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Author Topic: Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com  (Read 3007576 times)
The Avenger
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October 16, 2013, 09:43:08 AM
 #16441

How come crumb's ignore button is sooooo dark yellow while avenger's is just fine!
Because I've been trying to get KNC to treat their customers fairly and professionally. And destroying some bs some people have tried to pass off as fact

crumbs - he's somewhere between mars and uranus  Grin

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October 16, 2013, 09:46:03 AM
 #16442

Can people please stop comparing BFL to every other company. Being better than the worst is not a measure worth using.

It's like someone running you over in a car and then telling you that you're lucky, you could have been shot.


BFL was perceived as the market leader even in light of Avalon coming online.  Its called a "control group"  


I could have done the same thing by quoting Avalon for their 3 month delay on batch 3 units and/or the whole batch chip distribution debacle.  But why would I do that...I'd rather focus on the big company that put in a ton of money into advertising and banners EVERYWHERE...and fucked everyone royally (I had my mercury money towards a bfl single for a couple months before hand, mind you)

Would you suggest a better "control group"?

bitfury is a chip mfg with their own subsidiary turnkey distribution channels bfstrikesback/megabigpower

Asicminer?   Please. Those guys charged 10X the market value of their devices hand and fist - the only folks I saw buying up those units were the ones who were wary of BFL, missed out on Avalon Batch one, and had prior infrastructure in the form of GPU farms that they wanted to upgrade for power efficiency reasons.  

so please friend....name a better control group for us to all compare KNC would you?

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October 16, 2013, 09:47:15 AM
 #16443

so let's say they are 4 days behind that means 350 * 4 = 1400 boxes. On avg each box should meant at 300GH/s (if they are going to ship also mercury(s)). That means that in next few days we will have an increase of at 420 TH/s only from KnC.

It also means KnC alone could produce and ship 4PH per month if they can source enough components.  If KnC can do 4PH today, imagine what Ciara (Hashfast) could do.
Those saying exponential growth has to taper off will be proven correct eventually, but probably a lot later than they thought.

well mine is supposedly shipped but mentally i'm already thinking of what i'm gonna do when the knc and of course if I ever get stuff from april from bfl when they are no longer useful to mine btc?....

(ASICcoin here I come?)

oh well ...mentally it is much more relaxing since I flipped a mental swich to "hobby mode"....more tranquil........(if I was really evil i'd put a knc module in a bfl 60gh box and mess with folks)

whatever the die is cast it is what it is

my real concern can BTC survive if everyone freaks out and flames out as a small guy miner in the near future or will people just say screw all alt coins as a concept

my 2c worth

Searing

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The Avenger
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October 16, 2013, 09:48:54 AM
 #16444

Still, why UPS? They delivered a 7000$ unit to the BABYSITTER of my neighbour, while I was at home waiting for the doorbell to ring....
Great you got satisfaction Mota! Couriers never ceases to amaze me with what they do with people's goods.

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October 16, 2013, 09:50:25 AM
 #16445

Can people please stop comparing BFL to every other company. Being better than the worst is not a measure worth using.

It's like someone running you over in a car and then telling you that you're lucky, you could have been shot.


BFL was perceived as the market leader even in light of Avalon coming online.  Its called a "control group"  


I could have done the same thing by quoting Avalon for their 3 month delay on batch 3 units and/or the whole batch chip distribution debacle.  But why would I do that...I'd rather focus on the big company that put in a ton of money into advertising and banners EVERYWHERE...and fucked everyone royally (I had my mercury money towards a bfl single for a couple months before hand, mind you)

Would you suggest a better "control group"?

bitfury is a chip mfg with their own subsidiary turnkey distribution channels bfstrikesback/megabigpower

Asicminer?   Please. Those guys charged 10X the market value of their devices hand and fist - the only folks I saw buying up those units were the ones who were wary of BFL, missed out on Avalon Batch one, and had prior infrastructure in the form of GPU farms that they wanted to upgrade for power efficiency reasons.  

so please friend....name a better control group for us to all compare KNC would you?
Actually you can't compare them since KNC explicitly stated they want only B2B customers. Despite the fact that their miners are for the general public, stating an interview with them.... A better control group would be Avalon, BFL was never considered market leader -  even their fpga's were delivered laaaaaaaate.

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October 16, 2013, 09:51:36 AM
 #16446

SAAAAM!! SAAAAM!! Ok, so you're trying to fool us with your "In progress" bullshit for the rest of the month orders in advance to avoid refunds.
Well, I've been a human being "in progress" for the last 30 years, does that mean I'm about to ship?Huh

hey at least you aint still "paid".

All kidding aside. with the dificulty about to change i do have to say that the miner now is almost way out of anyones complete roi period. It is a big downfall.

I will give till the end of the month befor i take legal action. Don't question me. Angry

Keep in mind this. There was a promis to SHIP all miners out by the 15. That as not happened. That is more then enough grounds. I sure hope KNC has one hell of a magic rabit.

Yeah, 'cause all those saying that BTC is rising forget the fact that difficulty rises are exponential and more than offset the standard/linear increases in BTC value. So they should put that argument to rest.

Short term thinking.

The exponential rise cannot continue indefinitely. The gradual (though rather nice today) rise in bitcoin is LIKELY to continue.

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October 16, 2013, 09:53:14 AM
 #16447

so let's say they are 4 days behind that means 350 * 4 = 1400 boxes. On avg each box should meant at 300GH/s (if they are going to ship also mercury(s)). That means that in next few days we will have an increase of at 420 TH/s only from KnC.

It also means KnC alone could produce and ship 4PH per month if they can source enough components.  If KnC can do 4PH today, imagine what Ciara (Hashfast) could do.
Those saying exponential growth has to taper off will be proven correct eventually, but probably a lot later than they thought.

it's a good thing measuring theoretical max production, but you have to find someone that will buy your product then (at the price you've chose). I think that every ASIC vendor will need to lower their product price inevitably. I just don't know what will be the price equilibrium, my gut tells me something along 0.5 to 1.5 GH/s should be correct, but I'm just guessing.

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The Avenger
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October 16, 2013, 09:57:55 AM
 #16448

Still, why UPS? They delivered a 7000$ unit to the BABYSITTER of my neighbour, while I was at home waiting for the doorbell to ring....
Great you got satisfaction Mota! Couriers never ceases to amaze me with what they do with people's goods.
No, satisfaction would be having my second order here right now, not my first one. Satisfaction would be a compensation for late delivery from KNC in form of anything other than insults to my intellect and knowledge of law. And even if I would not be legally eligible for compensation it would still be the morally right thing to do...
Ah, I didn't realise you have more than one order. Yeah, compensation for late delivery would be appropriate. And if they'd stop treating us like dummies, that would help too. We'll keep working on it.

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October 16, 2013, 09:59:28 AM
 #16449

How come crumb's ignore button is sooooo dark yellow while avenger's is just fine!

Well, it should have got a little "yellower" yesterday...  Roll Eyes

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October 16, 2013, 10:00:40 AM
 #16450

How come crumb's ignore button is sooooo dark yellow while avenger's is just fine!

Well, it should have got a little "yellower" yesterday...  Roll Eyes
I tried to hit the avengers ignore button yesterday, but it wasn't there. The guy is such a dick.

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October 16, 2013, 10:01:08 AM
 #16451

Yay, miner came today after being stuck in swedish customs for a day  Huh
Still, why UPS? They delivered a 7000$ unit to the BABYSITTER of my neighbour, while I was at home waiting for the doorbell to ring....

UPS blows goats. I have about 30 years of proof!

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October 16, 2013, 10:01:42 AM
 #16452

it's a good thing measuring theoretical max production, but you have to find someone that will buy your product then (at the price you've chose). I think that every ASIC vendor will need to lower their product price inevitably. I just don't know what will be the price equilibrium, my gut tells me something along 0.5 to 1.5 GH/s should be correct, but I'm just guessing.

You mean $0.5 to $1.5 per GH?
I think its even lower. The more cost effective asic designs would be below $0.1 per GH for the bare chip:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=295270.0
PCB, cooling, case etc may double or triple that, but not more than that in large volumes.
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October 16, 2013, 10:03:53 AM
 #16453

How come crumb's ignore button is sooooo dark yellow while avenger's is just fine!

Well, it should have got a little "yellower" yesterday...  Roll Eyes
I tried to hit the avengers ignore button yesterday, but it wasn't there. The guy is such a dick.

Might I suggest a little more tact? You do go after people like a terrier with "big dog" syndrome.

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October 16, 2013, 10:04:27 AM
 #16454

Short term thinking.

The exponential rise cannot continue indefinitely. The gradual (though rather nice today) rise in bitcoin is LIKELY to continue.

As far as I can tell, there is always a short-lived rally on the BTC exchange rate just before the difficulty goes up. We shall see in a few hours :-)

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October 16, 2013, 10:08:02 AM
 #16455

Short term thinking.

The exponential rise cannot continue indefinitely. The gradual (though rather nice today) rise in bitcoin is LIKELY to continue.

As far as I can tell, there is always a short-lived rally on the BTC exchange rate just before the difficulty goes up. We shall see in a few hours :-)

I've noticed the same thing, but the drop seems to still end up a little above where it was. I've also seen an odd correlation with gold over the last few months. Not totally consistent, but pretty close. When gold drops bitcoin goes up. Doesn't seem to correlate with other (dollar/Euro etc) exchange rates either, just gold.

Haven't graphed it, it's just eyeball analysis, but it's interesting.

Plus I'm rather encouraged that BTC recovered to it's previous level in just under five days after the precipitous drop on the news of the Silk Road bust. I knew it was a panic sell, of course, but I thought it would take longer to recover. I just wish I'd had some dollars to throw at it that day.

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October 16, 2013, 10:11:11 AM
 #16456

Short term thinking.

The exponential rise cannot continue indefinitely. The gradual (though rather nice today) rise in bitcoin is LIKELY to continue.

As far as I can tell, there is always a short-lived rally on the BTC exchange rate just before the difficulty goes up. We shall see in a few hours :-)


imho it is more due to the idiots in Washington and the fact they can't find a solution to debt issues and BTC improves as US dollar looks less then rosy

assuming they fix stuff...i'd expect BTC to go down significantly when people figure out the large difficulty increases in near future and rush to
get ROI back on their shiny soon to be outdated equip

(and yes i'm still in denial since I decided to call this an 'eccentric" hobby......(denial is a heady drug in these circumstances)

(funny humans ......so silly)

Searing


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October 16, 2013, 10:12:15 AM
 #16457


Wonderful - glad they speed up. But no word about their hosting customers. My unit was produced yesterday morning. I got no login, no hashing, no payout on my BC Wallet, no reply on my status request I sent to their support yesterday morning. Shipped people receive their units today - I am in the dark with my 12k$ hosted unit - amazing

For the hosting guys - just to give you an update -  I have bad news. I got order number 23xx and I talked to one very tired sounding KnC guy on the phone just 10 minutes back.

Summary:

- We are aware you are a hosted customer who paid more and we treat you order with priority

(aha, why are people behind me in pay date already received their units?)

- Your order will go online in the next few days

(ohh ok, so I paid early, I paid more and now I go online many days after shipping people. I dont know if, I dont know when, thank you!?)

- I am (as support) dont know the situation in the hosting center

(WTF - are you serious?!)

I respect what they have done so far for BC and everything. But breaking order chain and screwing their own "premium" hosting customers SO BAD - Impossible. All hosting customers - grab phone - call there - do pressure! They have to understand that we are all dissapointed, Ohterwhise the massage will not reach them.


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October 16, 2013, 10:15:54 AM
 #16458


Wonderful - glad they speed up. But no word about their hosting customers. My unit was produced yesterday morning. I got no login, no hashing, no payout on my BC Wallet, no reply on my status request I sent to their support yesterday morning. Shipped people receive their units today - I am in the dark with my 12k$ hosted unit - amazing

For the hosting guys - just to give you an update -  I have bad news. I got order number 23xx and I talked to one very tired sounding KnC guy on the phone just 10 minutes back.

Summary:

- We are aware you are a hosted customer who paid more and we treat you order with priority

(aha, why are people behind me in pay date already received their units?)

- Your order will go online in the next few days

(ohh ok, so I paid early, I paid more and now I go online many days after shipping people. I dont know if, I dont know when, thank you!?)

- I am (as support) dont know the situation in the hosting center

(WTF - are you serious?!)

I respect what they have done so far for BC and everything. But breaking order chain and screwing their own "premium" hosting customers SO BAD - Impossible. All hosting customers - grab phone - call there - do pressure! They have to understand that we are all dissapointed, Ohterwhise the massage will not reach them.




One man less on the phone is one more man assembling or setting up a miner in the warehouse...just saying.
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October 16, 2013, 10:19:31 AM
 #16459

Short term thinking.

The exponential rise cannot continue indefinitely. The gradual (though rather nice today) rise in bitcoin is LIKELY to continue.

As far as I can tell, there is always a short-lived rally on the BTC exchange rate just before the difficulty goes up. We shall see in a few hours :-)


imho it is more due to the idiots in Washington and the fact they can't find a solution to debt issues and BTC improves as US dollar looks less then rosy

assuming they fix stuff...i'd expect BTC to go down significantly when people figure out the large difficulty increases in near future and rush to
get ROI back on their shiny soon to be outdated equip

(and yes i'm still in denial since I decided to call this an 'eccentric" hobby......(denial is a heady drug in these circumstances)

(funny humans ......so silly)

Searing



[soapbox]

This is why it is essential that miners start promoting bitcoin for general exchange in any way you possibly can. TX fees are the future of mining profitability, and for that future to come to fruition, BTC has to be as useable as the dollar. It has massive advantages OVER the dollar if it can gain mainstream acceptance.
I saw a post recently where one block had over 200 BTC in TX fees. That should be EVERY block, and it would be if BTC were a mainstream currency. Then you wouldn't be worrying about short term ROI, as every block would be significantly more powerful than simply it's block reward.
Volume of purchase is the game that needs to be opened up. Right now, even though it has garnered a significant amount of notice, BTC remains a niche money rather than a generally useful currency. If you want your miners to make you money, then you gotta expand your horizons. We need to see all sorts of thing priced in BTC, with the various national fiats as the ALTERNATIVE price, rather than the other way 'round.
[/soapbox]

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October 16, 2013, 10:19:43 AM
 #16460

it's a good thing measuring theoretical max production, but you have to find someone that will buy your product then (at the price you've chose). I think that every ASIC vendor will need to lower their product price inevitably. I just don't know what will be the price equilibrium, my gut tells me something along 0.5 to 1.5 GH/s should be correct, but I'm just guessing.

You mean $0.5 to $1.5 per GH?

yes, but for a full working plug'n'play miner Tongue

I think its even lower. The more cost effective asic designs would be below $0.1 per GH for the bare chip:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=295270.0
PCB, cooling, case etc may double or triple that, but not more than that in large volumes.

Another thing that will determine the price is the power consumption, but I think they'll be able to lower it significantly as well.

Bitcoin is a participatory system which ought to respect the right of self determinism of all of its users - Gregory Maxwell.
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