Official Thread: AMT

[AMT_miners]

[NotFuzzyWarm]

opieum2:
Luckily I got in late to the BTC scene. Saw BFL's10G Jala's on Tigerdirthere ect in-stock of course) in early Feb. and said what the hell. Got me hooked. Since BFL has their own very fine Forum - I saw the Monarch Saga and stayed away since it was a Not There Yet product.

Ordered the A1 chip 520 (now maybe a 600?) on Feb. 27 only after seeing the A1 chip advertised from several miner makers. Figured must be in production so...

[AMT_miners]

For everyone who doesn't know, the courts DO care. You can get a TRO against these guys, prevent them from using YOUR bitcoin until they go to court. I bet you would get results real quickly on that refund...

http://www.deanlyons.com/PDFs/2014-03-27-Temporary-Restraning-Order.pdf


That's hashfast, getting in a lot of trouble for failing to ship on time.

Right, except that we don't hold bitcoin, that most CM's and parts companies like digi, mouser, etc accept USD not BTC.

But yea, get a restraining order from a company that you're contacting every other day, that's brilliant.

[NotFuzzyWarm]

Please don't post my details here, just send me an email update, I choose what to post here, thanks.

Or, perhaps just update the order status on our AMT Account page maybe?

[NaranKPatel]

A client which sympathizes with our situation on this thread made some high def photos of his 1.2Th, we thank for his help.

Guys,
Just wondering does the whole unit shutdown on overheat, before things burn out, just thinking of single fan on top if it fails what happens? I hate for it to become a really expensive brick?

[AMT_miners]

Please don't post my details here, just send me an email update, I choose what to post here, thanks.

Or, perhaps just update the order status on our AMT Account page maybe?

We might be able to do that.

[RickJamesBTC]

For everyone who doesn't know, the courts DO care. You can get a TRO against these guys, prevent them from using YOUR bitcoin until they go to court. I bet you would get results real quickly on that refund...

http://www.deanlyons.com/PDFs/2014-03-27-Temporary-Restraning-Order.pdf


That's hashfast, getting in a lot of trouble for failing to ship on time.

Right, except that we don't hold bitcoin, that most CM's and parts companies like digi, mouser, etc accept USD not BTC.

But yea, get a restraining order from a company that you're contacting every other day, that's brilliant.

You must not understand how a restraining order works. That one enjoined hashfast from using bitcoin. One for you would probably involve your bank accounts. From the posts in this thread, I would be led to believe that you don't actually let anyone contact you, as you don't seem to answer phones, emails, etc.

[AMT_miners]

A client which sympathizes with our situation on this thread made some high def photos of his 1.2Th, we thank for his help.

Guys,
Just wondering does the whole unit shutdown on overheat, before things burn out, just thinking of single fan on top if it fails what happens? I hate for it to become a really expensive brick?

The chip itself has an overheat threshold which is around 130's C. If the chip shuts down, the chain breaks cause the whole the unit to basically shut down from a hashing perspective. If you're using putty, you'll see an error message similar to CMD_READ_REG ERROR. If you see this, unplug it, wait 30 minutes restart it via putty and do the following:

root
amt
killall cgminer
cgminer -DT

And check to see if the cores in each chip are ok.

Also there are two 4-5 fans in this case. There are two 140's under the cage blow air up through the fins. The 200mm exhaust on top and the 120mm x 1 or 2 in the front of the case blowing air in.

[cobra89y]

So amt I understand u get a lot of negative feedback on this forum, and I believe it is justified. People keep asking for transparency so why not entertain them a little better. So far all I have read seems to be that you are behind based on a limited production staff/ facilities. Are you making any attempts to correct this issue minus asking the community to come assemble for you? Hire a production manager maybe? Use six sigma principles to cost cut/ increase production? I understand frm your previous post your not breaking even or just barely. Maybe this could help?

[RickJamesBTC]

ROFL. anyone else notice that AMT messed with the text of the link I provided in my quotes, to break it for you?


http://www.deanslyons.com/PDFs/2014-03-27-Temporary-Restraining-Order.pdf

There it is again.

[Biomech]

I don't know if worldwide difficulty would go up just because of AMT 1Th/s miners, but now it seems many manufactures are now releasing 1Th/s miners which would add up.  I am also not going to be referencing other miners. Even if difficulty was slightly higher, it would still be lost income. It's not that simple to discuss, so I will keep it at that. heh.

Understood. I don't think your argument is invalid in a general sense, I just can't see it flying in court due to the variable nature of bitcoin and the fact that the network is not static. In fact, it seems to be on another spike right now, with a whole bunch of vendors using Innnosilicon's version of the very same chip that AMT is using. Except you can actually get a dragon miner.

Biomech, what happened..

From where I sit, you very badly mismanaged your business. While you did good for me, personally, it seems that you left a lot of people hanging in the wind. Your story kept changing as time went by, and frankly, some of those hanging in the wind are friends of mine.

You asked me to be objective. That's always a difficult thing to do, and moreso when somebody gives you something nice for free. I've tried to walk the line, but it's very difficult to not be angry. I feel like you used my reputation, such as it is, to generate sales that you either didn't intend to deliver on, or were so hopelessly delayed on that you couldn't.

The last two days of revelations at least make me breathe a little easier, as I was beginning to think you didn't even have a terrahash mining unit being built. During the "silent" time, I called you seven times and always got an answering machine. I suspended judgement for some time, because you had done me well.

As for the discussion of law, it's a hobby. I'd play devil's advocate at my own trial for my own immortal soul, if I believed in such things.

That's the general "what happened" from my side. What else happened, just a few days ago, is something you better be ready for in your new rigs. One of my boards overheated and blew some caps. Martin says it's almost certainly because of the restrictive case and smaller heatsink you used. And indeed, the other one has improved its performance quite a bit by being in the open air. If you're restricting your airflow as much as those cases look like in the pics, you're going to be getting a LOT of RMA's if you get your assembly sorted and the majority of your orders shipped. The other board is running like a champ.

In the beginning fo this debacle I defended you, and I meant it. During my conversations here and on the phone with Jim, I advised you to hire a full time customer service rep. You agreed this was a good idea. I also advised you to speak openly to the community if you were going to be delayed in any way, which you also agreed on. Had you done these two, simple, cheap things, you wouldn't be facing the shit storm you are now.

[AMT_miners]

For everyone who doesn't know, the courts DO care. You can get a TRO against these guys, prevent them from using YOUR bitcoin until they go to court. I bet you would get results real quickly on that refund...

http://www.deanslyons.com/PDFs/2014-03-27-Temporary-Restraining-Order.pdf


That's hashfast, getting in a lot of trouble for failing to ship on time.

Right, except that we don't hold bitcoin, that most CM's and parts companies like digi, mouser, etc accept USD not BTC.

But yea, get a restraining order from a company that you're contacting every other day, that's brilliant.

You must not understand how a restraining order works. That one enjoined hashfast from using bitcoin. One for you would probably involve your bank accounts. From the posts in this thread, I would be led to believe that you don't actually let anyone contact you, as you don't seem to answer phones, emails, etc.

So wait.. While a hurdle of clients were asking Hashfast for refunds, most of which had paid in BTC, suddenly got a restraining order from using BTC - essentially not allowing them to pay people back?

Well that was smart. And your advising users here that paid via BTC to do the same to us in order to a get refund.

[regtable69]

ROFL. anyone else notice that AMT messed with the text of the link I provided in my quotes, to break it for you?


http://www.deanslyons.com/PDFs/2014-03-27-Temporary-Restraining-Order.pdf

There it is again.

or had you put it wrong so they quoted your typo and then you changed it. coins have 2 sides and thats another posibility. not saying they didnt or did change it or you did or didnt edit after quote but both are possible

[RickJamesBTC]

For everyone who doesn't know, the courts DO care. You can get a TRO against these guys, prevent them from using YOUR bitcoin until they go to court. I bet you would get results real quickly on that refund...




That's hashfast, getting in a lot of trouble for failing to ship on time.

Right, except that we don't hold bitcoin, that most CM's and parts companies like digi, mouser, etc accept USD not BTC.

But yea, get a restraining order from a company that you're contacting every other day, that's brilliant.

You must not understand how a restraining order works. That one enjoined hashfast from using bitcoin. One for you would probably involve your bank accounts. From the posts in this thread, I would be led to believe that you don't actually let anyone contact you, as you don't seem to answer phones, emails, etc.

So wait.. While a hurdle of clients were asking Hashfast for refunds, most of which had paid in BTC, suddenly got a restraining order from using BTC - essentially not allowing them to pay people back?

Well that was smart. And your advising users here that paid via BTC to do the same to us in order to a get refund.

Yes, because for two weeks Hashfast is legally prevented from using or hiding those bitcoins, and failure to obey the TRO will lead to them going to jail. Until they show up in court to defend the way they treat their customers, much of which is the same with how you treat your customers, they don't get to run off with the money / property.

[RickJamesBTC]

ROFL. anyone else notice that AMT messed with the text of the link I provided in my quotes, to break it for you?


http://www.deanslyons.com/PDFs/2014-03-27-Temporary-Restraining-Order.pdf

There it is again.

or had you put it wrong so they quoted your typo and then you changed it. coins have 2 sides and thats another posibility. not saying they didnt or did change it or you did or didnt edit after quote but both are possible

Nope, are you really trying to claim that I'd have some reason to typo a cut and paste?  Give me a break.

[NotFuzzyWarm]

So amt I understand u get a lot of negative feedback on this forum, and I believe it is justified. People keep asking for transparency so why not entertain them a little better. So far all I have read seems to be that you are behind based on a limited production staff/ facilities. Are you making any attempts to correct this issue minus asking the community to come assemble for you? Hire a production manager maybe? Use six sigma principles to cost cut/ increase production? I understand frm your previous post your not breaking even or just barely. Maybe this could help?

6-sigma would apply to the chip/board makers, possibly to the CM's as well but is pretty useless for a AMT's small(ish) operation. I take it AMT is pretty much physical assembly of core parts into systems. Going through ISO-9000 on the other hand... Great for putting the business practices in order!

[opieum2]

AMT has been posting a fair bit of info. And they said 12 days roughly now. Considering bitmine has been late also, this might be part of it too, but AMT might want to confirm that as well. They cant exactly talk about every aspect of their business either, there are trade secrets to be kept for any business. That said SOME transparency in operation is possible. But again there is alot of anger right now that needs to be handled first. Getting miners in peoples hands I think is something they are working at. I never really saw any complaints about their 80-128Ghs orders which appear to be in peoples hands. They had the hardware.

So for the 1.2Ths ones It would make logical sense that this would also be related to the bitmine issues as well as well as some of the other supply issues they are having? AMT can you confirm that? This is what I am piecing together from the various things that I have been reading. PSU shortage certainly can screw things up. Case supply shortage can as well.

This is all just speculation on my part of course. AMT can confirm that or it could be something else altogether. But at least if we know it might be for (some) more understandable. I am sticking around to get my miners. I figure Ive waited longer for BFL and likely will see this before I will see their hardware at this point. I put my order in just over a month ago with AMT so I am not hurting too badly in that sense. I do feel for those who have been waiting alot longer and were promised sooner. But it is unfortunately how preorders work sadly. BFL I ordered in mid November and each month its a new thing about why they haven't shipped. AMT at least seems to have some out in the wild now. That's a hell of alot better than none at this point. My position isn't popular but it's the truth at this point.

Just stop sucking up, apparently if you want your miner, you have to go down there. Otherwise they stopped offering discounts for positive reinforcement months ago.

LMAO yea thats the thing. I am going there anyway. I am one of the pick up customers that was my choice. Honestly I know their side of it because I have had to run a business myself (I've run a few in fact). I sold them a long time ago, but I get the growing pains of raising the capital needed. And while I didn't go through their specific pains here, there were pains to be felt. Overdemanding clients who expected one button miracles and jobs that normally took 3 months for a full firm to be done in 3 days. I'm not saying there are people here who are like that (there very well could be and there seems like there are). It is the bane of every business existence. I worked customer service as well early in my carreer. So yea I totally get the pains they are dealing with keenly as I worked for a large company whose product sucked at the time (Hint:They made Windows ME which I had to support)

AMT does have a point tho coming at you asking if you have an order with them. I am not "sucking up" I am seeing what it is. The whole point is they are trying to run a business and make it work. Problem is you got people who got no stake in this coming in and chiming in like they have some say. Bottom line if you like to shop at Walmart shop at Walmart don't trash Target because you like Walmart. There are people here with legitimate gripes. Who want refunds and have been waiting. Those are really the only people who deserve answers and likely will get them through proper channels. At least from some confirmation from Phin we know they are struggling with help. It does happen in any startup. Well not all but in the beginning its always a thing. I worked for one of the largest companies in its startup days and saw it grow into an enterprise. And believe me that growth was not without alot of pain and sacrifice. These guys could fold up shop after this just on the fact that this business is such a pain....OR keep going and establish themselves as a major player. But you are not part of that as a business partner OR a client. Whatever their issues here now they are in a sink or swim mode. How they come out of this is what will make them either stronger or dead as a company. And being that they are a C corp (as they said earlier), they all got a stake in this so they are going to be busting their ass to make it work.

BUT to avoid the whole sucking up thing I meant what I said earlier in that I am neutral (objective would be better I think) in all this. I gave the advice to those who are going the legal route to basically take it off this forum. Its beyond retarded to go talking legal stuff on a public forum and giving away your strategy (that alone is a huge help for those with legal gripes). That for the most part seems to have stopped. At the same time they are giving up info and so are other people. But noone believes anyone who comes on here with new info. Shit I got called a shill after my first post! It took some time but I think I have proven I am not a plant or something of the sort. Or a fanboy. But I do like to think I am a voice of reason and if the truth is staring me in the face I will deal with it. Its gotten me pretty far in life as a result. I got money in this so its in my best interest to make sure that they succeed right now. Seeing them go out of business before I have gotten my product would suck. But honestly? it would be nice to see an American company actually succeed right now because we are getting our asses handed to us by the Chinese in the bitcoin hardware market. It could well play out like that anyway, but it would be nice to see it say MADE IN USA vs made in china.

Bottom line you got nothing in this so yea in effect you are just trolling. Those who got something in this, you got a reason to complain. But complain right if you are going to complain. There is a way to do it without being an ass about it. NOONE likes to be treated like crap. Now if they are on the offensive consider whats happened to lead to that. This thread is over 200 pages of mostly people ragging on AMT. Noone wants to wade in that. And yet here they are trying to answer some questions and at least put a stop to some of the crap. Getting Phin out to the office clearly was an effort to help slow things down here. Again people doubted and called him a sellout. And yet he did BUY his miner and is selling it. Thats his prerogative since its his money he paid with. There are people whose pain I get. I feel for them I am dealing with the BFL debacle which is very similar to what they are dealing with. Seems like they are close to getting miners out. So lets see where this goes. They even asked for help to get the process moving. Again if they are serious they will take up the offers they got on the table.

The points made about them being more transparent and communicating tho are also valid. But looks like they are turning the corner on that and now are more communicative.

[NaranKPatel]

A client which sympathizes with our situation on this thread made some high def photos of his 1.2Th, we thank for his help.

Guys,
Just wondering does the whole unit shutdown on overheat, before things burn out, just thinking of single fan on top if it fails what happens? I hate for it to become a really expensive brick?

The chip itself has an overheat threshold which is around 130's C. If the chip shuts down, the chain breaks cause the whole the unit to basically shut down from a hashing perspective. If you're using putty, you'll see an error message similar to CMD_READ_REG ERROR. If you see this, unplug it, wait 30 minutes restart it via putty and do the following:

root
amt
killall cgminer
cgminer -DT

And check to see if the cores in each chip are ok.

Also there are two 4-5 fans in this case. There are two 140's under the cage blow air up through the fins. The 200mm exhaust on top and the 120mm x 1 or 2 in the front of the case blowing air in.

Perfect, I can use the top 200mm for exhausting and connecting ducting and funneling, i.e. from cold intake surroundings, thanks for following some of my earlier advice...

I've worked on unix/linux for 20 years, I think I can manage to restart cgminer, thanks for steps though anyway...sometimes cgminer bombs out, sometimes it just hangs..but if you really want to be smart, you'd stick in an auto-restart if conditions allow. Some buzzer or alerting for fan failures wouldn't go amiss either.

if you do have s/w fixes or workarounds are you going to place those in client/customer area for d/l and updating the s/w on the pi?

[AMT_miners]

For everyone who doesn't know, the courts DO care. You can get a TRO against these guys, prevent them from using YOUR bitcoin until they go to court. I bet you would get results real quickly on that refund...




That's hashfast, getting in a lot of trouble for failing to ship on time.

Right, except that we don't hold bitcoin, that most CM's and parts companies like digi, mouser, etc accept USD not BTC.

But yea, get a restraining order from a company that you're contacting every other day, that's brilliant.

You must not understand how a restraining order works. That one enjoined hashfast from using bitcoin. One for you would probably involve your bank accounts. From the posts in this thread, I would be led to believe that you don't actually let anyone contact you, as you don't seem to answer phones, emails, etc.

So wait.. While a hurdle of clients were asking Hashfast for refunds, most of which had paid in BTC, suddenly got a restraining order from using BTC - essentially not allowing them to pay people back?

Well that was smart. And your advising users here that paid via BTC to do the same to us in order to a get refund.

Yes, because for two weeks Hashfast is legally prevented from using or hiding those bitcoins, and failure to obey the TRO will lead to them going to jail. Until they show up in court to defend the way they treat their customers, much of which is the same with how you treat your customers, they don't get to run off with the money / property.

And when they could have refunded easier when the rate was higher now people will get their coins back when the rate is lower?

Either way, it was stupid. Now preventing us from accessing our bank accounts that's a bit smarter right. But via BTC sounds like a setup to not pay BTC buyers back, which is less troublesome than dealing with clients which paid in USD.

Sounds fishy.. was there any real court ordered documented verification of this other than an press article?

[NaranKPatel]

AMT has been posting a fair bit of info. And they said 12 days roughly now. Considering bitmine has been late also, this might be part of it too, but AMT might want to confirm that as well. They cant exactly talk about every aspect of their business either, there are trade secrets to be kept for any business. That said SOME transparency in operation is possible. But again there is alot of anger right now that needs to be handled first. Getting miners in peoples hands I think is something they are working at. I never really saw any complaints about their 80-128Ghs orders which appear to be in peoples hands. They had the hardware.

So for the 1.2Ths ones It would make logical sense that this would also be related to the bitmine issues as well as well as some of the other supply issues they are having? AMT can you confirm that? This is what I am piecing together from the various things that I have been reading. PSU shortage certainly can screw things up. Case supply shortage can as well.

This is all just speculation on my part of course. AMT can confirm that or it could be something else altogether. But at least if we know it might be for (some) more understandable. I am sticking around to get my miners. I figure Ive waited longer for BFL and likely will see this before I will see their hardware at this point. I put my order in just over a month ago with AMT so I am not hurting too badly in that sense. I do feel for those who have been waiting alot longer and were promised sooner. But it is unfortunately how preorders work sadly. BFL I ordered in mid November and each month its a new thing about why they haven't shipped. AMT at least seems to have some out in the wild now. That's a hell of alot better than none at this point. My position isn't popular but it's the truth at this point.

Just stop sucking up, apparently if you want your miner, you have to go down there. Otherwise they stopped offering discounts for positive reinforcement months ago.

LMAO yea thats the thing. I am going there anyway. I am one of the pick up customers that was my choice. Honestly I know their side of it because I have had to run a business myself (I've run a few in fact). I sold them a long time ago, but I get the growing pains of raising the capital needed. And while I didn't go through their specific pains here, there were pains to be felt. Overdemanding clients who expected one button miracles and jobs that normally took 3 months for a full firm to be done in 3 days. I'm not saying there are people here who are like that (there very well could be and there seems like there are). It is the bane of every business existence. I worked customer service as well early in my carreer. So yea I totally get the pains they are dealing with keenly as I worked for a large company whose product sucked at the time (Hint:They made Windows ME which I had to support)

AMT does have a point tho coming at you asking if you have an order with them. I am not "sucking up" I am seeing what it is. The whole point is they are trying to run a business and make it work. Problem is you got people who got no stake in this coming in and chiming in like they have some say. Bottom line if you like to shop at Walmart shop at Walmart don't trash Target because you like Walmart. There are people here with legitimate gripes. Who want refunds and have been waiting. Those are really the only people who deserve answers and likely will get them through proper channels. At least from some confirmation from Phin we know they are struggling with help. It does happen in any startup. Well not all but in the beginning its always a thing. I worked for one of the largest companies in its startup days and saw it grow into an enterprise. And believe me that growth was not without alot of pain and sacrifice. These guys could fold up shop after this just on the fact that this business is such a pain....OR keep going and establish themselves as a major player. But you are not part of that as a business partner OR a client. Whatever their issues here now they are in a sink or swim mode. How they come out of this is what will make them either stronger or dead as a company. And being that they are a C corp (as they said earlier), they all got a stake in this so they are going to be busting their ass to make it work.

BUT to avoid the whole sucking up thing I meant what I said earlier in that I am neutral (objective would be better I think) in all this. I gave the advice to those who are going the legal route to basically take it off this forum. Its beyond retarded to go talking legal stuff on a public forum and giving away your strategy (that alone is a huge help for those with legal gripes). That for the most part seems to have stopped. At the same time they are giving up info and so are other people. But noone believes anyone who comes on here with new info. Shit I got called a shill after my first post! It took some time but I think I have proven I am not a plant or something of the sort. Or a fanboy. But I do like to think I am a voice of reason and if the truth is staring me in the face I will deal with it. Its gotten me pretty far in life as a result. I got money in this so its in my best interest to make sure that they succeed right now. Seeing them go out of business before I have gotten my product would suck. But honestly? it would be nice to see an American company actually succeed right now because we are getting our asses handed to us by the Chinese in the bitcoin hardware market. It could well play out like that anyway, but it would be nice to see it say MADE IN USA vs made in china.

Bottom line you got nothing in this so yea in effect you are just trolling. Those who got something in this, you got a reason to complain. But complain right if you are going to complain. There is a way to do it without being an ass about it. NOONE likes to be treated like crap. Now if they are on the offensive consider whats happened to lead to that. This thread is over 200 pages of mostly people ragging on AMT. Noone wants to wade in that. And yet here they are trying to answer some questions and at least put a stop to some of the crap. Getting Phin out to the office clearly was an effort to help slow things down here. Again people doubted and called him a sellout. And yet he did BUY his miner and is selling it. Thats his prerogative since its his money he paid with. There are people whose pain I get. I feel for them I am dealing with the BFL debacle which is very similar to what they are dealing with. Seems like they are close to getting miners out. So lets see where this goes. They even asked for help to get the process moving. Again if they are serious they will take up the offers they got on the table.

The points made about them being more transparent and communicating tho are also valid. But looks like they are turning the corner on that and now are more communicative.

+1