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Author Topic: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP.  (Read 1805446 times)
ErisDiscordia
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Imposition of ORder = Escalation of Chaos


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February 17, 2015, 03:27:34 PM
 #21341


well, but there is a difference between losing money of government/bank-backed fiat kind and losing decentralised BTCs, right?
In the first case, there are certain guarantees to protect you from a loss, even if that means 'let's print some more money', in the latter case, once the money is gone it is gone for good. Unless the receiving party will send it back to you. I just can't find the reason for doing so.

In the former case the banks loss is covered by increasing everyones premiums and insurances or with a bail out by governments in the form of QE monetary dilution. In the latter the company that lost all the BTC either goes bankrupt or recompenses customers loss, plus all of their contemporaries are incentivised into making stronger storage systems.

When you come down to it, the primary complaint detractors have against bitcoin is they cannot socialize their own losses, that are a result of their own incompetence, on others . The prospect that they will directly bear the consequences of their own bad decisions, and not be able to force their loses on others, scares them to death.

Those of us who are sick and tired of have other people's losses forced on us (as uki promotes), look at bitcoin as a salvation.

Nailed it. Another thing is that abandoning personal responsibility for the supposed safety of the "experts" or authorities makes you incapable of critical thought and independence. You can see the same effect in pretty much every area where government is heavily involved. Nowadays people can't even educate their own children, care for their own health, plan their own retirement or handle their own money. A pretty sad state of affairs which can imo be only remedied by relocating responsibility where it belongs and where it is most effective: with the individual.

I'd suggest your taking it slightly too far here, a person can not be an expert in everything, there simply is not enough time in the day. TRUST being the key issue. I trust a teacher to provide a good education or a service to perform as they claim. Obviously due diligence is an important factor but an unwatched business will frequently cut corners/ take extra risk to make a profit. (hence the misconception regulation will improve the status quo). The point most detractors don't seem to realise is that theoretically at least, Bitcoin businesses have the potential to eliminate the need for trust entirely.  (just wish more of them would implement it already)

This is hugely valuable and seldomly mentioned in the mainstream media.

Point taken. I'm not suggesting that everyone try to become an expert on everything, division of labor obviously has its benefits. Your area of expertise should be in knowing which expert opinions to listen to - as opposed to blindly accepting whatever is handed to you as "education" or "health care". Then there is also the question of how frugally we consume resources where the cost of production has been socialized (hint: not very much). But in general the more responsibility you give away, the more complacent and less adaptable you become.

It's all bullshit. But bullshit makes the flowers grow and that's beautiful.
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Miz4r
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February 17, 2015, 03:42:02 PM
 #21342

But in general the more responsibility you give away, the more complacent and less adaptable you become.

Wise words. People have become complacent and apathetic due to this and are busy consuming their own culture. Real life news has become a form of entertainment you watch lying on the sofa with a beer in your hand.

Bitcoin = Gold on steroids
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February 17, 2015, 05:11:49 PM
 #21343

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The illiterate of the 21st century will not be those who cannot read and write, but those who cannot learn, unlearn, and relearn.

Like this post? you can tip me (BTC) 1LGi2DMhectdFSkBid5srrnHk8WHgD3V1d or very WoW (Doge) D9p6FZQb1sKkq9hApy4tnjSduYfdnc74bb
rocks
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February 17, 2015, 05:22:09 PM
 #21344

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The illiterate of the 21st century will not be those who cannot read and write, but those who cannot learn, unlearn, and relearn.
That's a great quote, where/who is it from?
Adrian-x
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February 17, 2015, 06:01:06 PM
 #21345

I was going to post and say thanks for the last 2 quotes, they are awesome, so Thanks, re-quoted for posterity.  

But in general the more responsibility you give away, the more complacent and less adaptable you become.

and
Quote
The illiterate of the 21st century will not be those who cannot read and write, but those who cannot learn, unlearn, and relearn.

In other news Canadian Bitcoin exchanges dropping like flies, CAvirtex going dark, this time I get a hint at what it's like to have coins on an exchange.

there must be an imminent rally coming on or something Tongue

Thank me in Bits 12MwnzxtprG2mHm3rKdgi7NmJKCypsMMQw
explorer
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February 17, 2015, 06:21:16 PM
 #21346

I was going to post and say thanks for the last 2 quotes, they are awesome, so Thanks, re-quoted for posterity.  

But in general the more responsibility you give away, the more complacent and less adaptable you become.

and
Quote
The illiterate of the 21st century will not be those who cannot read and write, but those who cannot learn, unlearn, and relearn.

In other news Canadian Bitcoin exchanges dropping like flies, CAvirtex going dark, this time I get a hint at what it's like to have coins on an exchange.

there must be an imminent rally coming on or something Tongue

Something must be up.  I guess I'll scrape my $0.07 and BTC0.06 out of there, lest it dissappear  Tongue 
To think I used to hold some coins on there.... what's left for Canadians?
msin
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February 17, 2015, 08:37:27 PM
 #21347

what's left for Canadians?

Maple Syrup
explorer
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February 17, 2015, 08:49:17 PM
 #21348

what's left for Canadians?

Maple Syrup

Excellent.  I'm well stocked.
tabnloz
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February 17, 2015, 09:22:48 PM
 #21349

"The Telegraph’s recent coverage of HSBC amounts to a form of fraud on its readers. It has been placing what it perceives to be the interests of a major international bank above its duty to bring the news to Telegraph readers"

https://www.opendemocracy.net/ourkingdom/peter-oborne/why-i-have-resigned-from-telegraph#.VOOCLwagd5Y.twitter
rocks
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February 17, 2015, 11:56:26 PM
 #21350

so sad:

AT&T charges $29 more for gigabit fiber that doesn’t watch your Web browsing

http://arstechnica.com/business/2015/02/att-charges-29-more-for-gigabit-fiber-that-doesnt-watch-your-web-browsing/
A good VPN is about 5 euros/month.

Take the $29 discount, route 100% of your traffic through a VPN, and you still come out ahead.

but how can you know that the VPN won't watch you?

you pay with bitcoin and it doesnt matter if they watch you. they won't know who "you" are.

^Horrible advice.  The VPN sees your IP, which is exactly what you're trying to obfuscate by using a VPN.

Exactly, in the end if you use a centralized service (such as a VPN) you have to trust that that service is not compromised somehow.

This is why P2P solutions, such as tor or bitcoin, are superior at maintaining anonymous traffic.

For example, with bitcoin if you run a full node, connect to the P2P network and send a transaction directly from your IP address, even if you are connected directly to an attacker trying to determine the source of that transaction they still could not determine your IP as the transaction's source, because your node is most likely a relay node for that transaction.

Now if you keep sending transactions to the the same node, then they could statistically determine your IP as the source. But if your node has a policy to always send new transactions to a different initial peer, then this attack becomes hard to impossible. Tor works the same way, if you route through 3 peers, then as long as one is honest you should (in theory) be fine.

A great application for bitcoin is to provide a funding model for tor P2P relay nodes. WIth bitcoin there can be a market for those willing to pay for anonymous traffic. This is not possible with fiat, because it is easy to trace the source of funds, but bitcoin provides a fully anonymous solution from payment through the end service. So lebing's point on using bitcoin was partially right, you just can't do so with a centralized service.
uki
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February 18, 2015, 12:07:41 AM
 #21351

Gold Collapsing. Bitcoin bottoming.
this time gold got a punch again. If that is BTC-positive, that is another question.

marcus_of_augustus
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February 18, 2015, 02:06:20 AM
 #21352

Quote
A great application for bitcoin is to provide a funding model for tor P2P relay nodes. WIth bitcoin there can be a market for those willing to pay for anonymous traffic. This is not possible with fiat, because it is easy to trace the source of funds, but bitcoin provides a fully anonymous solution from payment through the end service. So lebing's point on using bitcoin was partially right, you just can't do so with a centralized service.

This is the logical outcome, eventually there will be no such thing as ISP's, it will back to the truly distributed architecture original envisaged. The medum term outcome has been distorted by the lack of a resource allocation mechanism, i.e. internet money, for the market to correctly price and pay for network traffic, private or otherwise. If the packets encoded their own transport payments within them, so to speak, then the relays do not need this massive out-of-band billing and payment contraption that has globbed onto the internet and created opportunities for all the corpro-facist mahem we witness today, AT&T, WorldCom, ComCast, NSA, Google, etc.

bucktotal
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February 18, 2015, 02:41:34 AM
 #21353

I was going to post and say thanks for the last 2 quotes, they are awesome, so Thanks, re-quoted for posterity.  

But in general the more responsibility you give away, the more complacent and less adaptable you become.

and
Quote
The illiterate of the 21st century will not be those who cannot read and write, but those who cannot learn, unlearn, and relearn.

In other news Canadian Bitcoin exchanges dropping like flies, CAvirtex going dark, this time I get a hint at what it's like to have coins on an exchange.

there must be an imminent rally coming on or something Tongue

Something must be up.  I guess I'll scrape my $0.07 and BTC0.06 out of there, lest it dissappear  Tongue 
To think I used to hold some coins on there.... what's left for Canadians?

at first glance this is terrible news. the pre-emptive closing is weird. i had nothing there, so no worries, but i was an avid user for past couple of years. a big whole is left in the market now.

explorer
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February 18, 2015, 03:03:26 AM
 #21354

I was going to post and say thanks for the last 2 quotes, they are awesome, so Thanks, re-quoted for posterity.  

But in general the more responsibility you give away, the more complacent and less adaptable you become.

and
Quote
The illiterate of the 21st century will not be those who cannot read and write, but those who cannot learn, unlearn, and relearn.

In other news Canadian Bitcoin exchanges dropping like flies, CAvirtex going dark, this time I get a hint at what it's like to have coins on an exchange.

there must be an imminent rally coming on or something Tongue

Something must be up.  I guess I'll scrape my $0.07 and BTC0.06 out of there, lest it dissappear  Tongue 
To think I used to hold some coins on there.... what's left for Canadians?

at first glance this is terrible news. the pre-emptive closing is weird. i had nothing there, so no worries, but i was an avid user for past couple of years. a big whole is left in the market now.



And what will they do with the reams of personal financial information they demanded? 
uki
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February 18, 2015, 12:50:37 PM
 #21355

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The illiterate of the 21st century will not be those who cannot read and write, but those who cannot learn, unlearn, and relearn.
That's a great quote, where/who is it from?
I bump this question, as I am also interested to know who was the author.

meh32123
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February 18, 2015, 12:52:32 PM
 #21356

cypherdoc
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February 18, 2015, 04:55:34 PM
 #21357

up 19.2%.  gold sub 1200:

uki
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February 18, 2015, 05:50:24 PM
 #21358

-snip-
Thanks for the answer and the picture. It goes to my book with quotes.

cypherdoc
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February 18, 2015, 06:12:47 PM
 #21359

what stagnation?

cypherdoc
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February 18, 2015, 06:15:02 PM
 #21360

Full node FUDsters, please note:  PRUNING

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