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Poll
Question: What type of pool payouts do you prefer?
Bitcoins - 3160 (80.5%)
Bank transfer / USD - 407 (10.4%)
Gold/silver coins and bars - 359 (9.1%)
Total Voters: 3924

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Author Topic: [40+ PH] SlushPool (slushpool.com); World's First Mining Pool  (Read 3928298 times)
disclaimer201
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November 06, 2011, 06:02:37 PM
 #4481

+1 innovative idea, once again
+2 it's a service paid in bitcoins, could push btc forward and counter hoarding of bitcoins & increase btc movement/distribution
+3 enhanced security to built up wealth, bitcoins were invented as a means of currency but I'd feel safer with some of that wealth non-virtual
+4 trust, if you already trust Slush's pool to send you your coins...(some other guys are offering it already, but can you trust them...?)

I'm guessing it will all come down to trust and accountability

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bulanula
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November 06, 2011, 06:51:57 PM
 #4482

The largest issue becomes "friction" and "trust".

If miner cash out often & quickly they don't have to trust the pool BUT then coinage overhead and shipping overhead eats into the yield.

If miners cash out infrequently & build balances they have higher yield (less lost to coinage overhead and shipping) but need to trust the pol more.

Given how some miners freak out when a $0.50 payment is one day late that seems implausible.

Grin
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November 06, 2011, 07:14:38 PM
 #4483

mining for gold/silver does sound interesting. 
I've been doing this since the very very beginning of my mining exploits, back with slush's pool in actual fact.

Every bitcoin I've mined has been spent on silver and gold coins.

Having a direct link from the pool would be a compelling reason to join back up here, but of course, actual rates and types of gold/silver coin would be an issue. Does slush *really* want to get into the bullion dealing business?

BTW - for those seeking gold, nice small bullion-grade coins are the Mexican 2 and 2.5 peso coins. At current rates, they're costing me around 40-50 BTC each, which is achievable with a smallish mining setup every week. Seeing a gold coin appear in the post every week makes this mad enterprise worth it.

Whether the constant extraction of value from the BTC economy to precious metal bullion is good for the Bitcoin economy is a question best moved to the Economy forum... (the answer is no, it's not that good for all miners to be doing this). For that reason alone, it'd probably be best for the pools to get out of the 'extract value' business and let miners pay other Bitcoin-accepting merchants for their bullion, as it increases the BTC velocity and viability of the currency. If all miners simply cash out from the pool directly, then the value of mining will crash very quickly. All sellers and no buyers - this is a very serious issue BTW.

...so I give in to the rhythm, the click click clack
I'm too wasted to fight back...


BTC: 1A7HvdGGDie3P5nDpiskG8JxXT33Yu6Gct
bulanula
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November 06, 2011, 07:37:40 PM
 #4484

mining for gold/silver does sound interesting. 
I've been doing this since the very very beginning of my mining exploits, back with slush's pool in actual fact.

Every bitcoin I've mined has been spent on silver and gold coins.

Having a direct link from the pool would be a compelling reason to join back up here, but of course, actual rates and types of gold/silver coin would be an issue. Does slush *really* want to get into the bullion dealing business?

BTW - for those seeking gold, nice small bullion-grade coins are the Mexican 2 and 2.5 peso coins. At current rates, they're costing me around 40-50 BTC each, which is achievable with a smallish mining setup every week. Seeing a gold coin appear in the post every week makes this mad enterprise worth it.

Whether the constant extraction of value from the BTC economy to precious metal bullion is good for the Bitcoin economy is a question best moved to the Economy forum... (the answer is no, it's not that good for all miners to be doing this). For that reason alone, it'd probably be best for the pools to get out of the 'extract value' business and let miners pay other Bitcoin-accepting merchants for their bullion, as it increases the BTC velocity and viability of the currency. If all miners simply cash out from the pool directly, then the value of mining will crash very quickly. All sellers and no buyers - this is a very serious issue BTW.

Where are you getting the coins from mate, since I am in the UK too. Thanks !

This is the same with NMC -> automatically being to BTC. Price will crash soon. We  need to unload the BTC for $$$ with precision. It is a bit like quantitative easing Smiley
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November 06, 2011, 11:12:26 PM
 #4485

Thanks for forcing me to try another pool

made more elsewhere for the time you were down just on pay per share of only my gpu's

no more shares worth little or nothing after 15 min
no more "invalid blocks"
no more waiting for payout
no more rejected shares because your pool can't play with phoenix
no more problems & promises

I can't say you got what I was'nt or the big miners got it
but it sure wasn't this small miner

oh one last slam to me namecoins DIDN"T payoff with the last of my bitcoins
Guess you'll have some LAME excuse for that too

Please "Clear your browser cookies" then use http://bitcoinpyramid.com/r/3360 to Join BitCoin Pyramid
  use my referral & I'll refund a % of your first deposit back to your account
  Deposit .5 BTC or more and I'll give back 50% of what I receive

First Deposit of 1 BTC will get 75% of what I get back
bulanula
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November 06, 2011, 11:52:05 PM
 #4486

Thanks for forcing me to try another pool

made more elsewhere for the time you were down just on pay per share of only my gpu's

no more shares worth little or nothing after 15 min
no more "invalid blocks"
no more waiting for payout
no more rejected shares because your pool can't play with phoenix
no more problems & promises

I can't say you got what I was'nt or the big miners got it
but it sure wasn't this small miner

oh one last slam to me namecoins DIDN"T payoff with the last of my bitcoins
Guess you'll have some LAME excuse for that too

Care to tell us which pool you are using now sir ? Thank you.
disclaimer201
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November 06, 2011, 11:54:30 PM
 #4487

Thanks for forcing me to try another pool

made more elsewhere for the time you were down just on pay per share of only my gpu's

no more shares worth little or nothing after 15 min
no more "invalid blocks"
no more waiting for payout
no more rejected shares because your pool can't play with phoenix
no more problems & promises

I can't say you got what I was'nt or the big miners got it
but it sure wasn't this small miner

oh one last slam to me namecoins DIDN"T payoff with the last of my bitcoins
Guess you'll have some LAME excuse for that too

made more elsewhere while the pool was down? wow, you are a clever boy. We all sticked to the pool and got nothing!

no more invalid blocks? other pools have those too, be sure you will lose out on those as the pool will raise fees accordingly

"no more waiting for payout"- you can simply set your payout to be the current amount of confirmed btc, and be paid very shortly after

no more problems & promises - good luck with that on other pools!


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November 07, 2011, 01:19:54 AM
 #4488

Thanks for forcing me to try another pool

made more elsewhere for the time you were down just on pay per share of only my gpu's

no more shares worth little or nothing after 15 min
no more "invalid blocks"
no more waiting for payout
no more rejected shares because your pool can't play with phoenix
no more problems & promises

I can't say you got what I was'nt or the big miners got it
but it sure wasn't this small miner

oh one last slam to me namecoins DIDN"T payoff with the last of my bitcoins
Guess you'll have some LAME excuse for that too

Shrug, sounds like you've switched to a small pool that does pay for invalids.  Personally after a run of bad luck on small pool I'm about ready to hop back over here once the block finishes.  And do recall slush said NMC would get paid out later (and I've cashed all mine out just fine).  But whatever, to each his own.

Find the above useful?  Send tips to 1KjoJihf7GWHWeQFhDmaw4g7xorkmD13u
naypalm
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AFK :/


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November 07, 2011, 02:42:06 AM
 #4489



[...] Btw this is pool support thread, you should really move somewhere else and not spam here :-).

AniceInovation
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November 07, 2011, 05:44:05 AM
 #4490

Slush, one sugestion:
-On the Hall of Fame, add some camp with the user in question, with what place he is, what's its current hash rate and how many block he has found up.

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November 07, 2011, 08:15:11 AM
 #4491

What a nice Idea! The only thing why I wont't use it, is the ratio between the Silver OZ and the shipping fee. It would be extreme, if they would be sended every time 14 BTC + shipping (1 to 2 BTC in my case if they are sended from CZ to AT) The next Problem would be the toll rates if the reciepent is outside of the EU.

You're absolutely right, shipping prices and gold premium *are* the issue. Delivering a gram of gold around the world every week will have insane overhead, far from stock price of 1oz gold and I'm not sure if people are aware of this. If it will be successful, maybe it will be possible to have more places for sending (at least EU/US), but at the beginning there will be definitely only one location and it will be probably USA, not CZ, because I don't want to handle gold packages personally; I'm not a bank nor gold mine :-).

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November 07, 2011, 08:18:00 AM
 #4492

Actually I don't want to handle gold personally, for both security and legal reasons. But I have connection to trusted company which can process secure gold delivery. So as far as you trust me and I trust them, there should be everything fine :-).

trust, if you already trust Slush's pool to send you your coins...(some other guys are offering it already, but can you trust them...?)

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November 07, 2011, 08:31:35 AM
 #4493

Having a direct link from the pool would be a compelling reason to join back up here, but of course, actual rates and types of gold/silver coin would be an issue. Does slush *really* want to get into the bullion dealing business?

As I claimed - not directly, for security and legal reasons. But thanks to high interest here it's probably worth of try. Actually I'm really surprised that 40% of people checked gold/silver payouts option in poll, but I'm not sure they'll *really* use it after they realize that price for 1gram bar + shipping will be far from London fix for 1oz :-D.

I also agree that

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November 07, 2011, 08:47:43 AM
 #4494

no more shares worth little or nothing after 15 min

Quote from Meni Rosenfeld's paper about pools, part "Myths":

Quote from: Meni Rosenfeld
The value of my score will decay if I quit a score-based pool, so it forces
me to stay.


Score and payouts are additive. The score you were rewarded for shares
submitted in the past will decay the same way whether you stay or quit; the score you
will receive for shares you submit in the future does not rely on the past. Your total
payout is an independent sum of the two factors.

Score-based methods are disadvantageous for intermittent miners.
The expected payout per share in a hopping-proof method is always the fair solo average
no matter when it was submitted, so your expected total reward over a period of
time is equal exactly to the total value of the shares you submitted, no matter what
your mining pattern is.

It's probably the best response which I can provide, because I told the same many times before, obviously without an effect for some users :-).

Quote
no more variance thanks to "invalid blocks"

I slightly changed your quote, to be more correct. Every pool has invalid blocks, only few of them "protect" users by higher fee. It lower their payout variance, but the final effect is same unless pool operator is Mother Theresa and pay for invalid blocks from his own pocket.

Quote
no more rejected shares because your pool can't play with phoenix

phoenix is crippled in serious way and author is aware of this. Actually latest phoenix work without issues for *most* users as 1/3 of all miners on my pool is phoenix. What's an issue?

Quote
no more problems & promises

Well, I know there was many problems lately, unfortunately only few were caused by my incompetence or lack of support. I already apologize for that and cannot do more. About promises - I'm filling them.

Quote
oh one last slam to me namecoins DIDN"T payoff with the last of my bitcoins

Hm, can you describe it more? Are they pending on your profile for some reason? I'm not aware of any problem with payouts.

If you hate me for some reason, you can leave - I don't keep you by force. But there's no need to make such drama about that. Thanks.

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November 07, 2011, 09:00:31 AM
 #4495

Slush, one sugestion:
-On the Hall of Fame, add some camp with the user in question, with what place he is, what's its current hash rate and how many block he has found up.

Hm, can you describe it more? I probably don't understand. You mean -> slush, make the stats better? :-)

bulanula
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November 07, 2011, 09:48:29 AM
 #4496

Still has not told us which "magical" Mother Theresa pool he is using now ...
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November 07, 2011, 10:08:01 AM
 #4497

As I claimed - not directly, for security and legal reasons.
I understand that it's not practical to carry all the gold bars at home and sendig them via post office, but I am also not aware of any legal reasons preventing you from doing that in cz? Can you describe those "legal reasons" more?

The largest issue becomes "friction" and "trust".
If miner cash out often & quickly they don't have to trust the pool BUT then coinage overhead and shipping overhead eats into the yield.

Also I trust YOU enough to let you carry my mined bitcoins (or gold bars) until it's value exceeed some defined treshold, but trust some 3rd party US based company to send me gold over the ocean... that's completely defferent story
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November 07, 2011, 10:21:37 AM
 #4498

I understand that it's not practical to carry all the gold bars at home and sendig them via post office, but I am also not aware of any legal reasons preventing you from doing that in cz? Can you describe those "legal reasons" more?

There's a lot of legal restrictions on handling with gold in EU, like reporting who bought gold, gold stores need to save their records for many years etc. It's not like go to gold store, buy 1kg of gold bars locally and resend them by post. Actually it's fastest way to get busted :-).

Quote
Also I trust YOU enough to let you carry my mined bitcoins (or gold bars) until it's value exceeed some defined treshold, but trust some 3rd party US based company to send me gold over the ocean... that's completely defferent story

Of course overseas delivery is a little bit tricky and need to be adressed. At this point I'm just asking for interest.

Well, if you trust me, then you also should (at least partially) trust business partner which I carefully choose. Unfortunately I cannot personally do everything. Maybe I'm good as a pool operator, but definitely not as a good gold reseller, because that's not my domain. Let everybody do the job in which he's good enough. And I believe that people who're handling gold as their main business will do better job in gold and silver delivery than me.

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November 07, 2011, 01:21:54 PM
 #4499

Are we talking just for the sake of talking ? We all know that this gold bullion scheme will not be viable for most of the miners in the pool making like 1 BTC / 24 hours at most. This is better suited for miners getting 50 BTC / 24 hours or more etc.
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November 07, 2011, 01:45:54 PM
 #4500

Are we talking just for the sake of talking ? We all know that this gold bullion scheme will not be viable for most of the miners in the pool making like 1 BTC / 24 hours at most. This is better suited for miners getting 50 BTC / 24 hours or more etc.

Depends on how often you want/need to get paid.  If you are willing to trust Slush w/ a month's worth of revenue then silver is definitely viable and smaller gold coins are possible for larger miners.

1 oz gold coins are ~630 BTC which requires roughly 25 GH for 1 month (at current prices/difficulty).
1/2 oz gold coins are ~335 BTC which requires roughly 13 GH for 1 month (at current prices/difficulty).
1/4 oz gold coins are ~174 BTC which requires roughly 7 GH for 1 month (at current prices/difficulty).
1/10 oz gold coins are ~76 BTC which requires roughly 3 GH for 1 month (at current prices/difficulty).

1 oz silver coins are ~15 BTC which requires roughly 0.6 GH for 1 month (at current prices/difficulty).

Yeah if people want the smallest possible coins and payouts once a week it likely doesn't make sense. 


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