Official Thread: AMT

[clenell]

We'll give you an update on where we are at every Tuesday, how about that?

It's Tuesday again! Think AMT will bless us with another non-update?

Hmm missed that post. If they do that at least thats good. Its something. If it at least highlights what they are currently working on. Some communication is better than none. And they have been at least posting up pics of what they have been doing. Hopefully we hear more about what is going on and particularly how the bitmine issue is affecting them (or if they worked around it some how)

im fairly certain dopieum has missed a lot of posts.

[sirminesalot]

We should do a betting pool.

200 Page thread before anyone gets a 1.2TH miner.

I remember this post.

We are almost there!!!!
Let's do another betting pool! 300 threads before anyone received the mysterious 1.2TH miner.

In all honesty, I was hoping to be wrong. Let's see what happens.

Clennel: You called Josh, what did he say? Has anyone spoken to anyone from AMT recently?

Looking very dire now. They say models are shipping, then disappear off the face of the earth.   They really need to start issuing refunds before this gets uglier.

[sirminesalot]

We'll give you an update on where we are at every Tuesday, how about that?

It's Tuesday again! Think AMT will bless us with another non-update?

Hmm missed that post. If they do that at least thats good. Its something. If it at least highlights what they are currently working on. Some communication is better than none. And they have been at least posting up pics of what they have been doing. Hopefully we hear more about what is going on and particularly how the bitmine issue is affecting them (or if they worked around it some how)

Dude seriously? You really need to take AMT's dick out of your mouth. I guarantee that your ass kissing won't get you a miner sooner than anybody else.

You also need to go back and read this thread again.

[loshia]

We should do a betting pool.

200 Page thread before anyone gets a 1.2TH miner.

I remember this post.

We are almost there!!!!
Let's do another betting pool! 300 threads before anyone received the mysterious 1.2TH miner.

In all honesty, I was hoping to be wrong. Let's see what happens.

Clennel: You called Josh, what did he say? Has anyone spoken to anyone from AMT recently?

Looking very dire now. They say models are shipping, then disappear off the face of the earth.   They really need to start issuing refunds before this gets uglier.

Teu will postpone miners delivery as long as they can to mine and just before it gets uglier they will deliver the crap
So urgent actions are neded

[FrictionlessCoin]

So urgent actions are neded

Urgent action?  Like what kind of action?

[loshia]

So urgent actions are neded

Urgent action?  Like what kind of action?

If you can make tax authorities to see if they pay taxes and investigate them. Just file some sort of complain for money wandering or whatever you think will bring their attention to AMT and George  as as a person
Then go to court. Some urgent REAL legal action which will scare them. And they will contact you immediately mark my words. The refund preferable or your miner will be coming shortly.
No matter what we write here they just do not care. T is useless to mention you hav Los your investment already so just as for full refund if you can take this as advise

[FrictionlessCoin]

So urgent actions are neded

Urgent action?  Like what kind of action?

If you can make tax authorities to see if they pay taxes and investigate them. Just file some sort of complain for money wandering or whatever you think will bring their attention to AMT and George  as as a person
Then go to court. Some urgent REAL legal action which will scare them. And they will contact you immediately mark my words. The refund preferable or your miner will be coming shortly.
No matter what we write here they just do not care. T is useless to mention you hav Los your investment already so just as for full refund if you can take this as advise

Why should we take advise from someone who doesn't even live in America and can't even get a visa to America?  

We already posted the legal action that one can take earlier.  That is ... Delaware Consumer Affairs and Small Claims court.

I think you should get lost also.  This is an American matter to be handled by American consumers in the appropriate manner.

Wire-fraud is a very serious offense in the USA.   Here is an example of a guy who sold 'weight loss books'... he got 10 years in jail.  http://www.businessinsider.com/best-selling-author-kevin-trudeau-gets-10-years-in-prison-for-massive-deception-2014-3   

So AMT even intends on not delivering 1.2 THs miners or not refunding customers for not delivering,  they and their employees are going to spend a long time in jail.

[sirminesalot]

So urgent actions are neded

Urgent action?  Like what kind of action?

If you can make tax authorities to see if they pay taxes and investigate them. Just file some sort of complain for money wandering or whatever you think will bring their attention to AMT and George  as as a person
Then go to court. Some urgent REAL legal action which will scare them. And they will contact you immediately mark my words. The refund preferable or your miner will be coming shortly.
No matter what we write here they just do not care. T is useless to mention you hav Los your investment already so just as for full refund if you can take this as advise

Why should we take advise from someone who doesn't even live in America and can't even get a visa to America?  

We already posted the legal action that one can take earlier.  That is ... Delaware Consumer Affairs and Small Claims court.

I think you should get lost also.  This is an American matter to be handled by American consumers in the appropriate manner.

Wire-fraud is a very serious offense in the USA.   Here is an example of a guy who sold 'weight loss books'... he got 10 years in jail.  http://www.businessinsider.com/best-selling-author-kevin-trudeau-gets-10-years-in-prison-for-massive-deception-2014-3  

So AMT even intends on not delivering 1.2 THs miners or not refunding customers for not delivering,  they and their employees are going to spend a long time in jail.

This IS NOT just an American matter. They have taken payments from Internationals as well (at least based on their website). When Josh Zipkin flees back to Bulgaria, I hope our European friends might give a helping hand when that day comes.

I remember seeing that guy Kevin on TV selling his 'miracle cures' crap. Funny, didn't know he ended up in jail. There was always something fishy about that guy.

[FrictionlessCoin]

This IS NOT just an American matter. They have taken payments from Internationals as well (at least based on their website). When Josh Zipkin flees back to Bulgaria, I hope our European friends might give a helping hand when that day comes.

I remember seeing that guy Kevin on TV selling his 'miracle cures' crap. Funny, didn't know he ended up in jail. There was always something fishy about that guy.

Well,  I honestly doubt that Josh is dumb enough to commit wire fraud.    I gather he lives in Haverford, PA which is quite an afluent community.  His family appears to also comes from there.   So I doubt he plans on throwing all of that away to perpertuate a fraud.

I still think AMT is legit,  unfortunately they run a terrible business.

[sirminesalot]

This IS NOT just an American matter. They have taken payments from Internationals as well (at least based on their website). When Josh Zipkin flees back to Bulgaria, I hope our European friends might give a helping hand when that day comes.

I remember seeing that guy Kevin on TV selling his 'miracle cures' crap. Funny, didn't know he ended up in jail. There was always something fishy about that guy.

Well,  I honestly doubt that Josh is dumb enough to commit wire fraud.    I gather he lives in Haverford, PA which is quite an afluent community.  His family appears to also comes from there.   So I doubt he plans on throwing all of that away to perpertuate a fraud.

I still think AMT is legit,  unfortunately they run a terrible business.

Considering he might have millions of dollars of customers' money, it isn't far fetched to think he'd risk everything to 'get rich quick'.

It's a LOT of money.

[FrictionlessCoin]

Considering he might have millions of dollars of customers' money, it isn't far fetched to think he'd risk everything to 'get rich quick'.

It's a LOT of money.

If he had planned a scam from day one,  do you think we would even know who he is? 

Do you think he would take the trouble to become the U.S. exclusive distributor of Bitmain?

Do you think they would even bother to work with U.S. based contract manufacturers?

AMT is already receiving a ton of inquiries from law enforcement,  they aren't going anywhere until they deliver.

[sirminesalot]

Considering he might have millions of dollars of customers' money, it isn't far fetched to think he'd risk everything to 'get rich quick'.

It's a LOT of money.

If he had planned a scam from day one,  do you think we would even know who he is? 

Do you think he would take the trouble to become the U.S. exclusive distributor of Bitmain?

Do you think they would even bother to work with U.S. based contract manufacturers?

AMT is already receiving a ton of inquiries from law enforcement,  they aren't going anywhere until they deliver.

No, but they could of set themselves up to fail from day one. They could of also planned to actually run the miners, creating delays during said time: then deliver late.

Who knows? Unfortunately AMT won't update anyone as to what is going on, and even if they did it'd be hard to believe them at this point.

[opieum2]

Considering he might have millions of dollars of customers' money, it isn't far fetched to think he'd risk everything to 'get rich quick'.

It's a LOT of money.

If he had planned a scam from day one,  do you think we would even know who he is? 

Do you think he would take the trouble to become the U.S. exclusive distributor of Bitmain?

Do you think they would even bother to work with U.S. based contract manufacturers?

AMT is already receiving a ton of inquiries from law enforcement,  they aren't going anywhere until they deliver.

At this point there seems to be no reason to question that. Especially where wire fraud is concerned. Since the trolls here have been hellbent on trolling AMT I gave them the essential tool to do it. The press. This was mostly to call them out. There are only a couple of people here who have a legitimate claim to bitch about their miners. But then again Their attitudes don't help their case. The idea is if their claims are real and there is a real situation then guess what the news will ferret that out. If its BS then guess what, the trolls now are wide open to libel AND slander since they would have gone on TV to slander the company if what they say turns out to be bs.

I am inclined to believe AMT is legit. But I figure giving the trolls the tools to actually do something instead of just talk shit and post Alex Jones type shit might help them actually accomplish a couple of things. The press will actually have the resources and connections to dig up the dirt on both sides. At least in that sense they will work mostly objectively since this is not a political issue. The press can get real information and legit info. I haven't checked but I am guessing the trolls haven't even said anything in taking actual action regarding the press. I will take that as a sign that they doubt their position and are likely just talking shit. The actual customers who feel they need to talk to lawyers should also look at this route. But again, same thing applies. If you have an inkling of doubt in your legitimate position then this should make you question your position. If you are so adamant you are in the right then contact the press let them know what is going on (remember in this they are on your side until they see the truth (if your version of it isn't the truth). But know the second they come back with the fact you are lying and have proof of it, well the jig is up. I am challenging those who are talking all sorts of smack to try to get the press involved. I am curious to see what happens. I think there are other more level headed people here who are as well.

[sirminesalot]

Considering he might have millions of dollars of customers' money, it isn't far fetched to think he'd risk everything to 'get rich quick'.

It's a LOT of money.

If he had planned a scam from day one,  do you think we would even know who he is? 

Do you think he would take the trouble to become the U.S. exclusive distributor of Bitmain?

Do you think they would even bother to work with U.S. based contract manufacturers?

AMT is already receiving a ton of inquiries from law enforcement,  they aren't going anywhere until they deliver.

At this point there seems to be no reason to question that. Especially where wire fraud is concerned. Since the trolls here have been hellbent on trolling AMT I gave them the essential tool to do it. The press. This was mostly to call them out. There are only a couple of people here who have a legitimate claim to bitch about their miners. But then again Their attitudes don't help their case. The idea is if their claims are real and there is a real situation then guess what the news will ferret that out. If its BS then guess what, the trolls now are wide open to libel AND slander since they would have gone on TV to slander the company if what they say turns out to be bs.

I am inclined to believe AMT is legit. But I figure giving the trolls the tools to actually do something instead of just talk shit and post Alex Jones type shit might help them actually accomplish a couple of things. The press will actually have the resources and connections to dig up the dirt on both sides. At least in that sense they will work mostly objectively since this is not a political issue. The press can get real information and legit info. I haven't checked but I am guessing the trolls haven't even said anything in taking actual action regarding the press. I will take that as a sign that they doubt their position and are likely just talking shit. The actual customers who feel they need to talk to lawyers should also look at this route. But again, same thing applies. If you have an inkling of doubt in your legitimate position then this should make you question your position. If you are so adamant you are in the right then contact the press let them know what is going on (remember in this they are on your side until they see the truth (if your version of it isn't the truth). But know the second they come back with the fact you are lying and have proof of it, well the jig is up. I am challenging those who are talking all sorts of smack to try to get the press involved. I am curious to see what happens. I think there are other more level headed people here who are as well.

You're an idiot. I wouldn't be surprised if you were working for AMT or Josh himself. No one that shells out this kind of money for hardware, and gets nothing in return wouldn't be nearly as positive as you seem to be.

Go shill for AMT elsewhere.

[NotFuzzyWarm]

<snip>
I am inclined to believe AMT is legit.
<snip>
[/quote]
I do as well and unfortunately for them, they are as much caught in the problems BitMine's A1 chip has as we are. Actually. more so simply because while individually we buyers are currently out xxxx$, look at their position - they have scores of customers that they are obligated to. EACH who have paid them said monies. Aside from hiding & cowering in a corner like a puppy that got caught peeing on the floor AND shitting a brick in panic (making things worse) they need to communicate. Are they possibly business idiots that thought they could easily get into the OEM miner biz? Apparently so.

A. From day-1 of the chips actually getting into the hands of people to test in the real world - eg, actually connected to hardware - AMT should have at least pointed people to the A1 dev thread. All the chips trials and tribulations are there to be read.

B. They damn well had better be holding BitMine.ch's feet to the fire to do something to make this right with customers. If v1 of the chip is really destined to be an albatross then it is up to BitMine.ch to perhaps setup a program to give Antminers of equal or better total hashing speed to us.

In the end I lay this all at the feet of BitMine.ch. They are the ones who blew it. The chips were late - fine. But these were not pre-production test sample chips sent to a very limited # of testers/build companies to be used to find if they actual work right in the Real World. BM.ch hideously oversold the chip to companies and a lot like AMT & others jumped in head first. And hit a rock...

These seem to me to be pre-production quality chips that were expected to work like the computer sims say they should. Well, as their IP design company Innosilicon and BitMine.ch themselves should know better! I have never ever once heard of a complex chip right enough to be a salable item from the very first spin. At least BitMine.ch is getting the same 'roid rage from their own miner rig customers!

Again, I am NOT defending AMT as a business. They need to look at how GM is handling their recall woes and step up to the plate if they really want to get through this. Hiding is just making things worse. Will it cost them? Yep but they should have planned for something like this and not blindly believed this brand-new design would be plug & play easy.

I *do* understand the mess they and other companies are in over this but: They need to TALK! Heck, at least for smaller miners AMT is a reseller - not builder. Soooo. Get some Ants to give those will take them and also start selling them for cryin'out loud. At least they could bring in some money and have a salable item...

[sirminesalot]

<snip>

I am inclined to believe AMT is legit.
<snip>

I do as well and unfortunately for them, they are as much caught in the problems BitMine's A1 chip has as we are. Actually. more so simply because while individually we buyers are currently out xxxx$, look at their position - they have scores of customers that they are obligated to. EACH who have paid them said monies. Aside from hiding & cowering in a corner like a puppy that got caught peeing on the floor AND shitting a brick in panic (making things worse):

A. From day-1 of the chips actually getting into the hands of people to test in the real world - eg, actually connected to hardware - AMT should have at least pointed people to the A1 dev thread. All the chips trials and tribulations are there to be read.

B. They damn well had better be holding BitMine.ch's feet to the fire to do something to make this right with customers. If v1 of the chip is really destined to be an albatross then it is up to BitMine.ch to perhaps setup a program to give Antminers of equal or better total hashing speed.

In the end I lay this all at the feet of BitMine.ch. They are the ones who blew it. The chips were late - fine. But these were not pre-production test sample chips sent to a very limited # of testers/build companies to be used to find if they actual work right in the Real World. BM.ch hideously oversold the chip to companies and a lot like AMT & others jumped in head first. And hit a rock...

These seem to me to be pre-production quality chips that were expected to work like the computer sims say they should. Well, as their IP design company Innosilicon and BitMine.ch themselves should know better! I have never ever once heard of a complex chip right enough to be a salable item from the very first spin. At least BitMine.ch is getting the same 'roid rage from their own miner rig customers!

Again, I am NOT defending AMT as a business. I *do* understand the mess they and other companies are in over this but: They need to TALK! Heck, at least for smaller miners AMT is a reseller - not builder. Soooo. Get some Ants to give those will take them and also start selling them for cryin'out loud. At least they could bring some some money and have a salable item...

Let's say it is BITMINE's fault : Why isn't AMT honoring refunds?

AMT has given us no way out of this shit storm.

[NotFuzzyWarm]

As I said above - AMT has royally blown this in their actions and business'Plan'. If like they claim are people 'experienced' in this kind of business then as soon as the delay from BitMine.ch started they in turn should have started a back-up plan - like STOP selling systems. Since the mining community was more than willing to pay in advance, then just take a deposit - not the full amount - with the clear statement of these being not-yet in production. Having those advance orders with a deposit would have given investors/banks a nice warm fuzzy feeling to provide working capital until things get moving right. Gotta say it does not look like they or other companies did. They just saw $$$ in their eyes and prayed.

As it is, if the pictures are to be believed, AMT & others are now sitting on a mess'o under-performing chips with not even a decent reference design board to use with them... Betcha BM.ch made them and the other companies pay up-front like we did... Can you say screwed, blued, & tattoo'd?

[Syke]

As it is, if the pictures are to be believed, AMT & others are now sitting on a mess'o under-performing chips with not even a decent reference design board to use with them... Betcha BM.ch made them and the other companies pay up-front like we did... Can you say screwed, blued, & tattoo'd?

The chips are fine. There are plenty of Chinese vendors with enough skill to build working boards for the exact same chips that Bitmine/AMT are unable to develop. The problem isn't the chips.

[FrictionlessCoin]

As it is, if the pictures are to be believed, AMT & others are now sitting on a mess'o under-performing chips with not even a decent reference design board to use with them... Betcha BM.ch made them and the other companies pay up-front like we did... Can you say screwed, blued, & tattoo'd?

The chips are fine. There are plenty of Chinese vendors with enough skill to build working boards for the exact same chips that Bitmine/AMT are unable to develop. The problem isn't the chips.

Technobit appears to have a board that's stable.

Bitmine seems to be shipping sub 800 GHs that seem okay.

I don't think AMT has the requisite talent to get things right. 

The problem appears to be the power supply.

What Chinese vendor are you talking about here?

[NotFuzzyWarm]

As it is, if the pictures are to be believed, AMT & others are now sitting on a mess'o under-performing chips with not even a decent reference design board to use with them... Betcha BM.ch made them and the other companies pay up-front like we did... Can you say screwed, blued, & tattoo'd?

The chips are fine. There are plenty of Chinese vendors with enough skill to build working boards for the exact same chips that Bitmine/AMT are unable to develop. The problem isn't the chips.

Have you read the dev thread? I doubt it. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=294235.380

Page 20, Feb. 18 by the way... is when tester/reviewer folks JUST got the chips up and going to any extent. Those lucky soles had received first runs around mid-late Dec. 2013. Continue reading from there.
Original promised Turbo speed per chip: 40GH/s
Now lowered to 33. On a good day. When the moon is just right...
Power usabe at 25GH/s, eccellent at 0.65W/GH/s. in turbo mode... over 1.5w.
The list goes on.