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Question: Will you support Gavin's new block size limit hard fork of 8MB by January 1, 2016 then doubling every 2 years?
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Author Topic: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP.  (Read 2009000 times)
Meuh6879
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August 03, 2015, 04:07:59 PM
 #29701

Mark Karpeles retells the Mt. Gox story!
http://youtu.be/JCR3722ACTI?a  

that's even funny! how does he do that


like this : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EscuOuXx3JM
alternate : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YmHbYG7TGp4
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cypherdoc
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August 03, 2015, 04:09:02 PM
 #29702

remember this one?  how could you not?  i just showed this to you last Friday.  and many times before:

cypherdoc
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August 03, 2015, 04:09:38 PM
 #29703

You guys/girls hold gold/silver as well as BTC?

not me. 
cypherdoc
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August 03, 2015, 04:39:18 PM
 #29704

here's the formalization of the stupidity behind TBI's inflation proposal last Friday:

https://medium.com/@twobitidiot/the-21mm-btc-soft-cap-71e14cd09946?source=tw-dd6a8357807c-1438618892173

but he does bring up a VERY good point that directly undermines the Cripplecoiner's case:

Now I know that centralization will decrease over time. Current holders will get diluted by a third as the remaining seven million bitcoins are mined. And as bitcoin appreciates in value, early investors will likely reduce their positions and lock in gains. So even those who could temporarily tank the market with large sell orders (intentionally or otherwise, read: Bearwhale) will probably be held at bay, and their power to truly manipulate market pricing is limited. (Wealth concentration isn’t really a risk to new long-term investors, but it does ensure that it will be take many, many years and probably several unmitigated wipeouts of derivatives markets before a healthy infrastructure can emerge.)

It seems a bit perverse that 100 private capitalists could reap enormous gains in the event that the currency become a developing economy reserve, but there’s nothing unique or inherently wrong about that dynamic. Without speculators, bitcoin won’t hit the critical market cap and liquidity it needs to emerge as a truly viable reserve. So again, the wealth concentration issue is just the weak argument for adding low inflation to bitcoin (to gradually dilute down the largest holders). It’s not an industry killer, but the optics probably suck enough to significantly constrain growth.


if we keep Cripplecoin as is and attempt to make it a "settlement layer" with only 100 or so private capitalists as owners, what is the likelihood that the other 6 billion users worldwide will come on board with this new system?  answer: they won't. it will be an even worse system of wealth concentration than we have today.  and with the attitudes displayed by the most vocal advocates of Cripplecoin advocates (both technical and non technical) in this thread and elsewhere, are these really the new economic masters you want to bow down to?  i say, "hell no".
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August 03, 2015, 04:48:37 PM
 #29705

this can't be good:

Jdj1727
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August 03, 2015, 04:50:40 PM
 #29706

this can't be good:



Does NOT look promising. BTC on the other hand, is starting to build some nice momentum.
cypherdoc
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August 03, 2015, 04:52:02 PM
 #29707

exactly what inflation are you talking about?  oil, food, miners, commodities all going DOWN.  all i hear is that great sucking sound and sweet smell of Deflation:

cypherdoc
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August 03, 2015, 04:55:55 PM
 #29708

growth?  what f*cking growth?:





bad news for gold and silver.  the top 2 miners:



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August 03, 2015, 05:06:27 PM
 #29709

here's the formalization of the stupidity behind TBI's inflation proposal last Friday:

https://medium.com/@twobitidiot/the-21mm-btc-soft-cap-71e14cd09946?source=tw-dd6a8357807c-1438618892173

but he does bring up a VERY good point that directly undermines the Cripplecoiner's case:

Now I know that centralization will decrease over time. Current holders will get diluted by a third as the remaining seven million bitcoins are mined. And as bitcoin appreciates in value, early investors will likely reduce their positions and lock in gains. So even those who could temporarily tank the market with large sell orders (intentionally or otherwise, read: Bearwhale) will probably be held at bay, and their power to truly manipulate market pricing is limited. (Wealth concentration isn’t really a risk to new long-term investors, but it does ensure that it will be take many, many years and probably several unmitigated wipeouts of derivatives markets before a healthy infrastructure can emerge.)

It seems a bit perverse that 100 private capitalists could reap enormous gains in the event that the currency become a developing economy reserve, but there’s nothing unique or inherently wrong about that dynamic. Without speculators, bitcoin won’t hit the critical market cap and liquidity it needs to emerge as a truly viable reserve. So again, the wealth concentration issue is just the weak argument for adding low inflation to bitcoin (to gradually dilute down the largest holders). It’s not an industry killer, but the optics probably suck enough to significantly constrain growth.


if we keep Cripplecoin as is and attempt to make it a "settlement layer" with only 100 or so private capitalists as owners, what is the likelihood that the other 6 billion users worldwide will come on board with this new system?  answer: they won't. it will be an even worse system of wealth concentration than we have today.  and with the attitudes displayed by the most vocal advocates of Cripplecoin advocates (both technical and non technical) in this thread and elsewhere, are these really the new economic masters you want to bow down to?  i say, "hell no".

another quote from the blog:

One of the primary untested assumptions confronting the industry is that this anticipated fee-based mining incentive can work at scale. At best, that will mean that we probably end up with a network that is more expensive than existing card networks and money transfer options. At worst, that will mean that the network is constantly threatened by double spending attacks, undermining confidence in the entire bitcoin technology stack that is being built out today.

bold part mine.  Bitcoin won't get more expensive, fee-wise, if we bring on many, many more tx's onto the MAINchain that will help spread the costs and provide enough profit for mining to expand and grow.  this is why i'm so against all these offchain solutions that have been presented like SC's and LN.  furthermore, this isn't novel thinking; it was ALWAYS in the original Satoshi vision that these Cripplecoiner's are so quick to dismiss and trash. 
inca
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August 03, 2015, 05:24:07 PM
 #29710

Do any of you have any links to a side chain white paper or proposal for bitcoin? I am keen to read the technicals in a bit more detail.

Thanks..

or is this it: https://blockstream.com/sidechains.pdf
cypherdoc
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August 03, 2015, 05:28:40 PM
 #29711

Do any of you have any links to a side chain white paper or proposal for bitcoin? I am keen to read the technicals in a bit more detail.

Thanks..

or is this it: https://blockstream.com/sidechains.pdf

that's it
Wekkel
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August 03, 2015, 05:43:47 PM
 #29712

Soon, Barrick will be a penny stock if this trend persists.

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cypherdoc
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August 03, 2015, 05:50:56 PM
 #29713

Soon, Barrick will be a penny stock if this trend persists.

and gold will be at $400
cypherdoc
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August 03, 2015, 05:51:51 PM
 #29714

oops, silver starting to crumble:

notme
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August 03, 2015, 05:58:09 PM
 #29715

You guys/girls hold gold/silver as well as BTC?

not me. 

only a few ounces of silver and a couple grams of gold

https://www.bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
While no idea is perfect, some ideas are useful.
12jh3odyAAaR2XedPKZNCR4X4sebuotQzN
inca
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August 03, 2015, 06:02:21 PM
 #29716

It is getting mighty tempting to liquidate my remaining equities and rotate over into pm's and cash.
cypherdoc
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August 03, 2015, 06:02:45 PM
 #29717

You guys/girls hold gold/silver as well as BTC?

not me. 

only a few ounces of silver and a couple grams of gold

i still have my 2 small sleeves of Krugerands.  looks like miscreanity made the right decision not to take those off my hands 4 yrs ago.
Jdj1727
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August 03, 2015, 06:44:34 PM
 #29718

You guys/girls hold gold/silver as well as BTC?

not me. 

only a few ounces of silver and a couple grams of gold

I'm holding a little of each as well.
justusranvier
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August 03, 2015, 07:39:12 PM
 #29719

Bitcoin won't get more expensive, fee-wise, if we bring on many, many more tx's onto the MAINchain that will help spread the costs and provide enough profit for mining to expand and grow.
It just goes to show how insane people are to suggest that Bitcoin transaction processing, with its very high fixed cost, should spread that fixed cost over a smaller number of transactions rather than a larger number of transactions.

I think any business plan that suggested such a strategy would spontaneously combust out of embarrassment before anyone could read it.
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August 03, 2015, 07:49:48 PM
 #29720

justus, all

it seems that awareness of the need to introduce economic incentives for services provided by full nodes are rising among devs community, see this thread on the btc dev mailing list:

http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2015-August/009879.html

let's see how core devs will react to this idea.

Bitcoin is a participatory system which ought to respect the right of self determinism of all of its users - Gregory Maxwell.
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