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Author Topic: MultiMiner: Any Miner, Any Where, on Any Device (Free, Open Source, Cross Platform)  (Read 827250 times)
nite138
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January 01, 2014, 07:20:17 PM
 #1281

Happy New Year!

Ok, I'm running into a little problem with 2.3 and 2.3.2.  When it switches coins I get an awesome BSOD (atiblahblah.sys error).  The odd thing is on 2.8, no problems.  I don't know if it computer or program related.  Let me know if there is any info I can provide to help.

specs:
(2) r9 290x @ 917/1500 (stock volts)
4gb 1333 ram
win7 x64

Also, could you provide some feedback on this "issue" as well?  Looking at the API monitor I see some info that concerns me a bit. 

After an hour I see the following mining Doge:
Accepted:176
Discarded:85
Stale:5
M/H @ 1.75

The discard rate is what concerns me (or should it).

Thanks again for the great program
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Scyntech
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January 01, 2014, 09:42:34 PM
 #1282

My 7850 is up and running BTC @ 263 Mh/s and LTC @ 360 Kh/s

Not sure if I should be getting more. I think it's where it should be.

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January 01, 2014, 10:03:12 PM
 #1283

Hi everyone,

I have a problem with MultiMiner on two computers.

Hardware:
-Templarius 1150W
-MSI Z77A-G45
-3x MSI R9 290 4gb gddr5 (4gd5)
-RAM Kingston 4gb
-Processor Intel Celeron G1610 2,6 GHz

Software:
-Windows 7 64bit
-Multiminer 2.2.8 + bfgminer 3.9.0 (When I installed 2.3.0 or higher it blue screens when pressing stop button everytime). Good_shepherd had similar problem - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=248173.msg4213417#msg4213417
-Drivers (Catalyst Software Suite from http://support.amd.com/en-us/download/desktop?os=Windows%207%20-%2064 (so I have .net framework 4.5 installed too)
-LAN drivers
-Teamviewer
-AMD APP SDK (Do I have to install SDK? )

I also added commands: setx GPU_MAX_ALLOC_PERCENT 100 and setx GPU_USE_SYNC_OBJECTS 1 . I did not installed anything else.


Then I opened MultiMiner and started to configure it and I clicked START button.


It works but I can see 3-10 BSODs every day. Details: http://i44.tinypic.com/bgv0w5.jpg



// edit:
I have just seen Blue Sreen on the second device -  http://i43.tinypic.com/ri6wef.jpg


nwoolls (OP)
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January 01, 2014, 10:13:57 PM
 #1284

What's the new in 2.3.2 update?

Changes are listed here:

https://github.com/nwoolls/MultiMiner/releases

MultiMiner: Any Miner, Any Where, on Any Device |  Xgminer: Mine with popular miners on Mac OS X
btc: 1BmXY4ZZQh1iHSVre658gM1gPAEtDnq8rv  |  ltc: LP1SsHZTDexndkvRKsqAkXNsienPHwaMb5  |  hardware: nwoolls at gmail dot com
nwoolls (OP)
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January 01, 2014, 10:16:56 PM
 #1285

It works but I can see 3-10 BSODs every day. Details: http://i44.tinypic.com/bgv0w5.jpg

// edit:
I have just seen Blue Sreen on the second device -  http://i43.tinypic.com/ri6wef.jpg

Hard to say really. I have heard of several other users getting BSODs with the new R9 hardware. I don't have an R9 myself. If you or anyone would like to send me an R9 for a week or so I'd be happy to properly support it and send it back.

Until then all I can suggest is adjusting the arguments you are passing to bfgminer. You can also try launching bfgminer directly from the Process Log tab (right-click an entry and click Launch) to see if the BSOD occurs outside of MultiMiner.

Finally, I've also read that some users report a BSOD with the R9 hardware when the RPC API is used to QUIT a miner. However I do not want to remove the QUIT use as it is proper and correct and would rather fix the issue in bfgminer itself (if there is one).

MultiMiner: Any Miner, Any Where, on Any Device |  Xgminer: Mine with popular miners on Mac OS X
btc: 1BmXY4ZZQh1iHSVre658gM1gPAEtDnq8rv  |  ltc: LP1SsHZTDexndkvRKsqAkXNsienPHwaMb5  |  hardware: nwoolls at gmail dot com
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January 01, 2014, 10:19:22 PM
 #1286

cant seem to get stratum proxy working getting bunch of errors back on it liek i was doing befor with configuration

Process crashed

If launching bfgminer from the command line is crashing that is something you need to report in the bfgminer thread:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=168174.0

Let me know if I misunderstood - thanks!

MultiMiner: Any Miner, Any Where, on Any Device |  Xgminer: Mine with popular miners on Mac OS X
btc: 1BmXY4ZZQh1iHSVre658gM1gPAEtDnq8rv  |  ltc: LP1SsHZTDexndkvRKsqAkXNsienPHwaMb5  |  hardware: nwoolls at gmail dot com
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January 01, 2014, 10:21:32 PM
 #1287

Ok, I'm running into a little problem with 2.3 and 2.3.2.  When it switches coins I get an awesome BSOD (atiblahblah.sys error).  The odd thing is on 2.8, no problems.  I don't know if it computer or program related.  Let me know if there is any info I can provide to help.

Ah another R9 user getting BSODs. At least it's looking like a problem I should be able to reproduce.

First of all, what do you mean by 2.8? I'm not sure what you are referring to there - maybe MultiMiner 2.2.8?

Is there any way you'd consider sending me a single R9 for a week or so? And then I'll send it back. I can even mine to your pools while it's here.

Supporting hardware is much easier when I actually have it to reproduce issues. Under normal circumstances I'd offer to TeamViewer in but with it causing BSODs I don't think we'd get far.

Edit: Another thing I've read is that 8GB of RAM is needed to scrypt mine properly with the R9 hardware. But again I cannot confirm myself.

MultiMiner: Any Miner, Any Where, on Any Device |  Xgminer: Mine with popular miners on Mac OS X
btc: 1BmXY4ZZQh1iHSVre658gM1gPAEtDnq8rv  |  ltc: LP1SsHZTDexndkvRKsqAkXNsienPHwaMb5  |  hardware: nwoolls at gmail dot com
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January 02, 2014, 03:25:48 AM
 #1288

What are some of the best settings everyone has for automatic switching for multiminer? I have two jalapenos, and I'm trying to get the most profit I can.  Right now I have it set to check every 5 minutes for straight profitability. I have added all the sha-256 coins at coinwars and using coinwars api.

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nite138
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January 02, 2014, 03:56:31 AM
 #1289

Sorry, yes 2.2.8 is working perfectly (except the coinwarz api "setting" thing that you explained already).

I'm not having any trouble with bfgminer or cgminer for that matter when used through cmd prompt.  I have 8gb of ram on its way, I'll cross my fingers that it is the fix (I'll report my findings).  Until then, 2.2.8 for me Smiley
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January 02, 2014, 04:00:43 AM
 #1290

I'm not having any trouble with bfgminer or cgminer for that matter when used through cmd prompt.  I have 8gb of ram on its way, I'll cross my fingers that it is the fix (I'll report my findings).  Until then, 2.2.8 for me Smiley

If 2.2.8 works for you my guess is that this is related to using the QUIT API command to exit bfgminer, as I've read elsewhere. I did adjust things in MultiMiner to give bfgminer more time to exit from the QUIT API command before I terminate the process. Maybe that is what is causing this.

The problem is that not properly quitting bfgminer (e.g. not sending QUIT) means it may leave USB devices in-use.

Going to have to give this some thought. I'd really rather fix the BSOD in bfgminer as I said before.

MultiMiner: Any Miner, Any Where, on Any Device |  Xgminer: Mine with popular miners on Mac OS X
btc: 1BmXY4ZZQh1iHSVre658gM1gPAEtDnq8rv  |  ltc: LP1SsHZTDexndkvRKsqAkXNsienPHwaMb5  |  hardware: nwoolls at gmail dot com
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January 02, 2014, 04:59:25 AM
 #1291

I think you are correct, I'll look into the bfgminer threads and see if there are any suggestions
nwoolls (OP)
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January 02, 2014, 06:41:25 AM
 #1292

I think you are correct, I'll look into the bfgminer threads and see if there are any suggestions

No promises - but can you please give this a try when you have time?

https://www.dropbox.com/s/uo2fszswu5hrmrl/MultiMiner-2.3.2.zip

Basically this will try a few other ways of safely closing bfgminer before finally sending the QUIT command via the RPC API.

MultiMiner: Any Miner, Any Where, on Any Device |  Xgminer: Mine with popular miners on Mac OS X
btc: 1BmXY4ZZQh1iHSVre658gM1gPAEtDnq8rv  |  ltc: LP1SsHZTDexndkvRKsqAkXNsienPHwaMb5  |  hardware: nwoolls at gmail dot com
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January 02, 2014, 09:24:54 PM
 #1293

No promises - but can you please give this a try when you have time?

https://www.dropbox.com/s/uo2fszswu5hrmrl/MultiMiner-2.3.2.zip

Basically this will try a few other ways of safely closing bfgminer before finally sending the QUIT command via the RPC API.

I've received feedback that this update doesn't help with the R9 BSODs. I'm actually glad as I didn't really like all the work put into working around this issue.

So at this point I'm going to open up donations for R9 support for bfgminer and MultiMiner. You can donate to the following BTC address:

18ciG8A4SqQyUnwN5YSSMHJQxqJ9iKSDZR

Or the following LTC address:

LWDGNbJpiip1wvor6idJmYG1ZMztpPhZEF

If you would like official, optimized support for the R9 GPU in bfgminer and MultiMiner please consider donating to one of the above addresses. Once these two addresses total an amount that allow me to purchase the R9 hardware I will begin work on adding support.

As I've said before, if you'd rather send me sample hardware for a week for me to work on support that works as well.

MultiMiner: Any Miner, Any Where, on Any Device |  Xgminer: Mine with popular miners on Mac OS X
btc: 1BmXY4ZZQh1iHSVre658gM1gPAEtDnq8rv  |  ltc: LP1SsHZTDexndkvRKsqAkXNsienPHwaMb5  |  hardware: nwoolls at gmail dot com
atomicchaos
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January 02, 2014, 10:53:33 PM
 #1294

Is anyone solo mining Earthcoin using Multiminer / BFGminer? I haven't solo mined in a long time, and not ever with BFGminer,and I'm seeing an very, very high rate  of rejects. In fact the rejected blocks shows 5000%+, which leads me to believe it could be an issue with BFGminer.

I don't ever get any errors at all with my LTC pool mining, nor did I previously when solo mining. It certainly could be the coin, I just am trying to figure it out at the moment.

BTC:113mFe2e3oRkZQ5GeqKhoHbGtVw16unnw2
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January 03, 2014, 06:09:11 PM
 #1295

I'm running Multiminer 2.3.2 and linux mint 15 xfce.  The program crashed in the middle of the night, so I'm not sure how to replicate it.  Also, what's getting annoying is that "Coin configuration enable" option gets unchecked for some coins, so the miner never connects to those pools. I don't know if it's an error the program has or it is a feature.  Last, I'm getting the coinbase api error a lot.

Code:

mauricio@mauricio-B202 ~/Multiminer $ mono MultiMiner.Win.exe

(exo-helper-1:13226): Gdk-CRITICAL **: IA__gdk_window_get_window_type: assertion `GDK_IS_WINDOW (window)' failed

(process:13229): GLib-CRITICAL **: g_slice_set_config: assertion `sys_page_size == 0' failed
Error: No running window found

(process:13233): GLib-CRITICAL **: g_slice_set_config: assertion `sys_page_size == 0' failed
CreateProcess: error creating process handle

Unhandled Exception: System.ComponentModel.Win32Exception: ApplicationName='/usr/bin/bfgminer', CommandLine='--load-balance --scan noauto --quota "99;stratum+tcp://tek.dsync.net:6666" -u xxxxxx -p x -S bitforce_queue:/dev/ttyUSB0 -d bitforce_queue@/dev/ttyUSB0 -S bitforce_queue:/dev/ttyUSB1 -d bitforce_queue@/dev/ttyUSB1 --api-listen --api-port 4028 --api-allow W:127.0.0.1, -T -q', CurrentDirectory=''
  at System.Diagnostics.Process.Start_noshell (System.Diagnostics.ProcessStartInfo startInfo, System.Diagnostics.Process process) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Diagnostics.Process.Start_common (System.Diagnostics.ProcessStartInfo startInfo, System.Diagnostics.Process process) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Diagnostics.Process.Start () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at (wrapper remoting-invoke-with-check) System.Diagnostics.Process:Start ()
  at MultiMiner.Xgminer.Miner.StartProcessAndCheckResponse (System.Diagnostics.ProcessStartInfo startInfo, Boolean startProcess) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Xgminer.Miner.StartMinerProcess (System.String arguments, Boolean redirectOutput, Boolean ensureProcessStarts, System.String reason, Boolean startProcess) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Xgminer.Miner.Launch (System.String reason) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Engine.MiningEngine.LaunchMinerProcess (MultiMiner.Xgminer.MinerConfiguration minerConfiguration, System.String reason) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Engine.MiningEngine.StartMining () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Engine.MiningEngine.RestartMining () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Engine.MiningEngine.ApplyMiningStrategy (System.Collections.Generic.List`1 coinInformation) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Win.MainForm.CheckAndApplyMiningStrategy () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Win.MainForm.coinStatsTimer_Tick (System.Object sender, System.EventArgs e) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.Timer.OnTick (System.EventArgs e) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.Timer.FireTick () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at (wrapper remoting-invoke-with-check) System.Windows.Forms.Timer:FireTick ()
  at System.Windows.Forms.XplatUIX11.CheckTimers (System.Collections.ArrayList timers, DateTime now) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.XplatUIX11.UpdateMessageQueue (System.Windows.Forms.XEventQueue queue, Boolean allowIdle) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.XplatUIX11.UpdateMessageQueue (System.Windows.Forms.XEventQueue queue) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.XplatUIX11.GetMessage (System.Object queue_id, System.Windows.Forms.MSG& msg, IntPtr handle, Int32 wFilterMin, Int32 wFilterMax) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.XplatUI.GetMessage (System.Object queue_id, System.Windows.Forms.MSG& msg, IntPtr hWnd, Int32 wFilterMin, Int32 wFilterMax) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.Application.RunLoop (Boolean Modal, System.Windows.Forms.ApplicationContext context) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.Application.Run (System.Windows.Forms.ApplicationContext context) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.Application.Run (System.Windows.Forms.Form mainForm) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Win.Program.RunApplication () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Win.Program.Main () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
[ERROR] FATAL UNHANDLED EXCEPTION: System.ComponentModel.Win32Exception: ApplicationName='/usr/bin/bfgminer', CommandLine='--load-balance --scan noauto --quota "99;stratum+tcp://tek.dsync.net:6666" -u xxxxxx -p x -S bitforce_queue:/dev/ttyUSB0 -d bitforce_queue@/dev/ttyUSB0 -S bitforce_queue:/dev/ttyUSB1 -d bitforce_queue@/dev/ttyUSB1 --api-listen --api-port 4028 --api-allow W:127.0.0.1, -T -q', CurrentDirectory=''
  at System.Diagnostics.Process.Start_noshell (System.Diagnostics.ProcessStartInfo startInfo, System.Diagnostics.Process process) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Diagnostics.Process.Start_common (System.Diagnostics.ProcessStartInfo startInfo, System.Diagnostics.Process process) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Diagnostics.Process.Start () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at (wrapper remoting-invoke-with-check) System.Diagnostics.Process:Start ()
  at MultiMiner.Xgminer.Miner.StartProcessAndCheckResponse (System.Diagnostics.ProcessStartInfo startInfo, Boolean startProcess) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Xgminer.Miner.StartMinerProcess (System.String arguments, Boolean redirectOutput, Boolean ensureProcessStarts, System.String reason, Boolean startProcess) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Xgminer.Miner.Launch (System.String reason) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Engine.MiningEngine.LaunchMinerProcess (MultiMiner.Xgminer.MinerConfiguration minerConfiguration, System.String reason) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Engine.MiningEngine.StartMining () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Engine.MiningEngine.RestartMining () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Engine.MiningEngine.ApplyMiningStrategy (System.Collections.Generic.List`1 coinInformation) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Win.MainForm.CheckAndApplyMiningStrategy () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Win.MainForm.coinStatsTimer_Tick (System.Object sender, System.EventArgs e) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.Timer.OnTick (System.EventArgs e) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.Timer.FireTick () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at (wrapper remoting-invoke-with-check) System.Windows.Forms.Timer:FireTick ()
  at System.Windows.Forms.XplatUIX11.CheckTimers (System.Collections.ArrayList timers, DateTime now) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.XplatUIX11.UpdateMessageQueue (System.Windows.Forms.XEventQueue queue, Boolean allowIdle) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.XplatUIX11.UpdateMessageQueue (System.Windows.Forms.XEventQueue queue) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.XplatUIX11.GetMessage (System.Object queue_id, System.Windows.Forms.MSG& msg, IntPtr handle, Int32 wFilterMin, Int32 wFilterMax) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.XplatUI.GetMessage (System.Object queue_id, System.Windows.Forms.MSG& msg, IntPtr hWnd, Int32 wFilterMin, Int32 wFilterMax) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.Application.RunLoop (Boolean Modal, System.Windows.Forms.ApplicationContext context) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.Application.Run (System.Windows.Forms.ApplicationContext context) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at System.Windows.Forms.Application.Run (System.Windows.Forms.Form mainForm) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Win.Program.RunApplication () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0
  at MultiMiner.Win.Program.Main () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

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January 03, 2014, 06:16:20 PM
 #1296

Also, what's getting annoying is that "Coin configuration enable" option gets unchecked for some coins, so the miner never connects to those pools. I don't know if it's an error the program has or it is a feature.

This happens if you have Auto-mining enabled under Strategies and all pools for a coin go down. The coin is disabled so that MultiMiner continues mining other coins. I'd recommend adding more pools to each coin configuration if this is happening frequently so that they fail over.

MultiMiner: Any Miner, Any Where, on Any Device |  Xgminer: Mine with popular miners on Mac OS X
btc: 1BmXY4ZZQh1iHSVre658gM1gPAEtDnq8rv  |  ltc: LP1SsHZTDexndkvRKsqAkXNsienPHwaMb5  |  hardware: nwoolls at gmail dot com
boniggy
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January 03, 2014, 07:32:35 PM
Last edit: January 03, 2014, 09:13:13 PM by boniggy
 #1297

Great piece of software... love it!

I just upgraded to 2.3.2 and its now BSOD'ing the Win7 64bit system when i hit STOP after mining for a few mins. Not sure whats up and it seems im having lower than normal hashrates. I run 4x R9 290's.

Thanks for the awesome app.

UPDATE:
I have another rig running 2x MSI 7870's and its working fine when i hit STOP. They are practically the same system other than the GPU's running.

UPDATE2:
Downgraded back to 2.2.8 and it is not allowing me to STOP the mining.

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January 03, 2014, 08:04:57 PM
 #1298

I just upgraded to 2.3.2 and its now BSOD'ing the Win7 64bit system when i hit STOP after mining for a few mins. Not sure whats up and it seems im having lower than normal hashrates. I run 4x R9 290's.

UPDATE:
I have another rig running 2x MSI 7870's and its working fine when i hit STOP. They are practically the same system other than the GPU's running.

Hi there. Scroll up for details on this. If you would like official R9 support in bfgminer and MultiMiner, please consider either donating to the addresses linked above or sending me an R9 for a week or so (I can mine to your pools).

Right now both cgminer and bfgminer will BSOD with R9s when you stop mining. The only reason this didn't happen in 2.2.8 is because I wasn't giving bfgminer enough time to quit on its own before terminating it. However, this leaves USB devices in-use.

I'm all for fixing this within bfgminer so that it is no longer a problem, but don't have any hardware to reproduce the issue currently.

MultiMiner: Any Miner, Any Where, on Any Device |  Xgminer: Mine with popular miners on Mac OS X
btc: 1BmXY4ZZQh1iHSVre658gM1gPAEtDnq8rv  |  ltc: LP1SsHZTDexndkvRKsqAkXNsienPHwaMb5  |  hardware: nwoolls at gmail dot com
boniggy
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January 03, 2014, 09:25:22 PM
 #1299

yeah sorry read all the latest posts but that one. Wish i could send you one but just cant... need to make ROI... they be spendy little buggers.

I'll try to kick you some BTC soon tho... I love this software and would love to upgrade.

FYI:
I actually did some research on why BFGMiner would crash on me when running as standalone and someone mentioned basically what you posted up top. However, someone said that it would stop BSOD'ing their comp if they clicked the "X" instead of Q or CTRL-C.... so not sure if you could just put in the code that kills the process instead of sending Q or CTRL-C to it.

Either way man.. ill keep using 2.2.8 and continue to donate. I'll actually up my donate amount from 1% to 5% for a while... will that help with the R9 research?

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January 03, 2014, 09:31:49 PM
 #1300

FYI:
I actually did some research on why BFGMiner would crash on me when running as standalone and someone mentioned basically what you posted up top. However, someone said that it would stop BSOD'ing their comp if they clicked the "X" instead of Q or CTRL-C.... so not sure if you could just put in the code that kills the process instead of sending Q or CTRL-C to it.

That's what 2.2.8 was doing - terminating bfgminer before it had a chance to properly quit. Unfortunately this causes issues with leaving ASIC USB miners in-use. So I would like to properly fix this rather than reverting to "improperly" terminating the miner process.

Either way man.. ill keep using 2.2.8 and continue to donate. I'll actually up my donate amount from 1% to 5% for a while... will that help with the R9 research?

I appreciate it - every little bit helps. Right now the donations unfortunately aren't paying for new hardware at this point. They are basically a slow trickle. That's why I opened up the R9 donation addresses for those interested.

MultiMiner: Any Miner, Any Where, on Any Device |  Xgminer: Mine with popular miners on Mac OS X
btc: 1BmXY4ZZQh1iHSVre658gM1gPAEtDnq8rv  |  ltc: LP1SsHZTDexndkvRKsqAkXNsienPHwaMb5  |  hardware: nwoolls at gmail dot com
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