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Question: Ethnic cleansing of Russian speaking by Kiev forces is the main cause of clashes in Donbass area.
True. - 54 (51.4%)
This is Khasarian Kaganat and Russians must be killed or must be sclaves. - 29 (27.6%)
What is Donbass? - 5 (4.8%)
Where is Kiev? - 4 (3.8%)
My TV show only Israeli clashes. - 13 (12.4%)
Total Voters: 105

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Author Topic: Donetsk, Kharkov, Lugansk - way to Russia.  (Read 734742 times)
deisik
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September 03, 2014, 06:07:43 PM
 #4321

As I said, the primary aim is to make the Ukrainian army withdraw troops from Donetsk and Lugansk. And this tactic works perfect...

Putin is saying that a ceasefire might be announced by this Friday. This might be a very bad move, especially when many of the major cities in the Donbass still controlled by the Kiev forces (Slavyansk, Mariupol, Krasnyi Liman.etc). Also, the Kiev forces are very close to the major cities of Donetsk and Lugansk, which makes them extremely vulnerable to artillery attacks.

In fact, Putin says that he has nothing to do with the civil war in Ukraine, that he is not the right person to have truce negotiations with. I'm curious where you got the info about Putin announcing ceasefire from...

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September 03, 2014, 06:08:42 PM
 #4322

@jurij.timofejev

State of emergency is not exactly the same thing as the state of war. Your arguments look pale comparing to dramatical claims that Russia is invading Ukraine. If this was true, and Poroshenko and his gang are refusing to declare state of emergency as necessary step towards the full mobilization and declaration of war - then this is an act of high treason.
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September 03, 2014, 06:13:21 PM
 #4323

In fact, Putin says that he has nothing to do with the civil war in Ukraine, that he is not the right person to have truce negotiations with. I'm curious where you got the info about Putin announcing ceasefire from...

Here:

http://rt.com/news/184791-putin-ukraine-kiev-militia/

These are the conditions proposed by him:

1. Militias should cease military advances in the Donetsk and Lugansk Regions.

2. Pro-Kiev armed forces should withdraw to a distance that excludes the possibility of shelling settlements.

3. Implement full and objective international control over ceasefire observation and monitoring.

4. Exclude the use of combat aircraft against civilians and villages.

5. Prisoner/captive-exchange via an ‘all-in-all’ formula, without preconditions.

6. Humanitarian corridors for refugees movement and delivery of humanitarian aid across Donetsk and Lugansk Regions.

7. Direct repair-crew access to destroyed social and transit infrastructure with supportive aid.

The first proposal is absolute foolishness. I don't think that the rebels will agree to that.
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September 03, 2014, 06:17:24 PM
 #4324

Mr. Putin merely gave a suggestion, a possible path for the ceasefire as he sees it. But he made it pretty clear that it's not him Kiev should talk to, nor that he can speak on the behalf of people of Donbass.
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September 03, 2014, 06:33:49 PM
 #4325

In fact, Putin says that he has nothing to do with the civil war in Ukraine, that he is not the right person to have truce negotiations with. I'm curious where you got the info about Putin announcing ceasefire from...

Here:

http://rt.com/news/184791-putin-ukraine-kiev-militia/

These are the conditions proposed by him:

1. Militias should cease military advances in the Donetsk and Lugansk Regions.

2. Pro-Kiev armed forces should withdraw to a distance that excludes the possibility of shelling settlements.

3. Implement full and objective international control over ceasefire observation and monitoring.

4. Exclude the use of combat aircraft against civilians and villages.

5. Prisoner/captive-exchange via an ‘all-in-all’ formula, without preconditions.

6. Humanitarian corridors for refugees movement and delivery of humanitarian aid across Donetsk and Lugansk Regions.

7. Direct repair-crew access to destroyed social and transit infrastructure with supportive aid.

The first proposal is absolute foolishness. I don't think that the rebels will agree to that.

Quoting below what he actually said:

Quote
In order to stop the bloodshed and stabilise the situation in southeast Ukraine, I believe that the parties to the conflict should immediately agree on and coordinate the following steps:

1. End active offensive operations by armed forces, armed units and militia groups in southeast Ukraine in the Donetsk and Lugansk areas.

2. Withdraw Ukrainian armed forces units to a distance that would make it impossible to fire on populated areas using artillery and all types of multiple launch rocket systems.

3. Allow for full and objective international monitoring of compliance with the ceasefire and monitoring of the situation in the safe zone created by the ceasefire.

4. Exclude all use of military aircraft against civilians and populated areas in the conflict zone.

5. Organise the exchange of individuals detained by force on an ‘all for all’ basis without any preconditions.

6. Open humanitarian corridors for refugees and for delivering humanitarian cargoes to towns and populated areas in Donbass – Donetsk and Lugansk regions.

7. Make it possible for repair brigades to come to damaged settlements in the Donbass region in order to repair and rebuild social facilities and life-supporting infrastructure and help the region to prepare for the winter.

Where does he say that a ceasefire might be announced by this Friday?

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September 03, 2014, 06:44:04 PM
 #4326

Where does he say that a ceasefire might be announced by this Friday?

Hmm... got that news from one of the NAF accounts in Twitter. It came a few minutes after Poroshenko announced the ceasefire on his official site. So far it is not published in any of the major news sources.

Poroshenko is still refusing to deal directly with the NAF. Therefore, I don't think that any sort of permanent ceasefire will be implemented soon.
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September 03, 2014, 07:29:34 PM
 #4327

Whenever they declare a "ceasefire" it's obviously just for show. Meanwhile, shelling and combat continue.
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September 03, 2014, 09:52:19 PM
 #4328

Veeeery interesting... One of the Russian paratroopers who lost his legs in Ukraine after he "got lost" while being "on holiday" has photos posted of him in... Berkut uniform, defending Crimean parliament during the March events there. In other words, at least some of them were just Russian troops dressed up like Ukrainians.
Well well, Putty, your lies come out, one by one.

http://argumentua.com/tainoe-stanovitsya-yavnym-kto-igral-rol-berkutovtsev-vo-vremya-krymskogo-referenduma


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September 03, 2014, 10:44:09 PM
 #4329

The history with the Ukrainian air force officer Nadiya Savchenko has acquired a psychiatric aspect. Detained by Russian secret services on the territory of Ukraine, she was illegally transferred to Russia and by a decision of a Russian court sent to the Serbski Institute (currently the Federal State-budget Institution «State Scientific Center for Social and Forensic Psychiatry named after Serbski» of the Ministry of Health of the Russian Federation) to undergo a forensic psychiatric evaluation.

As a air force pilot on duty and a officer of the Ukrainian army, she regularly underwent medical check-ups, among them psychiatric ones. The mental health of Ms. Savchenko was before never subject to any doubt. This is confirmed both by relatives and fellow officers. On basis of this we can assume that the motive to send the Ukrainian officer Nadiya Savchenko for psychiatric examination is her courageous behavior in a Russian court.

We, Ukrainian psychiatrists, remember the recent history of declaring healthy people mentally ill behind the walls of the Serbski Institute in Moscow. We also know about new cases of political abuse of psychiatry in the Russia of today. The authoritarian political regime in Russia is able to use the «psychiatric cover up» also in the case of Nadiya Savchenko.



http://euromaidanpress.com/2014/09/03/appeal-to-the-world-psychiatric-community-on-the-case-of-nadiya-savchenko/

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September 03, 2014, 11:21:56 PM
 #4330

Sky News has filmed well-armed, well-equipped troops, who appear to be wearing recent issue Russian combat gear, operating alongside rebel forces in south-eastern Ukraine.



http://news.sky.com/story/1329691/sky-films-troops-in-russian-gear-in-ukraine

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September 03, 2014, 11:40:48 PM
 #4331



It's pretty obvious Ukraine is falling apart...



Novorussia won...




CONGRATULATIONS, NOVORUSSIAN SUPERHEROES!!!

Continue with the attack on Zaporozhje, the psychological impact is greater than the war itself on the ground because nobody wants to be sent to the front anymore, they are deserting like rats



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September 03, 2014, 11:47:38 PM
 #4332

Here is how big is the destruction capability of the ruSSian army invading Ukraine and attacking the Ukrainian defense forces.. And Adolf Putin claims that ruSSia is saint.. not interfering..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urzS7c8dOrM

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September 03, 2014, 11:59:32 PM
 #4333



NEWS TODAY ARE INTERESTInG:

CONFIRMED: POWs from Poland were captured at Luhansk airport


The commander of the losing UKrainian comedian forces is American, the wounded General Key Randy Allen & the fighters don't only include Wahhabis... but Polish?  Cheesy The victory for the Novorussians is sweeter




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September 04, 2014, 12:09:13 AM
 #4334

Comedian Forces? Hm, it seems that you have a point. With all these Kiev statements I forgot about TV series and comic broadcasts. Yats & Pornos duo have replaced them all.
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September 04, 2014, 12:41:07 AM
 #4335


To Understand Putin, Read Orwell

Anyone who wants to understand the current Russian position on Ukraine would do well to begin with George Orwell’s classic, 1984. The connections go deeper than the adjective “Orwellian”: the structure and the wisdom of the book are guides, often frighteningly precise ones, to current events.

The easiest way to begin, in light of the now entirely open Russian invasion of Ukraine, is with “War is Peace,” one of the slogans of the imagined empire in Orwell’s tale. After all, every attempt thus far at negotiation and cease-fire has been accompanied by a Russian escalation, to the point where we can be certain that this is not a coincidence. If Russian President Vladimir Putin meets with other leaders, we must simply expect that this is cover for the latest outrage, as with the entrance of Russian troops, armor and artillery during the recent talks in Minsk.

But we need to dig a bit deeper into the plot for the three concepts needed to understand this very strange war, in which Putin has radicalized Russian politics, destroyed a European peace order, challenged Europeans’ assumptions about their entire future — and even threatened nuclear war. Every reason proffered to explain a war that is pointless to the point of nihilism is obviously bogus or self-contradictory or both. To grasp this horrible event in which people are killing and dying for no discernible reason, we need to remember some key concepts from Orwell: Eurasia, doublethink and learning to love Big Brother.

In Orwell’s 1984, one of the world powers is called Eurasia. Interestingly enough, Eurasia is the name of Russia’s major foreign policy doctrine. In Orwell’s dystopia, Eurasia is a repressive, warmongering state that “comprises the whole of the northern part of the European and Asiatic land-mass, from Portugal to the Bering Strait.” In Russian foreign policy, Eurasia is a plan for the integration of all the lands from—you guessed it—Portugal to the Bering Strait. Orwell’s Eurasia practices “neo-Bolshevism”; Russia’s leading Eurasian theorist once called himself a “national Bolshevik.” This man, the influential Alexander Dugin, has long advocated that the Ukrainian state be destroyed, and has very recently proposed that Russia exterminate Ukrainians.

Orwell can help us understand what is happening to us as if we make a good-faith effort to use Russian media official sources to try to understand the world. Russian propaganda about Ukraine is today’s doublethink: it requires that people, as Orwell put it, “hold simultaneously two opinions which cancelled out, knowing them to be contradictory and believing both of them.” Russian propaganda daily pounds out two sides to every story, both of which are false, and each of which contradicts the other. Consider the propositions in italics below, all of which should by now, after eight months of repetition, sound familiar.

One the one hand, Russia must invade Ukraine because the Ukrainian state is repressive. (In fact, Ukraine is a democracy with free expression and is in every respect a freer country than Russia.) On the other hand, Russia must intervene because the Ukrainian state does not exist. (In fact, it is just as functional as the Russian state, except in the problematic spheres of war, intelligence and propaganda.)

On the one hand, Russia must invade Ukraine because Russians in Ukraine are forced to speak the Ukrainian language. (This is not the case: Russians in Ukraine are far more at liberty to speak as they please than are Russians in Russia. Most speakers of Russian in Ukraine are not actually Russian, in any case, any more than Americans who speak English are English.) On the other, there is no Ukrainian language. (There is. It has a proud literary tradition and is spoken by tens of millions of people.)

On the one hand, Ukrainians are all nationalists. (In fact, the Ukrainian far right polled at 2 percent in the last presidential elections, far less than in any other European country you care to name.) On the other hand, there is no Ukrainian nation. (In fact, opinion polls always show the contrary, even in the regions now under Russian occupation. Millions of Ukrainians were willing to take risks for their nation in the recent revolution, and thousands of volunteers have chosen to risk their lives on the front lines—far more than can be said of most people in the United States and elsewhere who regard themselves as patriots.)

Feeling dizzy yet? One more time: Russia is making war to save the world from fascism. (In fact, it is in Russia where the far right it exerts dictatorial power, the head of state enunciates a Hitlerian doctrine of invading another country to protect ethnic brethren. Russia’s political allies are Europe’s far right parties, including the fascists and neo-Nazis.) Meanwhile: fascism is good. (In Russia, Hitler is now being rehabilitated as a statesman, the Jews are being blamed for the Holocaust, gays are presented as an international conspiracy, Russian Nazis march on May Day and Russian Nazis in Ukraine are presented as heroes.)

Russian propaganda provides both sides of the story. We assume that the truth is in between. But no truth lies between propositions that are individually false and mutually contradictory. There is only insanity—or, as Orwell calls it, learning to love Big Brother, the novel’s distant, impersonal totalitarian leader. In 1984, one learns to love Big Brother by sacrificing the thing that one loves the most. In Ukraine, this would be statehood, as Putin has just demanded by endorsing the partition of the country and the formation of a Novorossiya (New Russia) in its southeast; in Europe, this would be peaceful integration, the achievement that Putin threatens; for all of us, reason.

All too often, we try to guess what is in Putin’s mind. We try to dwell in the mind of Big Brother rather than in the world of discoverable facts. But, fundamentally, who really cares what is in Putin’s mind? Does anyone really know, including Putin himself? Even if we did know what was in Putin’s mind today, is that a reliable guide to what will be in his mind tomorrow? And what chance would we have of defending freedom and decency if we begin from the brain of one individual? This is, after all, a man who intervenes in children’s cartoons and presides over television programs that raise the question of his possible divinity.

At the end of 1984, a member of Big Brother’s regime, in the midst of carrying out torture, makes a certain admission: “power is not a means, it is an end.” Whatever is in Putin’s mind, whatever he says and does, all he is really defending is his own power, something that will come to an end before very long in any event. Oppression in Russia, war in Ukraine and the destabilization of the West are grotesquely high prices to pay for one man’s preferences. Rather then beginning from these, rather than staring into the troubled eyes of the doublethinker, we had better think instead about what we value and what we can do to protect it. If Ukraine becomes Novorossiya, Europe becomes Eurasia, and the West collapses, it will not be because if Russia’s physical strength, but because of our mental weakness.

Timothy Snyder is Housum professor of History at Yale University and the author of Bloodlands: Europe Between Hitler and Stalin.

http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2014/09/to-understand-putin-read-orwell-110551_Page2.html

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September 04, 2014, 02:02:17 AM
Last edit: September 04, 2014, 02:24:40 AM by myshownow
 #4336



TIME FOR reckoning is HERE!!!

It starts now..


Crimea prosecutor Natalia Poklonskaya wins: Kolomoisky to pay 18.5bln to reimburse PrivatBank clients

Natalya Poklonskaya wins a case against "Privatbank" (aka PrivatBank Group) of Igor Kolomoisky to pay out 18.5 billion roubles to bank clients in Crimea who lost their savings


Kolomoyski is the Israeli-Ukrainian oligarch who owns that country's largest bank, PrivatBank, & financier of the genocidal battalions in the East of Ukraine


With the rout of the Ukrainian comedian forces in the battlefields & the increasing collapse in the country's fabric, the start of the payback period is welcome. But probably it would be better if the restitution is accelerated so the world can be presented with a fait accompli. Just making it drag allows for delusion among the losers (particularly the losing sponsors from the crumbling bankrupt Western empire) to distract the focus on the objectives...

The Ukraine fiasco was a usual extortion job by the crumbling Anglo-Zionist empire (their latest after a long series, e.g. Iraq, Libya, etc) but their propaganda now is turning it into a fight for Western civilization. Well, everybody already knows  Western civilization as bankrupt anyway and is just waiting to collapse, and it's because of the evil shenanigans of the shadow players of the empire which bankrupted the empire and is destroying Western civilization. Putin just defended Russia and won in the last gasp of the empire to perpetuate its evil extortionary control on the world. Putin is becoming the hero of the new world which will rise from the ashes of the crumbling Anglo-Zionist empire which enslaved Europe. Europe should thank Putin because Europe will soon be free.




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September 04, 2014, 02:55:40 AM
 #4337

Federalism Activist Gets Jail For Demanding Same Regional Rights Russia Wants in Ukraine

While Russia calls for a broader autonomy for eastern Ukraine, it has jailed a domestic activist for advocating the same kind of federalization rights for a southern Russian region, media reported Tuesday.
Activist Darya Polyudova, who participates in a leftist political movement, was charged with separatism and placed in pretrial detention soon after she finished serving a previous two-week sentence over a rally for broader autonomy for the Krasnodar region, Grani.ru reported.

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/russia-jails-federalism-activist-who-called-for-same-regional-rights-as-russia-wants-in-ukraine/506274.html

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September 04, 2014, 03:21:55 AM
Last edit: September 04, 2014, 04:35:44 AM by myshownow
 #4338

IS IT A BIRD? IS IT A PLANE?

IS IT A S-400? IS IT A YAKHONT?


NO, IT'S...

FLASH PUTIN:

THE AMAZING AVENGER AGAINST THE EVIL ANGLO-ZIONIST EMPIRE



It's really heartening to see that somebody is now standing up to the former self-appointed overlords of the world. They have lost their economic and financial credibility so the world has started forming an alternative financial sytem led by Russia, China & the BRICS, the fastest growing parts of the world with half its population (some major EU countries are still slaves of the Anglo-Zionist empire but some are struggling to be free AND JOIN THEM). Meanwhile the geriatric Western powers, all highly-indebted, insolvent and increasingly exposed as manipulating their data to present they are still "rich", are in panic. They are used to intimidating the world but they are increasingly seen as already powerless. Their last card is military. But what a last card, they don't have a respectable track record. According to the top German business paper, aside from the Normandy landing, the US failed in all its other wars like Korea, Vietnam, Afghanistan, Iraq, etc.

But they are so used to intimidating it's automatic for them to posture. When Ukraine forces started losing, they tried to intimidate again and announce there will be a NATO training in WEstern POland.

Here's Russia's answer, a counter military exercise. But nuclear. I think the over-the-hill, insolvent Western villains will become more panicky again. But these things are necessary to remind them their act of pretending powerful is now corny. Maybe in the past, but not anymore.
Grin Cheesy

Russia's strategic nuclear forces to hold major exercise this month

MOSCOW Wed Sep 3, 2014 9:09am BST

MOSCOW (Reuters) - The forces responsible for Russia's strategic nuclear arsenal will conduct major exercises this month involving more than 4,000 soldiers, the Defence Ministry said on Wednesday, in the latest sign of rising tension with NATO over the Ukraine crisis.

In an announcement a day before the start of a NATO summit in Wales, RIA news agency quoted the ministry as saying the exercises would take place in Altai in south-central Russia and would also include around 400 technical units and extensive use of air power.

The agency quoted Dmitry Andreyev, a major in the strategic rocket forces, as saying troops would practice countering irregular units and high-precision weapons, and "conducting combat missions in conditions of active radio-electronic jamming and intensive enemy actions in areas of troop deployment."

He said enemy forces would be represented in the exercises by spetsnaz (special forces) units.

Supersonic MiG-31 fighter-interceptors and Su-24MR reconnaissance aircraft would take part, Andreyev said, saying the scale of air power involved was unprecedented for exercises of this kind.

Both Russia and NATO have stepped up military manoeuvres since the outbreak of conflict in Ukraine between government forces and pro-Russian separatists in the east of the former Soviet republic.

A Kremlin security adviser said on Tuesday that Russia would update its military doctrine this year in the light of the Ukraine crisis and the sharp deterioration in relations with NATO.



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September 04, 2014, 05:20:23 AM
 #4339

To reinforce the troops of the RF in Ukraine Shoigu has sent a mobile crematorium. I would say this is more to destroy the evidence of that there were Russian soldiers in Ukraine and not have to ship body bags back to parents and wifes of these soldiers. Moscovia is a barbaric failed state!

RT @Slavyanskman "B пoдкpeплeниe вoйcкaм pф в Укpaинe Шoйгy пocлaл мoбильныe кpeмaтopии pic.twitter.com/QWl1ejgFvq"


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September 04, 2014, 06:15:32 AM
 #4340

Very important news. The rebels have captured a Su-25 bomber jet from the Ukrainian Air Force. Currently they are using the jet for trial flights. Soon we can expect them to be used against the Kiev forces trapped in various pockets (Amvroseevka, Dokuchaevsk, Mariupol.etc). At the same time, the news from Kiev is that they don't have many jets left after the rebels shot down dozens of them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFYY9V1ZNWA
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