[XMR] Monero Speculation

[TrueCryptonaire]

Today the general meeting of a certain Finnish company that already owns about 1% of XMR outstanding, has decided to refocus the company's mission to be a Monero fund, with the objective of converting its BTC holdings to XMR, and issuing shares to select parties and use the proceeds to acquire more XMR.

Heh, I love it when a plan comes together!

Proposal: RPEX

1. Beg, steal, or borrow TheKoziTwo's idle CN exchange code.

2. Host it on clear and/or dark web.

3. Use MPEX-style high membership fees and GPG rigmarole to ensure security and keep out unprofitable high-maintenance plebs.  Maybe even stay private and invite-only.

4. Sell shares of the exchange on the exchange (RPOE.s)

It is a regular, unregulated all-purpose business registered in Finland dating back to 2010, with no tax payable unless assets are sold, 2% tax on the aftermarket transactions on the company stock, and possible capital gains tax depending on your jurisdiction.

We don't have a restriction on who can buy the stock, except that the deal must be private (may not be constantly advertised to unbounded number of people). To reduce hassle, minimum would be a few €k. If you don't have that, you are probably in the position to buy the coins directly and don't need this.

Appreciate the proposal though  

Does the company lend bitcoins on Polo? For instance, if it is decided that the company will buy 2 btc*s worth of coins on daily basis, then just deposit 14 btc on weekly basis and lend out 10 btc or so and earn interest and thus prolonging the buying pressure and aiming at Titan?

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[iCEBREAKER]

Proposal: RPEX

1. Beg, steal, or borrow TheKoziTwo's idle CN exchange code.

2. Host it on clear and/or dark web.

3. Use MPEX-style high membership fees and GPG rigmarole to ensure security and keep out unprofitable high-maintenance plebs.  Maybe even stay private and invite-only.

4. Sell shares of the exchange on the exchange (RPOE.s)

It is a regular, unregulated all-purpose business registered in Finland dating back to 2010, with no tax payable unless assets are sold, 2% tax on the aftermarket transactions on the company stock, and possible capital gains tax depending on your jurisdiction.

We don't have a restriction on who can buy the stock, except that the deal must be private (may not be constantly advertised to unbounded number of people). To reduce hassle, minimum would be a few €k. If you don't have that, you are probably in the position to buy the coins directly and don't need this.

Appreciate the proposal though  

That's a great way to get the hands-off less-nerdy investor types access to XMR exposure.

Looking the other direction, I proposed RPEX and XMR-e because MPEX and BTC-e played such key roles in the rise of Bitcoin.

Gox got all the hype and media attention, but the more resilient System D structures quietly humming along in the background provide valuable templates for XMR's financial and economic development.

I think my proposals just became predictions...

[kazuki49]

This will change as XMR beings to snowball, and in spectacular ways enable the defections which Bitcoin alone cannot.

great words right here:

Monero’s Allure

Furthermore, potential attackers are at a disadvantage for another reason. Monero tends to oppose organizations rather than people. Even someone who stands to lose from Monero by not reacting to it, such as a banker or government agent, stands to gain a great deal by buying now. Only the very wealthiest people might reasonably expect to be worse off attempting to buy up as much as possible now than if it were gone. (This could happen if their attempt to buy caused the price to rise too fast relative to their ability to acquire additional Moneros, to the point that they ultimately had less influence over the future Monero economy than they have over the economy of today.) Thus, the agency problem with Monero affects Monero competitors as well as Monero holders.

Nearly any government agent who begins to see Monero as a potential threat must also simultaneously see it as an opportunity. He, too, can invest in Monero. And why shouldn’t he? Monero may be a threat to his livelihood, but it may well be making him an offer he can’t refuse. How can an organization that stands to lose by the adoption of Monero provide its members with a better opportunity for staying loyal than Monero provides for defection?

Even those who might resist the temptation to defect would have to think about the defection of his fellows. How quickly is adoption happening? Is there time to mount an attack before Monero becomes too powerful? How easily could the resources for such an attack be amassed, given both the ignorance and treachery of the other agents. If such an attack would be unlikely to succeed, then buying now would be the only intelligent action. Regardless of whether he liked Monero, it would be futile to continue pursuing a doomed cause.

Potential Monero attackers are in a Prisoner’s Dilemma. In the same way that the people cannot easily rebel against the king owing to a lack of coordination on their part, governments cannot rebel against Monero for the same reason. The government puts the people in a Prisoner’s Dilemma against one another, and Monero does the same to government agents.

Monero is like Invasion of the Body Snatchers. Monero attracts inside men to act as covert saboteurs. There have long been predictions from both Moneroers and naysayers of impending government attacks, but I think there is a possibility that Monero could win without suffering much resistance. Moreover, although I said above only that any legal Monero attack could be perverted, the considerations discussed in this section tend to make such diffusion very likely.

Monero defends itself by being obscure, but once it has attracted someone’s attention, its best interest is for that person to understand the logic presented here. For then he will also understand that his best course is to deny Monero’s threat to his superiors and quietly to become its willing slave.

[Johnny Mnemonic]

Right about now, as things start to fall into place... I feel an attack brewing.

[smooth]

Right about now, as things start to fall into place... I feel an attack brewing.

Spam may be the first phase of it. Recall that period of the BCX (non-) attack last year shortly after the real attack was accompanied a deluge of FUD and spam. It's eerily similar.

[Hueristic]

Careful of self fulfilling prophesies.

[pa]

Careful of self fulfilling prophesies.

As Confucius--or was it Socrates?--said: just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you.

[dnaleor]

Probably a lot of people will try to frontrun the big buying.

I added in some near 0.0018 and a week ago, if we have a daily close above 0.0022 I'm converting most of my BTC left to XMR and probably also do some margin longs.

This could be the first big rally with margin trading which could be very volatile and possibly also very much upside capablities in $ terms because BTC is still cheaper now than in 2014.

If BTC continues to rally and go to new ATH's we might sit on a insane rocket about to take off now, near the end of the current (XMR) bear trend.

funny you say that, hodlmybtc
(I did the same the previous time we were below 0.002, before we went to 0.0043. )

[TrueCryptonaire]

Probably a lot of people will try to frontrun the big buying.

I added in some near 0.0018 and a week ago, if we have a daily close above 0.0022 I'm converting most of my BTC left to XMR and probably also do some margin longs.

This could be the first big rally with margin trading which could be very volatile and possibly also very much upside capablities in $ terms because BTC is still cheaper now than in 2014.

If BTC continues to rally and go to new ATH's we might sit on a insane rocket about to take off now, near the end of the current (XMR) bear trend.

funny you say that, hodlmybtc
(I did the same the previous time we were below 0.002, before we went to 0.0043. )

Somehow I have a gut feeling, Monero will start making higher highs now.
Therefore higher prices than mere 0.0043 are possible at the end of this rally. However, I do not quite know to where this all end up but I guess it will go up.

[jehst]

Probably a lot of people will try to frontrun the big buying.

I added in some near 0.0018 and a week ago, if we have a daily close above 0.0022 I'm converting most of my BTC left to XMR and probably also do some margin longs.

This could be the first big rally with margin trading which could be very volatile and possibly also very much upside capablities in $ terms because BTC is still cheaper now than in 2014.

If BTC continues to rally and go to new ATH's we might sit on a insane rocket about to take off now, near the end of the current (XMR) bear trend.

funny you say that, hodlmybtc
(I did the same the previous time we were below 0.002, before we went to 0.0043. )

Somehow I have a gut feeling, Monero will start making higher highs now.
Therefore higher prices than mere 0.0043 are possible at the end of this rally. However, I do not quite know to where this all end up but I guess it will go up.

XMR went to .0043 (and .01 near launch) with just a few dozen serious buyers or fewer. When it's hundreds of serious buyers or thousands of serious buyers coming in during the next crypto bull market, the rise will defy expectations. XMR had a pretty brutal winter and therefore many of us see .01 as the moon. Even on the run up to .0043, I sold most of my holdings around .0028. I thought .003 was the moon, so I couldn't believe that it could or should keep going up. And of course I missed out on some serious gains.

I think people who hold XMR now will have the overwhelming urge to sell (or buy stuff with their XMR) at .008 to .01. And then XMR will laugh and keep going up. The spoils will go to those with the discipline to have a plan and stick to it.

[TrueCryptonaire]

Probably a lot of people will try to frontrun the big buying.

I added in some near 0.0018 and a week ago, if we have a daily close above 0.0022 I'm converting most of my BTC left to XMR and probably also do some margin longs.

This could be the first big rally with margin trading which could be very volatile and possibly also very much upside capablities in $ terms because BTC is still cheaper now than in 2014.

If BTC continues to rally and go to new ATH's we might sit on a insane rocket about to take off now, near the end of the current (XMR) bear trend.

funny you say that, hodlmybtc
(I did the same the previous time we were below 0.002, before we went to 0.0043. )

Somehow I have a gut feeling, Monero will start making higher highs now.
Therefore higher prices than mere 0.0043 are possible at the end of this rally. However, I do not quite know to where this all end up but I guess it will go up.

XMR went to .0043 (and .01 near launch) with just a few dozen serious buyers or fewer. When it's hundreds of serious buyers or thousands of serious buyers coming in during the next crypto bull market, the rise will defy expectations. XMR had a pretty brutal winter and therefore many of us see .01 as the moon. Even on the run up to .0043, I sold most of my holdings around .0028. I thought .003 was the moon, so I couldn't believe that it could or should keep going up. And of course I missed out on some serious gains.

I think people who hold XMR now will have the overwhelming urge to sell (or buy stuff with their XMR) at .008 to .01. And then XMR will laugh and keep going up. The spoils will go to those with the discipline to have a plan and stick to it.

In the past a good way to predict when we are on the peak is to see how much the coin gained value within past 24 hours.
Usually Monero goes parabolic before a major dump. It is time to sell coins when the price goes viral. Not necessarily all the coins at once but definetely to lighten the bag at least.

[jehst]

Probably a lot of people will try to frontrun the big buying.

I added in some near 0.0018 and a week ago, if we have a daily close above 0.0022 I'm converting most of my BTC left to XMR and probably also do some margin longs.

This could be the first big rally with margin trading which could be very volatile and possibly also very much upside capablities in $ terms because BTC is still cheaper now than in 2014.

If BTC continues to rally and go to new ATH's we might sit on a insane rocket about to take off now, near the end of the current (XMR) bear trend.

funny you say that, hodlmybtc
(I did the same the previous time we were below 0.002, before we went to 0.0043. )

Somehow I have a gut feeling, Monero will start making higher highs now.
Therefore higher prices than mere 0.0043 are possible at the end of this rally. However, I do not quite know to where this all end up but I guess it will go up.

XMR went to .0043 (and .01 near launch) with just a few dozen serious buyers or fewer. When it's hundreds of serious buyers or thousands of serious buyers coming in during the next crypto bull market, the rise will defy expectations. XMR had a pretty brutal winter and therefore many of us see .01 as the moon. Even on the run up to .0043, I sold most of my holdings around .0028. I thought .003 was the moon, so I couldn't believe that it could or should keep going up. And of course I missed out on some serious gains.

I think people who hold XMR now will have the overwhelming urge to sell (or buy stuff with their XMR) at .008 to .01. And then XMR will laugh and keep going up. The spoils will go to those with the discipline to have a plan and stick to it.

In the past a good way to predict when we are on the peak is to see how much the coin gained value within past 24 hours.
Usually Monero goes parabolic before a major dump. It is time to sell coins when the price goes viral. Not necessarily all the coins at once but definetely to lighten the bag at least.

Recently I tested myself with litecoin. When it started rising, I decided that .018 would be a good time to short. But I didn't short. I just watched. It went up to .03.
So even with all my experience in crypto, I STILL consistently underestimate how high these rallies can go. So I'm never going to get involved in shorting anything. I'll write out my plan and just stick to it. If I miss some gains, that's OK. The plan is the plan and I should design the plan so that I'm happy with the plan's results even if the rally continues.

The 24 hour gain is a good prediction but there's a lot of variability. A coin might gain 20% in a single day before it starts crashing or it might be closer to 80% in a single day. There's no good number to use.

[nakaone]

trolls are in full force again - look at altcoin discussion see tens of threads... any reasons for this?

[8XMR]

trolls are in full force again - look at altcoin discussion see tens of threads... any reasons for this?

Competition become desperate when they fall behind. Good news for competition member. Cryptography not like sports. If losing, can switch to winning team. XMR welcome everyone.

[kazuki49]

trolls are in full force again - look at altcoin discussion see tens of threads... any reasons for this?

Competition become desperate when they fall behind. Good news for competition member. Cryptography not like sports. If losing, can switch to winning team. XMR welcome everyone.

+1

Everyone can buy and sell, Monero is not affected by trolls, but if you seek quality reading among the best community in crypto, you better start filtering (ignoring) the known brands.

[jehst]

trolls are in full force again - look at altcoin discussion see tens of threads... any reasons for this?

You still read altcoin discussion?

[Johnny Mnemonic]

trolls are in full force again - look at altcoin discussion see tens of threads... any reasons for this?

You still read altcoin discussion?

I need to stay away from the altcoin forum myself. I sometimes check what's in there purely for entertainment purposes only to find myself arguing with trolls.

[nioc]

I haven't been buying any Monero lately.  I have been "diversifying" into btc by buying.  After accumulating some btc I started to get itchy.  I withdrew what crypto I had on Polo before their KYC changes went into effect even as minimal as they were.  I recently bought some Monero using ShapeShift.  Very easy.  As has been stated you can't buy large quantities but that's not my style.  I build my Monero brick by brick.

[hodlmybtc]

I haven't been buying any Monero lately.  I have been "diversifying" into btc by buying.  After accumulating some btc I started to get itchy.  I withdrew what crypto I had on Polo before their KYC changes went into effect even as minimal as they were.  I recently bought some Monero using ShapeShift.  Very easy.  As has been stated you can't buy large quantities but that's not my style.  I build my Monero brick by brick.

Yeah I feel like Poloniex is holding Monero back a little bit by this, there are other exchanges too but Poloniex always has been the biggest for Monero.

When there will be more (higher volume) exchanges where you can trade XMR and especially big, trusted exchanges for XMR/USD, then Monero can grow to it's full potential.

[XMRChina]

trolls are in full force again - look at altcoin discussion see tens of threads... any reasons for this?

You still read altcoin discussion?

I need to stay away from the altcoin forum myself. I sometimes check what's in there purely for entertainment purposes only to find myself arguing with trolls.

Time to move more conversation to getmonero forums. Too much clutter here to obscure what is important