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Question: Will you support Gavin's new block size limit hard fork of 8MB by January 1, 2016 then doubling every 2 years?
1.  yes
2.  no

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Author Topic: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP.  (Read 1807084 times)
tvbcof
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January 19, 2015, 05:12:37 PM
 #20361


no, i use a laptop.

it's all about being detail oriented and an insatiable thirst for obtaining as much knowledge as possible to get a good sense of the Big Picture.  unlike tvbcof, and others, who come here to vomit on this thread once in a while after returning from the fields from humping little dogs (he is a little dog afterall).

To the guy who

 - lost 75% of his money last year...and maybe some other people's as well if there is anyone dumb enough to listen to him any more
 - got such a kick out of the chihuahua-humping-leg gif that he re-posted it multiple times and cannot stop thinking about it (where I and I think probably most people didn't see a sexual connotation at all.)
 - sees a sheep and automatically thinks porn

Quote from: Sophocles
"Alas, how terrible is wisdom when it brings no profit to the man that's wise! This I knew well, but had forgotten it, else I would not have come here.


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cypherdoc
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January 19, 2015, 05:27:03 PM
 #20362

Thanks.. It was probably the time you were saying that the dollar would cause a selloff in equities but I said they would rise together and since equities were rising I inferred that you would have been bearish usd.

you have been very right on equities, and yes, i thought the rise in the dollar would spark a selloff.  i still think it will eventually.  too much USD denominated debt used to prop up those same equities which increases in magnitude as the USD rises.  look at all the margin.  could take some time though.  it will be interesting to see how this current pause in stocks will play out.
tvbcof
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January 19, 2015, 05:56:47 PM
 #20363

<gold important on the international stage>
<admittedly it seems so>

with Bitcoin, you merely have to check the signature, which takes a millisecond.

Ask, oh, say everyone who's been robbed of their BTC, how great that is.  If I'm remembering correctly there may be a few people in this category.

FWIW, this is another pretty decent reason for considering Bitcoin as an important reserve more than a trivial exchange item.  As politically incorrect as it may be, there is a decent correlation between being smart and having enough wealth to benefit by solid protection.  Smart people are more often (but not always) able to retain exclusive control of their secrets.  Fewer hand-to-mouth types trying to figure out how to secure their secret keys equates directly to fewer thefts.  Technology is very unlikely to come to the rescue here any time soon.  It's simply not in the interest of the powers that be to allow the peons to have secrets of any type.


cypherdoc
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January 19, 2015, 06:21:10 PM
 #20364

<gold important on the international stage>
<admittedly it seems so>

with Bitcoin, you merely have to check the signature, which takes a millisecond.

Ask, oh, say everyone who's been robbed of their BTC, how great that is.  If I'm remembering correctly there may be a few people in this category.

FWIW, this is another pretty decent reason for considering Bitcoin as an important reserve more than a trivial exchange item.  As politically incorrect as it may be, there is a decent correlation between being smart and having enough wealth to benefit by solid protection.  Smart people are more often (but not always) able to retain exclusive control of their secrets.  Fewer hand-to-mouth types trying to figure out how to secure their secret keys equates directly to fewer thefts.  Technology is very unlikely to come to the rescue here any time soon.  It's simply not in the interest of the powers that be to allow the peons to have secrets of any type.



actually, i don't disagree with you.  i think Bitcoin works either as a reserve currency or as a payment network simply b/c it's voluntary, mathematically secure, and based on a fixed supply.  both of us are probably considered to be in the upper percentiles in terms of wealth but i, for one, do understand the argument that Bitcoin should act as a great "leveler".  i don't have a problem with that as it would allow the spread of Bitcoin to far ends of the earth, like Africa and corners of Asia, which would greatly increase its usage and probably benefit mankind overall.  i don't have a problem with sharing.  i'm hedged either way.  but i've come to like the concept of Bitcoin being a "noble" endeavor.
cypherdoc
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January 19, 2015, 06:34:12 PM
 #20365

what a crock of shit:

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/story?guid=202a1eaa-9f62-11e4-b098-3bcc8cdda52c
justusranvier
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January 19, 2015, 06:38:50 PM
 #20366

President of the SNB probably started to worry about the risk of a strong CHF causing unexpected and fatal aircraft maintenance problems developing in his plane.
cypherdoc
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January 19, 2015, 06:43:44 PM
 #20367

it's great to see gvt sponsorship:

http://www.coindesk.com/singapore-government-sponsors-bitcoin-firm-attend-sxsw-event/
tvbcof
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January 19, 2015, 06:45:49 PM
 #20368

<gold important on the international stage>
<admittedly it seems so>

with Bitcoin, you merely have to check the signature, which takes a millisecond.

Ask, oh, say everyone who's been robbed of their BTC, how great that is.  If I'm remembering correctly there may be a few people in this category.

FWIW, this is another pretty decent reason for considering Bitcoin as an important reserve more than a trivial exchange item.  As politically incorrect as it may be, there is a decent correlation between being smart and having enough wealth to benefit by solid protection.  Smart people are more often (but not always) able to retain exclusive control of their secrets.  Fewer hand-to-mouth types trying to figure out how to secure their secret keys equates directly to fewer thefts.  Technology is very unlikely to come to the rescue here any time soon.  It's simply not in the interest of the powers that be to allow the peons to have secrets of any type.


actually, i don't disagree with you.  i think Bitcoin works either as a reserve currency or as a payment network simply b/c it's voluntary, mathematically secure, and based on a fixed supply.  both of us are probably considered to be in the upper percentiles in terms of wealth but i, for one, do understand the argument that Bitcoin should act as a great "leveler".  i don't have a problem with that as it would allow the spread of Bitcoin to far ends of the earth, like Africa and corners of Asia, which would greatly increase its usage and probably benefit mankind overall.  i don't have a problem with sharing.  i'm hedged either way.  but i've come to like the concept of Bitcoin being a "noble" endeavor.

Another place where it's sidechains to the rescue.  The two-way-peg makes any (properly implemented) sidechain an excellent proxy for Bitcoin (and as I always argue, would make it BE Bitcoin.)  An implementation which provides some add-on protection for the less sophisticated user would be fine with me and it really would bring Bitcoin to the masses.  In fact I'd be inclined to use just such a thing in a limited role.  This would allow me to use Bitcoin from my Android and Windows machines with some confidence.  As always, such use would be just pocket-change class.  My nest-egg would be native Bitcoin and I'd have to visit my safe deposit box in order to get at it.


JorgeStolfi
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January 19, 2015, 06:57:33 PM
 #20369


Wait, bitcoin is now being supported by money stolen from hard-working enslaved singaporeans by parasitic corrupt government thugs, under threat of violent harm and loss of liberty?  Grin

Academic interest in bitcoin only. Not owner, not trader, very skeptical of its longterm success.
tvbcof
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January 19, 2015, 07:03:24 PM
 #20370


Not to me it isn't.

All governments are effectively hired managers of people-farming operations as I see it.  The bureaucracies they form are effectively the labor hired to work the farm.  Management class folks get to move up the chain into a farm ownership role sometimes (watch what happens to Obama when his work is done) while the hired labor are not all that different from the stock they work though they are allowed to take some limited stock for their own use in most implementations.

My hope for Bitcoin is that it tears some holes in the fences and allows some of the herd to escape.  Of course most of the herd would stand in the pasture and stare at the hole rather than make a break for it.  What can you do?


cypherdoc
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January 19, 2015, 07:34:28 PM
 #20371


Not to me it isn't.

All governments are effectively hired managers of people-farming operations as I see it.  The bureaucracies they form are effectively the labor hired to work the farm.  Management class folks get to move up the chain into a farm ownership role sometimes (watch what happens to Obama when his work is done) while the hired labor are not all that different from the stock they work though they are allowed to take some limited stock for their own use in most implementations.

My hope for Bitcoin is that it tears some holes in the fences and allows some of the herd to escape.  Of course most of the herd would stand in the pasture and stare at the hole rather than make a break for it.  What can you do?



it's great in the sense that gvts are the linchpins of Bitcoin resistance, as they have the most to lose and have the power to make life tough for Bitcoin.  the more gvts disagree on their policies towards Bitcoin, the better chance it has to survive and thrive.
sickpig
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January 19, 2015, 07:45:28 PM
 #20372

also doesn't explain the Peter Todd debate reference from someone.

It seems I've missed this one. Care to share a pointer?

Bitcoin is a participatory system which ought to respect the right of self determinism of all of its users - Gregory Maxwell.
sickpig
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January 19, 2015, 07:52:05 PM
 #20373


p.s. you do have a big screen @cypher, don't you? Smiley



no, i use a laptop.

it's all about being detail oriented and an insatiable thirst for obtaining as much knowledge as possible to get a good sense of the Big Picture.  unlike tvbcof, and others, who come here to vomit on this thread once in a while after returning from the fields from humping little dogs (he is a little dog afterall).

I've no doubt about your thirst for knowledge, I was referring to your habit of posting hi-res screenshots without resizing or using img tag "with" property, though Smiley

Bitcoin is a participatory system which ought to respect the right of self determinism of all of its users - Gregory Maxwell.
cypherdoc
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January 19, 2015, 08:11:49 PM
 #20374

also doesn't explain the Peter Todd debate reference from someone.

It seems I've missed this one. Care to share a pointer?

Go back over the last few days of posts.
tvbcof
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January 19, 2015, 08:49:39 PM
 #20375

also doesn't explain the Peter Todd debate reference from someone.

It seems I've missed this one. Care to share a pointer?

Go back over the last few days of posts.

All I remember is some tweet from a guy who is threatened by the existence of Blockstream (and many in the rapidly expanding ecosystem are.)


zanzibar
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January 19, 2015, 09:17:08 PM
 #20376

also doesn't explain the Peter Todd debate reference from someone.

It seems I've missed this one. Care to share a pointer?

Go back over the last few days of posts.

All I remember is some tweet from a guy who is threatened by the existence of Blockstream (and many in the rapidly expanding ecosystem are.)


That was me who posted, here is the article for reference:

http://cointelegraph.com/news/113314/last-minute-tnabc-changes-garza-cancels-robot-roger-ver-and-more
tvbcof
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January 19, 2015, 09:28:54 PM
 #20377

also doesn't explain the Peter Todd debate reference from someone.

It seems I've missed this one. Care to share a pointer?

Go back over the last few days of posts.

All I remember is some tweet from a guy who is threatened by the existence of Blockstream (and many in the rapidly expanding ecosystem are.)


That was me who posted, here is the article for reference:

http://cointelegraph.com/news/113314/last-minute-tnabc-changes-garza-cancels-robot-roger-ver-and-more

Quote from: above linked story
by Ian DeMartino @ 2015-01-16 10:47 PM
...
There was a planned debate between Blockstream's Adam Back and Bitcoin Core Developer Peter Todd, but Back reportedly canceled just before this article went to press. It is unclear why, and we are attempting to reach out to him for comment.  ...

More clear now I guess.  In general, after countless blatant pump-for-hire stories, I rate the reliability of many of these crypto-rags to be a step below an off-hand tweet from some random wanker.


cypherdoc
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January 19, 2015, 10:00:53 PM
 #20378

i made a point some time ago that if Bitcoin were to become a global reserve currency, much like gold, due to maintaining the 1MB block size, all Bitcoin 2.0 projects trying to ride the MC would be eliminated due to high tx costs.  in that case, the blockchain would only be applicable to Bitcoin as Money:

https://twitter.com/bramcohen/status/557287567121346560
justusranvier
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January 19, 2015, 10:04:30 PM
 #20379

i made a point some time ago that if Bitcoin were to become a global reserve currency, much like gold, due to maintaining the 1MB block size, all Bitcoin 2.0 projects trying to ride the MC would be eliminated due to high tx costs.  in that case, the blockchain would only be applicable to Bitcoin as Money:
Bitcoin can't be money with a capped transaction rate.

Gold only maintains purchasing power due to being subsidized by central banks - there's no such thing as intrinsic value for a currency.

If those transaction rate limits are hit and the situation isn't fixed, then Bitcoin will disappear.
JorgeStolfi
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January 19, 2015, 10:34:19 PM
 #20380

Bitcoin can't be money with a capped transaction rate.
Gold only maintains purchasing power due to being subsidized by central banks - there's no such thing as intrinsic value for a currency.
If those transaction rate limits are hit and the situation isn't fixed, then Bitcoin will disappear.

The transaction rate limits are fixable.  The real problem is the inevitable centralization of mining.  It seems that no one knows how to fix that.  Bitcoin with centralized mining does not make any sense.

Academic interest in bitcoin only. Not owner, not trader, very skeptical of its longterm success.
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