Official Thread: AMT

[opieum2]

@clenell
Not defending anyone here, but if they are shipping you a miner which was the original intent why not just take it? Least you getting what you paid for. If its a matter of principle, its going to get complicated and more costly if you start getting lawyers involved. Sounds like they are getting their groove on. At the very least you can jump on and show people it works. You would be getting your hardware (better late than never). Sucks you had to go through what you did to get it. But at the end of the day you would have it and now they are also stating they will post a tracking number to show proof it is going to you. Least that way they now hold themselves accountable to their words here. We are all seeing it.

Consider that before acting out of anger and emotion. It won't serve you well in this situation. Not shilling here, just trying to help you see that you are getting the miner you deserve now vs having to go through a legally painful and expensive fight only to wind up getting the same thing and losing more in the process. Its more a logical way of thinking. Not to mention that is usually how it plays out.

[1715169590]

1715169590

[1715169590]

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[clenell]

@clenell
Not defending anyone here, but if they are shipping you a miner which was the original intent why not just take it? Least you getting what you paid for. If its a matter of principle, its going to get complicated and more costly if you start getting lawyers involved. Sounds like they are getting their groove on. At the very least you can jump on and show people it works. You would be getting your hardware (better late than never). Sucks you had to go through what you did to get it. But at the end of the day you would have it and now they are also stating they will post a tracking number to show proof it is going to you. Least that way they now hold themselves accountable to their words here. We are all seeing it.

Consider that before acting out of anger and emotion. It won't serve you well in this situation. Not shilling here, just trying to help you see that you are getting the miner you deserve now vs having to go through a legally painful and expensive fight only to wind up getting the same thing and losing more in the process. Its more a logical way of thinking. Not to mention that is usually how it plays out.

sorry, if AMT has taught me anything it's to not trust a word they say. what part of "they have lied about everything" are you not grasping? wait until you have to deal with these guys personally. you will see what i am talking about. they are con artists plain and simple. tracking number? pfft... whatever. i'll see them in court.

let me ask you a question. do you think i am exaggerating when i say they are lying about everything?

[sirminesalot]

@clenell
Not defending anyone here, but if they are shipping you a miner which was the original intent why not just take it? Least you getting what you paid for. If its a matter of principle, its going to get complicated and more costly if you start getting lawyers involved. Sounds like they are getting their groove on. At the very least you can jump on and show people it works. You would be getting your hardware (better late than never). Sucks you had to go through what you did to get it. But at the end of the day you would have it and now they are also stating they will post a tracking number to show proof it is going to you. Least that way they now hold themselves accountable to their words here. We are all seeing it.

Consider that before acting out of anger and emotion. It won't serve you well in this situation. Not shilling here, just trying to help you see that you are getting the miner you deserve now vs having to go through a legally painful and expensive fight only to wind up getting the same thing and losing more in the process. Its more a logical way of thinking. Not to mention that is usually how it plays out.

He is 100% entitled to a refund, by law. If they choose to not refund him, he shouldn't have to settle for his late miner.

AMT is in the wrong here.

That's that.

[sirminesalot]

Just make sure you get the 20 BTC in escrow before you bother to make the trip down.

I won't go the escrow route, taking him for his word.

you kidding? his word is crap. i know this from experience.

WHERE IS MY REFUND YOU SAID YOU SENT VIA MAIL? WHERE IS THE REFUND YOU SAID YOU WOULD WIRE? YOU LIED TWICE AMT MINERS. YOU HAVE NO CREDIBILITY YOU LYING PIECES OF SHIT.

Craig,

You're refund was sent on 3/11 along with other checks for bills to vendors and what nut. The following week, you notified us that you had not received that refund. Josh responded to you in kind saying that you're miner was ready and could instead ship your miner or if you wish fedex your refund to you. You responded after a few days in a very hostile fashion, accusing us of not actually sending your refund in the first place. We responded with the same question, your miner or a fedexed check, you responded again in a hostile fashion and never actually answered the question. Then, you some how obtained josh's cell phone number and basically blew up his phone with calls from sunday to monday. Josh spoke to you on the phone and explained that the check may have actually gotten lost in the mail and that we offered to fedex you're refund in order to have a tracking number which you can track. You kept the conversation going for quite sometime until eventually Josh got frustrated and hung up.

Then you called over 20 times and left over 20 messages - some quite disturbing by all means when josh blocked your number. At that point you downloaded a spoof app which allows you to disguise your number as any other number and called josh several times from different philadelphia area codes.

At this point josh stopped picking up the phone all together - until you spoof called him from his sisters phone number and said "Is this number important to you josh, you better give me my refund".

At that point we called our laywers. A few hours later they called us back and said that we could sue if we wanted to for corporate harassment and encouraged us to file a police report to get the process in motion. You called back again and josh notified you of this possibility at which point you stopped calling. We have not filed the police report yet.

Craig... You went from begging to purchase our product with a credit card - to finally purchasing our product 6 weeks after your order was created - at which point you became a company cheerleader and praised our name - to literally being associated with our company because of the excess in which you cheered for us and the trolls actually started posting your background info - to quieting down a bit on this thread - to disliking us - and finally ranting and raving like the hired trolls - and now have evolved into a something like a stalker or something bordering that line. While also sending over 57 emails regarding updates.

All of that we could have dealt with, but in the end you really pissed josh off with the weird messages and kind of crossed the line with the whole "is your sisters number important to you" bit but overall you again handled the situation inappropriately.  

Because of you we have changed our refund policy to simply no refunds or refunds on a client to client basis, also we'll be shipping your miner today (hopefully as it wasn't a planned shipment today) and posting the fedex tracking number here on this thread. Unfortunately we're waiting on power supplies later this week so we'll be shipping your miner without a 1200w-1500w supply. We will ship you the supply when they come in. Or feel free to purchase a supply from amazon and you'll have a supply by the time your miner is delivered.

You do realize he was AFTER you guys to get his refund? Way to play the victim in all of this.

So you're NOT going to refund him, instead SEND him a miner that won't be functional until you send him a power supply? This is a joke!

You are obligated by law at this point to refund his money.

You do not get to decide FOR HIM whether he gets his refund or a miner instead.

AMT, you have spent all this time posting about individual customers issues: why not update the whole thread with some usable pictures and proof of the miners? You guys are truly the most pathetic business and customer service I've seen in a LONG time.

[loshia]

They have spent their valuable time to reply to me also
AMT you are doing much better than BFL keep good job going guys
Just make absolutely sure before you ship something it is useless then go ahead and ship to make your customers happy

[Phinnaeus Gage]

Just make sure you get the 20 BTC in escrow before you bother to make the trip down.

I won't go the escrow route, taking him for his word.

you kidding? his word is crap. i know this from experience.

WHERE IS MY REFUND YOU SAID YOU SENT VIA MAIL? WHERE IS THE REFUND YOU SAID YOU WOULD WIRE? YOU LIED TWICE AMT MINERS. YOU HAVE NO CREDIBILITY YOU LYING PIECES OF SHIT.

Here's my take. If bitcoiners were kind enough to order AMT miners sans escrow, I should myself in the same boat and not ask for special treatment. Their word was good enough to order from, thus their same word is good enough pertaining to this bounty.

[opieum2]

@clenell
Not defending anyone here, but if they are shipping you a miner which was the original intent why not just take it? Least you getting what you paid for. If its a matter of principle, its going to get complicated and more costly if you start getting lawyers involved. Sounds like they are getting their groove on. At the very least you can jump on and show people it works. You would be getting your hardware (better late than never). Sucks you had to go through what you did to get it. But at the end of the day you would have it and now they are also stating they will post a tracking number to show proof it is going to you. Least that way they now hold themselves accountable to their words here. We are all seeing it.

Consider that before acting out of anger and emotion. It won't serve you well in this situation. Not shilling here, just trying to help you see that you are getting the miner you deserve now vs having to go through a legally painful and expensive fight only to wind up getting the same thing and losing more in the process. Its more a logical way of thinking. Not to mention that is usually how it plays out.

sorry, if AMT has taught me anything it's to not trust a word they say. what part of "they have lied about everything" are you not grasping? wait until you have to deal with these guys personally. you will see what i am talking about. they are con artists plain and simple. tracking number? pfft... whatever. i'll see them in court.

let me ask you a question. do you think i am exaggerating when i say they are lying about everything?

Oh I get where you are coming from. I know you have been burned bad by this that much is obvious. The point is now they have publicly put themselves on the spot specifically as posting a tracking number and info that holds them to actual account. If they don't come through in any shape or form on the whole order (PSU and all) then you have your smoking gun (legally speaking) This was done now with virtual witnesses. So yea you have a right to your refund of course. I'm just saying have a cooler head about it and think about what it means for you if they fail to live up to their side again. Now you have something that multiple people have seen. They arbitrarily changed their refund terms as well.  From a legal standpoint this actually works. For if they don't deliver, you have your smoking gun which was posted in public. They have already lied more than once. But by their own admission a tracking number. If you get a defective miner which you need to prove (video unboxing to power on to hashing without a break in video) and you can also show malicious retaliation on their part. Again there is more to consider than a point of money here. You could gain more going this route and have it be alot less painless for you. They did state they would send you a miner and later a powersupply (but you can buy your own which is not a bad thing to have spares on hand anyway)

But as you have a lawyer I strongly would recommend you consult with him/her before honestly posting more here. You could seriously be hurting your case with your actions alone. Just trying to help here. I get they have lied to you over and over again.

On the other hand if you keep on going refusing whatever they offer, they can take it as a sign of you being difficult and spin it that way in court (and it is a valid scenario) with documentation including whats in this forum to back it up. Which costs you more in the end. All I am saying is think carefully about how it will impact you. You get what you originally were looking to buy or you get a refund and potentially a harassment lawsuit, they alluded to (which you might get anyway in all this) that you now have to spend said refund on a lawyer to defend you. On the other hand take the miner make some money mining and do something with it (not gonna get into ROI discussions its still possible to make some money if you know what you doing). You also at one point did say you would take that and call it a day and be done with it (refund as well) but neither has happened to this point, so you are in every right to be angry. They have lied to you at every turn. But now they have put themselves in a very specific public accountability situation where we all see the tracking and now can see if you get what they promised this time. This will make or break their credibility on a permanent basis (all said I think its largely broken but since they appear to be making an effort to make it right its a step in the right direction).

This is more about picking your battles. But again. Seriously before even posting here talk to your lawyer. Least you have that right afforded to you now.
You have a right to your refund as well. They said they changed their refund policy because of you. However as of this moment it is still what it was before
http://advancedminers.com/terms-of-sale-consumer/
 "Consumer Refund. AMT will only provide financial refunds if AMT is at fault for noncompliance with these terms and conditions, and any/all future terms and conditions AMT publishes and/or makes notice of."

That said I think this will also apply in the terms.

"Excusable Delay. AMT shall not be liable for any delay or failure to perform due to any cause beyond its control or the control of its suppliers or subcontractors such as, for example, strikes, acts of God, acts of Buyer, Acts of Financial Payment Processing institutions, including freezing/holding of accounts, consumer payments, and interruption of transportation or inability to obtain the necessary labor, materials or facilities. Delivery schedules shall be considered extended by a period of time which AMT deems necessary due to the event circumstances or cause of delay. In the event AMT is unable wholly or partially to perform because of any such cause it may cancel its acceptance of Buyer’s order without liability to Buyer."

For the most part this is a vanilla type agreement that most merchants have. But the consumer can address this in court to their satisfaction. If there were manufacturing delays due to supplier the burden is on them to show that.

Essentially you are being given an out and they are mediating this with you instead of taking it to the cops for corporate harassment (If you really did call his sister's phone that's all they need). If they have been bothered in the ways they are saying then they have a leg to stand on and it could cost you even if you win in one way you lose in another. Sure they may be playing the victim here to some degree they do have the right. But they also do have a legal obligation to do what they said as well. That however does not warrant the retaliation they have gotten in their personal lives.

Doesn't matter if they deserve it or not. Our legal system doesn't permit it. That's the bottom line. Trying to be the voice of reason here. Not siding with AMT or Clenell, just posting the actual scenario that will ensue should he decide to go full bore and stick to his guns without compromise. Also listing the potential outcome should he just accept the terms of mediation (which is basically their offer of the miner) Not calling this an official mediation as its far from it. BUT it shows intent.

[Biffa]

The point is now they have publicly put themselves on the spot specifically as posting a tracking number and info that holds them to actual account. If they don't come through in any shape or form on the whole order (PSU and all) then you have your smoking gun (legally speaking) This was done now with virtual witnesses.

Posting a full tracking number on a public forum would be tantamount to stupidity.

Read back through the thread, I can see why clenell is going off his rocker, everything smacks of delay tactics, if they delay long enough before the final solution, whether it be actually shipping miners they have been farming on, or waiting for parts for because of bad planning, or  just disapearing into the sunset, they just get a few more suckers.

If it was me, I don't know what would be worse, getting a miner this late or them doing a vanishing act.

Here's my take. If bitcoiners were kind enough to order AMT miners sans escrow, I should myself in the same boat and not ask for special treatment. Their word was good enough to order from, thus their same word is good enough pertaining to this bounty.

I get where you are going with this. Nice.

[RickJamesBTC]

Bruno is "hired black pr" ?? ROFL  you amt hacks are a bunch of morons. This is why paranoid losers should never start a business. Screw the customers, blame them for your failures. ha.

Bruno, (if that is your real name rofl) head over there, get your 20 btc. You'll get to see just how BS the whole operation is.

[mdiggy]

@Bruno
Are you headed out there? On a flight? Please send pics!!

[Phinnaeus Gage]

The point is now they have publicly put themselves on the spot specifically as posting a tracking number and info that holds them to actual account. If they don't come through in any shape or form on the whole order (PSU and all) then you have your smoking gun (legally speaking) This was done now with virtual witnesses.

Posting a full tracking number on a public forum would be tantamount to stupidity.

Read back through the thread, I can see why clenell is going off his rocker, everything smacks of delay tactics, if they delay long enough before the final solution, whether it be actually shipping miners they have been farming on, or waiting for parts for because of bad planning, or  just disapearing into the sunset, they just get a few more suckers.

If it was me, I don't know what would be worse, getting a miner this late or them doing a vanishing act.

Here's my take. If bitcoiners were kind enough to order AMT miners sans escrow, I should myself in the same boat and not ask for special treatment. Their word was good enough to order from, thus their same word is good enough pertaining to this bounty.

I get where you are going with this. Nice.

To be clear, there's no underlying message in my reply. I honestly feel it fair that I shouldn't have them put the bounty in escrow when others have ordered and didn't use escrow, thus putting myself in the same boat as them, so to speak, taking AMT at their word, in spite of what the general sentiment currently is.

I will expect to paid the bounty upon my arrival though.

I'm still pondering flying or driving, hence not yet replying on this thread or via PM. The offer from AMT is very generous, I must add. Ideally, I would rather fly out Thursday so that I'm not in rush mode, personally, not implying that AMT is rushing me, for I don't see that as the case. Besides, I like to drive and see the countryside AND BARNS. I have no fear of flying.

The other reason I'm pondering this is that I have an opportunity to hand-deliver some barn door hardware to a client of mine in South Bend, IN, oppose to shipping them. I wish I would have had the order placed before this past Monday so that when my niece was in town, I could have put them in her car and she could have delivered them, or picked up by my client at her home. BTW, she's a pole dancer at two adjacent clubs there in SB if anybody is interested. You wouldn't be disappointed. In fact, it's not too much of a stretch to get the club to accept BTC oppose to counterfeit twenties.

Hopefully, the actions now taken by AMT would put them back to a more solid footing. It's a shame they lost it, but this may get them back on track.

[Phinnaeus Gage]

@Bruno
Are you headed out there? On a flight? Please send pics!!

Flight idea still pending. Ideally, I would rather return Thursday afternoon, for the Wednesday schedule is too tight for me for my liking, having nothing to do with on AMT's end. Just a personal thing. Shall, in re. pics.

[Phinnaeus Gage]

Bruno is "hired black pr" ?? ROFL  you amt hacks are a bunch of morons. This is why paranoid losers should never start a business. Screw the customers, blame them for your failures. ha.

Bruno, (if that is your real name rofl) head over there, get your 20 btc. You'll get to see just how BS the whole operation is.

Each time I read your pseudonym, I'm reminded of https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wp3x6l5dZp8.

[opieum2]

I for one am hoping you take them up on this and just go ahead and do this. Would put this whole thing to bed and at least we get someone with a track record and reputation here to validate things. This would go a long way to rebuild trust as now they got their most vocal detractor vouching.

(they might take you to cock'n'balls restaurant in downtown philly for that bowl of dicks lol) I kid of course.

[sirminesalot]

Bruno is "hired black pr" ?? ROFL  you amt hacks are a bunch of morons. This is why paranoid losers should never start a business. Screw the customers, blame them for your failures. ha.

Bruno, (if that is your real name rofl) head over there, get your 20 btc. You'll get to see just how BS the whole operation is.

Each time I read your pseudonym, I'm reminded of https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wp3x6l5dZp8.

Cold blooded! 

[opieum2]

UUUUUNITY!!!! CHARLIE MURPHY!!!

[augustocroppo]

Bruno, do not get involved with crooks as you did with BFL. The invitation to settle things is the tactic every fraudster use when they are desperate. AMT fraudulent scheme is about implode and your silence is what they want to not let anyone know. Stay where you are doing what you do best.

[opieum2]

All said and done I am curious to see where this will lead. Phin I hope you take up the flight offer and just go if only to check things out. Its on their dime and they are making it happen. This would put alot of things to rest for all of us. And you get 20BTC out of it.

Difference is now he goes and actually SEES what is going on vs just posting on it. This is a chance to go. Who else has actually made an invitation like this to a detractor?

[augustocroppo]

Do you see above, Bruno? They are desperate to you go. Do not fall for the trick. There is no guarantee you will even receive the promised 20 BTC. Do not put your psychological health under the influence of crooks. It is a trap to control you and got away with fraudulent scheme being perpetrated since 2013.

[opieum2]

You see above, Bruno? They are desperate to you go. Do not fall for the trick. There is no guarantee you will even receive the promised 20 BTC. Do not put your psychological health under the influence of crooks. It is a trap to control you and got away with fraudulent scheme being perpetrated since 2013.

Something tells me you are the black PR they are referring to. You seem to be the only person posting here that is against this. FYI I think its been REALLY well established I am not from AMT. Or one of their shills. Even the people who initially thought that including Phin have pretty much been convinced of that. I even provided some info that has started a snowball of info that others have provided. Who are you anyway? You seem to jump into this topic every 10 pages or so and say something completely useless.

Thats trolling. Provide him a very compelling reason to not go. Otherwise go away. AMT is footing the bill for this so its on their dime. He will obviously know the second he has the plane tickets that its legit since he is going to need them to get there. So at least they are making the effort. But I am wondering about you specifically since you seem to actually just pop in randomly and say nothing of value.

How about this? Provide a well written and detailed reason as to why you think Phin should not go. Right now all you say is they crooks and frauds....that may be. BUT That is the point. Phin was invited out to go prove exactly that. So far he has been honest with the community. See no reason why he wont be after this. Also it shows another thing. AMT is looking to clear their name at least. Their buisness practices might not be the best, but if they are now working aggressively to turn it around that would be good for everyone. Again a good reason why he should not go. They paying for it. They paying 20btc for him to just show up and put any doubts down.

If some of your other posts are any indication you are against bitcoin to begin with so why the hell are you even in this forum at all?

I also read portugese (which I notice you tend to write in at times) and about 6 other languages without the need to use google translate. All you post is scam scam scam and bitcoin is a joke. You sir are the definition of a troll. Maybe you are working for the banking cartels who are looking to undermine bitcoin? Maybe we need to start looking at you.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=457930.msg5627578#msg5627578

Seeing this statement pretty much sums up your position and should question why you are even on here at all. EVERYONE here wants to make bitcoin a success. BUT their issue is with a vendor right now. Are you concerned? Sounds like if phin proves things are legit, then there is nothing for you to stand on. I have seen some of your posts on various threads doing this exact same thing claiming its all a scam. I get there are people who have this patholgical need to be skeptical of everything. Skepticism is good to a point. I for one want the truth of this matter. And phin is the first person who has been able to get an open door invite to check things out and get the info we need.

And here you come with useless comments. Or contribute a very valid reason why he should not go.
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