Bitcoin Forum
July 27, 2017, 07:00:04 AM *
News: BIP91 seems stable: there's probably only slightly increased risk of confirmations disappearing. You should still prepare for Aug 1.
 
   Home   Help Search Donate Login Register  
Poll
Question: Will you support Gavin's new block size limit hard fork of 8MB by January 1, 2016 then doubling every 2 years?
1.  yes
2.  no

Pages: « 1 ... 540 541 542 543 544 545 546 547 548 549 550 551 552 553 554 555 556 557 558 559 560 561 562 563 564 565 566 567 568 569 570 571 572 573 574 575 576 577 578 579 580 581 582 583 584 585 586 587 588 589 [590] 591 592 593 594 595 596 597 598 599 600 601 602 603 604 605 606 607 608 609 610 611 612 613 614 615 616 617 618 619 620 621 622 623 624 625 626 627 628 629 630 631 632 633 634 635 636 637 638 639 640 ... 1558 »
  Print  
Author Topic: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP.  (Read 1939197 times)
zeetubes
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 371


View Profile
September 09, 2014, 04:23:05 AM
 #11781

Interesting days/weeks ahead. Just to add to all of the political uncertainty and dollar strengthening, we have the 9-11 anniversary and then CME telling us that after 9-15, no more market rigging is allowed. Right. And then 9-18 the Scottish independence ballot. Not to mention a new iphone. How could I forget that? They're rumored to be releasing a 5.5" iphone but even if I liked the iphone, a 5.5" display is just too small for me now. I could almost get excited about the new nokia 1525. I had a windows phone for a while and it honestly wasn't so bad. Metro is quite friendly in a phone environment. But I just bought a black market 6" chinese samsung rip off and even though it was intended to be just a back up, I've stopped using the Note.
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction. Advertise here.
rocks
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1153


View Profile
September 09, 2014, 04:31:03 AM
 #11782

In short: The "protocol" nature of Bitcoin enables it's functionality to continue to expand and grow over time, both in terms of the functionality of the protocol (ex: multisig) and in terms of services layered on top (ex: online wallets, open bazaar, etc). This is superior over gold where it's functionality is largely fixed and static. Granted gold's functionality worked very well in the pre-digial era of thousands of years, but in the digital era we can do better.
... you mean, like it is a new form of money? ...  like digital gold?

I see what you did there Wink

In all seriousness though, the phrase "digital gold" makes bitcoin sound to be a simple 1-for-1 replacement to gold in terms of functionality. But Bitcoin has the potential to be much more than that, which to me makes the term inaccurate. Of course the whole experiment is still quite likely to fail in the end and we have a long way to go before achieving "gold" status let alone "beyond gold" status.

No I think this is a fallacy.   Im all for technology but some things are constant like human nature and elemental properties.   Every generation thinks they can discard mistakes made previously as obvious and easily avoidable but we havent got past political bias and interference in economies yet.  

I agree that every generation is naive in the effect they can truly have, and that the vast majority of time are doomed to repeat the same mistakes, but there are fundamental shifts in technology that can and do have large permanent changes on society.

For example, the printing press lowered the cost of the written word which brought reading and later education to large segments of the population, steam and then gas combustion engines greatly increased the distances people could travel in a lifetime (previously most people did not travel far from their birth location), the Haber process to create ammonia for fertilizer is widely viewed as one of the most significant enablers of humanity's population boom over the past 100 years (though the guy also invented chemical warfare....).

Similarly modern computer technology has for all practical purposes eliminated the costs in storing and disseminating information. That will create permanent changes to society, although we don't really know how. Many of us here are betting on a significant and permanent change to the concept of money.
STT
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1428


¯\_(ツ)_/¯


View Profile WWW
September 09, 2014, 05:02:18 AM
 #11783

Thats a great run down, yes Im fan of advancement and acceptance of change through technology and obviously we are no longer all in the fields picking potatoes.  So some see gold as similar waste of time and effort but my point would be we still (desperately) need it  

Quote
Many of us here are betting on a significant and permanent change to the concept of money.
Iam still going to switch back and say the biggest change to money was not this current development but something like what Nixon did in 1972 and has been built on since.   That whole focus switch over to debt, away from productive assets and to stop the distribution of capital among people by centralising money production (ie no link to assets) this meant the failure of capitalism itself .    I dont think bitcoin fixes that, it may bypass some of the effects however which is helpful, but the biggest changes are to democracy and various 'rights' perhaps.  

I dont think this is a mainly technology change occurring now, we are just the side menu
tabnloz
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 961


View Profile
September 09, 2014, 09:15:50 AM
 #11784

Gold holders moving out of etf's

http://www.etftrends.com/2014/09/gold-bugs-flinch-as-etf-departures-escalate/?utm_content=8020325&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter
zeetubes
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 371


View Profile
September 09, 2014, 10:04:07 AM
 #11785


yes, the powers that be want you to be invested in stocks and real estate and they're tired of asking nicely. Smiley
BrunesBTC45
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 103


View Profile
September 09, 2014, 11:08:42 AM
 #11786

Who made this? Maybe bitcoin fanatics wrote this one.
ShintoshiBTC
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 140

YOU"RE LIKE A TIMEBOMB!


View Profile
September 09, 2014, 11:13:24 AM
 #11787

Gold collapsing? I don't follow the metal prices. Link?

For years gold is one of the 3 things that doesnt depreciate. You think Gold Reserves of the US doesnt regulate these things?
Wilhelm
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 658


View Profile
September 09, 2014, 11:21:04 AM
 #11788

Gold collapsing? I don't follow the metal prices. Link?

For years gold is one of the 3 things that doesnt depreciate. You think Gold Reserves of the US doesnt regulate these things?

You assume there is still gold left in those reserves?

Bitcoin is like a box of chocolates. You never know what you're gonna get !!
thoughtfan
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 574

thoughtfanwritesstuff.wordpress.com


View Profile
September 09, 2014, 11:36:16 AM
 #11789

How high a proportion of the world's gold would need to be with one entity (e.g. the Chinese gov't), given a viable alternative to the rest of us as a store of value were an option, for gov'ts and people worldwide to go: 'nah, I'm not playing the game of gold having a substantial store of value anymore, we're just going to buy it for pretty things and industrial use' and it's value permanently dive off a cliff to somewhere relative to its demand for those other things?

Please disregard Litecoin and Zcash badges to the left. I have just gathered they are an April fool's joke!
rpietila
Donator
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1624



View Profile
September 09, 2014, 12:13:30 PM
 #11790

How high a proportion of the world's gold would need to be with one entity (e.g. the Chinese gov't), given a viable alternative to the rest of us as a store of value were an option, for gov'ts and people worldwide to go: 'nah, I'm not playing the game of gold having a substantial store of value anymore, we're just going to buy it for pretty things and industrial use' and it's value permanently dive off a cliff to somewhere relative to its demand for those other things?

Up to 80% of the world's physical gold is commanded by the banking cartel, and they have also been campaigning for the demonetization for 1.5 centuries at least.

The plan until crypto was probably that fiat money regime earns them the best fees, but even if they lose control, they have the control of the only alternative also.

I don't believe that a sufficient number of wealthy entities ever discards gold totally, and therefore its monetary premium will stay forever. Only 1% need to care, for gold still to have a high value.
rocks
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1153


View Profile
September 09, 2014, 04:53:05 PM
 #11791

Quote
Many of us here are betting on a significant and permanent change to the concept of money.
Iam still going to switch back and say the biggest change to money was not this current development but something like what Nixon did in 1972 and has been built on since.   That whole focus switch over to debt, away from productive assets and to stop the distribution of capital among people by centralising money production (ie no link to assets) this meant the failure of capitalism itself .    I dont think bitcoin fixes that, it may bypass some of the effects however which is helpful, but the biggest changes are to democracy and various 'rights' perhaps.  

I dont think this is a mainly technology change occurring now, we are just the side menu

Those are great points and I agree with all of that.

One comment though is it really was Wilson and FDR who created the switch in money to a debt based system, Nixon just inherited the mess and was forced to close the gold window to protect the US's remaining holding. By the time Nixon came to office the run on the US's gold holdings was accelerating since the amount of money and debt created previously was vastly larger than the amount of gold held. This started in the 1950s.



From: http://www.marketskeptics.com/2010/06/draft.html
rocks
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1153


View Profile
September 09, 2014, 06:23:17 PM
 #11792

Up to 80% of the world's physical gold is commanded by the banking cartel, and they have also been campaigning for the demonetization for 1.5 centuries at least.

The plan until crypto was probably that fiat money regime earns them the best fees, but even if they lose control, they have the control of the only alternative also.

I don't believe that a sufficient number of wealthy entities ever discards gold totally, and therefore its monetary premium will stay forever. Only 1% need to care, for gold still to have a high value.

Gold is actually pretty widely distributed, with a majority in private hands via jewelry and to a lesser extent private investment. Central banks have around 18%, not 80%. Of course those are official numbers, they could very well have quite a bit less gold.

From: http://minerals.usgs.gov/minerals/pubs/commodity/gold/myb1-2011-gold.pdf
Quote
An estimated 171,300 metric tons (t) of gold was mined historically through 2011, with 29,500 t held by central banks as official stocks, 33,000 t held privately as investment, 84,300 t held privately as jewelry, 20,800 t in other fabricated products, and the remaining 3,600 t unaccounted (Klapwijk and others, 2012, p. 59).

iCEBREAKER
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1722


Support SEGWIT on 8/1/17 https://github.com/UASF


View Profile WWW
September 09, 2014, 06:45:40 PM
 #11793

Quote
Unfortunately for gold, it is relatively stagnant in terms of its use.

Well evidentially not as gold usage has declined dramatically in the last century despite being used for millennia.   Certainly in proportion to the amount of cash used this is true, ie. western countries do not value gold where as eastern cultures may still retain and use gold in more regular set patterns still such as the Indian wedding season, etc
 If I estimate any great rise its likely a large reversal of this decline


Quote
This is superior over gold where it's functionality is largely fixed and static. Granted gold's functionality worked very well in the pre-digial era of thousands of years, but in the digital era we can do better.

No I think this is a fallacy.   Im all for technology but some things are constant like human nature and elemental properties.   Every generation thinks they can discard mistakes made previously as obvious and easily avoidable but we havent got past political bias and interference in economies yet.    
Gold is inverse in its function, so yea its nothing new but look at the world now and effects in progress.  Such as the ECB moves recently to increase the magnitude of negative rates and so on.    The need and possible usage for gold or any steady medium of exchange is rising in proportion to systemic failure implemented by unproductive elements of the economy like government or general beaurcarcy.   At some point they'll be so much crap the demand will break badly in favour of any competitive free medium of value exchange

Gold usage for the last 100 years is in an extended local minimum.  This aberration will revert to the historical trend sooner or later.

The last century was dominated by world war and central banks (happy birthday US FED).  FDR banned gold, as did his authoritarian brethren in China, etc.

Now hard money is making a comeback.  Gold is in a 12 year bull run, silver tested ATHs, and the people of the BRICs and other emerging markets are once again able to put into practice the wisdom of the average Indian onion farmer who never stopped hloding (his wife would murder him if he did).

Most of the world's people are not the bi-coastal cosmopolitan elites who are vastly overrepresented on this thread.  Worry about PM vs BTC allocation is a first world problem.  Indian onion farmers are not going to diversify into cryptocash, although their computer savvy children are starting to.

Speaking of human nature, sweet shiny gold/silver/platinum are absolutely guaranteed get you laid.  BTC might also, but only if you are into furries... Shocked

The difference between bad and well-developed digital cash will determine whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy.  David Chaum 1996
"Monero" : { Private - Auditable - 100% Fungible - Flexible Blocksize - Wild & Free® - Intro - Core GUI - Podcats - Roadmap - Dice - Blackjack - Github - Android }
MoneroForCash.com  |  Buy and sell XMR near you  |  Easymonero.com  |  Bitsquare.io - Decentralized XMR Exchange  |  Buy XMR with fiat
Fungibility provides privacy as a side effect.  Adam Back 2014

Bitcoin is intentionally designed to be ungovernable and governance-free.  luke-jr 2016
Blocks must necessarily be full for the Bitcoin network to be able to pay for its own security.  davout 2015
Blocksize is an intentionally limited resource, like the 21e6 BTC limit.  Changing it degrades the surrounding economics, creating negative incentives.  Jeff Garzik 2013


The raison d'être of bitcoin is trustlessness. - Eric Lombrozo 2015
It is an Engineering Requirement that Bitcoin be “Above the Law”  Paul Sztorc 2015
Resiliency, not efficiency, is the paramount goal of decentralized, non-state sanctioned currency -Jon Matonis 2015

Bitcoin is intentionally designed to be ungovernable and governance-free.  luke-jr 2016

Technology tends to move in the direction of making surveillance easier, and the ability of computers to track us doubles every eighteen months. - Phil Zimmerman 2013

The only way to make software secure, reliable, and fast is to make it small. Fight Features. - Andy Tanenbaum 2004
Kupsi
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1190


9.9.2012: I predict that single digits... <- FAIL


View Profile
September 10, 2014, 12:20:11 AM
 #11794

Big money are on the way...

How Bitcoin is penetrating RIA portfolios by looking riskier to ignore than embrace

(The next "bubble" will be fun  Grin )
marcus_of_augustus
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2324



View Profile
September 10, 2014, 12:58:16 AM
 #11795

Big money are on the way...

How Bitcoin is penetrating RIA portfolios by looking riskier to ignore than embrace

(The next "bubble" will be fun  Grin )

They are more correctly waves than bubbles since they all have reverted to higher lows, so far.

Big money are here now, confirmed.

From first and second hand discussions with people employed with large financial institutions, including several megabanks, that have active research into bitcoin as an investment strategy or data analytics tool. Notably one with ~US 1.5 T (yes trillion) under private wealth management and a consortium of banks who are interested in establishing a BTC futures clearing platform (apparently legally easier than adopting/handling the BTC itself in their legal/accounting, go figure).

No BS, you heard it here first.

kodtycoon
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 672



View Profile
September 10, 2014, 09:30:20 AM
 #11796

Big money are on the way...

How Bitcoin is penetrating RIA portfolios by looking riskier to ignore than embrace

(The next "bubble" will be fun  Grin )

They are more correctly waves than bubbles since they all have reverted to higher lows, so far.

Big money are here now, confirmed.

From first and second hand discussions with people employed with large financial institutions, including several megabanks, that have active research into bitcoin as an investment strategy or data analytics tool. Notably one with ~US 1.5 T (yes trillion) under private wealth management and a consortium of banks who are interested in establishing a BTC futures clearing platform (apparently legally easier than adopting/handling the BTC itself in their legal/accounting, go figure).

No BS, you heard it here first.


klee
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1470



View Profile
September 10, 2014, 10:24:46 AM
 #11797

Big money are on the way...

How Bitcoin is penetrating RIA portfolios by looking riskier to ignore than embrace

(The next "bubble" will be fun  Grin )
RIA?

BTC: 1K9atu5zgz7izCMAynk5adBJ8Qn2YgS6nT
wachtwoord
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1596


View Profile
September 10, 2014, 10:45:41 AM
 #11798


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Registered_Investment_Advisor
BigGameCAsino
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 112

Want A Personal Coin? PM ME!


View Profile
September 10, 2014, 02:42:09 PM
 #11799

One question, if bitcoin is up in the bitcoin educated countries does that mean that Gold is down too in the third world countries?

oda.krell
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1316



View Profile
September 10, 2014, 03:10:51 PM
 #11800

Big money are on the way...

How Bitcoin is penetrating RIA portfolios by looking riskier to ignore than embrace

(The next "bubble" will be fun  Grin )

They are more correctly waves than bubbles since they all have reverted to higher lows, so far.

Big money are here now, confirmed.

From first and second hand discussions with people employed with large financial institutions, including several megabanks, that have active research into bitcoin as an investment strategy or data analytics tool. Notably one with ~US 1.5 T (yes trillion) under private wealth management and a consortium of banks who are interested in establishing a BTC futures clearing platform (apparently legally easier than adopting/handling the BTC itself in their legal/accounting, go figure).

No BS, you heard it here first.

Forgot who introduced it (wachtwoord, maybe), but the term "growth spurts" is the most fitting expression imo, though "waves" is still a lot better than "bubbles".

Not sure which Bitcoin wallet to use? I suggest to take a look at Electrum.
Electrum is an open-source lightweight client: user friendly, fast, and one of the safest ways to store, send or receive bitcoins.
For executables (Windows, OSX, Linux, Android), source code and documentation, see the Electrum homepage.
Pages: « 1 ... 540 541 542 543 544 545 546 547 548 549 550 551 552 553 554 555 556 557 558 559 560 561 562 563 564 565 566 567 568 569 570 571 572 573 574 575 576 577 578 579 580 581 582 583 584 585 586 587 588 589 [590] 591 592 593 594 595 596 597 598 599 600 601 602 603 604 605 606 607 608 609 610 611 612 613 614 615 616 617 618 619 620 621 622 623 624 625 626 627 628 629 630 631 632 633 634 635 636 637 638 639 640 ... 1558 »
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Sponsored by , a Bitcoin-accepting VPN.
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!