Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com

[Phoenix1969]

Day of Reckining 2: Neptune edition

I'm pretty sure we are past the day of reckoning.

How do neptombers feel about being defrauded well into Q3?

Do we think August is a new realistic date for Neptunes shipping, given we have to wait for new wafers and chips?

No KNC customers even a little mad at being lied to and misled?

Not sure what you mean... I received both CAbatch neppie orders over a week ago, and some people in Batch one even got Neptunes, when there was supposed to be a 2 week break between the CA and batch one.
Compensation for late time-frames has been announced as a second Neptune at the end of batch 3 unless you "took the shaft" on the cloud hosting deal, or got an early "FrankenJupiter"; so they actually have another week before they were supposed to start shipping batch one customers if you account for the promised two week delay between batches.

[1713307378]

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[1713307378]

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[1713307378]

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[The Avenger]

Neptunes selling for less than $7k on ebay. Those who spent $10k or $13k and are still waiting for delivery - we salute you! And KNC would like to thank you for your charitable donations to build their datorhalls.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/KNC-KncMiner-Neptune-3Ths-3-Ths-20nm-Bitcoin-BTC-Miner-First-Batch-3TH-IN-HAND-/331248909042
$6,600.00


http://www.ebay.com/itm/KNC-KncMiner-Neptune-3Ths-3-Ths-20nm-Bitcoin-BTC-Miner-First-Batch-3TH-IN-HAND-/231268676280?pt=US_Virtual_Currency&hash=item35d8aff2b8
$6,900.00

[rograz]

so they actually have another week before they were supposed to start shipping batch one customers if you account for the promised two week delay between batches.

But then there was that promised Q2 delivery of batch 1 to consider

[The Avenger]

so they actually have another week before they were supposed to start shipping batch one customers if you account for the promised two week delay between batches.

But then there was that promised Q2 delivery of batch 1 to consider

They should have shipped EVERYTHING ordered before February 2014 in Q2. Anything less is fraud/deception/misrepresentation/lies/false advertising etc...

Just to remind some people, I reported KNC were running this banner on google in February:

KnCMiner 3+ TH/s Bitcoin - kncminer.com‎
Ad www.kncminer.com/bitcoin/miner‎
Neptune Miner Pre-order for $9,995Shipment begins in Q2 of 2014

So every order they took b4 February *has* to ship before Q2 ends, right?

You can't start shipping batch 3 until you've finished shipping batch 0/1/2 right? So if you are going to start shipping Batch 3 in Q2, then shipping on all previous batches have to be completed already in Q2? Otherwise that would be like total fraud and misselling.

[Phoenix1969]

so they actually have another week before they were supposed to start shipping batch one customers if you account for the promised two week delay between batches.

But then there was that promised Q2 delivery of batch 1 to consider

They should have shipped EVERYTHING ordered before February 2014 in Q2. Anything less is fraud/deception/misrepresentation/lies/false advertising etc...

Just to remind some people, I reported KNC were running this banner on google in February:

KnCMiner 3+ TH/s Bitcoin - kncminer.com‎
Ad www.kncminer.com/bitcoin/miner‎
Neptune Miner Pre-order for $9,995Shipment begins in Q2 of 2014

So every order they took b4 February *has* to ship before Q2 ends, right?

You can't start shipping batch 3 until you've finished shipping batch 0/1/2 right? So if you are going to start shipping Batch 3 in Q2, then shipping on all previous batches have to be completed already in Q2? Otherwise that would be like total fraud and misselling.

Haaha, omg...
"Q" stands for "Quarter", and a year has 12 months.
Q1= Jan, Feb, March
Q2 = April, May, June
Q3 = July, Aug, Sept
Q4 = Oct, Nov, Dec
When they shipped a single machine on June 30th, Shipment indeed began in Q2, just as promised. They did not promise that "all" of any batch would be shipped before then. Key word being "begins" in the phrase "Shipment begins in Q2 of 2014".
Same, exact situation as when the first Jupiter shipped on the last possible day to fulfill the statement.
I don't know where you got the idea everything promised to begin shipping in Q2 was supposed to ship before February, but.... You are wrong.

Since a few of B1 machines were also shipped June 30th, that promise of "beginning" shipment in Q2 was also fufilled

[AFox]

They should have shipped EVERYTHING ordered before February 2014 in Q2. Anything less is fraud/deception/misrepresentation/lies/false advertising etc...

Just to remind some people, I reported KNC were running this banner on google in February:

KnCMiner 3+ TH/s Bitcoin - kncminer.com‎
Ad www.kncminer.com/bitcoin/miner‎
Neptune Miner Pre-order for $9,995 Shipment begins in Q2 of 2014

So every order they took b4 February *has* to ship before Q2 ends, right?

You can't start shipping batch 3 until you've finished shipping batch 0/1/2 right? So if you are going to start shipping Batch 3 in Q2, then shipping on all previous batches have to be completed already in Q2? Otherwise that would be like total fraud and misselling.

KNC stated for Batch 1 (link & source) :

• will be shipping in Q1/Q2 of 2014
• Shipment begins in Q1/Q2 of 2014

And for Batch 2, March 29th 2014 (link & source) :

• Neptune is our first 20nm product and will be shipping in Q2 of 2014
• Shipment begins in Q2 of 2014

Finally for Batch 3 (link & source) :

• This order is for the Third batch which will leave about one month after the Second batch
• Shipment begins one month after Batch 2

They never stated that they are going to ship batch 3 in Q2. What are you talking about ?!
The only thing they stated for Batch 3 is above; "Shipment begins one month after Batch 2".

Also there is a big difference between "Shipment begins in Q2", as KNC stated, and "Shipment finishes in Q2", as you are interpreting and inventing.

And I think them stating yesterday they ran out of wafer/chips is acknowledging a major delay in the Neptune delivery timeline.

So KNC is either guilty of fraud or misrepresentation - you or your lawyer decide.

How do neptombers feel about being defrauded well into Q3?

Do we think August is a new realistic date for Neptunes shipping, given we have to wait for new wafers and chips?

No KNC customers even a little mad at being lied to and misled?

Batch 0, 1 and 2 won't have any problems with chips and wafers. Kurt, from KNC stated it himself : link

Neptunes selling for less than $7k on ebay. Those who spent $10k or $13k and are still waiting for delivery - we salute you! And KNC would like to thank you for your charitable donations to build their datorhalls.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/KNC-KncMiner-Neptune-3Ths-3-Ths-20nm-Bitcoin-BTC-Miner-First-Batch-3TH-IN-HAND-/331248909042
$6,600.00

http://www.ebay.com/itm/KNC-KncMiner-Neptune-3Ths-3-Ths-20nm-Bitcoin-BTC-Miner-First-Batch-3TH-IN-HAND-/231268676280?pt=US_Virtual_Currency&hash=item35d8aff2b8
$6,900.00

Actually it currently takes 10 days with 3.3 TH/s to mine a bitcoin.

Damn that's bad.

Looks like Neptombers, all costs considered, paid about $2000 per bitcoin.

So they just lied to people, nothing more or less. Like the lie of claiming they would deliever all units by Oct 15th, even though they knew from the beginning of October they could never achieve that. And a million others if I could be bothered to dig them out.

And I noted 3 other lies knc told to decieve customers above, please address those too if you wish to defend KNC's policy of deceipt.

KNC's entire business is built on a pathological level of lies/fraud/deception/misrepresentation.

And these last 4 quotes sums up very well what you are : a big Troll.

The Avenger, please stay off this topic and go Troll elsewhere.

[crashoveride54902]

oh ya everyone is fine here with knc...move along, nothing to see here...hehe

although this knc drama has been interesting to say the least

[Phoenix1969]

oh ya everyone is fine here with knc...move along, nothing to see here...hehe

although this knc drama has been interesting to say the least

I wouldn't go THAT far (everything fine), but it's clearly not near as bad as some "Exquisite Trolls" make it out to be.  

*This is NOT an endorsement to buy ANY miner.

[RoadStress]

Not sure what you mean... I received both CAbatch neppie orders over a week ago, and some people in Batch one even got Neptunes, when there was supposed to be a 2 week break between the CA and batch one.
Compensation for late time-frames has been announced as a second Neptune at the end of batch 3 unless you "took the shaft" on the cloud hosting deal, or got an early "FrankenJupiter"; so they actually have another week before they were supposed to start shipping batch one customers if you account for the promised two week delay between batches.

This is one more reason to feel good about my refund. I thought CA batch paid 3k$ more for having 2-4 weeks head start which allowed them to mine a bit more than the others. More FU in the face for its loyal customers from KnC.

[Phoenix1969]

Not sure what you mean... I received both CAbatch neppie orders over a week ago, and some people in Batch one even got Neptunes, when there was supposed to be a 2 week break between the CA and batch one.
Compensation for late time-frames has been announced as a second Neptune at the end of batch 3 unless you "took the shaft" on the cloud hosting deal, or got an early "FrankenJupiter"; so they actually have another week before they were supposed to start shipping batch one customers if you account for the promised two week delay between batches.

This is one more reason to feel good about my refund. I thought CA batch paid 3k$ more for having 2-4 weeks head start which allowed them to mine a bit more than the others. More FU in the face for its loyal customers from KnC.

How many "Batch one" orders were shipped?
I thought only a couple/few to fulfill the statement they had made about B1 beginning delivery in Q2... ?
I realize that it does indeed infringe a bit on the 2 week gap promised between CA and B1 batches.
The result is a "Compromise" somewhere "in the middle" imho
I know Kurt said others were beginning to be shipped, and some folks had said their orders had changed to "shipped", but we also have yet to hear from anyone who has received anything in about a week...         anyone.....?
I am indeed a bit cloudy on that one, but their announcements tend to be extremely "cryptic" in nature, and purposefully "admittedly deceptive" according to the words uttered in a recent interview. "To keep competitors guessing" was the reason given.
That's my "take" on the situation anyway....
Kudos on being smart enough to refund before the "Shit hit the fan" on the Diff, and all this craziness.
I refunded a few, but had sold others, and my brother has a couple from B1 coming someday, which is why I'll have to fly to Maui to set them up, someday, maybe.... can't even buy a ticket to go yet because were so clueless as to when they will arrive. IF they arrive, because he DID request refunds on both orders, but it seems they may be denying refunds now on B1 because they "Began shipment" of B1, which I totally disagree with, because they said "refundable until your miner ships", so time will tell here soon, but I fully expect them to give us "the shaft", and ship them anyways.

Given the current trend in difficulty, it would be really cool if they shipped a 3rd neppy to ensure ROI, or at least a cube to add to the 6th port of every neppy shipped, including the "Extra" one.

[RoadStress]

Given the current trend in difficulty, it would be really cool if they shipped a 3rd neppy to ensure ROI, or at least a cube to add to the 6th port of every neppy shipped, including the "Extra" one.

Knowing that they are cheap bastards I doubt that they will at another cube to the 6th port. I wonder if the free Neptunes will be pre-mined or not. Time will tell.

[kingscrown]

they had offer to wait + mine and give extra kncs.
now u either get extra or mine.

sux totally.
knc ened up as lame company.

[Zelek Uther]

Not sure what you mean... I received both CAbatch neppie orders over a week ago, and some people in Batch one even got Neptunes, when there was supposed to be a 2 week break between the CA and batch one.
Compensation for late time-frames has been announced as a second Neptune at the end of batch 3 unless you "took the shaft" on the cloud hosting deal, or got an early "FrankenJupiter"; so they actually have another week before they were supposed to start shipping batch one customers if you account for the promised two week delay between batches.

This is one more reason to feel good about my refund. I thought CA batch paid 3k$ more for having 2-4 weeks head start which allowed them to mine a bit more than the others. More FU in the face for its loyal customers from KnC.

CA batch customers paid $3k less than batch 1.

CA batch is referred to as "batch #1" in the quote below (Tigggger invented his own numbering for the batches):

KNC are referring to the current batch as batch #2, but that's very confusing as there have been 3 so I am using the following
Batch #1 = 1,200 units available to previous customers @ $10,000
Batch #2 = 1,200 units available for anyone @ $13,000
Batch #3 = 1,200 units available for anyone @ $10,000

[RoadStress]

Not sure what you mean... I received both CAbatch neppie orders over a week ago, and some people in Batch one even got Neptunes, when there was supposed to be a 2 week break between the CA and batch one.
Compensation for late time-frames has been announced as a second Neptune at the end of batch 3 unless you "took the shaft" on the cloud hosting deal, or got an early "FrankenJupiter"; so they actually have another week before they were supposed to start shipping batch one customers if you account for the promised two week delay between batches.

This is one more reason to feel good about my refund. I thought CA batch paid 3k$ more for having 2-4 weeks head start which allowed them to mine a bit more than the others. More FU in the face for its loyal customers from KnC.

CA batch customers paid $3k less than batch 1.

CA batch is referred to as "batch #1" in the quote below (Tigggger invented his own numbering for the batches):

KNC are referring to the current batch as batch #2, but that's very confusing as there have been 3 so I am using the following
Batch #1 = 1,200 units available to previous customers @ $10,000
Batch #2 = 1,200 units available for anyone @ $13,000
Batch #3 = 1,200 units available for anyone @ $10,000

That's correct. I messed up the batches.

[user27]

Quick update:
No change on my order a full week after KfC admitted it was late at the end of Q2 (not to mention the Q1/Q2 deadline they missed by a clear quarter).

For those who would argue that Q1/Q2 delivery means end of Q2; why would they include the "Q1/" if that was the intention?

No free HWYW has been offered; only the $5,995 to hash for a couple of weeks and accept revised T&C (regardless of that fact that every Neptune order would have been refunded already without the 2for1 offer).

My refund (which was requested right after they released the spec, before shipping started) is still being refused.

No form of compensation has been announced on account of the third batch ($10,000 public batch) being sent out right after the CA and $13,000 batches/

u27

EDIT:
I was told on Friday that they would be in assembly over the weekend and the rest of batch 1 would ship Monday (today); just spoke to Anna and "it will most likely ship this week".

[murraypaul]

For those who would argue that Q1/Q2 delivery means end of Q2;

It does.

why would they include the "Q1/" if that was the intention?

To encourage the gullible to believe that they would ship earlier than the last possible date.

[user27]

For those who would argue that Q1/Q2 delivery means end of Q2;

It does.

why would they include the "Q1/" if that was the intention?

To encourage the gullible to believe that they would ship earlier than the last possible date.

Go back under your little bridge troll:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=142472;sa=showPosts

Although you do make a good point; they did intentionally mislead.

u27

[The Avenger]

They should have shipped EVERYTHING ordered before February 2014 in Q2. Anything less is fraud/deception/misrepresentation/lies/false advertising etc...

Just to remind some people, I reported KNC were running this banner on google in February:

KnCMiner 3+ TH/s Bitcoin - kncminer.com‎
Ad www.kncminer.com/bitcoin/miner‎
Neptune Miner Pre-order for $9,995 Shipment begins in Q2 of 2014

So every order they took b4 February *has* to ship before Q2 ends, right?

You can't start shipping batch 3 until you've finished shipping batch 0/1/2 right? So if you are going to start shipping Batch 3 in Q2, then shipping on all previous batches have to be completed already in Q2? Otherwise that would be like total fraud and misselling.

KNC stated for Batch 1 (link & source) :

• will be shipping in Q1/Q2 of 2014
• Shipment begins in Q1/Q2 of 2014

And for Batch 2, March 29th 2014 (link & source) :

• Neptune is our first 20nm product and will be shipping in Q2 of 2014
• Shipment begins in Q2 of 2014

Finally for Batch 3 (link & source) :

• This order is for the Third batch which will leave about one month after the Second batch
• Shipment begins one month after Batch 2

They never stated that they are going to ship batch 3 in Q2. What are you talking about ?!
The only thing they stated for Batch 3 is above; "Shipment begins one month after Batch 2".

You don't read so well do you? See the google ad above, paid for by KfC in February, which states Batch 3 starts shipping in Q2. You can read and understand what "Shipment begins in Q2 of 2014" means?

But if we stick to your logic, Batch 3 should have started shipped last week of June (Q2). All the other batches - before the last week of May (one month before).

Did that happen? No. Was that ever going to happen? No. KNC knew very well when the chips would arrive and there was no possibility of shipping in May. So it was false advertising/fraud to place that banner on google. They rely on people like you to support their lies, briniging up their carefully worded newsletters that are misleading and ambiguous.

Neptunes selling for less than $7k on ebay. Those who spent $10k or $13k and are still waiting for delivery - we salute you! And KNC would like to thank you for your charitable donations to build their datorhalls.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/KNC-KncMiner-Neptune-3Ths-3-Ths-20nm-Bitcoin-BTC-Miner-First-Batch-3TH-IN-HAND-/331248909042
$6,600.00

http://www.ebay.com/itm/KNC-KncMiner-Neptune-3Ths-3-Ths-20nm-Bitcoin-BTC-Miner-First-Batch-3TH-IN-HAND-/231268676280?pt=US_Virtual_Currency&hash=item35d8aff2b8
$6,900.00

Actually it currently takes 10 days with 3.3 TH/s to mine a bitcoin.

Damn that's bad.

Looks like Neptombers, all costs considered, paid about $2000 per bitcoin.

So they just lied to people, nothing more or less. Like the lie of claiming they would deliever all units by Oct 15th, even though they knew from the beginning of October they could never achieve that. And a million others if I could be bothered to dig them out.

And I noted 3 other lies knc told to decieve customers above, please address those too if you wish to defend KNC's policy of deceipt.

KNC's entire business is built on a pathological level of lies/fraud/deception/misrepresentation.

Nice summary of my points  

You are disputing those facts?

- Yes, Neptunes are selling for only $7k on ebay. Pretty bad for the guys still waiting on the rigs they paid $13k for.

- Yes, if you mine back about 6 btc with Neptune (which people on this forum are projecting is what they can mine with one Neptune), taking into account electricity costs, new fans, rewiring houses etc, then that leaves you about 5BTC. $10k divided by 5 = $2000/bitcoin. Is that math too hard for you to do on your own?

- Yes, they did lie about about delivering all rigs by 15th October. That's very old news, but a total fact. They said on 11th October they had only produced 700 units (https://www.kncminer.com/news/news-49), so they knew without a doubt then they could never ship the other 6-7000+ October units in the next 4 days. But did they admit that? No, they lied until the 16th October and then said they were 3 or 4 days behind in production. And then continued to ship units for another 2 weeks. And I know your math is bad, so let me reassure you that 3-4 days is not the same as 2 weeks. So that was total lies/deception too.

So based on these and many many more factors, - Yes, KNC's entire business is indeed built on a pathological level of lies/fraud/deception/misrepresentation. I'm sorry you think someone pointing out the facts is trolling, but I guess if you can't do basic math/logic, then everything is confusing.

[AFox]

They should have shipped EVERYTHING ordered before February 2014 in Q2. Anything less is fraud/deception/misrepresentation/lies/false advertising etc...

Just to remind some people, I reported KNC were running this banner on google in February:

KnCMiner 3+ TH/s Bitcoin - kncminer.com‎
Ad www.kncminer.com/bitcoin/miner‎
Neptune Miner Pre-order for $9,995 Shipment begins in Q2 of 2014

So every order they took b4 February *has* to ship before Q2 ends, right?

You can't start shipping batch 3 until you've finished shipping batch 0/1/2 right? So if you are going to start shipping Batch 3 in Q2, then shipping on all previous batches have to be completed already in Q2? Otherwise that would be like total fraud and misselling.

KNC stated for Batch 1 (link & source) :

• will be shipping in Q1/Q2 of 2014
• Shipment begins in Q1/Q2 of 2014

And for Batch 2, March 29th 2014 (link & source) :

• Neptune is our first 20nm product and will be shipping in Q2 of 2014
• Shipment begins in Q2 of 2014

Finally for Batch 3 (link & source) :

• This order is for the Third batch which will leave about one month after the Second batch
• Shipment begins one month after Batch 2

They never stated that they are going to ship batch 3 in Q2. What are you talking about ?!
The only thing they stated for Batch 3 is above; "Shipment begins one month after Batch 2".

You don't read so well do you? See the google ad above, paid for by KfC in February, which states Batch 3 starts shipping in Q2. You can read and understand what "Shipment begins in Q2 of 2014" means?

But if we stick to your logic, Batch 3 should have shipped last week of June (Q2). All the other batches - before the last week of May.

Did that happen? No. Was that ever going to happen? No. KNC knew very well when the chips would arrive and there was no possibility of shipping in May. So it was false advertising/fraud to place that banner on google. They rely on people like you to support their lies, briniging up their carefully worded newsletters that are misleading and ambiguous.

Please give us a link or screen capture of that Google ad. All I see is text that you could have invented.
Also in February, they were selling Batch 2 and not Batch 3. On March 29th 2014, they were still selling Batch 2 : link & source.

Again, they never stated that they were going to ship batch 3 in Q2. The only thing they stated for Batch 3 is above; "Shipment begins one month after Batch 2".

[The Avenger]

Oh and there is another 3-4 weeks between batches you forgot AFox. Because it's the kind of thing KfC put in their emails to customers, but not on the sales page. You know, so guys like you won't remember what KNC promised and will quote the wrong information:

I must have missed something.....   Can someone direct me to where it was stated that the Neptune deliveries would be separated in "Batches"?  Just because there was an order gap, and price difference between Noobs & old customers, means nothing towards delivery time as far as I see...   I cannot find anything to support that theory.

not batches per say, but on the site it does state the 13k price orders will come 3-4 weeks after first "batch" orders.

Yup it does

Neptune is our first 20nm product and will be shipping in Q1/Q2 of 2014.

The stats and performance that we can release today are

• Minimum 3000GH/s of hashing speed that 3TH Over 5 times the speed of our first Jupiter release (we reserve the right to increase this as we get closer to shipment)
• A 30% reduction in watts per GH
• Based on the existing Jupiter design (See photo, however this may change as development progresses)
• Shipment begins in Q1/Q2 of 2014
• Bitcoins first ever 20nm miner bought to you form the company who shipped the first 28nm bitcoin miner
• Limited batch of 1200 units,
• Payment for this product is bitcoins and bank transfer only.

• These boxes will ship 3-4 weeks after the first Neptune Batch

• All refunds will be refunded in dollars and you can refund up to shipment

So with a 3-4 week gap between the 0/1/2 batches and another 1 month between those and Batch 3, how are KNC doing? I'd say they've done well to mislead everyone and take all their customers for fools. It's the second week of Q3 and it's not even clear if they have finished shipping the customer humiliation batch (0) yet.