospitals

RCode has some great stuff on their channel, and archive.org generally doesn't suffer censorship gladly unlike the corp/govs such as youtube and facebook

  https://archive.org/details/@rcode

I had not seen the full vid of the mainstream fake nurse actor getting caught red-handed.

What happens if hospital receive more money for every dead

---------------	Pop. City---	Pop. Metro	Lockdown	COVID Deaths
New York	8 175 133	19 979 477	Yes	11000
Tokyo	13 929 286	38 140 000	Never	93

[20kevin20]

~
An interesting note is that I was buying some land recently and in the research I noticed that a big strip was claimed by the telco.  It was maybe half a kilometer from one of these types of towers and up-hill.  The tower was not on top of a hill as they usually are.  I got to analyzing this and decided that perhaps the power levels in that area exceeded a safe level and the telco wanted/needed a legal out in case people got injured.  To test this hypothesis, I drew a line and followed it and just as I expected, about 20 km there was another tower right in line.

It should be noted that no where in any sort of publicly accessible documentation from the planing/zoning people or anywhere else was there any mention of the area, and there were houses all over the place.  It was right in the middle of the city.  The FCC had no useful information at all, and in fact when I talked to an FCC person later, the lady had no concept of what a power level even was.
~

That is very interesting, but you probably understand the level of research needed to find out all these secretly planned safe-level-exceeding installation of towers and antennas.. Lots of them are probably out there in the plain sight already and we don't even notice.

~
Here's the key to not going mad:  Plan to KNOW almost nothing.  Go back to the way post-enlightenment science is supposed to work.  Just:

 - understand and entertain a lot of hypotheses which are often enough mutually exclusive.
 - go about absorbing information and making observations.
 - make pattern matches about what observations fall into the bins of which hypotheses
 - kick out the hypotheses which can be excluded based on observation
 - DON'T kick out hypotheses which cannot reasonably be exclude (even if you get called a 'conspiracy theorist'.)

This is elementary analysis.  It is not taught in school for the same reason that fiat monetary theory isn't.  Namely, you are a better and safer sheep-person if you DON'T think about these things.

I sure as hell won't go mad. But I can't say the same about the majority of people. I guess that, after a while, this constant confusion proceeds to generate even some sort of psychological damage. My "strategy" right now is to just read everything, bullshit or not, with a very critical mind and believe nothing but the uncensored and real facts.. That takes a lot of time though - and a lot of information to process.

[TwitchySeal]

What happens if hospital receive more money for every dead

---------------	Pop. City---	Pop. Metro	Lockdown	COVID Deaths
New York	8 175 133	19 979 477	Yes	11000
Tokyo	13 929 286	38 140 000	Never	93

They'd just start killing people on purpose and blaming the virus of course!

That's it Tash! You've cracked the case of the mysterious corona virus!  Well done!

[squatz1]

What happens if hospital receive more money for every dead

---------------	Pop. City---	Pop. Metro	Lockdown	COVID Deaths
New York	8 175 133	19 979 477	Yes	11000
Tokyo	13 929 286	38 140 000	Never	93

They'd just start killing people on purpose and blaming the virus of course!

That's it Tash! You've cracked the case of the mysterious corona virus!  Well done!

Ahahahah, I've literally heard some conspiracy theories like this. The ones I've heard didn't go as far though, some people were saying that hospitals were way overreporting the amount of deaths from COVID-19 to get more money. I don't think people understand that you can't just report someone dead and move on, you're going to be filling out a lot more paperwork and you're going to get caught very quickly if you're lying.

People folks. People.

[BADecker]

My "strategy" right now is to just read everything, bullshit or not, with a very critical mind and believe nothing but the uncensored and real facts.. That takes a lot of time though - and a lot of information to process.

Don't forget to watch Del Bigtree's The Highwire - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCq6oOuhSx7ESreh6m9LGy6Q/videos. The logic shown is the closest that I have seen to proof that, say, 90% of the CV talk is simply hype.

[franky1]

...
An interesting note is that I was buying some land recently and in the research I noticed that a big strip was claimed by the telco.  It was maybe half a kilometer from one of these types of towers and up-hill.  The tower was not on top of a hill as they usually are.  I got to analyzing this and decided that perhaps the power levels in that area exceeded a safe level and the telco wanted/needed a legal out in case people got injured.  To test this hypothesis, I drew a line and followed it and just as I expected, about 20 km there was another tower right in line.

the actual reasonss are this

for radio broadcasts they dont want people building anything in the line of sight between antennas
again not due to human risk of illness.. but due to blocking the signals line of sight if suddenly a large building was put in the way.

The strip was well away from the tower and was not between the two towers
As a matter of fact, if you go 20km away to the other tower and sight strait from the top of it to the top of the tower in question, the land claimed by the telco was exactly the patch of land which would be hit by a beam which missed the target by a part of a degree.  Because of the topography it was a relatively long and narrow patch on the surface of the terrain.

I predicted that I would find a tower along a certain line at a fair distance, and it was EXACTLY what I found.  Over a period of time when these kinds of things happen with a particular hypothesis it grows in strength.

so your rebuttal tries to say that its not about line of sight.. but then you argue that it was exactly about line of sight.

can you even get story straight not between towers exactly inline

.. anyway take your 5G conspiracy back to the other topic. it has nothing to do with corona virus.
we already debunked it due to corona being an outbreak in places that dont even have 5g
so take your 5g conspiracy to the other topic if you want to rebuttal it

[franky1]

NYC ventilator is euthanasia claims nurse
https://archive.org/details/nurse_testifies_COVID_murder_in_hospitals

already debunked Dr sidel
he was an ER doctor not an intensive care specialist. he admitted even on bigtree that he was putting patients who were not yet in acute respiratory distress because they were talking and calm. he was putting them on ARDS protocol by comatosing them and putting them on a ventilator

this has already been addressed months ago that he was told to go back to ER and not treat patients with covid. purely because HE done the wrong protocol

yep ARDS treatment is not for people who are not in respiratory distress
ill give you a clue
ARDS - Acute Respiratory Distress Syndrome

he done malpractice for giving ards treatment to a patient that was not in distress and still able to talk.

im starting to think america are just too dumb to even think for themselves. not just a few doctors. but the american conspiracy theorists and cultish people on this forum. you know who you are. if your getting offended by what i just said. im talking about you

[franky1]

The logic shown is the closest that I have seen to proof that, say, 90% of the CV talk is simply hype.

agreed 90% of bigtrees CV talk is hype
meanwhile actual doctors actual scientists actual fact checkers are saying whats really going on
try to find proper sources and stop following faux news thats 90% hype